The Revenant Marvel Comics Discussion Thread

[ObberGobb]

What's Loki's 1-A magic feats again?

I know Ikol Loki did some crazy stuff as God of Stories that absolutely warrants 1-A but I know little about Classic Loki's feats

He has a few feats of potentially scaling to Skyfather/Hell Lords tier which, if my thread goes through, will be 1-A:

• He was explicitly more powerful than pre-Sorcerer Supreme Doctor Strange, and many of Doctor Strange's 1-A feats are from before he became Sorcerer Supreme
• Loki broke Seth's magical bonds while in Seth's dimension, and said that "even with the home-field advantage, my magic is still vastly superior"
• Helped Odin and Thor fight Surtur
• His magic is superior to the Enchantress, who could poison Yggdrasil
• Could turn Bor into snow, meaning his hax magic works on Skyfather level characters

There's not too many, but I feel like it should at least warrant a "possibly" rating, given that he is always treated to be on the same level of god as Thor

 

[ObberGobb]

Is there also a profile or an explanation blog for Yggdrasil planned?

Yeah, I will definitely make one

 

[Eseseso]

He has a few feats of potentially scaling to Skyfather/Hell Lords tier which, if my thread goes through, will be 1-A:

• He was explicitly more powerful than pre-Sorcerer Supreme Doctor Strange, and many of Doctor Strange's 1-A feats are from before he became Sorcerer Supreme

I'll check if this was Classic or Ikol Loki

• Loki broke Seth's magical bonds while in Seth's dimension, and said that "even with the home-field advantage, my magic is still vastly superior"
• Helped Odin and Thor fight Surtur

If these have scans then it's possible

• His magic is superior to the Enchantress, who could poison Yggdrasil
• Could turn Bor into snow, meaning his hax magic works on Skyfather level characters

This seems more like hax to me

There's not too many, but I feel like it should at least warrant a "possibly" rating, given that he is always treated to be on the same level of god as Thor

Maybe

 

[The_man_with_the_Midas_touch]

Random, but I feel like we have more than enough users of Pym Particles for it to warrant its own page. A lot of them share near-identical powersets and should be able to perform what the others do (Particularly the size-shifters).

 

[SamanPatou]

Do we have any policiy, guideline, standard of whatevs to rate Venom-ified characters?
As in, those characters who bonded with a symbiote that isn't Venom, Carnage or other famous ones. Do we rate them as High 8-C by default, scaling from the original, or is it better to go by their own showings?
Same thing for the p&a, do we assume they get all the biological abilities of Venom?

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

Do we have any policiy, guideline, standard of whatevs to rate Venom-ified characters?
As in, those characters who bonded with a symbiote that isn't Venom, Carnage or other famous ones. Do we rate them as High 8-C by default, scaling from the original, or is it better to go by their own showings?
Same thing for the p&a, do we assume they get all the biological abilities of Venom?

Actually have the same question what about giant dragon symbionts from king in black?

 

[Antvasima]

Do we have any policiy, guideline, standard of whatevs to rate Venom-ified characters?
As in, those characters who bonded with a symbiote that isn't Venom, Carnage or other famous ones. Do we rate them as High 8-C by default, scaling from the original, or is it better to go by their own showings?
Same thing for the p&a, do we assume they get all the biological abilities of Venom?

I think that it seems reasonable to scale most of their statistics from base Venom if they have a sufficient number of appearances to be featured in our wiki.

 

[Genericstickman]

Do we have any policiy, guideline, standard of whatevs to rate Venom-ified characters?
As in, those characters who bonded with a symbiote that isn't Venom, Carnage or other famous ones. Do we rate them as High 8-C by default, scaling from the original, or is it better to go by their own showings?
Same thing for the p&a, do we assume they get all the biological abilities of Venom?

that reminds me that Black Widow's Symbiote form now has enough appearances to have a key

 

[SamanPatou]

I asked this question because I'm making a profile for Jeff the Land Shark (dw, he checks out appearances, notability, feats...), and he's normally 9-B.
At some point he befriended a Venom symbiote, one of the many which corrupted the heroes who would touch Knull's dragons, servants, all that nonsense which I didn't follow really much.

While Venom Jeff has only a handful of appearances (about 5-6), it is still somewhat relevant, aside from being involved with his very last appearances. He also never got rid of it entirely, he just put it away as a new friend, really wholesome stuff.
Now, Jeff is 9-B and while empowered by the Symbiote he performs on-screen another bunch of 9-B feats. However, I don't if bonding with a symbiote would automatically make him High 8-C, as well as inherit a bunch of other abilities by default, aside from those he has showed doing himself (empowerment, elasticity, size and shapeshifting, regeneration...)

 

[Antvasima]

I asked this question because I'm making a profile for Jeff the Land Shark (dw, he checks out appearances, notability, feats...), and he's normally 9-B.
At some point he befriended a Venom symbiote, one of the many which corrupted the heroes who would touch Knull's dragons, servants, all that nonsense which I didn't follow really much.

While Venom Jeff has only a handful of appearances (about 5-6), it is still somewhat relevant, aside from being involved with his very last appearances. He also never got rid of it entirely, he just put it away as a new friend, really wholesome stuff.
Now, Jeff is 9-B and while empowered by the Symbiote he performs on-screen another bunch of 9-B feats. However, I don't if bonding with a symbiote would automatically make him High 8-C, as well as inherit a bunch of other abilities by default, aside from those he has showed doing himself (empowerment, elasticity, size and shapeshifting, regeneration...)

I think that it would upgrade him to our standard symbiote level, at least if it is a spawn from the Venom symbiote, as it copied Spider-Man's powers.

 

[SamanPatou]

I didn't follow the arc, so I'm not sure how do all those symbiotes came to be. I believe it's one of the many symbiotes spawned by Knull and unleashed upon the world during his invasion or something.
Reading here and there, I noticed they could infect people and turn them into possessed slaves, which then had to be freed, I've seen a bunch of characters being corrupted. In the story where Jeff gets the symbiote, he fights a symbiote dragon that resembles Grendel, although I'm not sure if it's him or not. Everyone who got touched by the dragon would get infected by a symbiote.
However, I don't know how do all those symbiotes relate or even scale to the likes of Venom and Carnage, who are clearly ones of a kind.

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

Care to give your thoughts on a my new project?

 

[Excellence616]

Care to give your thoughts on a my new project?

Looks good, nice work.

You would need to elaborate more on her Destined One suit

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

Looks good, nice work.

You would need to elaborate more on her Destined One suit

You mean in the equipment section?

 

[Excellence616]

You mean in the equipment section?

Yeah.

 

[Antvasima]

I didn't follow the arc, so I'm not sure how do all those symbiotes came to be. I believe it's one of the many symbiotes spawned by Knull and unleashed upon the world during his invasion or something.
Reading here and there, I noticed they could infect people and turn them into possessed slaves, which then had to be freed, I've seen a bunch of characters being corrupted. In the story where Jeff gets the symbiote, he fights a symbiote dragon that resembles Grendel, although I'm not sure if it's him or not. Everyone who got touched by the dragon would get infected by a symbiote.
However, I don't know how do all those symbiotes relate or even scale to the likes of Venom and Carnage, who are clearly ones of a kind.

If it was not a symbiote with Spider-Man's powers, we probably have to scale it from its own feats.

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

So... Can you visit my new CRT?

Thread '[Marvel Comics] Upgrade for Marvel Stomper'

Dec 29, 2024

Ms. Marvel Kamala Khan
Her current profile needs some updates so I made a Sandbox

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User:Suigetsuhyugs/Sandbox?oldid=8867862

I will be talking about the most important changes in the thread too.
Before we start, I need to say that the Sandbox still has some stuff that needs to be discussed as I'm not sure about what's best in those cases.

P&A
There isn't much to see here, some new resistances, a new tab for her destined one suit with proper powers included, nothing fancy mostly just self evident, but...

• Suigetsuhyugs
• kamala khan marvel comics ms. marvel (kamala khan) power and abilities profile revision upgrades
• Replies: 64
• Forum: Content Revision

• 

 

[Antvasima]

I replied.

 

[Ser_Hakim_Dayne]

I have some questions about Thor lore:

1. From what I understand Ragnarok was a cycle that was broken by Thor, but if that was the case does that mean there were other versions of Thor and other Asgardians before?

2.In this page it is said that the Gods have an immortality 4 because they can resurrect like the Olympians did in Avengers No Road Home. If this is the case, the Asgardians of Marvel do not go to Valhalla when they die?

3.According to this Thor is the elemental archetype of storms, but what about Zeus? He's also a god of thunder right?

4.I finished the 2007 Thor run and am currently on the 2011 run (Mighty Thor). I read Mighty Thor Issue 8 (a Fear Itself tie in) and the origins of Bor's death and Odin's ascension as All-Father are completely contradictory to the 2007 Thor run. Is this a retcon or a mistake?

 

[MadeByZiggy]

1. From what I understand Ragnarok was a cycle that was broken by Thor, but if that was the case does that mean there were other versions of Thor and other Asgardians before?

No, the Thor we currently have is the same Thor. Ragnorak is funny in Marvel and since most of Asgard's history is myth told by humans it's hard to track.

2.In this page it is said that the Gods have an immortality 4 because they can resurrect like the Olympians did in Avengers No Road Home. If this is the case, the Asgardians of Marvel do not go to Valhalla when they die?

The Olympians have their afterlife (Hades), and the Immortality type 4 is the rebirth if they choose to do so.
Hades (an Olympian) has yet to rebirth after his death.

According to this Thor is the elemental archetype of storms, but what about Zeus? He's also a god of thunder right?

Thor is the stronger thunder god/God of the storms and Zeus was never stated to be an Elemental Archetype.

I finished the 2007 Thor run and am currently on the 2011 run (Mighty Thor). I read Mighty Thor Issue 8 (a Fear Itself tie in) and the origins of Bor's death and Odin's ascension as All-Father are completely contradictory to the 2007 Thor run. Is this a retcon or a mistake?

Neither, Pantheon Gods are stories based on human myth that are brought into existence. The inconsistencies with Pantheon Lore is most likely intentional.

 

[Antvasima]

I have some questions about Thor lore:

1. From what I understand Ragnarok was a cycle that was broken by Thor, but if that was the case does that mean there were other versions of Thor and other Asgardians before?

If I have understood correctly, a few writers have established that Thor and the Asgardians are reborn as different versions of themselves after every Ragnarok, which explains all of the massive differences between real world mythology and Marvel's version of Thor, including that Marvel Loki is not Thor's "adopted uncle".

2.In this page it is said that the Gods have an immortality 4 because they can resurrect like the Olympians did in Avengers No Road Home. If this is the case, the Asgardians of Marvel do not go to Valhalla when they die?

They do, much like Olympians go to Hades, but they likely continuously get resurrected over their lifespans of (currently established as) millions of years and through the Ragnarok cycles.

3.According to this Thor is the elemental archetype of storms, but what about Zeus? He's also a god of thunder right?

Both of them are elemental archetypes in different mythologies.

4.I finished the 2007 Thor run and am currently on the 2011 run (Mighty Thor). I read Mighty Thor Issue 8 (a Fear Itself tie in) and the origins of Bor's death and Odin's ascension as All-Father are completely contradictory to the 2007 Thor run. Is this a retcon or a mistake?

Possibly just a case of Matt Fraction not caring about continuity. He certainly did not care about proper characterisation, as he turned Odin from a wise, brave, and benevolent ruler (Tom DeFalco's version) to a fearful, raving, genocidal maniac.

 

[MadeByZiggy]

Possibly just a case of Matt Fraction not caring about continuity. He certainly did not care about proper characterisation, as he turned Odin from a wise, brave, and benevolent ruler (Tom DeFalco's version) to a fearful, raving, genocidal maniac.

Character assassination is real

 

[Antvasima]

Character assassination is real

Yup. Rick Remender treated The High Evolutionary in an even more extreme manner, and Jonathan Hickman and Kieron Gillen turned the X-Men into evil villains, and the latter apparently sympathised with some of their worst members.

 

[DivineCreator389]

Happy New Year, everyone!

 

[ByArrow]

Thread '[MCU] Canon to the Comics/High 1-B Meta. Massively controversial topic'

Jan 1, 2025

Canon crossover evidence
MCU

This December, behold the adventures of the agency tasked with upholding the timestream in TVA! Just announced by Marvel Studios President Kevin Feige and Marvel Comics Editor-in-Chief C.B. Cebulski at the Marvel Fanfare Panel at San Diego Comic-Con, TVA will be a five-issue limited comic book series written by Marvel Studios’ Loki writer Katharyn Blair and drawn by acclaimed Marvel artist Pere Perez (CARNAGE, EDGE OF SPIDER-VERSE).

The series will represent an...

• Naeem0304
• marvel marvel cinematic universe marvel cinematic universe cosmology marvel comics marvel comics cosmology (world hierarchy) mcu
• Replies: 76
• Forum: Content Revision

• 

 

[ObberGobb]

Has anyone here read Astro City by Kurt Busiek? I am currently working on a CRT adding the verse and was curious if there are any other fans on the site. I figured Marvel fans would be the most likely to have read this series.

 

[Antvasima]

Has anyone here read Astro City by Kurt Busiek? I am currently working on a CRT adding the verse and was curious if there are any other fans on the site. I figured Marvel fans would be the most likely to have read this series.

Yes. I love that series. It is what superhero comics should be like in my view. Humane stories that are about fundamentally decent, relatable, and inspiring characters.

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

Yes. I love that series. It is what superhero comics should be like in my view. Humane stories that are about fundamentally decent, relatable, and inspiring characters.

Like Kick ass?

 

[Antvasima]

Ewww. No, I am not fond of Mark Millar's writing. There is no genuine humanity to it, just hollow characterisation, quotable unnatural catchphrases, and callous ultraviolence.

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

Ewww.

Anything against Mark Miller? Or just the whole thing?

 

[Antvasima]

I updated my post above.

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

I like kick ass mostly because hit girl, I thought by "humane stories" you meant about non super powers characters. I don't consider it ultra violent.

 

[Antvasima]

Humane means that the stories are kind and compassionate at heart, not hollow callous murder-orgies marketed as something cool to strive towards.

 

[ObberGobb]

Yes. I love that series. It is what superhero comics should be like in my view. Humane stories that are about fundamentally decent, relatable, and inspiring characters.

I definitely agree. Samaritan is such a good take on the Superman archetype. "Steel Jacketed Man" is my favorite character. I also just love the looks at normal people living in this world.

Really great series. I would love if it came back someday.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, you will very soon be able to order all 6 "Metrobooks" that collect the entire series for an affordable price.

Also, I think that the author, Kurt Busiek, has some kind of illness or other health problems, and that this is why he isn't producing stories currently. I hope that he will get much better soon.

 

[SamanPatou]

May someone remind me the minimum amount of appearances a characters requires to have in order to warrant a profile?

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

May someone remind me the minimum amount of appearances a characters requires to have in order to warrant a profile?

The rules are here

• For the Prime Marvel Universe, please refrain from making profiles for characters with less than 20 appearances across comic books (approximately 2 years' worth of appearances). For DC Comics, refrain from making profiles for Golden Age characters with less than 5 appearances, Pre-Crisis characters with less than 15 appearances and Post-Crisis or Post-Flashpoint characters with less than 10 appearances, unless they play an extremely important part in the scaling of other characters, as the constantly changing nature of their statistics make it hard for us to keep files updated as is.
  • For keys in existing profiles, and equipment files, one only requires at least 15 appearances across comic books, as opposed to 20.
• Alternative canon/non-canonical character profile pages for Marvel and DC Comics can only be created if the version in question was prominently featured in their own runs, and scale to their own feats instead of being presumed to scale to their main canon counterparts.

 

[SamanPatou]

Do we allow something like "X Tier via Toon Force"?
Because in my making of Alligator Loki's profile (comics, not mcu) I have gathered a number of instances in which he hurts Thor-level characters (Thor himself, Throg and Loki), leaves minor, yet visible wounds (Thor) or even KOs them (Thor again).
Now, aside from scaling, he hasn't performed any feat that goes beyond 9-B, so there is realistically no reason to put him so high, but many of his stories are comedic in nature and he can hurt cosmically stronger characters because it's FUN (it actually is), so I thought of addressing it in some way, such as 3-C via Toon Force or such. However, I know it is probably controversial and perhaps even a unique case, so I don't know whether we can allow such a thing.

 

[Suigetsuhyugs]

Do we allow something like "X Tier via Toon Force"?
Because in my making of Alligator Loki's profile (comics, not mcu) I have gathered a number of instances in which he hurts Thor-level characters (Thor himself, Throg and Loki), leaves minor, yet visible wounds (Thor) or even KOs them (Thor again).
Now, aside from scaling, he hasn't performed any feat that goes beyond 9-B, so there is realistically no reason to put him so high, but many of his stories are comedic in nature and he can hurt cosmically stronger characters because it's FUN (it actually is), so I thought of addressing it in some way, such as 3-C via Toon Force or such. However, I know it is probably controversial and perhaps even a unique case, so I don't know whether we can allow such a thing.

It might be just my opinion but I think Toon Force works more as a sort of durability negation for laughs, when toon Force is involved they can hurt tier 3 or above with something as weak as a normal , a wooden bat a toy hammer, ect which in all logically makes no sense. My opinion is that we should assume that Toon Force can force their toon reality on their opponents making them vulnerable for laughs but this kinda reaches a NLF

 

[SamanPatou]

I thought about that as well, but I feel like Durability Negation should be more related to an actual ability and mechanic, in order to be justified.