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The commoners thread: Discussing Ultima's "On the Many, Many Incoherences of the Tiering System"

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Unqver said:
At this moment, Yarra changed her tone and said sternly, "So, have you ever thought about whether 'correctness' also has a' prototype '?"
Su Zhou: "?"
Obviously, he didn't think about it.
And Yala also saw this, and he smiled and said, "Yes, that's it."
Since there is a prototype like ours, is there also a prototype for the unattainable supreme gods and ultimate origins in religion and mythology
If there really exists a prototype for the supreme meanings of religion, mythology, fantasy, and philosophy, such as the strong word for "Dao", the never-ending "Brahma", the omniscient and omnipotent "Lord", and the absolute existence of "The One"
Can such a prototype represent 'true correctness'
【 Inclusion of all our correctness, even further correctness, can fulfill our wishes and make our love more vibrant and correct... 】
As Yala spoke, she couldn't help but sigh, "That is the truth of the right battle."
——Chapter ex-2 The Story of Man and Snake
而就在此时，雅拉一转话锋，祂正色道：【所以，你有没有想过，‘正确’是否也有‘原型’？】

苏昼：“？”

很显然，他并没有想过。

而雅拉也看出这点，祂微笑着道：【是的，就是这样】

【既然有我们这样的原型，那么宗教、神话中那些不可企及的至高神，终极的本源，是否也有一个【原型】？】

【强字之曰的“道”、无始无终的“梵”、全知全能的“主”、绝对存在的“太一”……这些宗教、神话、幻想、哲学上的至高意义如果真的存在一个【原型】的话】

【那样的原型，是否能代表‘真正的正确’？】

【包涵我们所有的正确，甚至更进一步的正确，能够达成我们的愿望，令我们的爱更加发扬的正确……】

如此说道，雅拉不禁叹息道：【那就是，正确之战的真相】
——章节ex-其之二 人与蛇的故事
This is the only thing I can remember that sticks to 0.
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Ah yes, thank for that. Haven't read the ex-chapter of MWDITK.

Any other untranslated Xianxia and Xuanhuan recommendations?
 
Rakih_Elyan said:
Yes, both.
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There are some that I don't remember if there is a translation.一世之尊，星河大帝，深空彼岸，剑主苍穹（I've only read another novel by the same author, and the plot is a little boring, but it's not bad.）My personal favorite is definitely 黑山老妖, and although it may not be very powerful, I personally think this book is definitely the strongest protagonist in the Divine Dreamwalker verse.
 
demonwarrior2266 said:
I'm CONVINCED the whole concept of "High 1-A+" Ultima outlined in his Tier 0 CRT was literally using the shell key of Self-Reference Engine as a template for its definition. It fits too well
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I was actually thinking of the old-ass interpretation we had of Lovecraft's cosmology where Azathoth was the dreamer of everything and Yog-Sothoth was considered to be the dream itself. Just the general idea of "This thing that isn't really the superessence in-and-of-itself but is second to it due to being the totality of all the content it emanates," pretty much. Turned out there are still characters who fit that bill.
 
Ultima_Reality said:
I was actually thinking of the old-ass interpretation we had of Lovecraft's cosmology where Azathoth was the dreamer of everything and Yog-Sothoth was considered to be the dream itself. Just the general idea of "This thing that isn't really the superessence in-and-of-itself but is second to it due to being the totality of all the content it emanates," pretty much. Turned out there are still characters who fit that bill.
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Since you contradicted me I think you are wrong.
 
Ultima_Reality said:
I was actually thinking of the old-ass interpretation we had of Lovecraft's cosmology where Azathoth was the dreamer of everything and Yog-Sothoth was considered to be the dream itself. Just the general idea of "This thing that isn't really the superessence in-and-of-itself but is second to it due to being the totality of all the content it emanates," pretty much. Turned out there are still characters who fit that bill.
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I feel like there's way more than just does two on the wiki though...
 
Ultima_Reality said:
I was actually thinking of the old-ass interpretation we had of Lovecraft's cosmology where Azathoth was the dreamer of everything and Yog-Sothoth was considered to be the dream itself. Just the general idea of "This thing that isn't really the superessence in-and-of-itself but is second to it due to being the totality of all the content it emanates," pretty much. Turned out there are still characters who fit that bill.
Click to expand...
When can we expect the next crt?
 
Ultima_Reality said:
I was actually thinking of the old-ass interpretation we had of Lovecraft's cosmology where Azathoth was the dreamer of everything and Yog-Sothoth was considered to be the dream itself. Just the general idea of "This thing that isn't really the superessence in-and-of-itself but is second to it due to being the totality of all the content it emanates," pretty much. Turned out there are still characters who fit that bill.
Click to expand...
How did that conclusion come about? I presume you were in it as well?
 
Here are the changes I know of , who’ll roughly stay the same, tiering wise:

Marvel: High 1-As, High 1-A+, and 0 . From what I know the regular High 1-As are staying. The justification will need to be changed for some of them due to DeMatteis’ continuity being planned to be separated from the main comic canon. I also have plans for scaling chains for the top tiers (High 1-As) of the DeMatteis cosmology, and it’s way crazier than you think

DC: Has potentially 1-A stuff due to Plato. 0 and High 1-A+ is for Divine Presence/God and Pralaya. Unsure where Vertigo Top Tiers (aside from Presence) end up but thanks to the tiering revisions they’re at least 1-A, but unsure if they end up High 1-A or not

Chulthu Mythos: Likely still High 1-A at least. Unsure if they are High 1-A+ or 0

Demonbane: Blatantly High 1-A at least. Unsure if they reach High 1-A+ or 0 though

Nasuverse: From what I remember their higher worlds / higher dimensions follow R>F so maybe the high-top tiers become 1-A. Even with people arguing whether The Root is 0 or not one thing that should be clear is that it definitely isn’t just 1-A. Surpassing every possible description or definition one can give it is at minimum High 1-A to me
DKD: They likely become High 1-A from what I heard. If not for inverse semantics on how their every possibility concept works they’d be higher

Sucker for Love: The most blatantly 1-A shenanigans I know of , which makes sense as it’s based off of the Mythos. So they’d very likely become 1-A if someone takes the time to make the CRT


Big Lez Show: Sassy stays at 1-A and probably becomes a “they either stomp or get stomped” not too dissimilar with how 3812 used to be



These are the ones I know off the top of my head.
 
The_2nd_Existential_Seed said:
Here are the changes I know of , who’ll roughly stay the same, tiering wise:

Marvel: High 1-As, High 1-A+, and 0 . From what I know the regular High 1-As are staying. The justification will need to be changed for some of them due to DeMatteis’ continuity being planned to be separated from the main comic canon. I also have plans for scaling chains for the top tiers (High 1-As) of the DeMatteis cosmology, and it’s way crazier than you think

DC: Has potentially 1-A stuff due to Plato. 0 and High 1-A+ is for Divine Presence/God and Pralaya. Unsure where Vertigo Top Tiers (aside from Presence) end up but thanks to the tiering revisions they’re at least 1-A, but unsure if they end up High 1-A or not

Chulthu Mythos: Likely still High 1-A at least. Unsure if they are High 1-A+ or 0

Demonbane: Blatantly High 1-A at least. Unsure if they reach High 1-A+ or 0 though

Nasuverse: From what I remember their higher worlds / higher dimensions follow R>F so maybe the high-top tiers become 1-A. Even with people arguing whether The Root is 0 or not one thing that should be clear is that it definitely isn’t just 1-A. Surpassing every possible description or definition one can give it is at minimum High 1-A to me
DKD: They likely become High 1-A from what I heard. If not for inverse semantics on how their every possibility concept works they’d be higher

Sucker for Love: The most blatantly 1-A shenanigans I know of , which makes sense as it’s based off of the Mythos. So they’d very likely become 1-A if someone takes the time to make the CRT


Big Lez Show: Sassy stays at 1-A and probably becomes a “they either stomp or get stomped” not too dissimilar with how 3812 used to be



These are the ones I know off the top of my head.
Click to expand...
Umineko?
 
The_2nd_Existential_Seed said:
DKD: They likely become High 1-A from what I heard. If not for inverse semantics on how their every possibility concept works they’d be higher
Click to expand...
The Afterlife will be High 1-A and TLOI will be High 1-A+ (Potentially tier 0 cosmology though, but as of now that's really iffy and I haven't even checked any requirements besides basic tier 0 outlines)
 
The_2nd_Existential_Seed said:
Here are the changes I know of , who’ll roughly stay the same, tiering wise:

Marvel: High 1-As, High 1-A+, and 0 . From what I know the regular High 1-As are staying. The justification will need to be changed for some of them due to DeMatteis’ continuity being planned to be separated from the main comic canon. I also have plans for scaling chains for the top tiers (High 1-As) of the DeMatteis cosmology, and it’s way crazier than you think

DC: Has potentially 1-A stuff due to Plato. 0 and High 1-A+ is for Divine Presence/God and Pralaya. Unsure where Vertigo Top Tiers (aside from Presence) end up but thanks to the tiering revisions they’re at least 1-A, but unsure if they end up High 1-A or not
Click to expand...
I’ll take my credit on those two fictions.
 
The_2nd_Existential_Seed said:
Nasuverse: From what I remember their higher worlds / higher dimensions follow R>F so maybe the high-top tiers become 1-A. Even with people arguing whether The Root is 0 or not one thing that should be clear is that it definitely isn’t just 1-A. Surpassing every possible description or definition one can give it is at minimum High 1-A to me
Click to expand...
Nasuverse might not qualify for the new 1A if we use the mooncell r>f.

Abigail/Yog-Sothoth should be High 1A.

The Root/Shiki is undeniably tier 0.
 
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