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The Boys: Homelander massive downgrade and Small Town Level calc problems

Skyggen

40
32
I was looking at Homelander's (TV series) profile and I think his durability is wrong. These are my opinions and analysis, so anyone feel free to disagree if they find any errors.
Durability is justified by this calculation. He struck me as incorrect in many ways.

1. Distance from Homelander to the explosion seems incorrect.

At the beginning of the calculation, 1 pixel is stipulated at 0.87354731707 inches.

To paraphrase the author of the calculation:
"Homelander’s knees are 0.6 cm tall or 22.677165354 pixels. Knowing 22.577165354 pixels equals 1.64351851852 feet or 19.7222222222 inches, this means 1 pixel equals 0.87354731707 inches."

In the end, those 0.87354731707 inches are used in the formula I = P/A as the distance from Homelander to the explosion. Again, paraphrasing:
"Then we use I = P/A, or I = 43069.457229 / (4π((0.87354731707 )^2))."

The feat is here. Pause at 1:41. Homelander cannot be 0.87354731707 inches (about 2.2 cm) away from the explosion. At 1:32 his arm is extended towards the object that exploded and there was a man between him and the object.
I couldn't find the average size of a single arm, but I'm smaller than Homelander (I'm 172 cm) and my arm is 65 cm from wrist to shoulder (I tried to imitate the Homelander position and measured my arm with a tape measure and got 55 cm; sorry, the best I could).
I know, it's not exactly a good source to use my measurements, but I imagine most people have an arm that is close in size (and longer than the 2.2 cm of the original calculation).

Not only that, but Homelander took a step back in 1:41. Accordingly, the average step distance is 0.415 x the height. Homelander is 180 cm. So, 74.7 cm.

I find it very difficult to estimate the final distance from Homelander in the 1:41 frame to the bottom of the object (and I don't particularly trust the angsize calculations), but it seems fair to add up the arm and stride distance I provided, concluding a distance of 1,322 meters. It seems to make sense to me looking at that frame.

2. The estimated smoke stack size problem.
According to the original calculation, a smoke stack of 275 meters was used as a base.
Pause at 1:42. There was a building in front of the smoke stack. The building appears to be half the size of the smoke stack (and that's considering the smoke stack was at the back, so it could be smaller from perspective). That building would have to be about 137.5 meters to cover so much of the smoke stack. Assuming that non-residential buildings average 4 meters high per floor, the building would have to be about 36 floors.

Now pause at 00:01.
We see that the buildings are clearly much smaller. We even see a small smoke stack (the size of a low-rise building) on the left (I don't think it's the one used in the original calculation, but it shows that there were small smoke stacks there).

It seems clear to me that that smoke stack was much smaller than 275 meters and that building in front of it looked small (in view of the buildings shown at 00:01 in the same video I quoted earlier).
I'm going to use a 3-story building (which should be about 12 meters high) as the base for the one in front of the calculation smoke stack. If the smoke stack was twice as tall, it would be 24 meters.

Taking advantage of this, I think the author of the calculation made a mistake at one point.
To paraphrase: "Now we're using the size equation, but now with 60 pixels (The explosion's size) instead of 66.
275 * 273/[66*2*tan(70deg/2)] = 812.259179 meters. The explosion covers the whole screen, so we'll use this as our blast radius as well."

It was said that the 66 pixels would be replaced by 60, but the 66 was repeated.

I'm going to reuse the formula using the 60 pixels of the explosion that the author of the original calculation got and replace the 275 meters of the smoke stack with the estimated 24 meters. It seems to me that the author also multiplied 275 meters by 273 pixels from the image he posted, but in the image the panel has 260.15999999999997 pixels. I will use the 260.15999999999997 pixels as well.

24 * 260.15999999999997/[60*2*tan(70deg/2)] = 74.3093970868 meters.

74.3093970868^3*((27136*1.37895+8649)^(1/2)/13568-93/13568)^2 = 32.9774240045 Tons.

Now using Homelander's distance for the explosion I estimated above. I = P/A, or I = 43069.457229 / (4π((1.322)^2)) =1.50156436769 Ton of TNT.

Homelander is 180 cm and 75 kg. According to this, the frontal surface area of his body would be 0.97 m².

1.50156436769 x 0.97 = 1.45651743666 Ton of TNT.

This is Building Level+, far below the Small Town Level proposed by the original calculation.

3. Consistency
The original calculation comes to a result of about 43 kilotons of TNT. Fat Man (the Nagasaki nuclear bomb) was 21 kilotons. It doesn't seem to make sense to me that an explosion from what appears to me to be a gas tank would be more powerful than a nuclear bomb. A woman who was in a building near the explosion survived without major injuries (a person would not survive only a few dozen meters from a nuclear explosion, right?). Even the walls of the surrounding buildings did not completely fall.
Soldier Boy was shown to be able to injure Homelander in season 3 of The Boys and using his energy, he did it with a building (pause at 1:49)
It seems consistent with Homelander if this feat really is Building Level+ and not Small Town Level. In fact, both feats look like Building Level+ to me.

Building Level seems much more logical than Small Town Level.

4. Conclusion
Basically, it's my opinions of why I think Homelander's durability should be reduced to Building Level+ (if we consider that the formulas and calculations made by the original calculation are correct, which was not my purpose to comment here). Some estimates I've made (like assuming Homelander took an average step when he clearly walked away from the man after splitting him with heat vision and the size of his outstretched arm) aren't such accurate evidence, but I believe it's something around that.
Anyway, I think Building Level+ is consistent.
 
Last edited:
So as the creator of the OG calc, I have some comments to make.
  1. Good job! This is generally just a banger of a downgrade post, and solves some of the problems I didn't take enough time to consider. (The smokestack/ridiculous building sizes.)
  2. I think there is room for less assumptions with the calc though, such as the wrist to shoulder length.
  3. I think I was tired and just made a mistake adding that 0.87 inch value in, because that assumes he was 1 pixel away.
  4. For the explosion's size, I had to make a decision as to where to cut it off. The fireball covers the entire facility, so I decided to cut it off on the second frame of the explosion as a lowball, and even that gave 43 kiloton results. I think a good idea at that point may be to take the size of the facility and see how much of its total area the fireball takes up by the end to calc its yield. (But that would probably be even more wank ngl).
  5. Also, another calc was done and accepted that calculated the actual strength of the blast based off of its destruction, and that got Multi-City Block level+ or 8A+, which is more reliable and calcs the event's actual destructive power instead of a gas explosion's size which probably violates a rule I didn't know about.
  6. The girl surviving seems to be pure PIS, because even if the explosion was 32 tons of tnt she would be vaporized.
  7. Here's the adformentioned calc: Here you go.
 
LIFE_OF_KING said:
The woman surviving is pure bullshit. Hell, all the walls and buildings were destroyed even several meters from the epicenter of the explosion, but the woman and her clothes were completely intact basically

Neutral atm
Click to expand...
I mean I'm inclined to agree my calc is wrong, but not with the Building Level+ proposed rating.
 
Did a quick calc, assuming Soldier Boys nuclear explosion moved at the speed of a real mushroom cloud (333 m/s), and using the fact that there's a two second timeframe between the boom, (the explosion's start), and us seeing it at its tallest to find its size/yield. Came out to 2.9 kilotons, which feels really wank for the destruction shown, but could work with the 8A+ calc, as the explosion is meant to be superior to Soldeir Boy's physicals and take out Homelander in 1 shot.
 
LIFE_OF_KING said:
The woman surviving is pure bullshit, or better, plot. Hell, all the walls and buildings were destroyed even several meters from the epicenter of the explosion, but the woman and her clothes were completely intact basically

Neutral atm
Click to expand...
The woman have her head twisted and she did die though
 
Cryo123 said:
Yeah but that was by Noir's doing, she survived the explosion.

Also, the calc I linked only finds the yield of the explosion, not Homelander's cooresponding durability.
Click to expand...
True, but at the same time though, we consider square inverse law since I don’t know if we ever shown he was at the epicenter of the explosion correct?
 
HammerStrikes219 said:
The woman have her head twisted and she did die though
Click to expand...
Dude, I am talking about the explosion.

Btw, for the OP, "8-C is more consistent" is not a argument. Homelander literally treats 99.89% of the verse as fodder and there are at least 3 statements saying that he is above "any weapon". So him being like, 5000 times above everybody else is not absurd
 
LIFE_OF_KING said:
Dude, I am talking about the explosion.

Btw, "8-C is more consistent" is not a argument. Homelander literally treats 99.89% of the verse as fodder and there are at least 3 statements saying that he is above "any weapon". So him being like, 5000 times above everybody else is not absurd
Click to expand...
I not arguing that though. The OP is.
 
HammerStrikes219 said:
True, but at the same time though, we consider square inverse law since I don’t know if we ever shown he was at the epicenter of the explosion correct?
Click to expand...
We are shown he was very close to it. I'm not opposed to using OP's estimated distance to find his durability from the explosion, just think the 8A+ calculation is more accurate on the blast's power.
LIFE_OF_KING said:
Btw, for the OP, "8-C is more consistent" is not a argument. Homelander literally treats 99.89% of the verse as fodder and there are at least 3 statements saying that he is above "any weapon". So him being like, 5000 times above everybody else is not absurd
Click to expand...
And I mean, there aren't may antifeats of character being hurt by lower level attacks, so it wouldn't be completely off the rails anyways.
 
Cryo123 said:
So as the creator of the OG calc, I have some comments to make.
  1. Good job! This is generally just a banger of a downgrade post, and solves some of the problems I didn't take enough time to consider. (The smokestack/ridiculous building sizes.)
  2. I think there is room for less assumptions with the calc though, such as the wrist to shoulder length.
  3. I think I was tired and just made a mistake adding that 0.87 inch value in, because that assumes he was 1 pixel away.
  4. For the explosion's size, I had to make a decision as to where to cut it off. The fireball covers the entire facility, so I decided to cut it off on the second frame of the explosion as a lowball, and even that gave 43 kiloton results. I think a good idea at that point may be to take the size of the facility and see how much of its total area the fireball takes up by the end to calc its yield. (But that would probably be even more wank ngl).
  5. Also, another calc was done and accepted that calculated the actual strength of the blast based off of its destruction, and that got Multi-City Block level+ or 8A+, which is more reliable and calcs the event's actual destructive power instead of a gas explosion's size which probably violates a rule I didn't know about.
  6. The girl surviving seems to be pure PIS, because even if the explosion was 32 tons of tnt she would be vaporized.
  7. Here's the adformentioned calc: Here you go.
Click to expand...
I posted my calculation here (along with a Great Wide Wonder feat with a Small Building Level result) here.
I agree with some of your points!

What I disagree with, my opinions:
1. I'm not sure the fireball traveled through the chemical plant. Pause at 1:42. What hits the footage camera is pure smoke. Covering the camera, we don't see how much of the area has been destroyed.

2. The MCB level result calculation assumes that all surrounding buildings have been destroyed, but I don't think we can assume that. There were several buildings in the chemical plant. We only saw the buildings that were around Homelander after the explosion. Watch at 2:01 (same video).

3. See at 0:53. We see undamaged buildings and a smoke stack on the right. It doesn't look like everything was destroyed. We also didn't see what was behind the destroyed region after the explosion. I find it incorrect to assume that all those buildings were destroyed.

4. Now my main problem. I understand that the Vs Battles Wiki uses a j/cc system to calculate the energy released on destroyed objects, but I've never come across a source saying that makes sense. I think, if I remember correctly, it has already been discussed here that there are no sources for this. Anyway, that's not the main point.
The calculation assumes that all structures were equally fragmented. Here (pause at 1:53) we see metal structures that have just fallen, but are still whole. Something that looks like a smoke stack or a water tank is undamaged to the bottom (although overturned). At 2:08 we see walls that although missing pieces are still standing. The buildings were not completely destroyed.

5. The calculation assumes that the ENTIRE chemical plant is made of steel. We clearly see most of the structures are concrete, like the walls in the background when the woman tries to escape. The author's source of the calculation is an article that cites how stainless steel is a good material to be used in chemical plants to contain hazardous chemical materials, but does not say that a chemical plant is ENTIRELY steel (including buildings, Smoke Stacks, etc).

6. In summary, while I agree with your first points, I think these calculations assume destroyed area and some things that seem strange to me like assuming that the chemical plant is entirely made of steel.
 
LIFE_OF_KING said:
The woman surviving is pure bullshit, or better, plot. Hell, all the walls and buildings were destroyed even several meters from the epicenter of the explosion, but the woman and her clothes were completely intact basically

Neutral atm
Click to expand...
I already quoted my opinions in the other answer, but reiterating them here:
I don't think we ever see any buildings or structures destroyed. We see entire walls and metal structures at one point (albeit fallen, but not fragmented). The woman was considerably far from the blast. I agree that it might be an inconsistency, but I think if the result is something around Building Level+, it would make sense for the woman to survive being so far from the epicenter.
 
LIFE_OF_KING said:
Dude, I am talking about the explosion.

Btw, for the OP, "8-C is more consistent" is not a argument. Homelander literally treats 99.89% of the verse as fodder and there are at least 3 statements saying that he is above "any weapon". So him being like, 5000 times above everybody else is not absurd
Click to expand...
LIFE_OF_KING said:
Dude, I am talking about the explosion.

Btw, for the OP, "8-C is more consistent" is not a argument. Homelander literally treats 99.89% of the verse as fodder and there are at least 3 statements saying that he is above "any weapon". So him being like, 5000 times above everybody else is not absurd
Click to expand...
I don't like to consider vague statements. If you're okay with using them as evidence, that's fine. Each one uses their own criteria, I think. Understand that you use different from mine.
I said I think it's consistent because Homelander was injured by Soldier Boy, and I think the guy's best show of power isn't close to Small Town Level.
 
Great Wide Wonder disperses clouds

Well I also put this on a blog but apparently I got blocked (?) from there and can't post or edit anything (and I don't know if the posts are visible)
Anyway, I think this could be a supportive feat to Small Bulding Level The Boys.

Pixel Scaling.
Feat here (0:15). I assumed the height of the average man in the US (175.26 cm) for the body of Great Wide Wonder.

I'm going to assume that the cloud is shaped like a cylinder. It appears to be a cirrus, which according to Vs Battles is an average of 1500 meters thick. Also according to Vs Battles, the average density of clouds is 1,003 kg/m³.

Volume of a cylinder = πr2h

π x 16.0655² x 1500 = 1216268.96361 m³.

Mass = 1216268,96361 x 1,003 = 1219917.7705 kg.

It's hard to visualize exactly when the clouds start moving and when they stop (as the scene cuts), so I'll assume 1.5 s (the feat lasts from 0:15 s to mid-0:16 s).

They moved by about 16.0655 m.

V = 16.0655/1.5 = 10.7103333333 m/s.

KE = 1219917.7705 x 10.7103333333² x 0.5 = 69969140.1434 joules = 0.0167230258 Tons de TNT (Small Building Level).

It seems consistent with the other characters in The Boys.
 
Skyggen said:
Great Wide Wonder disperses clouds

Well I also put this on a blog but apparently I got blocked (?) from there and can't post or edit anything (and I don't know if the posts are visible)
Anyway, I think this could be a supportive feat to Small Bulding Level The Boys.

Pixel Scaling.
Feat here (0:15). I assumed the height of the average man in the US (175.26 cm) for the body of Great Wide Wonder.

I'm going to assume that the cloud is shaped like a cylinder. It appears to be a cirrus, which according to Vs Battles is an average of 1500 meters thick. Also according to Vs Battles, the average density of clouds is 1,003 kg/m³.

Volume of a cylinder = πr2h

π x 16.0655² x 1500 = 1216268.96361 m³.

Mass = 1216268,96361 x 1,003 = 1219917.7705 kg.

It's hard to visualize exactly when the clouds start moving and when they stop (as the scene cuts), so I'll assume 1.5 s (the feat lasts from 0:15 s to mid-0:16 s).

They moved by about 16.0655 m.

V = 16.0655/1.5 = 10.7103333333 m/s.

KE = 1219917.7705 x 10.7103333333² x 0.5 = 69969140.1434 joules = 0.0167230258 Tons de TNT (Small Building Level).

It seems consistent with the other characters in The Boys.
Click to expand...
I think you have to verify your own account on Fandom and then you are allowed to post Stuff IIRC
 
The explosion’s epicentre should have been at crimson countess so it’s pretty easy to calc dura. I do think that calc is a little wank tho ngl.


8-A+ is fine, disagree with 8-C+, although it seems like the 8-A+ calc could also be redone.
 
Tago238 said:
The explosion’s epicentre should have been at crimson countess so it’s pretty easy to calc dura. I do think that calc is a little wank tho ngl.


8-A+ is fine, disagree with 8-C+, although it seems like the 8-A+ calc could also be redone.
Click to expand...
Where is 8-A+ from?
 
Tago238 said:
The explosion’s epicentre should have been at crimson countess so it’s pretty easy to calc dura. I do think that calc is a little wank tho ngl.


8-A+ is fine, disagree with 8-C+, although it seems like the 8-A+ calc could also be redone.
Click to expand...
As I said, my problem with the 8-A calculation is considering steel as the total material of the chemical plant. Also, I don't think we're sure that all the buildings were destroyed (it even seems to me that we see part of the place still in its entirety at the end of the episode).
 
to be honest i'm okay with the 8-C, since not only is the most consistent but the characters have never demonstarted feats that could go in 8-A tier
 
HammerStrikes219 said:
Yes, I know. This time though, I actually acting dramatic, but when two results are differ from one another. We have to essentially get all the staff members on board involved with both calcs on evaluating this thread and the calcs of the same feat.
Click to expand...
Well, maybe someone can tag (if it's appropriate and allowed) some member of the calculation staff to look into the issue.
 
I agree with the main post, there's no way that smokestack is 275 meters when there are urban buildings around the same height.

And the scene after the explosions shows that most of the city block is still standing, when it should have been a deserted area for hundreds of meters around after a supposedly 8-A+/Low 7-C explosion occured.

Agree with 8-C.
 
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