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Strongest Character for Every Tier 16

Vecna has high 2-A immortality (from ao) Magnus has 1-A immortality (from tzeentch) and alice has high 1-C immortality (From the axiom)
 
Monarch has finally been dethroned for being the strongest 11-C by default
 
Yobobojojo said:
With a sword. And that sweet observation
Click to expand...
How effective is his observation in those two tiers? Yeah I get it, it worked on a 1-C, but I need details. Cuz he culd probably be taken out with the right hax. Does his observation instantly powernull?
 
Isn't it a short ranged passive? Kessler outranges and shoots him.
 
Guff isn't a dragon. Ur dragon has everything any dragon has, not composite MTG. It just so happens that dragons include these two.
 
If you're talking about Shion Yorigami, he's stronger than her he just can't kill her. Sort of like saying a battle between someone with building level ap vs someone with high godly hasn't been decided yet for that tier. The situations isn't exactly the same but the point is that Shion's not stronger which is the point of the thread, he just can't kill her which is not needed for knowing who is stronger.
 
"He's stronger than her"

And you determine that based on what...? By your own logic, Sirzechs isn't stronger, it's just that she can't kill him.
 
@DragonEmperor23 Yeah her. So until the match is over or a new contender appears the spot will remain empty.
 
Being able to not get killed by him isn't strength. He's stronger because of his passive EE. His offensive hax > hers. Which is what matters when you're deciding the strongest.
 
He was still killed by Yawgmoth, who is still far below Ur Dragon, who isn't there. ALso Ur Dragon's omniscience should give it access to just about every spell, but something like what Guff had I'm pretty sure was just his own thing.
 
This isn't a "who has the best offensive hax" thread. If no one in the tier can kill Shion, she is the strongest. Sirzechs stalemating her (which I don't even think is accurate anyway) by using offensive hax does not make him "stronger" than Shion doing it with sheer unkillability.
 
Saikou The Lewd King said:
This isn't a "who has the best offensive hax" thread. If no one in the tier can kill Shion, she is the strongest. Sirzechs stalemating her (which I don't even think is accurate anyway) by using offensive hax does not make him "stronger" than Shion doing it with sheer unkillability.
Click to expand...
In that case it's one ability versus a passive, which kind of tips it in Sirzechs favor
 
Not necessarily, if the character's offensive hax allows them to fight and win outside their tier. People are harder to kill than Ahzek Ahrima by way of higher dimensional immortality (though his precog works wonders in that regard), but he can punch way, way above his weight both in canon and on this site.
 
It's one ability vs one ability. Both are passive too (due to Abstract Existence being passive).
 
YOu may want to see how they fare in general then, as opposed to one another. Kharn doesn't make the list because you can beat him through AP and skill, even if he wins against the uber haxxed dudes, because they will generally fare better. Isn't his EE not that far ranged though?
 
Isn't abstract existence, well a form of existence and not a passive? I mean it is passive, but it's a state of being rather than an ability. Like calling being 5th dimensional a power.
 
I mean yeah, but it still acts as a passive ability.

Also, pretty sure that resisting EE or just attacking him with something like strong mindhax would be easier than killing an Abstract like Shion, if we're going about who's more effective overall.

Hell, pretty some non-Shion 6-Cs can beat him, like Kishin Asura, assuming he starts out of his range.
 
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