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Sonic General Discussion Zone Act 1: New Frontiers

JJSliderman said:
Infinite or endless possibilities don’t mean anything without many worlds theory
Click to expand...
It does mean something, because in shadow the hedgehog, the actions generate ramifications or time lines, besides that in sonic 06 the time lines were said.
and the penguin guy literraly made a blog about MWT in sonic
 
LaserPrecision said:
The definition of limitless can mean multiple things as I had sent earlier (well, I assume it went through, I was tired when I sent it, so maybe I forgot to). It can mean no limits or a lot of. Even if we assume the former, it holds true within Sonic's world.

Sure, they could be reading this right now, let them ask their questions. It's fine.

Except its not argument from ignorance and now you're misusing it. I EXPLICITLY stated there's no proof that it does or DOESN'T exist. You're committing the proving non-existence fallacy by trying to make me prove the non-existence of something: https://www.logicallyfallacious.com/logicalfallacies/Proving-Non-Existence

You're also committing proof by example fallacy by assuming that since some examples of concepts existing in Sonic means EVERY concept exists in Sonic which is entirely irrational reasoning. In addition, you're using argument from ignorance fallacy yourself by assuming that since there's no proof they don't exit that they must exist.

Sure, some authors who don't care much about the lore of their story will say yes if random people tweet them random questions about cosmology if they know a little bit about what is being mentioned. I agree. Which is what I feel makes them less credible, similar to people harassing people who worked on Dragon Ball stuff for random stuff they don't care about or know little about.

It's an answer talking about Sonic's world to a question relating to Sonic's world. It's very much logical to assume it was in reference to Sonic's world when both the question and answer were about Sonic's world. I feel you'd need to be discord debate goon (which is understandable, its funny to do) or be someone who really cares about wanking Sonic to the highest level possible to think otherwise.
Click to expand...

Nope there’s only a few definitions of limitless.

Oxford: without end, limit, or boundary.

Merriam Webster: : without being controlled or stopped : without being limited (without limit)

or

as in infinite
being or seeming to be without limits (limitless)

Dictionary.com: without limit; boundless

Now it can only be four things: size, extent, not being stopped or quantity

Ian Flynn wasn’t talking about where something ends so extent is out, the context of his answer dictates it’s not about how much of something there is so quantity is out and Ian Flynn definitely wasn’t talking about what can or cannot be stopped so that’s out as well however he did talk about how big the dreams were before saying dreams have no limits so size is likely the answer.

Alright

I’m not misusing it you’re shifting the goal post, you were clearly saying it was one thing before and now it’s neither? There are choices now choose. Nonsense you can easily show something doesn’t exist in a fictional series by showing contrary evidence there’s no fallacy there.

That’s not proof by example fallacy that’s just common sense, if you see an octopus in Sonic as an example then that’s proof that an entire species of octopuses are able to exist within the world of Sonic unless there’s proof that octopus is the only one that exists in the entirety of the series.

Except the people asking the Dragon Ball people questions are asking irrelevant authorities, it would make sense if they asked writers or authorities like that but they’re not.

The question asked if all sizes and concepts existed in Fourth Dimensional Space not if all sizes and concepts that exists in Sonic exists in Fourth Dimensional Space this is a semantical goon argument and I personally think you’d need to be in denial to think otherwise. Both assertions made are logical but the difference is how each assertion ties into what the question asker said and meant and my assertion actually does that.

Plus even if we say you’re right, the concepts that were already confirmed to exist in Sonic would make MaginaryWorld Tier 1-0 easy.
 
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Alexander said:
It does mean something, because in shadow the hedgehog, the actions generate ramifications or time lines, besides that in sonic 06 the time lines were said.
and the penguin guy literraly made a blog about MWT in sonic
Click to expand...
Most of the evidence for many worlds was stuff like ‘06 (where timelines can mean time axes/points in time rather than separate universes), and Classic Sonic being from a different dimension now, which was retconned back to him being from the past.

Not enough evidence for many worlds yet.
 
On an unrelated note, should the Paradox Prism have MFTL+ shatter attack speed? It shattered the entire universe in a timeframe of about 34 seconds in-episode, meaning it had to reach the edge of the universe in that time to shatter all of it.
 
JJSliderman said:
Most of the evidence for many worlds was stuff like ‘06 (where timelines can mean time axes/points in time rather than separate universes), and Classic Sonic being from a different dimension now, which was retconned back to him being from the past.

Not enough evidence for many worlds yet.
Click to expand...

The 06 thing should already be enough to prove its existence,also,seriosly,why it will removed the fact that is still sonic from another dimension?
 
JJSliderman said:
On an unrelated note, should the Paradox Prism have MFTL+ shatter attack speed? It shattered the entire universe in a timeframe of about 34 seconds in-episode, meaning it had to reach the edge of the universe in that time to shatter all of it.
Click to expand...
yes,the end of the universe,a universe which is infinite(according to the end there is countless planets,stars and lives)
 
Alexander said:
The 06 thing should already be enough to prove its existence,also,seriosly,why it will removed the fact that is still sonic from another dimension?
Click to expand...
He isn’t from another dimension, they retconned it.

And with ‘06 timelines could just be a mistranslation of time axes.
 
ThatBusyDude said:
Nope there’s only a few definitions of limitless.

Oxford: without end, limit, or boundary.

Merriam Webster: : without being controlled or stopped : without being limited (without limit)

or

as in infinite
being or seeming to be without limits (limitless)

Dictionary.com: without limit; boundless
Click to expand...
You forgot the one I showed earlier
without a limit; very great
Click to expand...

Aside from that, yeah.
ThatBusyDude said:
I’m not misusing it you’re shifting the goal post, you were clearly saying it was one thing before and now it’s neither? There are choices now choose. Nonsense you can easily show something doesn’t exist in a fictional series by showing contrary evidence there’s no fallacy there.
Click to expand...
If I said all concepts didn't exist in Sonic, my mistake. But I clarified in the comment before the one you replied to here that neither could be true without evidence. So this didn't just come out of left field:
LaserPrecision said:
No, Occam's razor doesn't dictate all concepts that exist irl exist in a fictional setting. This can be dismissed via Hitchen's razor anyway. No proof it exists in the world means it can similarly be dismissed without evidence. One can't assert they do or don't exist in the world without evidence supporting either claim.
Click to expand...
Perhaps it would've been better to bold it in the initial comment, but I know a lot of people find it redundant for me to bold messages I refrained from it this time around.

Contrary evidence of every single concept that exists in the world. I'd be here forever in order to do that. Besides, not every concept would have visible contradictions. It'd be like asking me to prove there's not an mouse somewhere off in space 34 lightyears away from Sonic's planet.
ThatBusyDude said:
That’s not proof by example fallacy that’s just common sense, if you see an octopus in Sonic as an example then that’s proof that an entire species of octopuses are able to exist within the world of Sonic unless there’s proof that octopus is the only one that exists in the entirety of the series.
Click to expand...
That is entirely proof by fallacy. Your example also isn't very comparable. What you're saying is that since we saw an Octopus in Sonic's world, that every animal that exists in our world exists in Sonic's. In the case of just Octopus', sure, it's common sense since the Octopus would need bare minimum parents in order to exist and thus multiple would logically exist.
ThatBusyDude said:
Except the people asking the Dragon Ball people questions are asking irrelevant authorities, it would make sense if they asked writers or authorities like that but they’re not.
Click to expand...
That's only part of the issue. Them harassing them for non-serious answers about stuff they hardly know about so they can wank the verse is the bigger issue. They're trying to take claims that likely aren't even viable/trustworthy to try to inflate the cosmology or power of the verse.
ThatBusyDude said:
The question asked if all sizes and concepts existed in Fourth Dimensional Space not if all sizes and concepts that exists in Sonic exists in Fourth Dimensional Space this is a semantical goon argument and I personally think you’d need to be in denial to think otherwise. Both assertions made are logical but the difference is how each assertion ties into what the question asker said and meant and my assertion actually does that.
Click to expand...
The question was about the Sonic verse. By default the presumption is that the question is about the verse. It'd be the equivalent of saying "Hey, in Sonic, is Maginaryworld able to encompass every concept in Sonic?". It's entirely redundant to add that when the question in question is about the series in question. There's nothing semantical about it. This is just common practice when discussing topics. We naturally assume the person is referring to the topic in question, that being the series of Sonic.
ThatBusyDude said:
Plus even if we say you’re right, the concepts that were already confirmed to exist in Sonic would make MaginaryWorld Tier 1-0 easy.
Click to expand...
Which is alright. I just wanna see more people waste their time and money to try and get unreliable statements to try and wank a verse.

Unfortunately I may again need to take a long break before responding due to irl stuff. I may talk elsewhere, but due to it being easier to casually talk with others than having a debate due to current situation.
 
Last edited:
LaserPrecision said:
You forgot the one I showed earlier


Aside from that, yeah.

If I said all concepts didn't exist in Sonic, my mistake. But I clarified in the comment before the one you replied to here that neither could be true without evidence. So this didn't just come out of left field:

Perhaps it would've been better to bold it in the initial comment, but I know a lot of people find it redundant for me to bold messages I refrained from it this time around.

Contrary evidence of every single concept that exists in the world. I'd be here forever in order to do that. Besides, not every concept would have visible contradictions. It'd be like asking me to prove there's not an mouse somewhere off in space 34 lightyears away from Sonic's planet.

That is entirely proof by fallacy. Your example also isn't very comparable. What you're saying is that since we saw an Octopus in Sonic's world, that every animal that exists in our world exists in Sonic's. In the case of just Octopus', sure, it's common sense since the Octopus would need bare minimum parents in order to exist and thus multiple would logically exist.

That's only part of the issue. Them harassing them for non-serious answers about stuff they hardly know about so they can wank the verse is the bigger issue. They're trying to take claims that likely aren't even viable/trustworthy to try to inflate the cosmology or power of the verse.

The question was about the Sonic verse. By default the presumption is that the question is about the verse. It'd be the equivalent of saying "Hey, in Sonic, is Maginaryworld able to encompass every concept in Sonic?". It's entirely redundant to add that when the question in question is about the series in question. There's nothing semantical about it. This is just common practice when discussing topics. We naturally assume the person is referring to the topic in question, that being the series of Sonic.

Which is alright. I just wanna see more people waste their time and money to try and get unreliable statements to try and wank a verse.
Click to expand...
And what’s the source? I don’t remember seeing it.

Oh, the context doesn’t fit the latter.

Alright.

You wouldn’t be here forever, regardless if you’re going to assert something you have to prove it otherwise it’s Hitchens Razor regardless of how long it would take. The mouse example doesn’t work because there would need to be reason to assert there is a mouse out there, there’s a possibility that there is a mouse out there but asserting that it’s correct because it’s possible would be appeal to possibility would it not?

So you’re now going to say I claimed something I never said? I never said every ANIMAL exists in Sonic’s world by proxy of one octopus existing, I said an entire species of octopus exists in Sonic by proxy of an octopus being shown to exist that’s common sense. Things like the concepts of duality and plurality (which basically contains every other concept) is implied to exist by Ian

My issue is they’re not even linking up the right authority although what you said also holds true.

Like I said, what we both said is logical, both interpretations are tie and knot in terms of how they can tie into the context of the question. It would just be best to ask the original question asker what he/she meant then go around in circles.

Yeah but should I really note some of the things that would put the verse at Tier 1-0?

Concepts of Higher Dimensions

Concepts Of Physical Dimensions


Dimensions within Dimensions

All concepts of Sets and Sequences

Concepts of Mathematics

Concepts Of Arithmetic

Concepts of Numbers

Concepts of Logical Operators

Concepts of Duality and Plurality

Level 4 Multiverse

Concepts of Parallel Universes

Transfinite Mathematics

Modal Realism

I’m not sure if I named everything but you get the general idea. Sonic doesn’t need all concepts to get Tier 1-0 but your thoughts are fair enough.
 
ThatBusyDude said:
And what’s the source? I don’t remember seeing it.

Oh, the context doesn’t fit the latter.

Alright.

You wouldn’t be here forever, regardless if you’re going to assert something you have to prove it otherwise it’s Hitchens Razor regardless of how long it would take. The mouse example doesn’t work because there would need to be reason to assert there is a mouse out there, there’s a possibility that there is a mouse out there but asserting that it’s correct because it’s possible would be appeal to possibility would it not?

So you’re now going to say I claimed something I never said? I never said every ANIMAL exists in Sonic’s world by proxy of one octopus existing, I said an entire species of octopus exists in Sonic by proxy of an octopus being shown to exist that’s common sense. Things like the concepts of duality and plurality (which basically contains every other concept) is implied to exist by Ian

My issue is they’re not even linking up the right authority although what you said also holds true.

Like I said, what we both said is logical, both interpretations are tie and knot in terms of how they can tie into the context of the question. It would just be best to ask the original question asker what he/she meant then go around in circles.

Yeah but should I really note some of the things that would put the verse at Tier 1-0?

Concepts of Higher Dimensions

Concepts Of Physical Dimensions


Dimensions within Dimensions

All concepts of Sets and Sequences

Concepts of Mathematics

Concepts Of Arithmetic

Concepts of Numbers

Concepts of Logical Operators

Concepts of Duality and Plurality

Level 4 Multiverse

Concepts of Parallel Universes

Transfinite Mathematics

Modal Realism

I’m not sure if I named everything but you get the general idea. Sonic doesn’t need all concepts to get Tier 1-0 but your thoughts are fair enough.
Click to expand...

who you are,wixzers from csap?
 
JJSliderman said:
Maybe focus on getting game to 2-A before starting on platonic concepts.
Click to expand...
Platonic Forms are 1-A in most sites not Low 1-C to 1-C. But I agree we should move up the ladder one or two at a time.

Someone should make a content revision thread on 2-A Sonic on Endless Possibilities and Modal Realism (which would make those possibilities actual worlds) existing in Sonic. Then we can talk about moving up.
 
I feel Ian was referring more to the concept of parallel universes existing in general, rather than a many worlds theory equivalent
 
ThatBusyDude said:
Platonic Forms are 1-A in most sites not Low 1-C to 1-C. But I agree we should move up the ladder one or two at a time.

Someone should make a content revision thread on 2-A Sonic on Endless Possibilities and Modal Realism (which would make those possibilities actual worlds) existing in Sonic. Then we can talk about moving up.
Click to expand...
sonic prime.
there is a apparences of a ancient creature who is part of a clan that is in charge of the paradox prism,he says:
the shatterverse is a much bigger place than you think, there are not 10, nor 20, nor 100, nor a thousand, it is like a crystal that generates infinite reflections,but the same crystal is increased into infinite
 
JJSliderman said:
I feel Ian was referring more to the concept of parallel universes existing in general, rather than a many worlds theory equivalent
Click to expand...
Lets say he was: that would still be 2-A. Concepts of Parallel Universes exists in Sonic as well with the fourth dimension book which you can argue is canon.
 
Alexander said:
sonic prime.
there is a apparences of a ancient creature who is part of a clan that is in charge of the paradox prism,he says:
the shatterverse is a much bigger place than you think, there are not 10, nor 20, nor 100, nor a thousand, it is like a crystal that generates infinite reflections,but the same crystal is increased into infinite
Click to expand...
Got a scan?
 
ThatBusyDude said:
Lets say he was: that would still be 2-A. Concepts of Parallel Universes exists in Sonic as well with the fourth dimension book which you can argue is canon.
Click to expand...
Why would that be true, parallel universes existing doesn’t mean there’s an infinite amount by default.
 
JJSliderman said:
This is for Archie.
Click to expand...
Why would that matter? He still used infinite possibilities to say the multiverse itself is infinite. So if infinite possibilities is what makes a multiverse infinite in his eyes and he says Game Sonic has infinite possibilities then that refers to universes most likely.
 
ThatBusyDude said:
Why would that matter? He still used infinite possibilities to say the multiverse itself is infinite. So if infinite possibilities is what makes a multiverse infinite in his eyes and he says Game Sonic has infinite possibilities then that refers to universes most likely.
Click to expand...
In addition he’s also used infinite possibilities to describe the multiverse
 
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