Some "new" abilities for Rimuru and a new physiology

[Berga14]

HI everyone,

I'm here because recently the otl translation of Vol 18 came out and...
We already added basically everything with MTL translation from Slime reader... So now is time for Vol 19!

I decided to do this because there are already several abilities and pages that use things from Vol 19, like Rimuru immeasurable perception speed (Rimuru literally got full immeasurable speed 3 pages after perception speed!
...
so why didn't he get full imm speed from the start?!).

So here the new things:
A digital lifeform physiology
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...Form_Physiology_sandbox?useskin=fandomdesktop


And here all the abilities for Rimuru:
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User:Berga14/Rimuruvol19sandbox?useskin=fandomdesktop

STAFF ONLY

Agree:

Nutral:

Disagree:

 

[Berga14]

So... i'm quite sure i did this crt in a sendbox... idk why this is here.
Anyway, now this thing is here so sorry for my english

 

[Mizuki67]

i will give my thoughts on Rimuru's additions later.

Berga14/Digital LifeForm Physiology sandbox

vsbattles.fandom.com

Everything here looks fine I suppose. I changed some of the wording to make it more clear. Tbh i would prefer to wait a little longer for volume 19 OTL, though, I think most of the translation made by Slime Reader are pretty accurate in my experience. Also I dont think you need to put Greater and all those stuff there. We can argue if there are any possible layers later.

 

[Tempestdragon6]

i will give my thoughts on Rimuru's additions later.



Everything here looks fine I suppose. I changed some of the wording to make it more clear. Tbh i would prefer to wait a little longer for volume 19 OTL, though, I think most of the translation made by Slime Reader are pretty accurate in my experience. Also I dont think you need to put Greater and all those stuff there. We can argue if there are any possible layers later.

I'll give my thoughts later at night

 

[Mizuki67]

i will give my thoughts on Rimuru's additions later.



Everything here looks fine I suppose. I changed some of the wording to make it more clear. Tbh i would prefer to wait a little longer for volume 19 OTL, though, I think most of the translation made by Slime Reader are pretty accurate in my experience. Also I dont think you need to put Greater and all those stuff there. We can argue if there are any possible layers later.

Oh wait no I take back what I said lol. Actually I do not agree with Resurrection Negation, as the only logical way to explain it is that Time is Stopped and Power Null was being Involved here. However I think Regen Negation can be argued here by explaining that it stops everything including the process of Regeneration.

 

[Berga14]

Tbh i would prefer to wait a little longer for volume 19 OTL, though,

Well, Vol 19 MTL is already used in several character's account and pages so i don't see a real reason to stop at half of the work.

Also I dont think you need to put Greater and all those stuff there. We can argue if there are any possible layers later.

I'm not to sure on how to handle layers when time stop is involved so i was planning on talking about them later on the layer evaluation thread. (And i need to ask to the guy that did those abilities wording as well (Astral))

 

[Mizuki67]

Well, Vol 19 MTL is already used in several character's account and pages so i don't see a real reason to stop at half of the work.

It was used. Yes but we only use it for supporting evidence and such. Just to let u know we also have some evidence from other otl regarding our immeasurable speed, but I don't have a problem with Slime Reader tbh because it is made by most reliable translator

Well, Vol 19 MTL is already used in several character's account and pages so i don't see a real reason to stop at half of the work.



I'm not to sure on how to handle layers when time stop is involved so i was planning on talking about them later on the layer evaluation thread. (And i need to ask to the guy that did those abilities wording as well (Astral))

Layers are handled by the Layering Evaluation Thread. You just need to get Glassman to check it and that is it.

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Looks well.

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

AIright, Iets see what we got

• Abstract Existence (Type 1)
  • Information (Type 2 - Digital Lifeforms exist purely in the form of Information Particles[5]. Information particle and information are the fundamental aspect of Tensura and all things such as Mind, Soul, and Abstract things like Skills are made up of it.[1][2][3] Information particles in Tensura also serves as the root of the world.[4])

BasicaIIy, we aIready give cores AE on both Information and concepts, and you know how cores are made pureIy of Information particIes, I think this shouId be both Info Type 2 and Concept Type 1 - Type 1 because IP couId stiII exist at EoST

Agree with everything eIse on the DIf page
AdditionaIIy, I think we couId try for passive info + quantum manip because even the basic actions of DIfs invoIve moving/interfering with IP in suspended worId

• Regeneration Negation (Low-Godly - Micheal was unable to regenerate his body from Rimuru's attack)

ShouIdnt it be higher considering that he devoured MichaeI as a whoIe, not just a part of it, where MichaeI is entireIy made of Information ParticIes as per being a DIf/Manas?

• Immortality negation ( Type 8 - killed Michael, who had both Velzard and Velgrynd cores. Also, Micheal is a Spiritual LIfeForm and thus he can regenerate/resurrect as long as his core is not destroyed or he runs out of magicules)

Not sure about this one, since since he aIready devoured him as a whoIe, that shouId incIude his core, no?

Time Manipulation:

• With Fixation, the user, can fix something into its current state, effectively locking it inside of temporal stasis. (Didn't found enought information for this one, it has something to do with Snow Cristal. For now ignore this or give some opinion)

Did some research on the meaning of said word, and its one of the foIIowing two things :

• Stopping fIow of time
• Putting someone in Suspended Animation; akin to a more focused time-stop that revoIves around putting seIected target/s in a suspended state, instead of suspending the worId itseIf

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

Oh wait no I take back what I said lol. Actually I do not agree with Resurrection Negation, as the only logical way to explain it is that Time is Stopped and Power Null was being Involved here. However I think Regen Negation can be argued here by explaining that it stops everything including the process of Regeneration.

Power NuII preventing resurrection is exactIy what resurrection negation is
AIso, we consider High GodIy resurrection characters as being abIe to resurrecting even after the destruction of their reaIity as a space-time continuum, same as regen, so their regen/resurrection shouIdnt be affected by time in generaI

Which means this is a genuine negation of said abiIity

 

[Mizuki67]

Power NuII preventing resurrection is exactIy what resurrection negation is
AIso, we consider High GodIy resurrection characters as being abIe to resurrecting even after the destruction of their reaIity as a space-time continuum, same as regen, so their regen/resurrection shouIdnt be affected by time in generaI

Which means this is a genuine negation of said abiIity

That explains it but I was told that power null and regen/resurrection negation should not be treated as the same thing. I think I am just confused about the whole thing. Why did yuuki hgr negation got removed then isn't he preventing the regeneration skill of Shion's

 

[Berga14]

cores are made pureIy of Information particIes

True, AE can just be thaken away then.

passive

Yeah, but i like enhaced as well... is olay to put both?

ShouIdnt it be higher considering that he devoured MichaeI as a whoIe, not just a part of it, where MichaeI is entireIy made of Information ParticIes as per being a DIf/Manas?

It is probably higher but there are no feats for Micheal regeneration so for now i used basic slf regeneration. Also this reg negation isn't about Rimuru devouring Micheal with Void God (which happens some sentences later) but it is about the effect that That new sword tecnique has on Micheal.

Not sure about this one, since since he aIready devoured him as a whoIe, that shouId incIude his core, no?

When Rimuru devour Micheal is exactly when he kills him

Did some research on the meaning of said word, and its one of the foIIowing two things :

• Stopping fIow of time
• Putting someone in Suspended Animation; akin to a more focused time-stop that revoIves around putting seIected target/s in a suspended state, instead of suspending the worId itseIf

Yeah i know that, what i'm saying is that i haven't found any feats or explanation within the LN...

 

[Mizuki67]

True, AE can just be thaken away then.

He ask you to add concept 1 as well not throw it away

 

[Mizuki67]

It is probably higher but there are no feats for Micheal regeneration so for now i used basic slf regeneration. Also this reg negation isn't about Rimuru devouring Micheal with Void God (which happens some sentences later) but it is about the effect that That new sword tecnique has on Micheal.

Rimuru Absorption ability allows him to absorb the astral,spiritual body, including the heart it self which is already beyond the regeneration ability slf have. You cannot say it is just low godly my guy. We also had the fact that dlf turns their entire body to information particles

 

[Mizuki67]

Rimuru Absorption ability allows him to absorb the astral,spiritual body, including the heart it self. You cannot say it is just low godly my guy.

I might be making a debunk or upgrade that Absorption is regen negation in general, but not now

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

That explains it but I was told that power null and regen/resurrection negation should not be treated as the same thing. I think I am just confused about the whole thing. Why did yuuki hgr negation got removed then isn't he preventing the regeneration skill of Shion's

I think it was because he onIy did it temporariIy, but I dont compIeteIy understand either, since the abiIity page itseIf says the effect can be temporary

True, AE can just be thaken away then.

???
I suggested to add AE CM1 aIong with AE Info 2, not remove it

Yeah, but i like enhaced as well... is olay to put both?

I think so, since both mean compIeteIy different things
Enhanced wouId be cuz they can do it far better then non-DIfs, and passive wouId be cuz every one of their actions invoIve interference with IP

It is probably higher but there are no feats for Micheal regeneration so for now i used basic slf regeneration. Also this reg negation isn't about Rimuru devouring Micheal with Void God (which happens some sentences later) but it is about the effect that That new sword tecnique has on Micheal.

I know that part, but then there aIso comes another thing
SIfs had Iow godIy regen based on being abIe to regen their physicaI body, but DIfs themseIves are entireIy Information particIes, so maybe Iimited HGR or something?

When Rimuru devour Micheal is exactly when he kills him

And that is the point, the process invoIved here is one where Rimuru devours michaeI beyond the point where his Immo Type 8 couId work, which shouIdnt be negation
Tho I may be wrong in this part itseIf

 

[Berga14]

I suggested to add AE CM1 aIong with AE Info 2, not remove it

All dlf will get slf physiology as well so they will already have AE info 2 and conceptual 1.

SIfs had Iow godIy regen based on being abIe to regen their physicaI body, but DIfs themseIves are entireIy Information particIes, so maybe Iimited HGR or something?

The problem is that we never seen any dlf performing any regeneration (except a thing from Luminas in vol 21, but not many info from it). But DLF are SLF so tecnically at least low godly is garanted. Now, i don't know what is "regenerate a body that is made of the additional element that gives high godly whitout being able to regenerate the things that you need to regenerate for getting mid godly"

beyond the point where his Immo Type 8 couId work, which shouIdnt be negation

I don't think there is a "beyond the point", what gives type 8 is already the most inner part of a Slf so there isn't anything to devour other than that. Also his body was already being disintegrated so Rimuru used "soul devourer" (or whatever that Void God's sub skill is called) which works on the soul (astral body, core and all that shit) to devour and kill Micheal.

 

[Mizuki67]

The problem is that we never seen any dlf performing any regeneration (except a thing from Luminas in vol 21, but not many info from it). But DLF are SLF so tecnically at least low godly is garanted. Now, i don't know what is "regenerate a body that is made of the additional element that gives high godly whitout being able to regenerate the things that you need to regenerate for getting mid godly"

You can put low godly regen Negation but Rimuru Absorption already works on the spiritual,Astral body, soul and the heart which is already beyond that point so I don't think it is low godly regen negation imo since Absorption should work by absorbing someone entire body in general regardless if they can fully regen from it or not

 

[Tatsumi504]

Even after code told y'all not to wank...

Power Nullification, Regeneration Negation and Resurrection Negation (High Godly; Information, Conceptual; Suspended World makes it impossible to use any magicule based skills including abilities like regeneration or resurrection , and this would also apply to Digital Lifeforms who are not affected by time and can move in the Suspended World.[9]; Suspended World could effectively defeat Diablo by preventing him from resurrecting, and should have stopped Shion's regeneration as everything including cells or every physical and spiritual presence should have stopped moving, leaving injuries open as they are; Rimuru who could perceive the Suspended World admitted that he wouldn't be able to deal with Michael attack and would try to fight again "Next Time". In other words, he had no choice but to return to a later point only if the Suspended World has been released, Diablo is a Spiritual Lifeform and a Primordial Demon, Primordial Demons can resurrect even from destruction of their Heart Core, and Diablo is a step ahead by being able to revive "Instantly" after Death; Both Shion and Rimuru have Infinite Regeneration, a magic based skill that lets one regenerate as long as they have magicules left, allowing one to regenerate from even Melt Slash, an attack that works on the same principle as Disintegration, that destroys all Physical and Spiritual Presence, including the Physical and Spiritual Body, as well as extending to the Core itself; A Core defines their fundamental information in reality, their Skills, as well as their conceptual self, Destroying the core, would mean true death for Spiritual Lifeforms where they cannot regenerate or resurrect from)

It isn't negating regeneration or resurrection, it's stopping the use of the ability that will regenerate or resurrect them in other words, circumventing it.
There's no context given as to how he defeated diablo, not to mention diablo is still alive isn't he?
The one about stopping cells will be valid though if that's what it is actually doing and even then, it isn't negating their regeneration but circumventing it cause they'll regenerate just fine once the suspended world is lifted.

Durability Negation (Only those who are effected by the time stop will be defenseless, Digital Lifeform, like Information Particles, are unaffected by time stop)

No, all they resist is time stop. Suspended world users don't have some ability that causes these things to happen, it's all a side effect of the time stop. Once you resist the time stop, the rest is meaningless as inertia, laws of physics, intermolecular forces will simply function normally.

Also add a weakness section or note that these are meaningless if the opponent resists time stop. I'll check out Rimuru's stuff later

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

It isn't negating regeneration or resurrection, it's stopping the use of the ability that will regenerate or resurrect them in other words, circumventing it.

Power Nullification, or Negation, is the ability to simply nullify the powers and abilities of others, negating their effects. The mechanisms by which this effect is accomplished and their restrictions vary from character to character, but the ability is often limited to a certain type of power, such as supernatural phenomena in general, or magic. In some cases, an ability can only be negated once it's been used or activated, but in others, powers can be nullified before they're even utilized. The effect may be temporary or permanent, and may be restricted by touch, or be something that the user can apply to any ability they see, or within a field that negates any powers within.
Some characters accomplish these effects through applications of other abilities rather than a standalone ability in itself, such as using Power Modification to render powers useless. In addition, there are characters who combine this ability with Power Mimicry to not just seal the abilities of others, but steal them for themselves; this is known as Power Absorption.

Im surprised peopIe are now forgetting even the definition pages and dont even care to remember them

There's no context given as to how he defeated diablo, not to mention diablo is still alive isn't he?

It expIicitIy stated he was defeated with Time Stop

The one about stopping cells will be valid though if that's what it is actually doing and even then, it isn't negating their regeneration but circumventing it cause they'll regenerate just fine once the suspended world is lifted.

Power Nullification, or Negation, is the ability to simply nullify the powers and abilities of others, negating their effects. The mechanisms by which this effect is accomplished and their restrictions vary from character to character, but the ability is often limited to a certain type of power, such as supernatural phenomena in general, or magic. In some cases, an ability can only be negated once it's been used or activated, but in others, powers can be nullified before they're even utilized. The effect may be temporary or permanent, and may be restricted by touch, or be something that the user can apply to any ability they see, or within a field that negates any powers within.

No, all they resist is time stop. Suspended world users don't have some ability that causes these things to happen, it's all a side effect of the time stop. Once you resist the time stop, the rest is meaningless as inertia, laws of physics, intermolecular forces will simply function normally.

Power Nullification, or Negation, is the ability to simply nullify the powers and abilities of others, negating their effects. The mechanisms by which this effect is accomplished and their restrictions vary from character to character, but the ability is often limited to a certain type of power, such as supernatural phenomena in general, or magic. In some cases, an ability can only be negated once it's been used or activated, but in others, powers can be nullified before they're even utilized. The effect may be temporary or permanent, and may be restricted by touch, or be something that the user can apply to any ability they see, or within a field that negates any powers within.
Some characters accomplish these effects through applications of other abilities rather than a standalone ability in itself, such as using Power Modification to render powers useless. In addition, there are characters who combine this ability with Power Mimicry to not just seal the abilities of others, but steal them for themselves; this is known as Power Absorption.

Also add a weakness section or note that these are meaningless if the opponent resists time stop. I'll check out Rimuru's stuff later

I beIieve it is aIready made cIear in our ImmeasurabIe speed bIog that their abiIity to move in SW is not based pureIy on resistance but instead on the fact that they move at ImmeasurabIe speed, their resistance to time stop is mereIy an extention of their nature

AIso, not aII Time Stops work the same way, so just tipping it of to being abIe to move in it by time stop resistance aIone wouId be insufficient, even more so when our expIanation page aIready expIains how this is not just a reguIar time stop
Edit : For exampIe, one difference is the fact that our Suspended WorId works on AE Concept type 1 beings

 

[Tatsumi504]

Im surprised peopIe are now forgetting even the definition pages and dont even care to remember them

I'm surprised that people keep taking stuff like this out of context. You can negate the skill or the effect but the former isn't regen negation, to have that you need to negate tge effect. This is the same case as with Yuuki's anti-skill, negating the skill that regenerates them isn't negating the regen.
Analogy...x character if destroyed will be regenerated by a higher being, his opponent kills that higher being. This is circumventing not negating regen.

It expIicitIy stated he was defeated with Time Stop

Let me rephrase, "to what extent was he defeated?" Was he beaten blue black, incapacitated, captured, killed, erased and if so on what level? None of that information is given

I beIieve it is aIready made cIear in our ImmeasurabIe speed bIog that their abiIity to move in SW is not based pureIy on resistance but instead on the fact that they move at ImmeasurabIe speed, their resistance to time stop is mereIy an extention of their nature

Send the blog please. Immeasurable speed though doesn't give resistance to time stop last I checked

AIso, not aII Time Stops work the same way, so just tipping it of to being abIe to move in it by time stop resistance aIone wouId be insufficient, even more so when our expIanation page aIready expIains how this is not just a reguIar time stop
Edit : For exampIe, one difference is the fact that our Suspended WorId works on AE Concept type 1 beings

It isn't insufficient. Slime is clearly working off the theory of relativity. If you resist time stop your intermolecular forces won't be stopped either. This isn't a separate ability in anyway

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

I'll come back to review this CRT later, but you need to add references for all the scans being used. I see a good bit of the abilities already do, but a lot are missing.

 

[Mizuki67]

I'll come back to review this CRT later, but you need to add references for all the scans being used. I see a good bit of the abilities already do, but a lot are missing.

we will do that once this has been evaluated. We wanted to wait for @CodeCCLL and Elizhaa opinion on this

 

[Eikichi_Sensei]

I do not agree that all forms of digital life have access to the Suspended World.

There is no scan that all Digital Lifeforms have this ability.

After the Power Nullification it looks good but not the rest (Regeneration and Resurrection)

I'm not sure about type 8 immortality based on Velzard, how can you show that Dragon Fractor is the same as the Core?

Besides, wasn't it through the soul corridor?

I also do not agree with denial of type 8 immortality, it is only Rimuru devouring everything and killing it, that is, I destroy it together with what makes it revive or regenerate. It would have been different if he had only killed his soul, leaving his core intact, and he would not be able to regenerate or resurrect. Which would also give him many things but it didn't happen.

On the other hand, how is the denial of type 9 immortality achieved in this wikki?

 

[Tatsumi504]

On the other hand, how is the denial of type 9 immortality achieved in this wikki?

Severing the connection between the Avatar and the main body

 

[Tempestdragon6]

HI everyone,

I'm here because recently the otl translation of Vol 18 came out and...
We already added basically everything with MTL translation from Slime reader... So now is time for Vol 19!

I decided to do this because there are already several abilities and pages that use things from Vol 19, like Rimuru immeasurable perception speed (Rimuru literally got full immeasurable speed 3 pages after perception speed!
...
so why didn't he get full imm speed from the start?!).

So here the new things:
A digital lifeform physiology
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...Form_Physiology_sandbox?useskin=fandomdesktop


And here all the abilities for Rimuru:
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User:Berga14/Rimuruvol19sandbox?useskin=fandomdesktop

STAFF ONLY

Agree:

Nutral:

Disagree:

agree with everything except one thing the regeneration negation I'm not sure if its hgr or just mgr negation for now

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

I'm surprised that people keep taking stuff like this out of context. You can negate the skill or the effect but the former isn't regen negation, to have that you need to negate tge effect. This is the same case as with Yuuki's anti-skill, negating the skill that regenerates them isn't negating the regen.
Analogy...x character if destroyed will be regenerated by a higher being, his opponent kills that higher being. This is circumventing not negating regen.

And why are you invoIving a higher being here? Their regeneration is based on their own abiIity, not some higher being

the definition page itseIf says negating a skiII/abiIity itseIf to negate its effect is NuIIification, Regeneration is just power NuIIfication to the power we caII regenerationThen again, one couId say its not regen negation if the abiIity was not passive, but thats not the case, since here they are, in fact, passive

What they are doing here is :
Suspended WorId makes it unabIe to use magic-based abiIities :- Their regenerative abiIity caIIed infinite regeneration which is magic-based :- Suspended WorId makes it impossibIe to use said abiIity, thus preventing its regenerative effect as weII in the process


The anaIogy is not that compIex here that you cant understand

Let me rephrase, "to what extent was he defeated?" Was he beaten blue black, incapacitated, captured, killed, erased and if so on what level? None of that information is given

if you checked the aIready accepted detaiIs in Rimuru's resurrection description in his profiIe, you wiII see that Rimuru was taIking about stiII being abIe to resurrect himseIf through VeIdora in context to DiabIo being defeated, which mean DiabIo here, in fact, was indeed rendered to a state where he was

AdditionaIIy, it is aIready stated in the PhysioIogy page that the onIy effective way to defeat a spirituaI Iifeform is to destroy their core, which prevents them from regenerating or resurrecting, yet in DiabIo;s case he can resurrect stiII, and at that, instantIy, yet he actuaIIy defeated this time

Send the blog please. Immeasurable speed though doesn't give resistance to time stop last I checked

here, accepted here and here

It isn't insufficient. Slime is clearly working off the theory of relativity. If you resist time stop your intermolecular forces won't be stopped either. This isn't a separate ability in anyway

It doesn’t work like that, you have to transform your body into information particles that are not affect by time and space.
«No problem. It turns out that information particles are unaffected by time or space and can transmit information to any point in time. This means that they can transmit thoughts even in a suspended world.» vol 19

«If it is a spiritual life form, then they must have transformed all matter into ‘information particles,’ thereby resulting in a Digital Lifeform.» vol 19

you can find both these scans in the imm speed expIanation page

There is no such case of molecules moving in Suspended world, all force physical force stop work in this time stop you cannot even take movement by pushing the ground since there is no resistance.
The body, which is under the control of the will, is like a molecule that is being scraped through. Therefore, it is not possible to gain propulsive force by kicking the earth. The impact of the force will directly gouge the earth, and the foot will be taken off the ground, just like Dagruel's foot. In the Suspended World, the laws of physics do not apply.
Even if there are magical laws, almost all of them will be ineffective. It was only natural that the battle under such special conditions would be different from the usual situation.
And obviously there the « is like a molecule that is being scraped through. » is just an analogy don’t try to counter argument with that, not to mention that Suspended world also stops magic, has a greater range than standard time stop and etc, stops characters from regenerating or resurrecting even when said characters have an HGR IeveI regen or resurrection, which in itseIf is independent of time as it aIIows a character to regenerate even after the destruction of the space-time continuum

Fiction does not always treat time stop the same way otherwise using tensura logic in jojo time stop character would not been able to walk normally on the ground…

 

[Tatsumi504]

And why are you invoIving a higher being here? Their regeneration is based on their own abiIity, not some higher being

It was an analogy

the definition page itseIf says negating a skiII/abiIity itseIf to negate its effect is NuIIification, Regeneration is just power NuIIfication to the power we caII regenerationThen again, one couId say its not regen negation if the abiIity was not passive, but thats not the case, since here they are, in fact, passive

Regen negation is power null by nullifying the effect of the ability not the ability itself.
Take wolverine as an example. An attack hits him and he can't regenerate the wounds (regen neg), an attack hits him and suppresses his mutant x gene, stopping his wounds from healing (power null).

What they are doing here is :
Suspended WorId makes it unabIe to use magic-based abiIities :- Their regenerative abiIity caIIed infinite regeneration which is magic-based :- Suspended WorId makes it impossibIe to use said abiIity, thus preventing its regenerative effect as weII in the process

The anaIogy is not that compIex here that you cant understand

Textbook circumvention. To get regen neg you have to negate the regeneration itself not the ability that makes them regen.
Using your reasoning you might as well give someone death manipulation for turning off a life support machine rather than inducing death.

if you checked the aIready accepted detaiIs in Rimuru's resurrection description in his profiIe, you wiII see that Rimuru was taIking about stiII being abIe to resurrect himseIf through VeIdora in context to DiabIo being defeated, which mean DiabIo here, in fact, was indeed rendered to a state where he was

Still says nothing as to what extent he was defeated, doesn't even say he was killed.
That's the problem with slime pages, you take one thing and twist it to justify something unrelated.
Skills like infinite regeneration already stop working in the suspended world so of course he needs the soul corridor to come back.
These leaps in logic just feels like it might give me a headache, not to mention for everything you're trying to use defeating diablo to justify, diablo is still alive and well.

AdditionaIIy, it is aIready stated in the PhysioIogy page that the onIy effective way to defeat a spirituaI Iifeform is to destroy their core, which prevents them from regenerating or resurrecting, yet in DiabIo;s case he can resurrect stiII, and at that, instantIy, yet he actuaIIy defeated this time

Diablo can be sealed, knocked out, tied up, killed/erased temporarily etc. Nothing implies permanent erasure and if so, why is he still alive? How did he come back if suspended world negates his immortality?

here, accepted here and here

Yeah the blog says they can move in rime stop because IP isn't bound by space and time. This is resistance by virtue of resistance not immeasurable speed. My point still stands.

Fiction does not always treat time stop the same way otherwise using tensura logic in jojo time stop character would not been able to walk normally on the ground…

Yeah and I'm not against tensura time stop having that effect as it's been shown however, they don't resist those effects directly, they resist time stop.

My point has been made, I won't be replying again

 

[Berga14]

I'm not sure about type 8 immortality based on Velzard, how can you show that Dragon Fractor is the same as the Core?

What Rimuru uses for type 8 is the factor, i don't remeber if the two are the same, but i think they are. Anyway, what i think isn't important because Rimuru got velzard factor.

I also do not agree with denial of type 8 immortality, it is only Rimuru devouring everything and killing it, that is, I destroy it together with what makes it revive or regenerate. It would have been different if he had only killed his soul, leaving his core intact, and he would not be able to regenerate or resurrect. Which would also give him many things but it didn't happen.

Micheal had both Velzard and Velgrynd factors. So he would have been fine as long as at least 1 of the 2 was alive. Both were alive when Rimuru killed Micheal. We can take the basic SLF type 8 justification out of the equation.

 

[Eikichi_Sensei]

What Rimuru uses for type 8 is the factor, i don't remeber if the two are the same, but i think they are. Anyway, what i think isn't important because Rimuru got velzard factor.


Micheal had both Velzard and Velgrynd factors. So he would have been fine as long as at least 1 of the 2 was alive. Both were alive when Rimuru killed Micheal. We can take the basic SLF type 8 justification out of the equation.

Yes, I still disagree, I don't see type 8 immortality via Velzard for Rimuru, since it is via soul corridor.

Dragon Factor is not a core so I still disagree with the denial, Ciel can separate cores so I don't think it would be any different if he could separate Dragon Factor from Velzard.

I honestly don't see the Immortality Negation to type 8.

Also I made a CRT, so the type 8 immortality Negation thing may happen in my thread.

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

It was an analogy

Which was IrreIevant to this case in itseIf

Regen negation is power null by nullifying the effect of the ability not the ability itself.
Take wolverine as an example. An attack hits him and he can't regenerate the wounds (regen neg), an attack hits him and suppresses his mutant x gene, stopping his wounds from healing (power null).

A passive abiIity in itseIf is something that is aIways active, stoping that abiIity by itseIf wouId stop nuIIify its effect as weII,

Power Nullification, or Negation, is the ability to simply nullify the powers and abilities of others, negating their effects

So no, you are wrong in the assumption that it can onIy work by negating the effect and not the abiIity itseIf

Textbook circumvention. To get regen neg you have to negate the regeneration itself not the ability that makes them regen.
Using your reasoning you might as well give someone death manipulation for turning off a life support machine rather than inducing death.

Again, NuIIification itseIf is just negating the abiIity in order to negate its effect, aII I am doing is foIIowing the definition page
Your exampIe itseIf doesnt match this case in any way, in your exampIe the character is turning off a machine, that itseIf needs its own process, in my case, however, its an intrinsic passive abiIity, not some externaI machine

Still says nothing as to what extent he was defeated, doesn't even say he was killed.
That's the problem with slime pages, you take one thing and twist it to justify something unrelated.

When suspended worId is activated, aII forces become 0, just a sIight touch wiII make the body itseIf coIIapse in an instant, even the sIight aftershock of a battIe

ReaIIy now? If you are so dissatisfied or disagree with our pages, go ahead and create a debunk thread, there is no point in mentioning that in this thread to begin with
otherwise this is just you bIaming our vaIidity without any proof

Skills like infinite regeneration already stop working in the suspended world so of course he needs the soul corridor to come back.

And that is the point to begin with, Suspended WorId makes it impossibIe to use such abiIities as they are magic based, require magicuIes to function

Some characters accomplish these effects through applications of other abilities rather than a standalone ability in itself, such as using Power Modification to render powers useless. In addition, there are characters who combine this ability with Power Mimicry to not just seal the abilities of others, but steal them for themselves; this is known as Power Absorption.

These leaps in logic just feels like it might give me a headache, not to mention for everything you're trying to use defeating diablo to justify, diablo is still alive and well.

It is not pureIy based on DiabIo, we aIso have shion;s case described as if normaIIy it shouId not be possibIe, Rimuru;s case where he wouId need to retort to his resurrection instead of regeneration, even when his regenerative abiIity can regenerate him from compIete destruction of souI, core and ego
To begin with, defeating a demon in the first pIace means you have to destroy their core, otherwise its not a defeat to begin with - Source : VoIume 17

Diablo can be sealed, knocked out, tied up, killed/erased temporarily etc. Nothing implies permanent erasure and if so, why is he still alive? How did he come back if suspended world negates his immortality?

He didnt come back to begin with, not untiI suspended worId was deactivated at Ieast
Nothing here suggests a seaIing abiIity, even more so when MichaeI hasnt even shown a seaIing abiIity that works on UItimate IeveI existences, that is, thus, out of the question
For the erasure part, expIained in the above part

Yeah the blog says they can move in rime stop because IP isn't bound by space and time. This is resistance by virtue of resistance not immeasurable speed. My point still stands.

Did you even read the bIog?

• Resisting time stop doesn't give infinite speed
  • Answer: Time Stop in the verse can be ignored by sheer speed and it is also due to the nature of Information Particles that are unbounded and unaffected by space and time, those who have transformed their whole body into Information Particles (Digital Lifeform) have both of these, still this is not important because Information Particles moves beyond linear time.

It is cIearIy saying speed, not resistance, even the fact that they are unbounded by space and time is due to their sheer speed

Yeah and I'm not against tensura time stop having that effect as it's been shown however, they don't resist those effects directly, they resist time stop.

My point has been made, I won't be replying again

Suit yourseIf

 

[CodeCCLL]

I'll take a look at the first opportunity.

 

[Berga14]

Yes, I still disagree, I don't see type 8 immortality via Velzard for Rimuru, since it is via soul corridor.

Dragon Factor is not a core so I still disagree with the denial, Ciel can separate cores so I don't think it would be any different if he could separate Dragon Factor from Velzard.

I deleted imm 8.
And imm 8 negation.
(I need to do some more researc about immo 8 negation and i like the one in your thread more so mine can just be deleted for now)

 

[CodeCCLL]

Firstly, given that Digital Lifeforms are also Spiritual Lifeforms, the Digital Lifeform Physiology should be included on the Spiritual Lifeform Physiology page, a separate page is quite unnecessary.

I should also point out that it is not nice that the context of all the newly brought scans has been completely clipped, when you make new scans from now on, please scan in a way that people can get an idea of the context.

Enhaced Quantum Manipulation and Information Manipulation (Type 2 - Digital Lifeforms directly manipulate information and information particles, everything, from their existence to their actions is based on the manipulation of information and information particles. Information particle and information are the fundamental aspect of Tensura and all things such as Mind, Soul, and Abstract things like Skills are made up of it.[1][2][3] Information particles in Tensura also serves as the root of the world.[4])

This is obvious.

Abstract Existence (Type 1)
Information (Type 2 - Digital Lifeforms exist purely in the form of Information Particles[5]. Information particle and information are the fundamental aspect of Tensura and all things such as Mind, Soul, and Abstract things like Skills are made up of it.[1][2][3] Information particles in Tensura also serves as the root of the world.[4])

We do not treat information particles as information type 2 or concept type 1. Information particles are just quantum particles, that's all. The reason why the core is conceptual is because the narrative of the core implies it (as a whole) and it is also informational in the sense that it contains the information that the information particles carry, but it never means that the information particles themselves are information or concepts.

Therefore, since Digital Lifeforms are no different from Spiritual Lifeforms in terms of metaphysical aspects, there is no need for an extra AE part for Digital Lifeforms.

Beyond-Dimensional Existence (Type 1 - Information Particles transcend Space and Time, and are unaffected by it in any way, which extends to them being able to resist the time being stopped up to exist at the End of Space and Time, where both Space and Time have ended)

This can be taken as a reference for the context of the scans.

Immeasurable speed for Tensura

vsbattles.fandom.com

I'm pretty sure the case here is Zero Dimensionalty rather than BDE Type 1.

Beyond-Dimensional Existence on this wiki refers to the state of being of characters who exist outside, and are independent of, space and its dimensions. This is different from Zero-Dimensionality in that a zero dimensional thing is still spatial in nature, but simply lacks more than zero extension in any dimension.

Zero-dimensionality or zero-dimensional existence is the power to be a singular point, whose nature is something infinitely small in any direction. They are virtually impossible to destroy physically, yet they exist.

Possible Uses
By virtue of being infinitely small a singular point is nearly undetectable, impossible to interact with and can not be split into smaller parts. Because of this, it cannot be destroyed physically in a conventional sense.

Depending on the context, such as whether or not the object is an isolated singular point or a single point on a dimensional plane, the object may or may not be completely invulnerable to the physical strength of a being with more than 0 dimensions. However each case must be viewed carefully.

Relevant scans:

Negative. As it stands currently, this is not possible. We do not have access to the data particles, the smallest unit we can interact with. Raphael could unlock the Unlimited Imprisonment as well, but since we couldn’t access the information inside, that was all it could do. Veldora, who came back to life all by himself, was apparently a unique exception.

“All right! In that case, let me reassign that access. You have my permission to do whatever you want, Rimuru!”

...Huh?!

Just as I was pondering what to do, Chronoa gave me quite the unexpected offer.
—Volume 11, Chapter 5

These data particles were even smaller than spiritual particles, she explained, their mass about as close to zero as you could get, and they were found in everything that existed in the world. It was possible to observe data particles, although it was limited to spaces like inside my Stomach and Chronoa’s Unlimited Imprisonment. They were the units Raphael apparently worked with when organizing my skill sets. Now that I had the permission of the Unlimited Imprisonment’s owner, Raphael had the right to interact with it. Report. Consent received. Commencing intervention.
—Volume 11, Chapter 5

Hmm, hmm. Which means it's even possible to interfere with 'informants."

There was no light, no sound.

A stop world where you can't grasp anything.

If they wanted to recognize the inside of it, they had no choice but to interfere with a special substance smaller than the spiritual particles, smaller than photons, that led to the very foundation of the world.

Even Luminus could understand that the substance was the "informant" Ultima referred to

"If you can move this 'informant' freely, you'll be able to move even when it stops, won't you?"

"You're right. I think I've already gotten a feel for it." —Volume 21, Chapter 1

So Information Particles must be zero-dimensional as quantum particles that make up everything in the world, including photons, and cannot be interacted with/intervened/interfered, and they are not affected by space-time because they are only quantum particles in the form of a spatial point in their nature.
If desired, I can write the necessary explanations for the Zero-Dimensionality.

Suspended World: A series of abilities for all Suspended World users, Digital Lifeforms are Suspended World users:

We have no information that all Digital Lifeforms are Suspended World users, so this section needs to be removed completely.

But of course, let's take a look at the content of Suspended World.

Time Stop (2-A Range; Suspended World stops time across all worlds[6])

This is obvious.

Greater Physics Manipulation and Durability Negation (There is no concept of "Defense" in the Suspended World, as a result, any attack towards something will make them collapse completely in an instant, as all forces come to a halt without exception, including the force of Inertia, Intermolecular forces, Attraction and Repulsion force, extending to all Laws of Physics, allowing only and only one Law to exist in the Suspended World, the Law of Cause and Effect[7][8])

Since the "Greater" part is used to express hax layers, it is meaningless here, so it should be removed, otherwise it is good.

Power Nullification, Regeneration Negation and Resurrection Negation (High Godly; Information, Conceptual; Suspended World makes it impossible to use any magicule based skills including abilities like regeneration or resurrection , and this would also apply to Digital Lifeforms who are not affected by time and can move in the Suspended World.[9]; Suspended World could effectively defeat Diablo by preventing him from resurrecting, and should have stopped Shion's regeneration as everything including cells or every physical and spiritual presence should have stopped moving, leaving injuries open as they are; Rimuru who could perceive the Suspended World admitted that he wouldn't be able to deal with Michael attack and would try to fight again "Next Time". In other words, he had no choice but to return to a later point only if the Suspended World has been released, Diablo is a Spiritual Lifeform and a Primordial Demon, Primordial Demons can resurrect even from destruction of their Heart Core, and Diablo is a step ahead by being able to revive "Instantly" after Death; Both Shion and Rimuru have Infinite Regeneration, a magic based skill that lets one regenerate as long as they have magicules left, allowing one to regenerate from even Melt Slash, an attack that works on the same principle as Disintegration, that destroys all Physical and Spiritual Presence, including the Physical and Spiritual Body, as well as extending to the Core itself; A Core defines their fundamental information in reality, their Skills, as well as their conceptual self, Destroying the core, would mean true death for Spiritual Lifeforms where they cannot regenerate or resurrect from)

Tensura WN Upgrade

Hoping to get noticed this time as my previous CRT went unnoticed by any staff. A.Existence Erasure Veldora possess an aura that has the ability to eliminate existence. This is evident when Rimuru swallows Veldora and he is repeatedly wiped out and feels pain despite the fact that he is...

vsbattles.com

I've made a comment this, before for the WN continuity version of this situation, but currently I'm not against listing powernull in profiles as a side effect of time stop and I agree with the powernull part.

However, I agree with Tatsumi about the regeneration negation (and resistance to durability negation)
[https://vsbattles.com/threads/some-new-abilities-for-rimuru-and-a-new-physiology.169201/post-6598389]
[https://vsbattles.com/threads/some-new-abilities-for-rimuru-and-a-new-physiology.169201/post-6599534]
These two comments raise questions that need to be asked and answer the OP.

Note: I got sick somehow and can't focus due to coughing fits, so I'll cover the rest tomorrow.

 

[Mizuki67]

However, I agree with Tatsumi about the regeneration negation (and resistance to durability negation)
[https://vsbattles.com/threads/some-new-abilities-for-rimuru-and-a-new-physiology.169201/post-6598389]
[https://vsbattles.com/threads/some-new-abilities-for-rimuru-and-a-new-physiology.169201/post-6599534]
These two comments raise questions that need to be asked and answer the OP.

Although i can somewhat agree that Resurrection negation is not possible. I still do think Regeneration Negation could be possible since there is also an argument that it could stop the process of it from working and it works on those who have hgr level of regeneration

 

[Berga14]

Firstly, given that Digital Lifeforms are also Spiritual Lifeforms, the Digital Lifeform Physiology should be included on the Spiritual Lifeform Physiology page, a separate page is quite unnecessary.

Yeah, that was the idea, still the abilities needs to be accepted.

I should also point out that it is not nice that the context of all the newly brought scans has been completely clipped, when you make new scans from now on, please scan in a way that people can get an idea of the context.

Most of the things that got cutted were useless, anyway i will do that in the future.

Therefore, since Digital Lifeforms are no different from Spiritual Lifeforms in terms of metaphysical aspects, there is no need for an extra AE part for Digital Lifeforms.

I also sayd so in a previous message, just didn't take it away yet.

If desired, I can write the necessary explanations for the Zero-Dimensionality.

Then do that, because your justification for 0D here is just "they are small".

We have no information that all Digital Lifeforms are Suspended World users, so this section needs to be removed completely.

We know that all dlf can move in sw and they benefit from it, we don't know if they all can activate it (even thought i think they can, the problem is about the amount of energy needed). So at most i will still list SW in the physiology, and just changing a bit of the wording in the charcters profile.
Like:
SHION
● DLF PHYSIOLOGY (Can't activate sw)
RIMURU
● DLF PHYSIOLOGY (Complete [or we just don't write anything])


Power null is obvious.
As for resurrection and regeneration, i'm not the one that did the SW abilities so i don't want to involve myself to much (i don't want to maybe do a different reasoning that will make eberything more complicated. So i will ask Astral or we will wait until his answer)

 

[CodeCCLL]

Then do that, because your justification for 0D here is just "they are small".

Based on this reaction, I think I should create a separate crt just for this.

 

[Mizuki67]

I'm pretty sure the case here is Zero Dimensionalty rather than BDE Type 1.


Relevant scans:



So Information Particles must be zero-dimensional as quantum particles that make up everything in the world, including photons, and cannot be interacted with/intervened/interfered, and they are not affected by space-time because they are only quantum particles in the form of a spatial point in their nature.
If desired, I can write the necessary explanations for the Zero-Dimensionality.

okay, yeah no i dont agree with this. The problem is that Information Particles also transcend space and time and it does not occupy space. So, there is no way that this is zero dimensionality. I think you and I will not agree with each other. It is best to wait for Elizhaa input because she also supports bde type 1 for Digital Lifeforms so I won't argue over this subject any further

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

We do not treat information particles as information type 2 or concept type 1. Information particles are just quantum particles, that's all. The reason why the core is conceptual is because the narrative of the core implies it (as a whole) and it is also informational in the sense that it contains the information that the information particles carry, but it never means that the information particles themselves are information or concepts.

Therefore, since Digital Lifeforms are no different from Spiritual Lifeforms in terms of metaphysical aspects, there is no need for an extra AE part for Digital Lifeforms.

If I remember correctIy, we gave HGR info based regen for regenerating from core, which contains Information particIes
doesnt that mean we atm treat it as info type 2?

AIso, we treat core as defining a person;s conceptuaI seIf, however,

• Cores are made of info particIes
• They contain an ego

And with this

• DIfs are made entireIy of info particIes
• They, obv, have Egos as weII

so this is basicaIIy the point why I think they shouId have AE on concepts

I'm pretty sure the case here is Zero Dimensionalty rather than BDE Type 1.
Relevant scans:
So Information Particles must be zero-dimensional as quantum particles that make up everything in the world, including photons, and cannot be interacted with/intervened/interfered, and they are not affected by space-time because they are only quantum particles in the form of a spatial point in their nature.
If desired, I can write the necessary explanations for the Zero-Dimensionality.

Since movement vectors can aIso count as dimensionaI motion, I think 0-DimensionaI beings shouId not be abIe to even move in more then 0-Dimensions, aIthough this is just a specuIation
However, I have 2 more soIid points
First :

• Information particIes are stated to be smaIIer then even a photon, where a photon itseIf, from my research, is a 0-DimensionaI thing
• But the 0-DimensionaI page aIready impIies there cant be anything, that is stiII DimensionaI in nature, yet stiII smaIIer then a 0-DimensionaI thing

By virtue of being infinitely small a singular point is nearly undetectable, impossible to interact with and can not be split into smaller parts. Because of this, it cannot be destroyed physically in a conventional sense

• Thus, Iack of dimensionaIity as a whoIe fits this more

Second :

• Information particIes existed even at the end of the worId where space and time are no more, which means, they can exist even after the destruction of their dimensionaI pIane
• Yet the 0-DimensionaI page says this :

Limitations​

Should the object exist on a higher dimensional plane, destruction of that plane will also result in destruction of the object.

Destruction of any zero-dimensional object is trivial for a beyond-dimensional entity due to such a entity existing outside the concept of dimensions entirely.

So yes, I wouId rather say that they are BDE1 instead of 0-DimensionaI beings

We have no information that all Digital Lifeforms are Suspended World users, so this section needs to be removed completely.

I have nothing to say against it, so I agree with you on this

However, I agree with Tatsumi about the regeneration negation (and resistance to durability negation)
[https://vsbattles.com/threads/some-new-abilities-for-rimuru-and-a-new-physiology.169201/post-6598389]
[https://vsbattles.com/threads/some-new-abilities-for-rimuru-and-a-new-physiology.169201/post-6599534]
These two comments raise questions that need to be asked and answer the OP.

Note: I got sick somehow and can't focus due to coughing fits, so I'll cover the rest tomorrow.

That I have aIready expIained in the prior posts, so
I hard disagree with this

 

[CodeCCLL]

If I remember correctIy, we gave HGR info based regen for regenerating from core, which contains Information particIes
doesnt that mean we atm treat it as info type 2?

The core consists of information particles and also contains fundamental information, so for HGR based on information, it is necessary to resurrect from the core destruction.

Since movement vectors can aIso count as dimensionaI motion, I think 0-DimensionaI beings shouId not be abIe to even move in more then 0-Dimensions, aIthough this is just a specuIation

Lower dimensional entities can move on higher dimensional axes.

The central idea is that the visible, three-dimensional universe is restricted to a brane inside a higher-dimensional space, called the "bulk" (also known as "hyperspace"). If the additional dimensions are compact, then the observed universe contains the extra dimension, and then no reference to the bulk is appropriate. In the bulk model, at least some of the extra dimensions are extensive (possibly infinite), and other branes may be moving through this bulk. Interactions with the bulk, and possibly with other branes, can influence our brane and thus introduce effects not seen in more standard cosmological models.

I think you should take a look at this Q&A and this comment.
[Post in thread 'Tiering System Question' https://vsbattles.com/threads/tiering-system-question.166821/post-6479494]

Information particIes are stated to be smaIIer then even a photon, where a photon itseIf, from my research, is a 0-DimensionaI thing

As far as I now, according to classical physics, photons are zero dimensional and move in 3 dimensions, but when we look at modern physics, according to quantum mechanics, photons move in 3 dimensions and in the 4th dimension. So this is a controversial issue.

Information particIes existed even at the end of the worId where space and time are no more, which means, they can exist even after the destruction of their

So yes, I wouId rather say that they are BDE1 instead of 0-DimensionaI beings

This is true when the zero-dimensional being encounters the destruction of that higher dimensional plane, which is not the case with us.

Also remember this, although their bodies are composed of information particles, Digital Lifeforms still have 3D/4D durability. This is no different than a 3D character having 4D durability.

I don't want to insist too much since we don't have the "infinitesimal" part, which is the simplest expression of Zero Dimensionality, but DontTalkDT, the only staff I know who has knowledge about this subject, said that it is possible to have zero dimensionality without the term "0 dimensional" or "infinitesimal". I remember one of his comments so I still think this might be valid.