Skill Debate: Hayato vs Fugil

[Firephoenixearl]

They're masters. It's kind of like asking to prove that a 30 year old man would have more AP than a baby. While not everyone may be as good as hearing as let's say Lugh (except Hayato), in terms of analysis they should be superior as they can sense things Koukin cannot like the capabilties of other fighters (like master classes). But eh, i guess i do not have a very strong argument here. So anything to outclass Kokuin's analysis?

Fugil is better in...certian areas of dodging let's say (more specifically in terms of faster people scaling from Lux), but in some areas like minimal movement i'd give it to Hayato.

Comparable until you 1v1 me in basket and i show you that it's not actually a thing, that of being easier to bounce stuff that's already comming for you

 

[Ionliosite]

Well, I don't think outclassing, the best Info Analysis I can find is Sacred Eclipse which is basically reading the other person heart and know who is the most important person to them and then she transforms into it, but I don't know if it would fall into hax territory. But about knowing the other person true intentions, I think a gave you a good example.

Not only faster people, also in great amount of attacks, for example Fugil dodging every attack from one of Lux's End Actions or the Silver Flashes that Lux dodged (this is like a massive danmaku). But, yeah, in areas like minimal movement Hayato wins, I guess.

It easier to bounce stuff that are coming for you, I already tried, it is easier to bounce something that's comming towards you than make bounce something towards other person.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Considering the last part where she transforms into them i'm gonna have to lean on hax, unless it's specifically stated "skill". Fair enough on the true intentions, i'd just be grasping at straws to go any further. So Info Analysis going to Hayato?

In terms of amount, i guess fair enough, but this is a thing. Idk.

 

[Ionliosite]

I mean, the heart reading and the transformation are apparently unrelated to the other, just that with what she read she can transform into the person imitating their appearence, voice and personality based on that, yet there i no real explanation as how she does this, so idk.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Heart reading is something even Kenichi right after learning R Seikuken does. I guess we gun give this to Hayato via Tirawit's analysis?

 

[Ionliosite]

I mean SE's info analysis (if you can call it that) is reading the heart of the other person and even tells her who is the most important person for them telling her the appearance, voice and peronality of that person so she can imitate it while transforming into that person. But I don't know if Fugil should even scale to that, I know Fugil can analyze a lot of things, but I don't know if he should even scale to SE. What is Tirawit btw?

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Tirawit Kokuin. The dude with this analysis feat. So Hayato takes this point?

 

[Ionliosite]

Pretty sure Sacred Eclipse's is better Yeah, since almost sure Fugil doesn't scale to Sacred Eclipse's analysis.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

So who wins in total then?

 

[Firephoenixearl]

If im counting correctly Hayato has:

• Info analysis

• Attack Reflection

• Senses

• Dodging (minimal movement)

Fugil has:

• Dodging (Amount of attacks and speed difference).

Idk what else

 

[Ionliosite]

In quantity of mastery over things: Fugil (I don't know if we can use this, but I will)

Precision with swords: Tie

Copying techniques: Tie

Dodging things faster than them: Fugil (I don't know if ammount of things is something different but, meh)

Dodging with the most minimal movement: Hayato

Senses: Hayato

Movements that cannot be predicted: Tie

Prediction: Tie

Attack Reflection: Hayato

Info Analysis: Hayato

Aiming feats: We said comparable , but I would give the point to Fugil but just by a minimal margin

Whatever we talked with Ryusui Seikuken: I think we said Tie.

I don't know if we talked about anything else.

 

[Moritzva]

As a side note, can we use Fugil in matches yet?

I want to finish murdering him with a chair.

 

[Ionliosite]

As a side note, can we use Fugil in matches yet?

Not yet, still banned

 

[Moritzva]

Pray tell, what revisions are going through? So I bargain it doesn't affect skill, seeing this debate, so what is under contention?

 

[Ionliosite]

He is missing some hax and tons of resistances, in addition to missing a new 8-A key and some abilities in Base.

 

[Moritzva]

Ah, yeah, that seems pretty major.

(Should I move on to fighting Yujiro first?)

 

[Firephoenixearl]

So Hayato wins? Ion?

 

[Ionliosite]

Wait until I check if there's a feat similar to the attack reflection one so we can completely tie.

 

[Ionliosite]

(Should I move on to fighting Yujiro first?)

That doesn't affect me, so do it if you want

 

[Moritzva]

Lux's fate has been postponed.

Anyhow, I skimmed a bit, such a shame we can't add skill debates to profiles.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

1. Ok do I'll claim the win for now. Tell me if you find that feat.

2. Fugil vs the throne? Isn't fugil haxed, as in...rakudai top tiers levels of hax. He should stomp ez.

 

[Moritzva]

Depends on the key, methinks. Base key lacks a fair bit of hax right now, but then again, it would be best to wait until revisions are done to consider it.

 

[Ionliosite]

Fugil with Ouroboros is massively haxed, and he's getting even more haxed with the CRT.

 

[BakiHanma18]

Ah, yeah, that seems pretty major.
(Should I move on to fighting Yujiro first?)

No pls OVO

 

[Moritzva]

I made the match, sir Baki.

 

[Ionliosite]

Hey Earl, about the "being attacked while writing" thing, do you think Lux perfectly reacting to an attack while he was talking and walking with his sister is similar?

Lux and Airi walked side by side. From the main road they entered into a narrow street where there weren't any signs of people. Because of the night's darkness and the rain, the light and temperature at the surrounding suddenly felt like they were dropping drastically. "……Haa, in the end it turned out like this. If I at least could come along, I would be able to protect Nii-san a little, that was what I thought when coming here butÔöÇÔöÇ" Airi whispered in melancholy. However, Lux's body moved reflexively faster than he could reply to her words. "ÔöÇÔöÇWatch out-!" "Kyah……!?" Lux quickly pushed down Airi who was walking in front of him down on the street's stone paving. Lux covered the back of Airi's head with his hand so it wouldn't hit the ground but, "Wha, what are you doing all of a sudden!?" Right after Airi who was pushed down as though being embraced yelled that, the sound of a violent cutting wind passed by at high speed right above Lux and Airi who were ducking down. Airi who saw that became speechless and her body froze. The raining royal capital at night with no presence of people. A dragon of atypical shape was floating in the air above that street.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Hmm that feels like senses. Cus he expected the attack (sensed it), rather than being hit without knowing. He realized an attack was coming and ducked. So while it's not an useless feat it's more senses than countering something he wasn't expecting.

 

[Ionliosite]

I mean, he obviously wasn't expected being attacked when he was walking around with his sickling sister.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Ok but when the attack was launched he sensed it and ducked.

 

[Ionliosite]

Siegfried did the same thing.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Siegfried did the same thing.

He never expected the attack, at least there was no sign or implication that he did. He just countered the moment the attack connected.

It's different from reacting to an attack that you sense coming from far away.

 

[Ionliosite]

The attack is very clearly not from far away, Greifer is literally floating above that same street they're in.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

I mean he had time to sense the attack scream at his sister, push her down, she said a sentence then the attack came. Unless he felt it before the dude even fired it of I'd say pretty far away.

 

[Ionliosite]

Greifer didn't even fired the attack, it is a sword slash, Greifer doesn't have guns.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Never said it's a gun. I meant fire the wind blade or whatever it was, not actually fire a gun.

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Anyway, how about Body control, what's fugil's best feat?

 

[Ionliosite]

What are Hayato's? Because Fugil just scales to Philuffy due to Baptism mechanics and why would Hayato scale to body control feats?

 

[Firephoenixearl]

Cus hayato doesn't scale, he performs them. Kek. He can limit his stats to 1/1ml of his normal. Can make the 2 parts of his body act independently of each other, can control the direction of the sound he sends and can say 2 sentences at a time.

In terms of scaling he should be able to move his organs up his rib cage to hide them.

Can't post scans now cus am on phone