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Shea Haulia VS Garou (Hopefully fair)
- Thread starter azontr
- Start date
- 6,020
- 3,043
She was, but as I said in the beginning of the match there is currently a crt updating the stats of the characters based on recent crts (like, I have done more than nine calcs and this is to update the verse with them). The only reason to why still isn't applied to the profiles is because I'm trying to wait until pegasus read Arifureta Zero vol 6 to give his input (since that's actually the main focus of that crt), however the stats part is pretty direct and simple so that part don't really have any contention.
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Pre-Schnee is 192.75 Megatons do to Shea own calc, Post-Schnee have always scaled to 3x her Pre-Schnee value hence she is 578.25 Megatons in this key. You can see all the exact values to which the characters scales with all the new calcs here.
- 6,020
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Don't think is needed to change keys since Garou is able to eventually close the gap and the initial advantage (AP and LS wise) Shea have is one of her main win cons.
- 11,561
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Doesn't she literally one shot before that tho
- 6,020
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I mean, the point with Garou was that his RE is so crazy that he could quickly close immense gaps and his skill let him survive big differences no? You and others were arguing that all the times I mentioned the initial difference. So at the end is still the same argument than before, 'Shea need to finish Garou quickly before he grow too strong', which I have been trying to argue all this time that she can do.
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I am just now seeing the fact about her AP being drastically higher than his in this key. I thought they were comparable, but she is literally high-end 7-A based on what you are saying. Obviously Garou won't be able to handle one-shot attacks constantly, at least by wiki standards
- 6,020
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Still think is a fair match though, he have the means to close the gap with his RE, the regen to recover from a certain degre of damage, and the skill to dodge and survive long enough. So while Shea have the initial stat advantage and various other things (like the precog, stealth, etc.) which would give her the win, I don't believe it is a stomp.
- 11,561
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All of his keys happen one after the other with no time in-between so technically he can jump to a higher tier at this point, since you use peak of this key's AP, but not fast enough to combat a difference of 20x before getting folded.
- 6,020
- 3,043
If he could become 13-15x stronger as you claimed before (and as I'm sure various more people believe so based on other threads) the he would go beyond 7-B limit though.
However if you really feel is too much then it can be changed to Pre-Schnee Shea who is 192.75 Megatons and 1.10e+11kg, so like a 6.41x and 7.01x difference respectively, which is enough initial advantage to pull the more specifics ways that she could pull to finish the fight quickly before he grow too much.
- 6,020
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If you say that he can close 13-15x ap gap, and if I'm not wrong he is 30 Megatons, that means that he would jump to 7-A.
azontr
He/Him- 40,519
- 50,160
- Thread starter
- #96
I said that within the confines of his key, to say that he evolved quickly. I never tried to insinuate he would jump to an entirely different tier. Don't twist what I meant.
Though, I believe OPM is getting upgraded to 7-A, so the match may still be possible.
- 6,020
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I'm not twisting the meaning of anything and just saying what you stated previously in this thread, but whatever.
The match is perfectly possible in its current condition though, like completely possible with both sides having arguments and reliables win cons. Don't know if they will get upgraded (currently don't see any crt about that) but if that happen then the match could be redone then.
So, based on all the previous arguments, and the fact that the match isn't a stomp, my vote go for Shea if it wasn't clear.
The match is perfectly possible in its current condition though, like completely possible with both sides having arguments and reliables win cons. Don't know if they will get upgraded (currently don't see any crt about that) but if that happen then the match could be redone then.
So, based on all the previous arguments, and the fact that the match isn't a stomp, my vote go for Shea if it wasn't clear.
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I don't believe you're allowed to restrict RE to a certain tier. And the next key happens literally right after this one ends...
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The profile just separates different parts of Garou's evolution. Once again, they take place right after one another. It isn't limiting what he can evolve to, so nah, you would be the one saying he can "only go to 7-B"
azontr
He/Him- 40,519
- 50,160
- Thread starter
- #102
In this specific key, he can only go up to 7-B. Because that's what it says on the profile. If it isn't listed in that specific key, we don't use it, this isn't a case of me specifically saying Garou can only evolve up to 7-B even though he can go beyond it, in this key, he literally is incapable of going beyond that because that is how it's indexed on his profile. We do this with every other profile that has keys.
If this was Post-Darkshine Garou you'd have a point, but it's not, it's Half-Monster Garou, and Half-Monster Garou's profile states that he is capable of evolving up to City level. No higher.
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I have heard that you aren't allowed to limit someone's capabilities like that in other threads, even if the tier itself mentions a "cap." IIRC it was some new rule.
other Garou threads have mentioned this same thing.
azontr
He/Him- 40,519
- 50,160
- Thread starter
- #104
You cannot restrict abilities that are not under the user's control, correct. This would include Garou's evolution or any other reactive evolution, since they does not toggle it on or off and have no control over it.
But that doesn't mean he is suddenly able to go beyond his key. I'm not restricting Garou's ability. The profile simply says that in that specific key he can only go up to 7-B. We do that for every other profile. Those other Garou threads merely misinterpreted this.
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I'm also pretty certain that characters with AD/RE can indeed potentially grow to other tiers depending of the level of their feats and other things which depend of the context. Though even assuming that he is only allowed to cap at 99.99 Megatons, the match still would be fair do to the gap between the two be less than the 7x one shot currently used.
