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Samus' Speed and Keys

LordXcano

LordXcano

VS Battles
Retired
2,334
312
https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/175503#32

So first off this message and all the ones after. A few objections to the MFTL+ speed result for Samus have come up, including some from me (even though I initially supported the upgrade). Basically the objections are as follows

  • The series is consistently Hypersonic and up, a random MFTL+ thing seems like a bit of an outlier
  • We have no proof Dark Samus flew to each planet on her own. She is apart of Phaaze and can teleport, she possibly also has wormhole abilities. While I don't think MFTL+ for Dark Samus' teleportation speed is bad, I do think scaling her flight and combat speed to that is a pretty high-end interpretation
  • Ridley, as far as I can tell from the comments, only scales to Samus' ship in atmosphere, and assuming she was going MFTL+ there is a bit odd. Especially since cutscenes suggest she's entering at speeds around orbital re-entry speed.
Now as for the Keys mentioned. I think that the Star level result for Samus should be put in a separate Key. Not only is it far outside her usual level (the justification for the separate Mario Galaxy Key AFAIK) but Samus and Joey is likely non-canon. It's overall mood and atmosphere is way different than the canon Metroid series, there's no references to it in-canon, and there were no statements saying it was apart of canon. This should be treated similarly to Animeverse Goku vs. Canon Goku, IMO, just without a separate article.
 
I think that this seems to make sense.
 
1: How in the seven levels of hell is she 72c?

2: Yeah, she does. Somewhat. The by far greatest feat she has is the destruction of Dark Aether, which counts as a large planet level feat at bare minimum, but i´m not exactly sure if this can directly be scaled to her own DC. So i went with the next best feat i yould come up with: The mountain- level power beam.
 
1. Keeping up with Ridley who kept up with her 72c ship

2. Well, maybe it would just be with her best equipment?

Anywyas - I think I found a high hypersonic feat she scales to
 
Mountain level comes from Samus (In her weakest suit other than the Fusion Suit, the Pre-Zero Mission Power Suit) being able to fight off Ridley in the manga who in turn blew up a mountain.

MFTL+ being an outlier is absurd, she has different suits that are leagues ahead from the rest (Might as well make the Multi-Galaxy feat from DBS an outlier as well)
 
Additionally, it seems that either you don't even understand the feats that placed them at the levels that they are at:

"We have no proof Dark Samus flew to each planet on her own. She is apart of Phaaze and can teleport, she possibly also has wormhole abilities. While I don't think MFTL+ for Dark Samus' teleportation speed is bad, I do think scaling her flight and combat speed to that is a pretty high-end interpretation"

^Not only is the other FTL feat before MP3, this feat isn't even relevent.

Also, there is nothing that puts Samus and Joey as "non-canon" because its "mood" is different.
 
@Des, while calcing, keep in mind Zebe's massive gravity (and by extension, extremely dense rock). Also remember about depth in the photo.
 
ImagoDesattrolante said:
1. Keeping up with Ridley who kept up with her 72c ship
2. Well, maybe it would just be with her best equipment?

Anywyas - I think I found a high hypersonic feat she scales to
Click to expand...

I'll hate to load the video because angsizing (provided the planet is in view) may provide a higher result, unless it's explicitly stated the distance is 226 km or you already did that of course.

Where is the feat of Ridley keeping up with Samus' ship? Was this an in atmosphere thing?

@Somebody I know it was pre-MP3, but I don't remember the exact detail of the calc since the wiki is dead. Either way what is preventing wormholes before MP3? I don't think those are specific to the Leviathans (unless it says otherwise of course)
 
LordXcano said:
@Somebody I know it was pre-MP3, but I don't remember the exact detail of the calc since the wiki is dead. Either way what is preventing wormholes before MP3? I don't think those are specific to the Leviathans (unless it says otherwise of course)
Click to expand...
What is preventing her from using wormholes? The lack of ability to use it...
 
Alright since, yeah, assuming she can make wormholes is technically an assumption then I'll drop that unless I find something else. However she still has teleportation and she uses it quite frequently as her method of transportation.
 
LordXcano said:
Alright since, yeah, assuming she can make wormholes is technically an assumption then I'll drop that unless I find something else. However she still has teleportation and she uses it quite frequently as her method of transportation.
Click to expand...
However, at that point in time, she had been severly weakened by her fight with Samus, furthermore she shows that her teleportation ability is rather not that long in range, at all. At best, she would manage a few short boosts, but it would cost her stamina quite a bit
 
Aren't there a few months time between the games? We know Dark Samus can regen, and I think even a few hours is enough to regain stamina. Do we have any proof her teleportation isn't that long in range?
 
LordXcano said:
Aren't there a few months time between the games? We know Dark Samus can regen, and I think even a few hours is enough to regain stamina. Do we have any proof her teleportation isn't that long in range?
Click to expand...
There are a few months, yes the calc took that into account.

You forget that she would be nearly completely void of any phazon to use to regenerate

During the 2nd fight with Dark Samus, she falls off a tower, but can't teleport back to beat Samus

As matter of fact when does she even show teleportation in MP2?
 
Thats... not teleportation

each time she splits up into particles because she gets beaten badly, just saying
 
Okay, it isn't teleportation in the traditional sense of A to B instantly, however it is clearly a faster method of transportation for her. Otherwise why wouldn't she just fly away?
 
Maybe its because you're overlooking the fact that Dark Samus got beaten badly by Samus?

Also, why are we discussing this? This isn't even the MFTL+ feat?
 
She's using the dispersal to get away from Samus, which she has done several times. This indicates that its faster than her flight, which is why we're discussing it. If the dispersal transportation > flight speed then Samus doesn't scale, as she explicitly cannot keep up with the dispersal speed in game.
 
Yeah, I know that. She scales to Dark Samus' flight speed. I'm saying Dark Samus didn't fly there, she used her dispersal to get there since it's explicitly faster than her flight speed.

If she used dispersal, then the scaling used to justify Samus' MFTL+ speed (keeping up with Dark Samus' flight) is no longer valid since we would have no proof of MFTL+ flight speed.
 
Then what speed did she scale too? Ridley's? I already addressed that. He's a Space Pirate, he likely took a ship.
 
Wait what? Do you even know what you're debating about? He outspeed her onscreen without a ship??

Can someone close this? The OP has literally no idea what hes talking about...
 
Wow okay. The calc is down, I don't remember everything about it. I know he outsped her ship though. Can you give me the quote about it though? Or is it that on-screen Frigate Orpheon thing?

If it's the Frigate Orpheon then well... do we have any reason to assume Samus was going max 1 million+ times lightspeed when a mere 226 km away from the planet she's going to?
 
@Xcano I actually posted the feat on the upgrade thread and pretty sure I also did it on the Ridley page, however, Des has a point and I'm being rude, however, please understand the fact that you kept on not understanding the feat in question was the reasoning. And that I am sorry.

That said @Des and @Xcano, 99% that A-In fiction a lot of characters fly at FTL or above speeds without even blowing up the planet or themselves, it is a common trait and B-Not sure why Samus would go so slow considering shes chasing the purple dragon that killed both her biological and adopted family.
 
Yeah I know the feat is on the page, it's just down now.

The reason Samus was going slow was because she was right next to a planet. We aren't talking about her going FTL and destroying everything, we're talking about her going FTL and crashing into the planet. That's why she would've been going slow.
 
Actually I was refering to my revision thread

Except thats kinda outta character? You have to realize that from what we see in the Metroid games and manga, she really doesn't care what the risk is as long as it has an impact on the safety of the galaxy. Heck, look at her destroying the X infected GF ship, a move that put her at risk of being hunted down forever when she was at argueably her weakest. Or how about tanking Ridley's attacks in her Varia Suit to save Grey Bird while not even knowing what the Varia upgrade did yet? Heck, she even crashed into Aether's storm to save the GF troopers faster, something that happened a bit of time later and Ridley wasn't even involved.
 
She isn't exactly stupid though. She won't kill herself chasing Ridley because then she wouldn't be able to actually fight Ridley. Taking risks to save people != moving far faster than your reactions can comprehend into a planet because your enemy is flying towards it. The only way flying into it at MFTL+ speed can be justified is if you pre-suppose that she's MFTL+, which is circular logic.
 
Again in fiction its pretty normal for flight with control and reactions speed to be pretty spread apart (Silver Surfer being the perfect example of this)
 
Except we never assume they're going towards planets when near them at max speed, otherwise it would scale to their reactions.
 
LordXcano said:
Except we never assume they're going towards planets when near them at max speed, otherwise it would scale to their reactions.
Click to expand...
I have never heard of an occurance where we scale flight speed to reaction speed under normal examples. Furthermore, by that logic, Samus would be MFTL+ simply by using the ship in MPH, and several times in MP3.
 
We would scale flight to reaction speed if we saw someone stopping close to an object when moving at max speed.

Considering that assuming Samus is MFTL+ by saying she went towards the planet at max speed is circular logic, then we assume she is Mach 50 by the above calc as that is what we see happen.
 
LordXcano said:
We would scale flight to reaction speed if we saw someone stopping close to an object when moving at max speed.
Considering that assuming Samus is MFTL+ by saying she went towards the planet at max speed is circular logic, then we assume she is Mach 50 by the above calc as that is what we see happen.
Click to expand...
No, we never do that.

Mach 50 <<<< Normal Ridley (MHS) <<<< Meta Ridley

Its really absurd to think that both Meta Ridley and Samus would only go at HH speeds when they displayed MHS at their weakest
 
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