- 2,500
- 1,248
She makes the past and present happen at the same time which allows her to spawn knives in Goku from the future and past (idk how the past part works tbh) at the same time. Speed is equal so how does Goku "lol dodge" out of that?
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Sakuya Night vs Sun Goku
- Thread starter OnsokunoSonic
- Start date
- 8,857
- 5,697
Oh. That's how it works? My bad then. But Jiren should still have resistance to time manipulation.
Goku can predict where they spawn, and UI dodges before they appear, also those knives can't harm Goku.
- 2,500
- 1,248
Cool
10 Knives spawn in Goku's throat, Goku can't breathe GG.
Also how does he predict where they spawn? You need something to base your prediction on otherwise it's precognition which I don't see on Goku's profile. Sakuya thinks and the knives appear, tell me what Goku can analyse in that situation to predict the attack.
- 5,803
- 3,265
He doesn't
- 5,803
- 3,265
How?, do you seriously agree with him?
- 1,639
- 1,010
Then do a CRT to remove it, Hit's time manipulative abilities having the ''stronger overpower weakness bs'' is only a thing inside of the manga.
Vietthai96
He/Him- 10,251
- 14,623
what he mean is Jiren doesn't have resistance to Time Manipulation as a whole
- 5,803
- 3,265
I think you misunderstood my comment, Jiren does indeed have time Stop resistance, just not resistance to every time realeated ability, that's what I said.
- 8,857
- 5,697
Hm, you're right, Goku can't predict something if there's no indication it'll happen. But there are some counters, either Goku can sense her intentions and then attack before she attacks with a huge attack she can't dodge for example a kiai. Or he can get tagged, but then instant transmission without taking the knives with him to get them out his body. Then he can teleport behind her and win.
- 5,803
- 3,265
Again no, Fluffy, Goku's only known time manip resistance is time Stop, that's it.
The same as, a character who resist it's Soul getting absorbed doesn't mean that it will resist their soul getting destroyed.
The same as, a character who resist it's Soul getting absorbed doesn't mean that it will resist their soul getting destroyed.
- 2,500
- 1,248
Does Goku have intent sensing (I actually don't know)? Plus if he instant transmissions then he is still going to end up looking like Swiss cheese because any knives that teleported in-between his skin and organs and whatever will leave behind holes due to telefraging in him....
Wait a sec....what stops Sakuya from just telefraging a knife into Goku's heart or brain? Sure the knives can't hurt him but if they spawn through those organs then it will ignore durability and leave holes in his body.
- 2,500
- 1,248
Mb, I thought he said resistance to time stop, I obviously disagree with every time ability lol
- 1,639
- 1,010
He can sense dark intentions within the individual when reading through their chi circulation, and Goku is directly capable of making a distinction in between.
- 1,639
- 1,010
Also, how does Sakuya attacking from the past or future work in practice? No specifics are given about how the vectorial trajectory of the knife projectiles are for herself to overwhelm Goku here, especially since teleportation is a ability not listed under her profile.
- 2,500
- 1,248
Is the universal power source in touhou able to be equalised with ki from dragon ball?
- 8,857
- 5,697
Do you mean the knives that will spawn will like "replace" the place his organs were? I thought they were just gonna push them aside or something. BTW Goku can destroy space time manipulation which I think she uses to spawn knives, so he could just release energy and destroy her starting move (I forgot the name).
Ki is the easiest power source to equalize, if you are alive, then you have life force, then you have ki.
- 2,636
- 1,039
- Thread starter
- #98
This.
She also stops time while doing it. So good luck moving in a space where every time periods is compressed.
This is sheer NLF, you're assuming Goku can move through different time periods with sheer speed, that's NLF, IMO.
- 2,500
- 1,248
I mean as in they will teleport into a position that has them already piercing his organs. Also where did Goku destroy space time manip?
Fair enough
- 8,857
- 5,697
I see so that's because like they replace the space that his organs occupy.
Hit placed son Goku in an alternate dimension he created and Goku screamed and broke the space time of that dimension breaking out. So he should be able to replicate the same feat with sakuya's starting move when he sees her manipulating space time. Gogeta and broly also did something similar.
- 2,500
- 1,248
Yeah
Would that apply to Sakuya compressing the past and future together though, a dimensions spacetime and a compression of past and future seems different to me.
If we're getting into the specifics of Sakuya's abilities then I won't be much help since I'm not that knowledgeable on Touhou
- 11,416
- 2,550
Goku shouldn't be able to do jack shit about sakuya's space-time abilities.
Vietthai96
He/Him- 10,251
- 14,623
He capable of destroying Hit's pocket space-time dimension with his raw power though @.@
- 8,857
- 5,697
Well it's all still space time manipulation just different applications, and the son goku that performed the feat is infinitely weaker than this one. So I don't see the problem.
- 5,803
- 3,265
Not sure if we can equalize all applications, for example: just becouse your resist your Soul getting absorbed, doesn't mean you can resist your sould getting destroyed. So Goku shouldn't be able to resist that specific kind of Space-time manip.
- 8,857
- 5,697
That's a false equivalence, Goku isn't resisting anything. Goku will still be destroying space time whether it's hit's technique or sakuya's technique.
- 5,803
- 3,265
Oh Yeah, my bad, I misunderstood your comment, yeah, I remember when he broke Hit's dimension, so yeah, he should do the same here.
- 1,639
- 1,010
On top of Goku being able to destroy Hit's space-time dimension. (seeing compressed space-time in a single place he should be able to do the same here), he also pertains to have a physical movement pace advantage due to UI's instinctive reactions, since he would already act faster if Sakuya plans on spamming her knives and force hand-to-hand combat against him. (At which on this point Goku should very much outclass her)
I don't see what changes that much from the previous thread, and I'm sure about establishing my vote for Goku here.
I don't see what changes that much from the previous thread, and I'm sure about establishing my vote for Goku here.
- 2,500
- 1,248
While Goku may be able to destroy Sakuya's space time stuff (I'm still unsure since based on Hit's profile his dimension/spacetime manip is composed of the time he skips while Sakuya's is done through merging the past and present), how will Goku destroy it before a knife spawns on/in his organs?
The only shot Goku has is the negative intention sensing or whatever since I doubt he can realistically react to an attack that spawns on his vitals the moment it activates.
The only shot Goku has is the negative intention sensing or whatever since I doubt he can realistically react to an attack that spawns on his vitals the moment it activates.
- 8,857
- 5,697
Goku can sense and predict that she is about to attack and his UI makes it so his body automatically responds and destroys her attack before she can properly attack, and he just needs to flex his ki to destroy her attack which is practically instant, also he's also practically blood lusted so releasing his energy will both nullify her attack and kill her at the same time or nullify her attack and then incapacitate.
- 2,500
- 1,248
Fair enough
Speed equalised and the attack literally spawns on him with a thought so I doubt ui boosting Goku's speed will allow him to dodge an instantaneous attack (since the attack spawns on him with a thought)
If this happens before the attack appear then makes sense but if after then I don't see how that would work since in the interval between the attack hitting him and him flexing his ki, he would have several knives poking through his entire body including his internal organs and such which should instantly kill him.
- 8,857
- 5,697
My bro. Ultra instinct is not to dodge, but to attack, Goku's Ultra instinct automatically attacks sakuya and her technique before she can spawn her knives without Goku expending a conscious effort to think then attack, this is the fastest you can be in a speed equal match without being straight up passive.
- 2,500
- 1,248
So does Goku use the intent sensing or not to attack beforehand? My point is that he can't just use UI to guess the attack if he doesn't have any stimulus to react to, does his body do the negative intent sensing on its own or does he have to think to do it?
It may just be me but saying "UI let's Goku attack before Sakuya can think under speed equal" sounds like your hyping up UI too much since that's basically precog which Goku doesn't have.
Anyways, considering that both characters have thought based moves they can start with that should oneshot, kiai and Sakuya telefraging knives into Goku, what stops this from being an incon since Goku's UI will go for a kiai considering he's bloodlusted and senses how weak she is while Sakuya counters with her own thought based attack?
- 1,639
- 1,010
Goku's Ki sense is pretty much automatic when a foe is getting nearby, he doesn't need to think in order to perform it.
just clarifying it.
- 8,857
- 5,697
UI reacts to sakuya's intent as stimulus, it reacts to her intent and makes the body move on it's own without having Goku think about the action, making him hit her and destroy her attack before she can hit him. UI is not precognition, it's automatic action, it cuts reaction time making you act without needing to consciously think which is why he can counter sakuya's space time attack.
- 1,639
- 1,010
From what I was able to gather from the explanation page, this is like the closest her ability looks in-screen.
Which doesn't entail much in how the pattern of the knife attacks actually are, since they just appear on the other sides of the battlefield without spawning from the internal structure of the opponent, but rather aim at their physical body spawning from different directions to release a powerful danmaku in compensation.
- 2,636
- 1,039
- Thread starter
- #118
Because she can't kill someone in a spellcard rules hindered battle, it's not allowed.
- 2,636
- 1,039
- Thread starter
- #119
You have to proof Goku can react to knives popping from the past and future, not to mention every time period is stopped when she's doing that.
- 1,639
- 1,010
That still doesn't cover my contention, as they can spawn from any sort of direction within a 4km wide range given that her range is limited by using danmaku and her space-time ability doesn't extent by that much in AoE, while Goku can teleport between universal distances far away and destroy compressed space-time dimensions alone.
this is not a very relevant argument, time travel stuff is not something that you would need literal immeasurable speed to give reactions.
we
already
established
that Goku withstands time stop for different layers.
