Rune King Thor problems

[Graf_Thorsdottir]

I'm planning to propose a big update of Thor's profile in a month when I finish all university stuff. So I thought to myself I'd better start now with the very controversial Rune King Thor.

So about RKT:

• The infamous RKT appears in the last 3 issues of Ragnarok, which is the last storyline of the Thor (1998) run, until Thor's return in the post-Civil War story (2007) by Straczynski.

• For context, Ragnarok takes place after the The Reigning storyline. Thor was deemed unworthy by the Odin Force after The Reigning, so he had a large majority of his allies across the 9 realms slaughtered by Loki's forces. Thor then sought the wisdom of Odin with the water from the Well of Mimir and had to surpass Odin's sacrifice by plucking out both of his eyes, and with the water of the well gained knowledge that Ragnarok is a cycle. (Issue #83)

• To gain the knowledge of the runes, Thor hung himself just like Odin did. As he came closer to death, Thor "sees beyond quantum structure, beyond cosmic architecture, and into the nothingness of Gun-Ginggap". Thor then died and was brought to Hel, the realm of the death, with Hela approaching. With a rune letter Thor summoned Odin, who carried Thor away from Hela. Thor was then brought to the presence of Those Who Sit Above In Shadows. Honestly, this part confuses me. Is this Thor's "evolution past death" in his explanation? (Issue #84)

• Moving on: Thor claimed to TWSAIS that he will bring an end to the endless cycle that is Ragnarok, and teleported from wherever they are back to Hildstalft, noting that he is embraced by the Odinforce once more. He made very short work of Mangog and Loki's other monsters. Note that Loki said he syphoned the magics of Mangog, which may mean Mangog is weaker than usual. I'm not sure about this. Thor plucked Loki's head off his body without killing him, and brought him along as he went to Surtur. As of Issue #84, RKT has demonstrated Flight, Teleportation, Can see without eyes, Force-field, Energy Manipulation, Soul Manipulation? (emptied the "bottle" that was Mangog?), Biological Manipulation (Plucked Loki's head off his body without killing him), possible Immortality (Type 1 and 4?)

• Thor (bringing Loki along) then went to Surtur, demonstrating Telekinesis in the process (threw a Mjolnir-level hammer back to the fire demons that attacked his ship, reducing the demons the skeletons in the process). Thor demanded Surtur to reforge Mjolnir, which was broken in Issue #80, promising Surtur that he would blast a way straight to Vanaheim, so a Final Battle can take place. As gods, giants and demons battled, Thor teleported Beta Ray Bill away, telling him to live on and tell tales of their deeds. Fenris swallowed all remains of the battle, and Thor teleported to the Sisters of Fates, who had woven the fates of all beings of the 9 realms to a tapestry with only one thread, keeping Ragnarok a never-ending cycle. Thor himself claimed that he hasn't the power to change what has been writte, but by destroying that single thread, the cycle came to an end. All the 9 realms were sucked into the fissure that formed on Yggdrasil. Thor "closed his eyes and breathed deep the slumber of gods. For a while, at least."

And that is all there is of RKT. He MAY have evolved past death, but nothing indicated he overcame time, while destiny was defied with a specific ritual. Even the image of him becoming one with the universe (famously known as a floating head) seems more like an imagery. So the whole idea of becoming one with the universe, and becoming Omnipresent thus getting a Low 2-C, Omnipresent ranking seems extremely unreliable to me. At best, he surpassed Odin, because he sacrificed more than Odin did in gaining knowledge of Mimir and runes.

About Those Who Sit Above In Shadows:

• TWSAIS are called the "Gods of Gods", "Gods of Old", "Celestial Beings", "Creators of the Asgardians" (Issue #84-85)

• They draw energy from Ragnarok, and by keeping it an endless cycle, they can sustain themselves. To them, a "final battle of the gods" are nothing but a source of sustenance, and all major players of the battle (Odin, Surtur) are no more than mere toys (Issue #84)

• Just as Thor was about to destroy the Thread of Fate, they appeared before him and tried to offer him a position among them to stop him from destroying the thread. Although this may be because Thor was threatening to end their source of sustenance, not because he is more powerful. But they did not physically interfere with Thor destroying the thread either, only looking at him with worried faces. By destroying the thread, Thor had "destroyed them", although this may refer to him destroying their source of sustenance. (Issue #85)

• They appeared again in the last few issues of Loki ― Agent of Asgard (specifically, Issue #14, 16 and 17). BUT this story is so confusing, I have no way of interpreting it. Loki hypothesized them to be Beyonders, or not. Either way, I cannot comprehend this story.

Overall, I really need help interpreting Loki ― Agent of Asgard, and would really appreciate some inputs to put a definite tier for RKT, with a definite powersets, to prevent controversial wanking.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

There's nothing stopping Thor from getting more Odinforce than Odin and becoming Low 2-C.

 

[Graf_Thorsdottir]

How is more Odinforce = Low 2-C? I can only see him at best 3-A if he ever surpasses a high-end 3-B being

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

He has a blatant Low 2-C feat in destroying Yggdrasil and the thread of fate which controlled the fate of the 9 worlds.

 

[Graf_Thorsdottir]

So destroying the Thread of Fate is Low 2-C? I don't doubt it, I just don't understand how defying fate is Low 2-C

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Not defying, destroying fate.

 

[Graf_Thorsdottir]

So destroying fate in any fiction automatically makes you Low 2-C?

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

no. But the fate that binds the Nine Worlds (Nine universes) and their gods is.

 

[Graf_Thorsdottir]

But Thor himself said he doesn't have the power to change what has been wove

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

That simply means that he doesn't have Fate Manipulation in the way of rewriting the past. Thor literally destroyed the future Fate that bound the Nine Worlds to the cycle of Ragnarok.

 

[Graf_Thorsdottir]

fair enough. But it doesn't explain him being Omnipresent. In fact he had to take a flying boat to get to Surtur

 

[Antvasima]

We may have to remove omnipresence, yes. What do you think Matthew?

 

[Dark649]

He had to take a flying boat to get to Surtur.

He became one with the universe and that above is PIS or Thor was simply tired since even normally he is MFTL+.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.

 

[Graf_Thorsdottir]

He became one with the universe

I disagree. I think there is a common misunderstanding of what is exactly RKT.

RKT is just Thor + Odinforce + Mimir Well knowledge + Runes. His visual is exactly the same as usual except the glowing eyes . He destroyed the Thread of Fate in this form .

This is the last page of Ragnarok, after Yggdrasil and all the realms have been destroyed. People often calls this the appearance of RKT, but if you read it in context of the comic, it just screams imagery of transcendence.

 

[Antvasima]

Alright then. I would still appreciate input from Matthew.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Rune King Thor could see into the past, present and future simultaneously and sort of transcended the Cycle of Ragnarok that bound the Norse Gods, and even surpassed the Gods of the Norse Gods.

He also destroyed the Thread of Fate which bound the fate of the Nine Worlds and its Gods, destroying the Cycle of Ragnarok forever.

He is Low 2-C.

 

[Dark649]

We are talking about his omnipresence Matthew.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Indifferent on that.

 

[Antvasima]

I think that it seems appropriate to remove it, unless somebody has new information.

 

[Dark649]

I added the changes, we can close this.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.