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Regarding "Ignoring" Revisions/Calc Requests/Blogs/etc.

VenomElite

VenomElite

VS Battles
Retired
1,092
919
It's become apparent that our community has become rather, "dissatisfied" with how certain content revisions, calc requests, blog posts, etc. get outright ignored while the "more popular" ones always get attention, regardless of how heated, time-consuming, and redundant it can get. You know what I'm talking about. DBS, One Punch Man, Pokemon, and the like, whereas other revisions can be important yet go ignored for days with only Antvasima or sometimes Promestein or myself to answer these threads. And we aren't knowledgeable about every little thing.

Some of our staff have even gotten fed up about this. So...what's the deal? Not everyone can use the "I'm busy" excuse. And I honestly think Ant shouldn't have to be forced to answer every revision thread by himself. Other input is required in certain cases. But even highlighting a thread does nothing.

Personally, I understand if something doesn't interest you, you'll likely ignore it. But since this has been brought to attention, I went ahead and made this thread. I'll let the community express their concerns.
 
I have felt this way sometimes when I make calc requests or revisions. For example Sometimes I do get responses to a calc, it's calculated but then the conversation just ends there...I bump it like 4 times...no response. I am not sure if it's accepted?


Of course, this doesn't speak for every user in the community here. This is just my experience. And I agree. Ant or Dark has helped me out a lot and sometimes thanks to their highlights or comments more people get hooked on and respond.
 
I'm new here, but I'd be more than happy to help with any research I can. Not a math genius like you guys but I always like to be helpful.
 
The Everlasting said:
Many calc requests go ignored because the calc group members are often very busy and the ones that aren't have tons of requests to go through.
Click to expand...
Also to keep in mind is that calcs take a lot of time and hard work to do. They aren't something that can be quickly made or spammed like comments on a thread.

No member has the time to be making that many calculations to where no one feels dissatisfied with their request not being done.

And often members understandably want to dedicate the large commitment and effort of a calc into a series they care about. Not some verse they have never heard of or see before.
 
Even if you don't know the verse, you can still give input based on what's presented in the thread. I don't comment on big, crowded threads for things I don't know very well (Like DMC), but when it comes to less popular things, anyone can analyze a what's being proposed and come to a conclusion based on the information presented. It's not an issue that not every staff member comments on every thread, but a lot of threads are just disregarded by most of the staff.

Users shouldn't have to go asking for staff to look at revision threads. If they need more input, yeah, they can do it, but it's our job to look over revision threads.

For the calc requests thing... I rarely see things from the calculation requests thread get calced. I realize the calc team is busy, but the thread doesn't really get much attention, it seems.
 
@Ever and Ryu

Thanks for replying guys. Keep in mind that these are necessarily my complaints, I just made the thread by request.
 
@Prom

Very few calc team members are consistently active, so those few have to sort through a vast quantity of requests.
 
I must admit that sometimes I feel like that (I mean, a bit dissatisfied) when certain revisions and calcs go ignored. Not just mine, mind you (I made very few calcs, and the ones I made are really faulty and I have made very few revisions), but from many verses. The Dark Souls upgrade isn't something recent, for an example. It is at least a year old, if I remember it correctly. I understand the problems and all, and I am certainly not blaming @Everlasting (Who did a wonderful job at making the DS calcs) or anyone specifically, but rather about the general disinterest.

Sorry if I sounded arrogant or anything. :/
 
@EV

Well, to be fair, I'm still formulating the actual Dark Souls revision (There's a lot of research I need to put into it).
 
Lets start:

Here I made a blog that when I first requested for it to be reviewed, I waited a day for input and posted a message on a members wall without getting any attention. Everyone was happy with commenting on A joke calc that has no relevance whatsoever and I had to bump my calc before Darkanine kindly gave some input. (Yes I requested it for further input, to my knowledge, it has no attention yet)

Fast forward till Fan makes a revision for Doctor Who and hardly anyone responded. I kindly asked people in chat and nothing. I privately asked Ever and I even said I was bummed coz no one was responding.

This is not to mention that Fan had to send a message to Azzy that was at first ignored and AMM but I can only say thanks for Azzy responding the second time. I should also mention that the thread had 3 highlights plus bumps. Doctor Who is apparently on the navigation bar for being a popular verse so...

I don't care about other things such as vs threads being overly bumped or discussions being ignored, but if my revisions mean nothing and I don't get input, what can I do?

I'm also not including image/calc requests either.
 
Apologies if I come off in the wrong tone, I am not hateful towards anyone in anyway.
 
@Ever @Ryu

This.

I try to never actively ignore a calc request, but the sheer volume of them with the amount of time they take can get tiring and very, very draining. At one point I was knocking down at least 5 request a day, which lead me to be exhausted and unproductive in other matters. It's not a matter of ignoring someone because I don't care for the series (I've done calcs for series I hate or never even heard of) but because it's exhausting.

If a thread doesn't get as much attention as you want, you can feel free to ask others personally. Leaving a polite message on a wall or asking for input in chat is totally okay, acceptable and encouraged. You can also feel free to request threads to be highlighted.
 
Well in Kru's case, he asks Ven to highlight threads. Even when Ven highlights a thread it still gets ignored for days.
 
@Dark I greatly appreciate your work. I couldn't believe how much you were churning out calcs for a while there. But of course your other personal matters and not getting burnt out matter far more.

And I wasn't accusing you of not doing a calc cause you weren't a fan of the series. I was just saying how other Calc Members feel or might feel. Even then I don't think it's a bad thing for someone to rather put hours of hard work into a series they care about than something they've hate or never heard of.

I agree that those are other really good options.
 
I also greatly appreciate Dark's work as well as Tsubaki's translations.
 
With calc request I feel like imposing on calc members to calculate feats for verses they don't really know shouldn't be one that's pushed to be done and the calc members themselves should have the freedom to decide to do it. However noting that's it's very appreciative for calc members to accomplish these tasks even if they do not like or know the verse is something we should do.

Most of the time I see members like dark or LordX having no problem doing a calc request for users of verses they don't really know or care. so this isn't a problem I see that's big enough to address.

Content threads though is one I've noticed as a big problem we've never addressed in the past and now I'm glad it's being brought to the light.

For small time content revisions it's not too hard to review the points and agree if they seem reasonable. Of course it should be mandatory or at least asked if users who are very knowledgeable in said verse to reply so we have confirmation that the results are accurate and not misconceptualized.
 
I forgot to mention for large scale content revision threads they have little to no idea about the verse . While it's a good thing and again appreciated if staff reply to it and try to make some sense of the argument being talked about, it should not be required for them to reply. It's best if at minimum 1-2 staff who are noted as knowledgeable on said verse reply and agree or disagree with what's being proposed as they will know what's going on and once again, will check if things are being accurately potrayed and nothing is being mislead.
 
I have stuff I want to say but I don't know how to phrase it. I guess first I'll say that I greatly appreciate some of the staff's help in certain manners (such as Dark), but sometimes it does get quite frustrating when certain things get completely ignored for days or weeks or months or YEARS on end. I'm sure I don't need to say what I'm talking about, but overall I've had some fairly bad experiences here, though I also have had my share of good experiences which is why I keep coming back. I feel like the staff should have the freedom to choose what they want to do, but at some point you guys have to realize you were chosen to monitor this wiki for a reason, and it would be appreciative where, if you see something isn't getting a whole lot of attention, if you try and help. Even if you're not asked, it would still be extremely helpful to those who initially brought certain things up.
 
@Pikachu

As stated before, there are a lot of threads the Staff ends up avoiding since we don't have expertise on the subject. Can and should we respond to more threads? Sure. But there's only so much input we can provide if we don't have knowledge on the subject.

In the past I've shot down several upgrades that were proposed by badgering Antvasima to provide input when he was too tired and too disinterested in the verses at hand to properly fact-check them. The street goes both ways.

Yes we need to be more active and provide input when possible. But bothering us to give a yes or no on things we can't properly interpret or fact-check is equally exploitative and rude.
 
For the record, I have stated that there are some calcs I want to get done on certain franchises.

It is just

A. The calc thread is messy.


B. Not many members of the calc group are free and math is hard, and the requests sometimes are vague.

I am doing some amateur calcs done just to learn how to do it because personally think it is ridicilous how little the calc thread gets attention


Would honestly pay someone for a two hour course on how to calc and I will be on every day doing calcs tbh.

and smaller verses from my mind get ignored for bigger ones.

That is more anecdotal though, I think. I could be whining about nothing here

At the very least the first thing though is a big issue. The calc thread is at best hard to keep up with and at worst just messy.

Rant over, I hope to read more and keep up with this thread because I think this is what I love about vs wiki compared to obd.

It is a community and it isnt closed off, with friendly staff and people.

I guess what would be helpful would be more streamlined calc requests with template? Idk.
 
I pretty much agree with what Reppuzan and Grudgeman said.

There's honestly so much you can do with any verse before ignoring them for whatever reason such as not having an interest in it or, more likely so, just not able to know it enough that you can't properly put in an opinion on there even if you want to give it some thought on it.

I mean to be honest, there's times where i want to be included in threads that not a lot of people would give input to but it's like.....really REALLY hard to do that when i don't even know what's being proposed let alone the nature and such of the thread in question. Which is why i, in particular at least, just haven't been responding much to a lot of threads nowadays. Well that and the fact that some threads i know tend to go overly long than necessary or, likely so, end up being chaotic to the point people want it closed or end up having that closed.

So like Rep and Grudge said, it's good that if everyone, especially the staff ourselves, try to at least give input to any thread when/if possible. But i just think it wouldn't work if, as Rep said earlier here, were to go onto somewhere only to maybe not know what to do if they know next to nothing of the verse(s) in question. But it can also at least work if we're given explanations of why this should be changed/or added.
 
In all honesty, as a casual around here, I get it when you come up with something for a thread and it just doesn't get any attention or love. I haven't made too many threads but I know what it's like to be waiting from someone to respond or chime in. It can be really fustrating but we have to realize one thing: that something we like or are familiar with may not be popular with the wider community, thus less people know about it. It's a shame but it's true.

I can't tell you how many threads I've popped in on that I've found or been highlighted and then realized I was completely out of my depth and couldn't add much to the discussion. I wouldn't be surprised if that often happens to the staff. It's a little daunting to join in a thread where you don't really feel like you know anything or you don't know enough to make some halfway decent point. Even reading wiki pages will not always give you the context you need to join in vs. actual reading/watching a particular series. We cannot expect staff members to be doing loads and loads of research on series they may not care about or, worse, may not even enjoy. That turns everything that goes into the site from something fun, rewarding and worth doing to a chore, which I doubt anyone truly wants.

If a staff memember can add to a thread if they feel comfortable, that's one thing. Asking them to chime in because they're the staff is another.

Just my two cents.
 
You guys also have to understand that some of the Staff have other reasons why they can't reply on threads.

Some of us literally can't reply on threads over a hundred posts since their hardware can't support it. They suffer lag and their responses come out as stilted and jumbled up as a result.

Many of us are busy with college, familial matters, and other issues. Heck, I'm going to be out of the country for a month in just a week. I have no idea how my Wi-Fi is going to be impacted by this. Not to be rude, but you of all people should know this Ven.

Then there's the fact that many of us are tired. The calc group members can only process so many requests at once, Chat Mod Hop is monitoring chat upwards of 16 Hours a day, Antvasima monitors everything at least eight hours a day, and I've spent hours a day doing renders for other users.

We are putting in as much as we can, but we're only human.
 
Well, I agree that I would definitely appreciate more help with evaluating the content revision threads (although they are much easier to evaluate if the original posters make them easy to understand, and provide evidence), and the calculation evaluation thread requests, but the staff are often very busy in real life.

As for the calculation requests thread, given how time-consuming these are, they are obviously considerably less prioritised, but if a staff member makes a comment that a certain calculation is crucial to get anywhere with a content revision thread for a popular franchise, they are much more important than usual.
 
While I agree with the opinion of Grudgeman, if the verse is small and the revision is big, isn't that even more highlight worthy?

Because if I make a thread about Pokemon, Dragon Ball, or similar, people are going to find it evern without the highlight, and they'll comment based on their knowledge of it.

If I make a thread about a less known verse, this is much, much less likely to happen.
 
Well, it depends on if the revision seems important enough. We cannot highlight remotely everything.
 
No, not everything. But i'd say that if I made a revision about tiers, powers and abilities of a whole verse, this should be more highlight worthy than Porygon's speed.
 
Kaltias said:
No, not everything. But i'd say that if I made a revision about tiers, powers and abilities of a whole verse, this should be more highlight worthy than Porygon's speed.
Click to expand...
If their is no supporters active for a verse to get evaluated other than yourself, and the revison is an important one to said verse. Than I don't see a problem highlighting the thread and getting the opinions of staff and normal users.
 
Well, I am just saying that we have to try to make judgement calls regarding whether a thread seems important or not, as othervise we would end up with 30 or more highlighted threads at the same time.
 
@Antvasima that's why I noted it has to be a very important revison to the verse, like a large scale revison. Plus judging from my experience of what goes around during vs battles we hardly get one of those so it won't affect the chain of highlighting.
 
I agree that case-by-case basis is the best option. What I meant is that the main criteria should be how big the revision is.

In general, a small revision shouldn't be highlighted even if the verse is big and a big revision should be highlighted even if the verse is small, in my opinion.
 
Well, it also depends on how reliable the arguments seem to be.
 
I generally agree with what has been said by most people here. The Everlasting, Promestein, Reppuzan and Cross said it all.

Some Verses will inevitably steal most of the attention do to their popularity, and Calc Members often have their hands full with multiple requests, so the process with that can be slow.

And this is not bringing up work, college, personal life, private issues and a myriad of other situations that the Staff might be going through. It's regretable, but it is also inevitable.

Regardless, I don't believe any Calc Group member avoids doing calculations purposefuly. It is either because they are busy with other calcs, or have real life issues in the way.
 
That or they may not know how to do said calc. Each calcer has their own type of calculation they know intimately, and they would almost always have something to base on if they don't, but there are times that they're just clueless on what to do.

I may not have seen this happen here, but I've seen quite a few in other forums saying so.
 
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