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The Dragon Sword's scabbard is remarked as indestructible, and can effortlessly withstand attacks from Regulus Corneas using his Authority of Greed.

As I'm sure everyone here is aware of, the Authority of Greed allows Regulus to stop time for any object he wants. When he does this and uses it as an attack, the object is explicitly unstoppable. Attacks from him are unbound by physical laws such as gravity, air resistance, and conservation of momentum. By definition, his attacks move at light speed and carry infinite force.

The Dragon Sword's scabbard also resisted the direct gravitational force of, and destroyed, a singularity. Necessitating high-universal durability.

The Dragon Sword's scabbard, despite its apparent invulnerability, was once damaged by the claws of a dragon, believed to be Volcanica, implying high-universal AP, which Reinhard would scale to.
There’s no way this is actually being accepted. We don’t even know if it’s indestructible due to its insane "physical" durability. Unless I'm missing something.

And extrapolating Regulus ability (infinite force) in ways Tappei never mentioned is just weird, and what’s even weirder is how everyone is fine with it.
 
There’s no way this is actually being accepted. We don’t even know if it’s indestructible due to its insane "physical" durability. Unless I'm missing something.
What part? The Dragonsword being indestructable was already accepted ages ago, it's on all Sword saints profiles

And extrapolating Regulus ability (infinite force) in ways Tappei never mentioned is just weird, and what’s even weirder is how everyone is fine with it.
Tbf, maybe apart from Satella, i don't recall anyone accepting anything related to the "Infinite regulus" something something, noone was fine with it and it died pretty quick
 
Why does being removed from Time result in infinite force suddenly? Because Time is 0 so acceleration becomes infinite and so thus Force?
No, because his attacks are unstoppable due to being removed from all physical limitations, granting them light speed travel and virtually infinite force.
No, that may be true in real life physics, but not in fiction. Especially with how many characters move and exert force in stopped time or timeless realms, that is just hax, not speed.

We quite literally have an ability page dedicated to it called Physics Manipulation.
Yes, and that doesn't mean it can't also be High 3-A.
That wouldn't translate to infinite force or High 3-A for the singularity. If you have problems with that, make a thread to change our standards.
Since when are those the standards? The literal Black Hole Feats in Fiction page disagrees with you. So actually, if you have problems with that, you're the one who needs to make a thread about it.
Same as above, make a staff thread for it. Our current standards classify all black hole feats as "Black Hole Creation" (in other words, hax) and any rating derived from them is based on calculations unrelated to the singularity's infinite density.
Except we're not talking about Aldeberan making a black hole, we literally just went over this last time.

We are talking about Reinhard tanking the force near the black hole, and the Dragon Sword tanked the direct force of the singularity, that is the only thing we are talking about in this thread. Do you understand?
From what you wrote in the OP, point 1 and 2 give the sword High 3-A durability. Point 3 gives the dragon high 3-A AP for damaging the sword that supposedly has high 3-A durability.
They do, and that is an objective fact, it has High 3-A durability.

Point 3 does not give it High 3-A AP, it gives Reinhard large star-solar system level DC and AP when he draws the Dragon Sword, because we don't know how large the Re:Zero universe is and stars in Re:Zero are not actual stars, they're tiny spheres of Mana, though the Sun may not apply to that.
How exactly is that "unrelated"?
Because durability and AP are not correlated in this context?

You literally said that "Point's 1 and 2 are wrong, therefor point 3 is wrong as well" even though all 3 arguments are talking about COMPLETELY different things.
Overall I'm still not seeing any valid argumentation here. The arguments are all relient on either trying to classify hax as high tier AP or basing on theoretical models that our standards do not even accept, at least not in the way you are treating them.
Except you're blatantly wrong about that.
 
There’s no way this is actually being accepted. We don’t even know if it’s indestructible due to its insane "physical" durability. Unless I'm missing something.
That's not relevant? It's indestructible within the RZ verse and can withstand infinite forces, so it has High 3-A durability, period. Even if you don't accept the Regulus argument, it objectively did that against a black hole.

If you want to suggest its durability is in any way magical or hax related, Burden of Proof is on you.
And extrapolating Regulus ability (infinite force) in ways Tappei never mentioned is just weird, and what’s even weirder is how everyone is fine with it.
Except it's not extrapolation but simply an aspect of what his ability does. It is an unstoppable, infinite force because it cannot be changed from its environment and is unbound by physical limits and concepts. That by definition means it has High 3-A AP.

An ability being hax related does not mean it cannot have an AP value, that is a logical fallacy.

And literally almost no one agreed with it? Almost everyone in this thread disagreed with it.
 
To clarify, I think there isn't enough info for either side but because of the singularity a possibly/likely rating is fine by me for the sword
i only mentioned the fact that Regulus had the "free from all concepts" because that statement was relevant and wasn't in the OP

Tbf, maybe apart from Satella, i don't recall anyone accepting anything related to the "Infinite regulus" something something, noone was fine with it and it died pretty quick
However, I’d like a counterargument to what @RinneItachi has said so far beyond simply calling it “an extrapolation,” because his interpretation at least has some supporting basis instead of being completely unfounded. it's true that some things can be both written as hax and AP, heck we do that for stuff like black holes themselves, Pain also gets AP from chibaku tensei which is a hax ability too, Accelerator's vector manip despite being higher dimensional also has AP. Rimuru also has higher AP via gluttonous king which is a hax,.
Just saying that its hax doesn't null the fact that it can still be used for AP

Reinhard’s durability/lifting strength would need to be calculated from that black hole feat.

As for the night to day feat, the accepted interpretation so far has been restoration + time manipulation, but I disagree with the time manipulation part because the attack is still fundamentally a sword slash. It makes more sense for it to be erasure followed by restoration, with Reinhard restoring the environment in a way that brought the sun back into view. Changing the placement of celestial bodies is a simpler and more consistent explanation than literally advancing the time of day. By Occam’s Razor, that would be the more reasonable interpretation.

So there are basically two routes we can take here:

  • Either we give Reinhard both the higher AP scaling with the sword and list time manipulation as “likely/possible,”
  • Or we keep the higher AP scaling itself as “likely/possible” while removing time manipulation from his profile entirely.
 
Reinhard’s durability/lifting strength would need to be calculated from that black hole feat.
Durability is very clearly High 3A tho? If the blackhole is accepted to act like a real one, and the singularity is real, Lifting strength is what would need to be calculated
 
Durability is very clearly High 3A tho? If the blackhole is accepted to act like a real one, and the singularity is real, Lifting strength is what would need to be calculated
Not necessarily.

This would be true if he actually touched it directly, which is what my argument was initially, but in the thread we've generally reached the consensus that he was just close to it, with his arm being in the very nearby vicinity, at least around 3-4 feet away from it.

Gravity and tidal forces at that range would be insanely high still, but not infinite. We're trying to figure out what that actually would be, waiting for someone more knowledgeable to calc it. Made a request in the calc request thread but currently we haven't gotten anyone.

There is a possibility it won't even be an upgrade though.
 
Not necessarily.

This would be true if he actually touched it directly, which is what my argument was initially, but in the thread we've generally reached the consensus that he was just close to it, with his arm being in the very nearby vicinity, at least around 3-4 feet away from it.

Gravity and tidal forces at that range would be insanely high still, but not infinite. We're trying to figure out what that actually would be, waiting for someone more knowledgeable to calc it. Made a request in the calc request thread but currently we haven't gotten anyone.

There is a possibility it won't even be an upgrade though.
I see, that makes more sense then.

I don’t think his arm was literally inside the singularity itself either, but the wording still says the singularity damaged his arm specifically, which is why I’m a bit hesitant to completely reduce it to just nearby finite black hole effects. And like i said earlier even though Reinhard was very clearly damaged, he still withstood the attack enough to immediately continue functioning and use the Dragon Sword against Satella afterwards. So to me it feels like the feat should still mean something durability-wise beyond just surviving proximity to gravity.
I’m just unsure where exactly the line should be drawn there you know
 
do we know the mass of the blackhole?

I see the text says it's a star brought down into a single point, is it 1 stellar mass then?
 
Why does being removed from Time result in infinite force suddenly? Because Time is 0 so acceleration becomes infinite and so thus Force?

No, that may be true in real life physics, but not in fiction. Especially with how many characters move and exert force in stopped time or timeless realms, that is just hax, not speed.

We quite literally have an ability page dedicated to it called Physics Manipulation.
I mean to be completely fair, Regulus's attacks when imbued with lions heart are consistently shown and stated to bypass any defenses and ignore durability not because he's literally stopping time and punching you (in fact he can't even stop time for anything other than himself and inanimate objects he directly touches) but because the objects he affects with his authority are liberated by all the worlds physical laws and it's explicitly stated he's freed from things like gravity and inertia, things that actually affect force both irl and within the actual series itself.

It would be one thing if his authority was never properly elaborated on, and if that was the case I'd certainly agree with you here, but since the verse does a pretty good job of explicitly stating that he essentially has an infinite AP work around when utilizing his authority, not to mention aside from the dragon sword it also doesn't ever have antifeats of being able to be blocked by anything or anyone, so I do think it is a little disingenuous to say the argument is completely unfounded here, at least imo. Though I can ultimately understand your misgivings
 
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do we know the mass of the blackhole?
Nope. But a safe estimate of its diametre would be half of the length of the sheathed Dragon Sword Reid, which is what Reinhard shoved into the singularity to disrupt it.

I see the text says it's a star brought down into a single point, is it 1 stellar mass then?
Ah nono, it's "enough mana to bring down a star (pause) concentrated into a single point". Refers to a very mana-intensive spell that pulls a star down to the earth.
 
Ah nono, it's "enough mana to bring down a star (pause) concentrated into a single point". Refers to a very mana-intensive spell that pulls a star down to the earth.
Ah ic, without context I thought the og spell made a star which the amped version concentrated into a singularity

Problem is there isn't really a consensus for finding durability from being next to black holes

The method of using PE has been rejected by CGMs (Here & Here) so that doesn't seem like an option (Tho I think it's weird cause isn't it under the same principle of scaling someone's AP to what they can lift above their head and jumping?)

Might be able to calc it via the black hole's tidal force on him as it seems like his arm entered the event horizon due to the sword thrust
It would give a force which you multiply by the distance, I believe here it would be the movement of his thrust into the black hole, to find the energy

I haven't seen this method used before so take what I'm saying with a pinch of salt tho, yall should try to get some CGM help on this
 
do we know the mass of the blackhole?

I see the text says it's a star brought down into a single point, is it 1 stellar mass then?
No, we can only use a conservative estimate. Though from the description it sounds as though the Event Horizon was large enough to engulf the tip of the Dragon Sword, so likely planetary-scale mass.

No, that's not necessarily relevant. Any singularity could do this if given enough time.
 
Nope. But a safe estimate of its diametre would be half of the length of the sheathed Dragon Sword Reid, which is what Reinhard shoved into the singularity to disrupt it.


Ah nono, it's "enough mana to bring down a star (pause) concentrated into a single point". Refers to a very mana-intensive spell that pulls a star down to the earth.
Oh if we're going with that then this singularity would more so be large planetary in mass for sure. Assuming that the whole front side of the scabbard was engulfed in the Event Horizon off of the description (I was ignoring this for conservational purposes), we're talking about an Event Horizon at least extending a couple feet or so from the singularity, so tens of times an Earth-mass black hole.

Reinhard's hand and arm would still only be like 4-5 feet away, so we'd still need to calc the gravity and tidal forces at that distance.
 
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