[R2M2] 2nd Crosstier Tournament - Azalea Aculeus vs. Delta (0-0-0)

[Phoenks]

I wonder what his reaction will be to me telling him his character got everyone to quit the tournament

 

[Rayfire]

"Azalea can return an object to back its initial state with restoration, essentially undoing any influence that alters said object's state"

It's pretty clear cut lol. The only thing that isn't mentioned is what this is based on. Which is memory.

Which is exactly what we are talking about. You can’t use things that aren’t on the page, regardless of what the original creator says. You are literally trying to say that restoring something back to an original state = based on memories which is completely illogical

"Object" is referring to any target. If she has a target in mind, she can recover it to a more original state. Which means the past state of an object.

This can include herself. Hence why she can return herself to a previous state and position in time.

Once again, in no way does the description say anything about dimensional hopping or time travel that would be required to circumvent this sort of thing. In the context or arcane collection, this basically means status effects and the like, not being sent to a whole other inescapable dimension.

Nova's pages don't tend to be as crazy detailed as I make mine so that is the issue. Not even I knew her restore went that far, but he explained it to me just now so I understand it.

Then why didn’t you just… check with him before making it? Plus, aren’t you supposed to be one of the biggest names working on the verse? How come you don’t know about it? It can’t be used anyway, because azalea doesn’t even have memory manipulation on her page

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

I wonder what his reaction will be to me telling him his character got everyone to quit the tournament

Well, it shouldn’t be something to be proud of in my opinion, he needs to make his pages better and give his character real abilities that can actually be worked with tangibly and not shatter any possible conflicts

Us quitting is by no means a good look for azalea lol

 

[MintyBoi1]

It’s been 24+ hours since Grace and I’m seeing no reason to change my vote given the faulty nature of Azalea’s restore and Delta’s many tricks to pull off Quiet Tomb. Can we call it wraps?

 

[Phoenks]

Which is exactly what we are talking about. You can’t use things that aren’t on the page, regardless of what the original creator says. You are literally trying to say that restoring something back to an original state = based on memories which is completely illogical

Once again, in no way does the description say anything about dimensional hopping or time travel that would be required to circumvent this sort of thing. In the context or arcane collection, this basically means status effects and the like, not being sent to a whole other inescapable dimension.

Then why didn’t you just… check with him before making it? Plus, aren’t you supposed to be one of the biggest names working on the verse? How come you don’t know about it? It can’t be used anyway, because azalea doesn’t even have memory manipulation on her page

It is on the page, it just isn't super clear. Also it isn't an application of memory manipulation. It's causality manip based on memories. Since memories store the past.

Causality manipulation covers it all.

 

[Rayfire]

In any case, nothing that nova has said is on azalea’s page, meaning it can’t be used. Although, even if it was legitimate, there’s still issues with it that make using it to escape quiet tomb problematic.

Someone like Phoenks in particular should know rules like these, but you are apparently blatantly ignoring a basic rule like that just to try and avoid a loss, which is not what being a mod is all about, is it?

 

[Phoenks]

Anyway match can't be added since azalea stomps. Sorry guys.

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

In any case, nothing that nova has said is on azalea’s page, meaning it can’t be used. Although, even if it was legitimate, there’s still issues with it that make using it to escape quiet tomb problematic.

Someone like Phoenks in particular should know rules like these, but you are apparently blatantly ignoring a basic rule like that just to try and avoid a loss, which is not what being a mod is all about, is it?

Just drop it at this point, why feed further into it when it’s actually rigged lol

 

[Rayfire]

It is on the page, it just isn't super clear. Also it isn't an application of memory manipulation. It's causality manip based on memories. Since memories store the past.

Causality manipulation covers it all.

But azalea doesn’t even have causality manipulation listed, what on earth are you talking about? You can only use things that are shown on a characters’ pages, regardless of what the original creator says. I could say all my oc’s have full causality manipulation whenever, but i never wrote it down nor put it on the page, so it’d be invalid.

Even then, that’s still very inconsistent with what restore is all about, which, from it’s description, is for status effects, not being sent to another dimension, for the millionth time.

 

[Rayfire]

Anyway match can't be added since azalea stomps. Sorry guys.

Well, everybody else is saying the opposite. You haven’t addressed the problems with restore properly, and simply because you disagree doesn’t mean that you can’t ignore grace rules. This should be extremely obvious.

 

[Rayfire]

Also, why are you focusing on me to ignore everyone else’s arguments? It sounds like you are still trying to uphold some kind of image that everyone else is wrong despite not responding to them and instead mostly me. For example…

I don’t know if it’s just me, but I don’t even know how you can have a tangible story with powers like that, and I know that azalea isn’t even like a high tier ark character. It’s not just absurd, it’s like borderline insanity. I wouldn’t wanna write if my characters could negate all like that

So she causality manips anything which happens to her out of existence, not even a hint of a drawback to that either. An ability like that is literally plot breaking, no one can do anything to her. There’s no conflict, no room for character growth, it’s just nothingness really, why does she have it?

They seem less likely to happen. You haven’t even said a word about Delta’s spatial manipulation or speed reduction. You’re the one who’s parroting the same arguments. Just because Azalea has more win cons doesn’t mean hers are more likely, everyone else agrees.

Then why doesn’t the description reflect that? I don’t even see Memory Manipulation on the profile. Even under Powers and Abilities it just says it restores something to a previous state. Versus rules say we can only use what’s on pages, so there would need to be changes made for me to have faith that’s really the ability and not what is actually described.

 

[Phoenks]

But azalea doesn’t even have causality manipulation listed, what on earth are you talking about? You can only use things that are shown on a characters’ pages, regardless of what the original creator says. I could say all my oc’s have full causality manipulation whenever, but i never wrote it down nor put it on the page, so it’d be invalid.

Even then, that’s still very inconsistent with what restore is all about, which, from it’s description, is for status effects, not being sent to another dimension, for the millionth time.

Wait what I told you before that Restoration on her page is linked to causality manipulation. Click on restoration.

Idk why y'all are so mad I just explained the ability and the description lines up exactly. It just doesn't tell you the memory based mechanism behind it. Which is fine anyway since many pages don't tell you that much info.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Screw this match

Wait what I told you before that Restoration on her page is linked to causality manipulation. Click on restoration.

Idk why y'all are so mad I just explained the ability and the description lines up exactly. It just doesn't tell you the memory based mechanism behind it. Which is fine anyway since many pages don't tell you that much info.

It’s linked to causality manipulation but that can still fall under the original description. Restoring back to previous state with cause and effect. Not exactly dimension jumping. I just don’t see how this ability is described in a completely inaccurate way and how we’re supposed to take that at face value.

 

[Rayfire]

Wait what I told you before that Restoration on her page is linked to causality manipulation. Click on restoration.

Idk why y'all are so mad I just explained the ability and the description lines up exactly. It just doesn't tell you the memory based mechanism behind it. Which is fine anyway since many pages don't tell you that much info.

Even then, as I’ve said a million times before, it isn’t very useful in this case because all it really has been shown to do is reverse things like status effects or spells. It has nothing to do with reversing inescapable BFR. What on earth are you talking bout?

Exactly. Memory manipulation isn’t even on the page itself. For a page as detailed as azalea’s, you’d expect it to be if that were true, but it isn’t. And whose fault is that? I’ll say it one more time. You can only use things listed on the profiles themselves, regardless of what the og creators say. Imagine if i said my oc’s could beat azathoth without a basis. You would think i was talking bs. It’s the same situation here.

 

[Phoenks]

Screw this match

It’s linked to causality manipulation but that can still fall under the original description. Restoring back to previous state with cause and effect. Not exactly dimension jumping. I just don’t see how this ability is described in a completely inaccurate way and how we’re supposed to take that at face value.

It isn't described in an inaccurate way though.

Restoring something back to its previous state can include physical location. For example if I was at home 7 hours ago and I remember that I was, then I could restore myself to that position I was in 7 hours ago. It ignores distance.

Idk what more to tell you that just is a genuine application of restoration lol.

There is infact another character, which is my own, that can do the same thing via restoration. So it isn't that out of the ordinary in the verse either.

Anyway, IDC if Delta moves on. But the match can't be added since Azalea stomps.

 

[Rayfire]

Restoring something back to its previous state can include physical location. For example if I was at home 7 hours ago and I remember that I was, then I could restore myself to that position I was in 7 hours ago. It ignores distance.

Dude, you are ignoring everything i just said 5 minutes ago. She doesn’t even have memory manip listed on her page, and it completely contradicts the description of the skill, so I’m not sure what saying that is supposed to achieve.

There is infact another character, which is my own, that can do the same thing via restoration. So it isn't that out of the ordinary in the verse either.

Which one? Even then, azalea hasn’t been shown to do that herself either, so it’s likely not applicable either.

Anyway, IDC if Delta moves on. But the match can't be added since Azalea stomps.

We can. It’s grace in delta’s favor. You can’t ignore a basic VS thread rule.

 

[Phoenks]

Memory manipulation is not a part of the ability in the first place. You are just babbling at this point lol. It's all just causality manipulation/restoration. Memory manip has nothing to do with it. She isn't altering anyone's memories. She's just recalling an event in her mind and restoring an object in-line with that event.

 

[ExSENNA]

Well I am back, this truly was one of the threads of all time.


I heard a bunch of people withdrawing. Is it ok if I restart this without Azalea (for having an auto "no" button) Delta (for having thought based "go away and die" button)?

I want this tourney to end properly bois

 

[Rayfire]

Memory manipulation is not a part of the ability in the first place. You are just babbling at this point lol. It's all just causality manipulation/restoration. Memory manip has nothing to do with it. She isn't altering anyone's memories. She's just recalling an event in her mind and restoring an object in-line with that event.

So are you. You are literally trying to downplay how absurd you sound right now. The memory-usage description is completely contradictory to azalea’s page, which is clearly meant to be super dooper detailed and accurate, and yet, apparently it’s not? It has never once been shown to work on the level it needs to be here. You are assuming way too many things just to glorify azalea’s ways to win.

There is also absolutely no source material i can see to fact-check this at all, so it’s complete madness to say that it’s different all of a sudden given all the above factors ^

 

[LeoEpicGamer8910]

Well I am back, this truly was one of the threads of all time.


I heard a bunch of people withdrawing. Is it ok if I restart this without Azalea (for having an auto "no" button) Delta (for having thought based "go away and die" button)?

I want this tourney to end properly bois

Ehh I'll see what the others think. I do have someone in line to take Delta's place.

 

[Javenplayz253]

I want SANIC replaced too

 

[Rayfire]

I heard a bunch of people withdrawing. Is it ok if I restart this without Azalea (for having an auto "no" button)

The auto “no” button is very questionable as you might tell, lol, especially when Phoenks seems to be ignoring some pretty basic rules to get around this, but you’re in charge of the tourney, so up to you

 

[ExSENNA]

The auto “no” button is very questionable as you might tell, lol, especially when Phoenks seems to be ignoring some pretty basic rules to get around this, but you’re in charge of the tourney, so up to you

Fine then. I'll restart without Azalea or Delta. Both can chose others if they wanna enter again

 

[ExSENNA]

I want SANIC replaced too

Sonic becomes a strong boi when both Azalea and Delta not here. Idk if Phoenks will participate again so I might just end up having Sonic win his round against nobody to face Leo's replacement for Delta. If Leo also doesnt participate then Sonic fights Grender at finals if Vene stops the process of withdrawal

 

[ThePrimalHunter]

Fine then. I'll restart without Azalea or Delta. Both can chose others if they wanna enter again

Does this technically mean Kira won?

Yep, I'm adding Supernatural Luck to her profile now

 

[Phoenks]

I don't mind Azalea being DQ'd. She's too OP for the rest of the people in the tournament and looking back at it she breaks some rules.

 

[VNova]

I wonder what his reaction will be to me telling him his character got everyone to quit the tournament

azalea is peak ark fodder