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Questions about qualitative superiority and R>F

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Georredannea15 said:
Pein and DT didn't talk about what we discussed in the revision, and frankly I think she's wrong. As I said, I don't care what Pein or anybody else says, because it wasn't discussed in the revision. At the very beginning pein opened the revision for R>F to give HDE and DT refused.
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Pain has wrote the revision. So Idc, her words are there on HDE page which states that uncountable infinite "construct" doesn't give HDE but just existential QS, change the standards if you disagree with what she has wrote.
Georredannea15 said:
Quote me DT's comment or a comment from the HDE page about what we are discussing. Other than that... mehh
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> Being infinitely larger than or containing infinite 3-dimensional objects, entities, or constructs signifies an uncountable infinite difference, which can suggest qualitative superiority. However, without further context, this does not necessarily imply the existence of an extradimensional axis.
 
Reiner said:
Pain has wrote the revision. So Idc, her words are there on HDE page which states that uncountable infinite "construct" doesn't give HDE but just existential QS, change the standards if you disagree with what she has wrote.
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Page is not talking about "existential QS", which you quoted below. It is only talking about the uncountable infinite difference=QS
Reiner said:
> Being infinitely larger than or containing infinite 3-dimensional objects, entities, or constructs signifies an uncountable infinite difference, which can suggest qualitative superiority. However, without further context, this does not necessarily imply the existence of an extradimensional axis.
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Then the HDE of the character containing a 4-D universal space-time must go.

nuke all large size based HDEs in the wiki lmao.
 
Georredannea15 said:
Then the HDE of the character containing a 4-D universal space-time must go.

nuke all large size based HDEs in the wiki lmao.
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im very sure a 3D space cannot contain a 4D space
that is common logic
There is a thing called assumption when such cases are present unless the fiction specifically says otherwise despite the fact that it is illogical

Also, the quote is specifically talking about containing infinite 3D space and not an entire spacetime continuum. which is why we cannot assume it contains a 4th axis because infinite 3D space is only 3D space unless specified it also contains time.
so QS to 3D things by uncountable infinite of course doesn't grant HDE in 4D as it specifically did not mention time as included and only infinite 3 dimensional object
 
I think he is just overwhelmed especially with how a lot of us trying to explain it at the same time.

But give it some time and try not to hyper fixate so much on things and read more into the clarifications on later responses.
 
ImmortalDread said:
Georr: "Hey let's call Pain, she is actually knowledgeable member"
"Pain spitted fax"
Georr: "I think she is wrong"

This is the moment you lose your argument terribly.
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I never said that, lmao. I asked for DT's interpretation for that but I guess you don't want understand that.
 
TheGreatJedi13 said:
im very sure a 3D space cannot contain a 4D space
that is common logic
There is a thing called assumption when such cases are present unless the fiction specifically says otherwise despite the fact that it is illogical

Also, the quote is specifically talking about containing infinite 3D space and not an entire spacetime continuum. which is why we cannot assume it contains a 4th axis because infinite 3D space is only 3D space unless specified it also contains time.
so QS to 3D things by uncountable infinite of course doesn't grant HDE in 4D as it specifically did not mention time as included and only infinite 3 dimensional object
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I never claimed that.

A universal space-time continuum = having uncountably infinitely larger size than any 3-D structure.

And if we think about it for a character, that is, a character with an uncountably infinitely larger size than 3-D, this will give it an extra +1 range of movement, so it will be 4-D with large size because uncountable infinite always means "+1" and in this case it gives you +1 range of movement.

What DT is talking about is to encompass 3-D structures and be infinite(Well, i guess), but I am not talking about these, I am talking about being uncountable infinitely/qualitatively larger than these 3-D structures in terms of "size".

Likewise, there may be an uncountable infinite difference between you and 3-D(power), but this only gives you Tier.
 
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ImmortalDread said:
It's fine observation for me. If DT came and told you are wrong, you will still think DT is wrong.


@Reiner and @TheGreatJedi13 what are y'all actually benefit on this?
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Don't confuse me with you, you're the one who did this. Whether DT or Ultima, Lmao. Anyway...

I don't actually do that. If DT says it, I'll say "he knows something" and I'll move on.

Of course, I'll open a thread and try to correct it, but if DT insists on it and explains it with evidence, I'll say I'm mistaken and move on.

Just like Pein called R>F is a HDE and later realised she was wrong, we are not children, we can understand this
 
DontTalkDT said:
What's the question?
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It's about current revision that happened in HDE page. Specifically this one:

Being infinitely larger than or containing infinite 3-dimensional objects, entities, or constructs signifies an uncountable infinite difference, which can suggest qualitative superiority. However, without further context, this does not necessarily imply the existence of an extradimensional axis.

Arguements are that it's talking about uncountable infinite difference of AP not size. So uncountable infinite size still Qualifies as HDE by default regardless of the revision and pain said no, current addition do not give uncountable infinite size HDE by default but doubt are still there.
ImmortalDread said:
OP
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Reiner said:
DT will come to me one day I'm sure
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Told ya.
 
DontTalkDT said:
The answer is case-by-case. What's the question?
The stuff in the OP or has the discussion moved on?
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There are 3 questions;

1- Does having an uncountable infinitely larger "size" or "existence" according to 3D structures give HDE?

2- Does a person who performs R>F have an uncountably infinitely greater existence/size than the reality he/she sees as fiction?

3- Is R>F basically an existential qualitative transcendence, or is it just being "more real than the lower plane"?
 
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LuisGeno said:
I have great doubts about the qualitative superiority and the R>F, if someone answers me I would greatly appreciate it.

First: qualitative superiority could be achieved by being "infinitely larger" than x dimension, and therefore that dimension is infinitesimal to that infinitely larger dimension. Alright?
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Sounds ok. As long as it's the right level of infinitely larger.
LuisGeno said:
And another thing, if the higher spatial dimensions are not automatically greater infinities than each other, where did the idea that extradimensional axes could give rise to greater infinities come from? Where can I read information about this? I want to learn it well.
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vsbattles.fandom.com

Some old stuff

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

î--- an old explanation page from before the tiering revision.
LuisGeno said:
Another thing, does the transcendence R>F between layers/dimensions make them infinitely greater than each other? According to me, this has nothing to do with size, but with the nature of dimensions/layers, so is it a form of qualitative transcendence, or is it just a form that is added apart?
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It's not physically greater unless the verse describes it as such. It's a power difference large enough to correspond to qualitative superiority, though.
LuisGeno said:
And, last question: if in a verse it is mentioned that there are infinite dimensions, that they are explicitly about extra dimensional axes, but nevertheless, there is only evidence of qualitative superiority between 3 of those infinite dimensions, can this qualitative superiority also be applied to all other dimensions?
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Case-by-case.
LuisGeno said:
I had heard that this is possible, if it is said that the qualitative superiority is by its nature of spatial dimension, but I want to be sure.
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If it's said that it's a property of dimensions in general, then yes.
Reiner said:
It's about current revision that happened in HDE page. Specifically this one:

Being infinitely larger than or containing infinite 3-dimensional objects, entities, or constructs signifies an uncountable infinite difference, which can suggest qualitative superiority. However, without further context, this does not necessarily imply the existence of an extradimensional axis.

Arguements are that it's talking about uncountable infinite difference of AP not size. So uncountable infinite size still Qualifies as HDE by default regardless of the revision and pain said no, current addition do not give uncountable infinite size HDE by default but doubt are still there.
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One can imagine cases in fiction in which a character is larger in a fashion that qualitative superiority is achieved without having HDE.
Georredannea15 said:
There are 3 questions;

1- Does having an uncountable infinitely larger "size" or "existence" according to 3D structures give HDE?
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Not necessarily.
Georredannea15 said:
2- Does a person who performs R>F have an uncountably infinitely greater existence/size than the reality he/she sees as fiction?
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That question is kinda vague. Greater existence in which sense? If we talk size, then no, unless it's specified (Umineko for instance specifies it)
Georredannea15 said:
3- Is R>F basically an existential qualitative transcendence, or is it just being "more real than the lower plane"?
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I don't see the difference.
 
DontTalkDT said:
Not necessarily.
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Wouldn't that have won you Large size? For example, Large size type 9 is to have a "size" as big as multiple space-time continuums, and which gives you HDE by default.

And wouldn't having a "size" uncountably infinitely larger than the 3D structures give you HDE directly with large size I mentioned above? Or am I missing something?
DontTalkDT said:
That question is kinda vague. Greater existence in which sense? If we talk size, then no, unless it's specified (Umineko for instance specifies it)
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Well, i mean pyhsical size.(Large size)
DontTalkDT said:
I don't see the difference.
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So one last question, does R>F give a character an "uncountable infinitely larger existence/size" by default(I mean pyhsical size)? Or does this need to be stated in the verse.
 
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Anyway, my goal was to prove that R>F does not give without context "uncountably infinitely larger/greater size/existence", but I came up with a lot more bullshit, I'm still waiting for him answers.(I hope he sees)
 
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Georredannea15 said:
Wouldn't that have won you Large size? For example, Large size type 9 is to have a "size" as big as multiple space-time continuums, and which gives you HDE by default.

And wouldn't having a "size" uncountably infinitely larger than the 3D structures give you HDE directly with large size I mentioned above? Or am I missing something?
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Being infinitely large would give you large size.

But being higher D has something to do with how many directions your body extends into. So no. You can be large in other ways.
Georredannea15 said:
So one last question, does R>F give a character an "uncountable infinitely larger existence/size" by default(I mean pyhsical size)? Or does this need to be stated in the verse.
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No, just qualitative superiority, unless there are other statements or showings.
 
Well, my questions have already been answered, I think that unless other people have doubts about the same thing, they can close the thread. Thank you very much DT, and others for answering my questions.
 
DontTalkDT said:
Being infinitely large would give you large size.

But being higher D has something to do with how many directions your body extends into. So no. You can be large in other ways.
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I see. For example having a Type 9 large size does not always give HDE by default. Thanks DT🙏
DontTalkDT said:
No, just qualitative superiority, unless there are other statements or showings.
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Thanks DT. Actually, the first discussion area of the thread was whether R>F has uncountable infinitely larger/greater size than the lower plane or not. Thanks for the clarification. 🙏
 
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