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Hello. This CRT was created to possibly upgrade the Heavenly Father God's order to a type 1 concept, and therefore upgrade Anos Voldigoad's concept manip to type 1, as he can manipulate and destroy that order.
Thanks to @RamadhanDayYet for helping me with this.
Possible Type 1 Concept:
Order = laws and concepts
Gods only maintain order, therefore a God's death =/= destruction of their order, but a God's death = order not being maintained, which would disrupt the order (remove the order from the natural system of the world).
Completely destroying an order would destroy the world as a by-product.
Normally, disrupting an order would not destroy the world as a by-product, as evidenced by the fact that disrupting the Order of Destruction did not destroy the world. There are two exceptions to this, namely the Chief God's order and the Heavenly Father God's order.
The Chief God's order is the basic purpose of the world, and therefore disrupting it would destroy the world.
The Heavenly Father God is also referred to as the "pillar of the gods".
Details about the Heavenly Father God's order, namely the "Order of Order":
The Order of Order creates new gods and order while also maintaining all other order in the world.
Merely disrupting the Order of Order, by destroying the god who maintains it, indirectly destroys the world, since disrupting the Order of Order would disrupt and destroy all other order in the world.
Destroying the Order of Order would destroy all other order in the world, since all other order in the world can't be maintained/exist without the Order of Order, therefore making all other order in the world dependant on the Order of Order.
The Order of Order would be independent of all other order in the world, since it both creates and maintains all other order in the world.
Since it both creates and maintains all other order in the world, it would naturally exist before and after all other order in the world.
Reasons why I think this possibly qualifies as a type 1 concept:
1. Type 2 concepts (normal order) are dependant on the Order of Order, and would be unable to exist in the reality they govern without the Order of Order.
2.I'm uncertain if altering the Order of Order would change all other order in the world (though it's possible), but I'm certain that destroying the Order of Order would destroy all other order in the world (this does not happen when destroying any other order in the world).
3. The Order of Order would exist prior to and after the existence of all other order in the world.
**Updated reasons + new evidence:
Agree (18): @RamadhanDayYet, @Ness21, @Bernkastelll, @Dereck03, @Imperium, @megaraptor, @God900, @deonment, @Yzak, @Shizuka, @Verrel966, @Marciano15, @InfiniteCosmology, @Delta333, @TOAAPRESENCE1, @Teezar, @Qawsedf234, @Elizhaa
Disagree (1): @InfiniteDay
Neutral (1): @QuasiYuri
Thanks to @RamadhanDayYet for helping me with this.
1. Independent Universal Concept: Such concepts are completely independent from the reality they govern. These concepts shape all of reality and whatever level that reality exists in, and everything in reality "participates" in these concepts. For example, a circular object is circular because it is "participating" in the form of "circle-ness". In this way, the alteration of these concepts will change every object of the concept across all of reality, while the opposite wouldn't affect the concept.
- Concept Manipulation Page
Possible Type 1 Concept:
Order
"The various laws that make up the world, or the power of the gods that keep these laws normal. There are various orders such as “time”, “creation”, and “destruction”, and the same number of gods control them." ~ LN Keyword
"Gods are the race that controls the world. Each person has some kind of "order" as their authority and is extremely powerful." ~ LN Keyword
"The order of the world, the laws of the world, or providence, are embodied by the Guardian Deities." ~ WN Chapter 29
"It is the reason why this world is the world it is. Why is a bird a bird, why is a demon a demon? The heavens send down rain to moisten the earth and nurture the trees. If you draw a magic circle and put magic power into the magic formula, the light will come on. These are what we call the laws of nature, the laws of magic, the order that makes this world what it is."
[...]
"And the beings who maintain that order, the beings who embody that order, are the higher order divine race, the gods." ~ WN Chapter 120
秩序 - chitsujo :: Translations: order; regularity; system
Order is the laws and concepts that define and maintain the world. Gods maintain order by either controlling an order or protecting it from being disrupted. Completely erasing an order from the world would destroy the world as a by-product. Disrupting an order means that the order has only been removed from the natural system of the world, and not completely erased.
"All things without exception must eventually lead to destruction, however, because the Demon King stole the Order of Destruction, the world has been limited. Those that should have died did not die, those that should have brought about ruin did not and thus the natural law was disrupted. Other gods stepped in to compensate for it but the order was not completely restored." ~ WN Chapter 120
<Venuzdonoa> is a weapon created by the Order of Destruction. The order was not completely erased, but rather disrupted and turned into a weapon. After removing the order from the natural system of the world, the concept of destruction and all laws related to it across the entire world was affected.
A god's divine order, also referred to as an authority, is connected to that god's respective order, and seemingly utilises that order.
- Maou Gakuin no Futekigousha: Terminology & Cosmology Blog
「私は天父神ノウスガリア。神を生む秩序、神々の父である」
[...]
「蒙昧な君に知恵を授けよう。神の父たる私は、この世の秩序の父である。一時的にでも、私が滅べば、その間、世界を維持するための秩序が生まれない。私を滅ぼせば、世界が滅びる」
神も永遠ではない。
奴らは秩序に従い消え、そして新たに生み出される。
そしてそれらを生み出している神が、天父神ノウスガリアというわけか。
'I am Nousgalia, the Heavenly Father God. I am the order that gives birth to the gods, the father of the gods.
[...]
'I will give you wisdom, you who are ignorant. I, the Father of God, am the father of the order of the world. If I perish, even temporarily, there will be no order to maintain the world during that time. If I perish, the world perishes.
God is not eternal.
They disappear and are reborn according to the order.
And the god who creates them is Nousgalia, the Heavenly Father God.
- WN Chapter 120
天父神を滅ぼせば、世界の秩序は乱れ、やがて滅び行く。
[...]
「エールドメードの体と根源に寄生したのは間違いだったな。その中にいれば、一割の根源でも生きることができる。天父神の根源が一割残っていれば、その秩序も完全には崩壊しない。貴様ら神は不滅の存在だ。本来なら、根源を再生することは容易いはずだが、理滅剣の前ではそうはいかぬ」
[...]
天父神は、神が生まれるという秩序を保つ。それならば、奴が有する秩序としても納得のいく話だ。
If the Heavenly Father God is destroyed, the order of the world will be disturbed and eventually destroyed.
[...]
'It was a mistake to become a parasite in the body and source of the Eldemade. If you stay in it, even ten percent of the source can live. As long as ten percent of the Heavenly Father God's source remain, the order will not be completely destroyed. You gods are immortal beings. Normally, it would be easy to regenerate the source, but that is not possible in front of the principle destroying sword.
[...]
The Heavenly Father God maintains the order of divine birth. If that's the case, then it makes sense for him to have his own order.
- WN Chapter 121
「だが、秩序を生む秩序、天父神ノウスガリアと言えど、魔王の敵としてはどうにも見劣りする。なぜなら、奴は暴虐の魔王を取るに足らぬ存在だと見くびっているからだ。敵を侮る相手が、戦いに勝てると思うか?」
'However, even the order that creates order, the Heavenly Father God Nousgalia, is inferior as an enemy of the Demon King. He is disappointed that he is insignificant to the Demon King of Tyranny. Do you think the opponent who despises the enemy can win the battle?
- WN Chapter 170
「君は私を滅ぼすことはできない……秩序を生む秩序。天父神を滅ぼせば、世界は崩壊の一途を辿るのみだ」
'You can't destroy me... the order that creates order. If you destroy the Heavenly Father God, the world will only collapse...
- WN Chapter 186
Order = laws and concepts
Gods only maintain order, therefore a God's death =/= destruction of their order, but a God's death = order not being maintained, which would disrupt the order (remove the order from the natural system of the world).
Completely destroying an order would destroy the world as a by-product.
Normally, disrupting an order would not destroy the world as a by-product, as evidenced by the fact that disrupting the Order of Destruction did not destroy the world. There are two exceptions to this, namely the Chief God's order and the Heavenly Father God's order.
The Chief God's order is the basic purpose of the world, and therefore disrupting it would destroy the world.
The Heavenly Father God is also referred to as the "pillar of the gods".
Details about the Heavenly Father God's order, namely the "Order of Order":
The Order of Order creates new gods and order while also maintaining all other order in the world.
Merely disrupting the Order of Order, by destroying the god who maintains it, indirectly destroys the world, since disrupting the Order of Order would disrupt and destroy all other order in the world.
Destroying the Order of Order would destroy all other order in the world, since all other order in the world can't be maintained/exist without the Order of Order, therefore making all other order in the world dependant on the Order of Order.
The Order of Order would be independent of all other order in the world, since it both creates and maintains all other order in the world.
Since it both creates and maintains all other order in the world, it would naturally exist before and after all other order in the world.
Reasons why I think this possibly qualifies as a type 1 concept:
1. Type 2 concepts (normal order) are dependant on the Order of Order, and would be unable to exist in the reality they govern without the Order of Order.
2.
3. The Order of Order would exist prior to and after the existence of all other order in the world.
**Updated reasons + new evidence:
Agree (18): @RamadhanDayYet, @Ness21, @Bernkastelll, @Dereck03, @Imperium, @megaraptor, @God900, @deonment, @Yzak, @Shizuka, @Verrel966, @Marciano15, @InfiniteCosmology, @Delta333, @TOAAPRESENCE1, @Teezar, @Qawsedf234, @Elizhaa
Disagree (1): @InfiniteDay
Neutral (1): @QuasiYuri
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