Orochi vs Superman

[Cropfist]

A different caped hero battles the monster king...the Justice League raids the Monster Association's base, and the man of steel goes to confront their leader.

Speed equalized, pre-resurrection Superman, Orochi is large island

 

[Bob8999]

neither have any mind blowing or durability negating abilities (although orochi should have a pretty large skill advantage.) so for the most part it comes down to ap and durability, orochi scales to golden sperm who is slightly below if not on par with tatsumaki who is 372.62 gigatons, superman on the other hand is baseline (i think.) which means he´s 100 gigatons giving orochi an almost 4x ap and dura advantage + his skill advantage, all supes has is flight and lifiting strength(mabye), ill give it to orochi.

 

[ElixirBlue]

Yeah, i'll give it to Orochi as well FRA

 

[Ionliosite]

Orochi FRA

 

[Schnee_One]

Orochi FRA

 

[KGiffoni]

Orochi fra

 

[SpookyShadow]

Orochi FRA

 

[GyroNutz]

Orochi FRA

Superman is probably above baseline btw, scaling above other High 6-Cs like Aquaman. Still, doubt that matters much.

 

[SpookyShadow]

One of the fastest graces ever

 

[Cropfist]

But how many gigatons is superman actually?

 

[Schnee_One]

Above 100

 

[Bob8999]

probably not by much, but i dont think its ever been specified, has it? so it´s probably be like 101, mabye 110?

 

[Cropfist]

The aquaman feat he scales from has a calced value, which is just listed in joules instead of gigatons for some reason

 

[Bob8999]

calc? am i just blind? can i have a link or something?

 

[Cropfist]

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...athen_travelling_up_to_Earth's_surface_(DCEU)

 

[Bob8999]

karathen´s kinetic energy is about 347 gigatons shrinking the ap and dura gap to about 25 gigatons, but aquamans profile doesnt say anything about him damaging karathen or anything just says he controlled it and that is the most powerful creature on earth. (which i would assume includes superman, aquaman and wonderman.)

 

[SuperAPM]

Orochi FRA

 

[SuperAPM]

Bob8999 Question, why are guys like Supe's and Aquaman scaling to a feat performed by a completely unrelated character? How do they scale to it exactly?

 

[Bob8999]

karathen´s kinetic energy is about 347 gigatons shrinking the ap and dura gap to about 25 gigatons, but aquamans profile doesnt say anything about him damaging karathen or anything just says he controlled it and that is the most powerful creature on earth. (which i would assume includes superman, aquaman and wonderman.)

@superAPM thats exactly what i want to know.

 

[SuperAPM]

Hm, might have to create a CRT on that if I can be bothered. Unless you want to make one or anything.

 

[Bob8999]

im not going to, but if you want to, go for it i guess.

 

[JackJoyce]

Bob8999 Question, why are guys like Supe's and Aquaman scaling to a feat performed by a completely unrelated character? How do they scale to it exactly?

Aquaman is comparable to Wonder Woman and Base Supes. He endured hits from Karathen. Steppenwolf did more damage to Aquaman than Karathen did. So the scaling is roughly Aquaman Ôëñ WW = Base Superman < Karathen < Doomsday = Steppenwolf << Post- resurrection Superman

Aquaman with the trident of Atlantis can be higher though

 

[Bob8999]

Bob8999 Question, why are guys like Supe's and Aquaman scaling to a feat performed by a completely unrelated character? How do they scale to it exactly?

Aquaman is comparable to Wonder Woman and Base Supes. He endured hits from Karathen. Steppenwolf did more damage to Aquaman than Karathen did. So the scaling is roughly Aquama Ôëñ WW = Base Superman < Karathen < Doomsday = Steppenwolf << Post- resurrection Superman
Aquaman with the trident of Atlantis can be higher though

aquaman is weaker or equal to wonder woman who is equal to supes who is weaker than karathen, sooo.... why does aquaman scale to karathen?

 

[SuperAPM]

JackJoyce

Um......how does that work exactly? How does Aquaman surviving held back hits from Karathan scale him to High 6-C when said creature gets its tier from a completely different and unrelated feat? Just saying, "surviving (obviously held back) hits from the Karathan" is a terrible jusification for his and everyone eles tier when said strikes could have been anywhere from Island to City Block level for all we know.

 

[JackJoyce]

I'm not sure if Karathen was holding back. Since her job was eliminating all false kings from claiming the trident. Also Wonder Woman scales from Zeus who created the island of Themyscira.

 

[SuperAPM]

That doesn't indicate her using all her force, she would indicate more clearly if she was struggling to kill a little bug. All she was doing was essentially playing with her food.

I don't exactly see how wondie scales to zues when she only beat a weakened version of ares. I also don't see how manipulating matter to create an island scales to your AP, but regardless, that feat doesn't have a calc as far as I'm aware, and if it does it needs to be linked in that case.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

>Job is to kill people after the Trident

>Isn't using her full strength

>Current would-be thief already survived multiple blows and still going

Uh huh. Don't forget her first act after reaching the surface was to slap Orm >= Arthur.

Diana scaling to Zeus' death rattle makes perfect sense as Prime Ares >= Prime Zeus. Where Zeus died, Ares lived. Not that this is really relevant since it isn't what they are scaling to.

347.8 gigatons = Karathen >= Aquaman = WW < Steppenwolf << Post- resurrection Superman

 

[SuperAPM]

You can literally see in the fight in question that she was merely playing around with him. Three obviously casual wacks followed by a couple of snide remarks and you somehow think that means she used all her force. "You think yourself worthy to be king" with that tone does not come anywhere close to suggesting she would even begin to struggle one shotting Arthur, come on now.

Don't exactly see how that scaling would work when Ares was supposed to be significantly weaker at that point than when he fought Zeus.

347.8 Gigatons = Karathen >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Everyone else = whatever their highest most substantial feat is. The current justification for their tier is beyond weak.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Ignoring that those are the same slaps it was throwing out at the Atlantean armies when it was serious. You also ignored the part of Orm getting slapped.

Ares being massively weakened and living is greater than Zeus dying and making Themyscira in the meantime. Zeus was dead when he performed the feat so Ares scales and so does Diana for killing him.

 

[SuperAPM]

"They were exactly the same slaps" unbelievably unsubstantiated, Jesus Christ. At no point did Aquaman intend for the Karathen to kill Orm, the whole point was to subdue him. Surviving hits from the karathen is, again, completely irrelevant under those parameters. Unless it is made blatantly obvious, you can't just directly scale them to Karathen on the basis that they "survived a hit" when its either unclear how much effort it was using, or, in this case, obviously wasn't going all out. You need to show me them doing any amount of damage to it for it to be a definitive proof of scaling, but as it is, not even the ships could do more than merely tickle her.

Completely unsubstantiated, just because they were both weakened does not mean they were at the exact same level. Ares' power had most of his power permanently stripped from him, Zeus was just wounded with the same amount of power that he always has.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Unsubstantiated? Do you even know what the KE calc is about? Its of Karathen travelling from the center to the floor. Guess what happened when it arrived? Slam Orm into a ship in the very same action. The force that Orm took is exactly what was calced and he shrugged it off. His physical equal Arthur did the exact same and they can harm each other. Those ships mean nothing when Orm and Arthur are stronger than them. Arthur took a stupidly enormous plasma blast to the face without a scratch so what do you think the tiny littel boats are going to do to Karathen?

>Claims my statement is unsubstantiated

>Immediately follows up by doing that exact thing

>Says Zeus is weakened

>Says he has the same power as normal

Hypocrisy and contradictions is a good look for you. Everything about the story implies he is drastically weaker than normal when he created Themyscira so prove Zeus still had the same amount of energy as he normally did. Actually don't. Not only because you can't but because its not relevant to the thread as I stated with my first post.

 

[SuperAPM]

No, Orm survived being hit by the shockwave of a single tentacle swing. Karathan had already stopped moving at that point so neither Orm or anyone else up above took anywhere near its total KE. If Orm had survived being hit by its full KE, it would've been pretty fortuitous of you to have just led with that / have that be the justification for his and everyone's tier on their page. But never mind then.

Just saying, being heavily injured does not automatically indicate a reduction in power. Superman was in a near death state when he fought Doomsday, and his last dying punch against him still had his full power put into it. Zeus was "weakened," obviously, but nothing indicates a reduction in power, not when he was still able to heavily injure the guy who put him into said injured state.

 

[AnonymousBlank]

So you mean to tell me that Karathen and Arthur just decided to stop right before the surface when they are in a rush and then break through the seafloor? That is just dumb.

Except I did say Orm got hit by Karathen when it arrived. Literally the first thing I said on this thread that wasn't sarcastic. I didn't write the justifications so I dunno what you want me to do about that.

The blow that crippled Ares took most of Zeus' power. The story even says he used the last of his power to make Ares retreat so how exactly can Themyscira be his normal output when he was running on empty?

 

[SuperAPM]

Yes, I'm aware its dumb, a lot of things in that film is dumb. I'm simply transcribing what's happening in the film.

That's arguable, since what you said was "Don't forget her first act after reaching the surface was to slap Orm >= Arthur." I can see what you mean now, but the way you worded it made it sound that as soon as she climbed out of the surface she stopped and then immediatly wacked Orm away. My mistake.

 

[Duedate8898]

Can this be added?

 

[ElixirBlue]

Is there enough votes?

 

[Duedate8898]

There were enough 10 days ago, the rest was just a debate over scaling in regards to aquaman and woderwoman

 

[ElixirBlue]

Ok, are the profiles unlocked? I think the OPM profiles are unlocked.

 

[Duedate8898]

Both are, might want to call a discussion moderator to close this though.

 

[Bob8999]

there is a request board for this kind of stuff, here:https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/3490623#218