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Ordinary Magician vs Keyblade Wielder [Marisa Kirisame vs Sora: Battle for Most Skilled on the Wiki || GRACE]

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Votes are 5-3, let's see how this goes now that I've responded to Sora's "skill" wank.
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RH0904 said:
are you just seriously thinking you just won? Boy, you sure gonna be proven wrong ;)
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I've walked this road a hundred times, bringing verses down from their purported glory, all the while their supporters foolishly believe they can stave off the inevitable decay of their glorious wank. Maou Gakuin, Hellsing, Mario, DMC, Tokyo Revengers.... It doesn't matter. One way or another, no matter the method, I win in the end. Kingdom Hearts will be but another corpse for me to step over once I'm done with you... A corpse that is yet another stepping stone on the path to Touhou's wiki-wide domination.

for legal purposes this is a joke im not actually an anime villain
 
...OK, RH, you DO understand that this skilled debate conversation has absolutely nothing to do with tiering, right?

Olimar is arguably one of the greatest battlefield commanders on the entire wiki. This is not hampered, and is arguably made more impressive, by the fact that he's a tier 10 character commanding a bunch of other tier 10 characters. KH being a tier above Touhou is immaterial to the claim that a character in one verse is more skilled than a character in the other verse.
 
For Sora it would be good to check the combat part of his Intelligence section on his profile as an additional reference. In regard to Sora's endless combos, they seem to be a deliberate feature which actually got alluded to by Square Enix if I'm not wrong.
 
Not going to weight into the topic, but something catched my eye glacing over it and I have to adress this; Things going "Interdimensional", beyond reality is unquantifiable in terms of skill. I read something something Marisas crazy senses for example. Her having senses working kilometers far is quantifiable, it remains within the confines of the logical. Them working across dimensions not so much. Its the same as the whole cutting space via skill nonsense
 
Nehz_XZX said:
For Sora it would be good to check the combat part of his Intelligence section on his profile as an additional reference. In regard to Sora's endless combos, they seem to be a deliberate feature which actually got alluded to by Square Enix if I'm not wrong.
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That does give a lot more context, and I do think Sora is legitimately very skilled based on what I've seen, but my stance of "whatever Sora can do, Marisa can do better" remains. While there's some overlap in skills, Marisa's senses, stealth, faster AD, better IR, and scaling to some borderline supernatural feats of precision and combat intelligence means she has a pretty clear edge. I would like to see a source on SE referencing endless combos if you happen to have it on hand, though, since that'd be a large advantage for Sora.

First_Witch said:
Not going to weight into the topic, but something catched my eye glacing over it and I have to adress this; Things going "Interdimensional", beyond reality is unquantifiable in terms of skill. I read something something Marisas crazy senses for example. Her having senses working kilometers far is quantifiable, it remains within the confines of the logical. Them working across dimensions not so much. Its the same as the whole cutting space via skill nonsense
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Ah, alright then. In that case I'll stick with kilometers of range for the purposes of this debate.
 
Yeah this argument is now tipping in favour of Marisa from what I see. If the Sora fanatics don't come up with a good response, I'll switch my vote for Marisa.
 
I would prefer that Bob weigh in before a conclusion is reached. Things seem pretty skewed in Toehoe girl's favor, though.
 
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara said:
I've walked this road a hundred times, bringing verses down from their purported glory, all the while their supporters foolishly believe they can stave off the inevitable decay of their glorious wank. Maou Gakuin, Hellsing, Mario, DMC, Tokyo Revengers.... It doesn't matter. One way or another, no matter the method, I win in the end. Kingdom Hearts will be but another corpse for me to step over once I'm done with you... A corpse that is yet another stepping stone on the path to Touhou's wiki-wide domination.

for legal purposes this is a joke im not actually an anime villain
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Didn't you fail at that one already?
 
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara said:
That does give a lot more context, and I do think Sora is legitimately very skilled based on what I've seen, but my stance of "whatever Sora can do, Marisa can do better" remains. While there's some overlap in skills, Marisa's senses, stealth, faster AD, better IR, and scaling to some borderline supernatural feats of precision and combat intelligence means she has a pretty clear edge. I would like to see a source on SE referencing endless combos if you happen to have it on hand, though, since that'd be a large advantage for Sora.
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It doesn't seem to directly talk about endless combos but it does mention a certain feature that is essential for enabling them like this video on Youtube demonstrates.
 
Well it's been like a day and no one has rebuked Mad Dog's argument yet so I'm going to switch my vote to a definite "Marisa wins" vote

Marisa wins FRA
 
I mean if you're gonna blatantly ignore the skill rules (such as allowing enhanced senses) or be openly hypocritical ("Marisa can't be skilled from fighting fodder. Anyways here's the time where Sora fought 1000 fodder at once", or "Marisa needs statements of IR for her feats to be valid but Sora doesn't") then I am gonna respond to that. So whether or not I respond is entirely up to what your post contains.
 
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Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara said:
This includes breaking down the hidden power of the oni, which is inherently impossible to even fathom, as it is powered directly by remaining unknowable.
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also this kinda seems like bs

you can't seperate what's fundamentally powered by being an unkown substance into simpler varieties because...well, it's simply unkown



unless the argument is she found out that not so unkown source that powers the oni's abilities and broke it down or she found out that their abilities are not powered by being unkown but by something else, then i am an idiot and please ignore this sh*t
 
Passersby said:
also this kinda seems like bs

you can't seperate what's fundamentally powered by being an unkown substance into simpler varieties because...well, it's simply unkown



unless the argument is she found out that not so unkown source that powers the oni's abilities and broke it down or she found out that their abilities are not powered by being unkown but by something else, then i am an idiot and please ignore this sh*t
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Yeah when I say "break down" I moreso mean she came to understand the theory of magic behind it and create an accurate explanation of how it works. Basically, her analysis of magic lets her understand things that, by their very nature, can't be understood, and are powered by that lack of understanding.
 
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara said:
Yeah when I say "break down" I moreso mean she came to understand the theory of magic behind it and create an accurate explanation of how it works
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ah, so she simply understood and broke down how the phenomena occurs basically and not how it does


Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara said:
Basically, her analysis of magic lets her understand things that, by their very nature, can't be understood, and are powered by that lack of understanding.
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but you kinda lost me here...because this is simply a repeat of the first point

if something can't be understood by it's very nature then it's simply impossible to understand it, if she can understand it then that means that it can be understood, it's just that no one was smart nor capable enough to understand them so far or they lacked some kind of property that her magic had to allow them to understand it

and based on this

Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara said:
and are powered by that lack of understanding.
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i would assume she can now easily counter them since they're powered by being unkown, yet she can understand them, so logically speaking, she should be their worst enemy

unless the author didn't even about what he was writing...either that, or again, i'm an idiot

i'd put my money on the latter but who knows i guess

this is why i hate overwanked skill debates where someone is so skilled they can make a wooden door with nothing but rocks
 
Passersby said:
but you kinda lost me here...because this is simply a repeat of the first point

if something can't be understood by it's very nature then it's simply impossible to understand it, if she can understand it then that means that it can be understood, it's just that no one was smart nor capable enough to understand them so far or they lacked some kind of property that her magic had to allow them to understand it
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That's more or less the point I was trying to get at, yeah (the highlighted part). It's a testament to her knowledge in the field of magic.
 
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