One-Punch Man - Downgrade Boros's speed

[Shadow_x007x]

I think you guys are using it incorrectly or something. This thread is not a "Downgrade possibly FTL of Boros" thread. The only thing offered here is downgrading in the three speed ranges that are mentioned: Supersonic+ in key Power Sealed, High Hypersonic+ in the key Released and Relativistic+ in the key Meteoric Burst only.

And yes, if you guys want to argue, please use reason. Ready to scan or link for reference as well. And please use words that do not express insults or cursing. Thank you.

 

[darkphantom9805]

Lol at boros being in the supersonic ranges ranges

 

[Shadow_x007x]

Lol at boros being in the supersonic ranges ranges

Show that you have success or evidence or calculations that say he is more than this. Please show it.

 

[darkphantom9805]

Show that you have success or evidence or calculations that say he is more than this. Please show it.

it’s called not being ridiculous Boros isn’t some fodder in opm lol anyway boros in base scales above geryuganshoop who is fodder to him which debunks the entire super sonic thing your trying to preach

 

[Golden_Void]

In summary agree with point 1, idk what point 2 is referencing I'm not reading that whole thread, kinda disagree with point 3

 

[Shadow_x007x]

it’s called not being ridiculous Boros isn’t some fodder in opm lol anyway boros in base scales above geryuganshoop who is fodder to him which debunks the entire super sonic thing your trying to preach

I think you didn't actually read this thread.

possibly Relativistic+ (Perceived the fight between Saitama and Geryuganshoop, and was confident in fighting the former even after witnessing him react to Geryuganshoop's near lightspeed pitches.

possibly Relativistic+

possibly FTL (Saitama was seemingly surprised by the speed of Boros' Meteoric Burst, while he considered Geryuganshoop's near light speed pitches to be nothing but a bad joke)

If you really read You will see these messages And these reasons will not be mentioned because they are already in the profile. Well, I didn't bother adjusting these sizes.

 

[darkphantom9805]

I think you didn't actually read this thread.

The fact supersonic is even mentioned near boros name is utter nonsense

Again his minions are already far above that speed boros is above

 

[Shadow_x007x]

In summary agree with point 1, idk what point 2 is referencing I'm not reading that whole thread, kinda disagree with point 3

In conclusion, you agree to change Melzargard's Supersonic+ to attack speed, but don't agree to reduce the size. Relativistic+ (0.90c) is attack speed only.

 

[Shadow_x007x]

The fact supersonic is even mentioned near boros name is utter nonsense

Again his minions are already far above that speed boros is above

His subordinates were faster than that. What are you referring to? Geryuganshoop is only Relativistic+ in attack speed, Melzargard is only Supersonic+ based on this calculation. So why are supersonic speed proposals nonsense? When we have more stable calculations Statements arise from feelings. And this proposal just scales him to Supersonic, possibly Relativistic+ anyway in key Released, making him already hundreds of times faster than his subordinates.

 

[darkphantom9805]

His subordinates were faster than that. What are you referring to? Geryuganshoop is only Relativistic+ in attack speed, Melzargard is only Supersonic+ based on this calculation. So why are supersonic speed proposals nonsense? When we have more stable calculations Statements arise from feelings. And this proposal just scales him to Supersonic, possibly Relativistic+ anyway in key Released, making him already hundreds of times faster than his subordinates.

It’s nonsense because boros is above his minions who can attack that fast not hard and that’s in his base form

 

[Golden_Void]

In conclusion, you agree to change Melzargard's Supersonic+ to attack speed, but don't agree to reduce the size. Relativistic+ (0.90c) is attack speed only.

I'm saying I don't think the wind from an attack can be considered attack speed but there's a bunch of titles that use wind from strikes as actual attacks. Idk how we treat it here.

 

[Shadow_x007x]

It’s nonsense because boros is above his minions who can attack that fast not hard and that’s in his base form

And yes, that "possibly Relativistic+" exists in the profile and the proposal in this thread does not include deleting this.

possibly Relativistic+ (Perceived the fight between Saitama and Geryuganshoop, and was confident in fighting the former even after witnessing him react to Geryuganshoop's near lightspeed pitches)

 

[Shadow_x007x]

New calculation:

One-Punch Man - Boros kicks Saitama to the moon at near light speed

vsbattles.fandom.com

Now we have some calculations that might be useful. Or not at all. As for Boros' speed, he needed to launch Saitama to the moon at near light speed. If we look at momentum We will receive that success at FTL based on our opinions. CloverDragon03 (He is not sure, however, whether we are allowed to perform such calculations or not.) In any case, Dark-Carioca agrees to use the results. Sub-Relativistic+ for very large low balls. Or, in the end, we can still treat Boros as Relativistic+ 0.90 c. But this is an offer that might be interesting.

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

New calculation:

One-Punch Man - Boros kicks Saitama to the moon at near light speed

vsbattles.fandom.com

Now we have some calculations that might be useful. Or not at all. As for Boros' speed, he needed to launch Saitama to the moon at near light speed. If we look at momentum We will receive that success at FTL based on our opinions. CloverDragon03 (He is not sure, however, whether we are allowed to perform such calculations or not.) In any case, Dark-Carioca agrees to use the results. Sub-Relativistic+ for very large low balls. Or, in the end, we can still treat Boros as Relativistic+ 0.90 c. But this is an offer that might be interesting.

I honestly don't know. I'm not a good at calculations, so my input probably doesn't mean too much.

That being said, I don't know if the feat should be used for speed at all because Boros only wraps Saitama in a aura that lets him ignore friction to reach that speed.

 

[ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn]

Oh, for the original post, I guess I'm more in favor of option one.

 

[Soulaaa]

I disagree

- This is Throwing Feats if the character can throw something at near the speed of light. That doesn't mean the characters will move at near the speed of light either.

I didn't saw "Throwing feats" in the vsbw actually. But lemme make it clear;

1. I disagree with your opinion because here Boros isn't "throwing" Saitama; he's directly kicking him, sending him to the moon at a speed close to the speed of light.

2. Since the energy and force transmitted by Boros's strike hurl Saitama to the moon at the near SoL, with this energy and force, Boros should be able to move at the near SoL as well. Otherwise, it would be extremely illogical.

 

[Golden_Void]

Upon closer inspection...

"Note that throwing speed is typically not applied to combat speed, but only treated as attack speed, as it is usually considered a feat of strength more so than a measure of how fast the character can run or fight"

I think typically is the key here - the notation is not a blanket statement. For example, Tanktop Master clearly puts all his strength into throwing a building. Using common sense, he most likely cannot achieve the speed of the thrown building, either casually or consistently. Boros's knee launch is basically a two-part regular kick. A normal kick would generate far more force through basic biomechanics than somebody putting their knee into you then swinging their foot upward.

We also need to remember two key details. 1 - MB loses power as its duration increases. The first punch melted the ship. No other attack replicated this. Not even that puny crater Boros made with Saitama's body on the Moon. 2 - The kick was the only upward attack. Saitama could only counter this if he could fly down. None of Boros's other attacks after the kick budged Saitama at all.

So I disagree with the last one.

As far as the supersonic feat, the context of the feat is clearly different from what TTM did. That was a casual blow that generated that much air pressure as a result. The force and speed of the resulting pressure has a direct relationship with the last timeframe of the hammer swing that imparted the force. I don't think the speed of the air would be faster than the source of the air unless he had some weird hax ability that caused his attacks to gain energy over time and not lose energy over time.

So I disagree here too.

I still disagree with the PS, FF and "Saitama's Reactions" sidebar too

 

[Shadow_x007x]

I disagree

I didn't saw "Throwing feats" in the vsbw actually. But lemme make it clear;

1. I disagree with your opinion because here Boros isn't "throwing" Saitama; he's directly kicking him, sending him to the moon at a speed close to the speed of light.

2. Since the energy and force transmitted by Boros's strike hurl Saitama to the moon at the near SoL, with this energy and force, Boros should be able to move at the near SoL as well. Otherwise, it would be extremely illogical.

If you read the description well, we will know that:

With a simple kick, his clothes should honestly burn up completely in the atmosphere, with [Saitama] being naked as a result (since the clothes are basically just regular clothes). I basically resolved the whole question of heat friction by wrapping him in [Boros] energy while he was being launched near the speed of light, making the question a non-issue.

The only thing left to answer is how come Saitama's clothes were still on when he got back and didn't burn up? Well... I suppose he still had some Boros energy left on him, hehe...

You know right away that the message is that Boros' energy can protect Saitama from thermal friction. Nothing in the scan tells us that Boros' energy can propel him at near the speed of light.

You also can indeed kick an object faster than you yourself can run. Professional soccer players kick the ball at an average speed of up to 70 mph, but no one can run that fast.

Upon closer inspection...

"Note that throwing speed is typically not applied to combat speed, but only treated as attack speed, as it is usually considered a feat of strength more so than a measure of how fast the character can run or fight"

I think typically is the key here - the notation is not a blanket statement. For example, Tanktop Master clearly puts all his strength into throwing a building. Using common sense, he most likely cannot achieve the speed of the thrown building, either casually or consistently. Boros's knee launch is basically a two-part regular kick. A normal kick would generate far more force through basic biomechanics than somebody putting their knee into you then swinging their foot upward.

We also need to remember two key details. 1 - MB loses power as its duration increases. The first punch melted the ship. No other attack replicated this. Not even that puny crater Boros made with Saitama's body on the Moon. 2 - The kick was the only upward attack. Saitama could only counter this if he could fly down. None of Boros's other attacks after the kick budged Saitama at all.

So I disagree with the last one.

As far as the supersonic feat, the context of the feat is clearly different from what TTM did. That was a casual blow that generated that much air pressure as a result. The force and speed of the resulting pressure has a direct relationship with the last timeframe of the hammer swing that imparted the force. I don't think the speed of the air would be faster than the source of the air unless he had some weird hax ability that caused his attacks to gain energy over time and not lose energy over time.

So I disagree here too.

I still disagree with the PS, FF and "Saitama's Reactions" sidebar too

If you want to talk about momentum, the movement of objects follows the law of conservation of momentum. Boros would be FTL, not Relativistic+. Considering that the mass of Boros' legs is much less than Saitama's mass.

And yes, as CloverDragon03 told me, I don't know if we can use this to tell Boros' speed.

That being said, though, we have an issue at play. Namely, I'm unsure if we're allowed to calculate another object's speed in this way (in a similar vein to how we can't calculate speed from an existing kinetic energy value), as momentum transfer doesn't exactly apply in fiction the same way it does in real life. We tend to avoid things like this, and the other options are all just less accurate.

 

[Golden_Void]

If you want to talk about momentum, the movement of objects follows the law of conservation of momentum. Boros would be FTL, not Relativistic+. Considering that the mass of Boros' legs is much less than Saitama's mass.

What are you talking about

And yes, as CloverDragon03 told me, I don't know if we can use this to tell Boros' speed.

In context of the feat, that's false. Boros didn't just kick Saitama from an initial frame of 0, bro literally charged at him at full speed and put his knee in his stomach and kicked him up. He had the momentum of a full charging body behind him.

Also the translation concerns need to be addressed. "Sub-light speed" and "near-light speed" are two completely different categories. "Sub-" can be as little as 1% and still valid.

 

[CloverDragon03]

In context of the feat, that's false. Boros didn't just kick Saitama from an initial frame of 0, bro literally charged at him at full speed and put his knee in his stomach and kicked him up. He had the momentum of a full charging body behind him.

The knee strike didn't move Saitama any distance at all, so it's irrelevant. It was only the kick that sent him flying, which is a completely separate movement involving only his leg that lacks the before full-body momentum

Speaking of which, that's precisely why the Relativistic+ rating on his Meteoric Burst key should remain as is if the speed can't be calced. I said before that I was unsure what our stance was on using conservation of momentum to find speed like what was done in the calc. If that's allowed, this should be FTL from Shadow's calc. Otherwise, it would still make Meteoric Burst Boros at least Relativistic+ when applying the same principle and the fact that Boros's leg has less mass than Saitama's body.

And then for the lower forms' scaling to Hypersonic, the Deep Sea King scaling should probably work? I hesitate to say anything concrete since I don't actively scale the verse, but if the scaling is that straightforward, it should be used.

 

[Golden_Void]

The knee strike didn't move Saitama any distance at all, so it's irrelevant. It was only the kick that sent him flying, which is a completely separate movement involving only his leg that lacks the before full-body momentum

Both the anime and manga interpretation of the event has strong indications of that moment being a "cool moment", especially in the anime. There's several other examples within the same fight in the manga. The initial punch shows Boros's punch imparting so much force that you can tell Saitama was going to go flying back, but the flying part isn't actually shown within the same panel.

 

[CloverDragon03]

That's not the same thing, though. In the case of the punch, it's not as if Boros does another move immediately after. Here, Boros knees Saitama in the gut and it doesn't move him at all, and then he does a separate kick that sends him flying. Going by this sequence of events, using Boros's full body for the mass involved in conservation of momentum is just not accurate, because it wasn't his entire body moving there.

 

[Golden_Void]

That's not the same thing, though. In the case of the punch, it's not as if Boros does another move immediately after. Here, Boros knees Saitama in the gut and it doesn't move him at all, and then he does a separate kick that sends him flying. Going by this sequence of events, using Boros's full body for the mass involved in conservation of momentum is just not accurate, because it wasn't his entire body moving there.

It's a snapshot of a movement in progress. A kick is fundamentally a two-part movement unlike a straight punch. It wouldn't make sense for Boros to not move Saitama at all when he literally attacked him with power and speed exceeding the force that was still sending him flying in the first place. Both people were off the ground.

Otherwise, the implication is that a snap of his limb has more speed/power than a blow with the weight of his entire body behind it. And that is disproven when he outruns the effects of a full-weight punch, let alone what would be the equivalent of a quick jab.

 

[CloverDragon03]

That doesn't even hold up at all. He kneed him in the gut, and then did a kick separate from that. I'm using what's directly shown in the manga, and this would not indicate that he carried his whole body's earlier momentum into that kick.

Also, when you kick, it's true that it's a two-part movement. But, you don't actually hit someone with the first part of it (aka raising the knee). There's no point. And it also wouldn't translate very well into the full kick to begin with.

From my point of view, it's very unlikely for me to buy into the idea that he was using his entire body's momentum, given the sequence of events.

 

[Golden_Void]

That doesn't even hold up at all. He kneed him in the gut, and then did a kick separate from that. I'm using what's directly shown in the manga, and this would not indicate that he carried his whole body's earlier momentum into that kick.

Also, when you kick, it's true that it's a two-part movement. But, you don't actually hit someone with the first part of it (aka raising the knee). There's no point. And it also wouldn't translate very well into the full kick to begin with.

If he just flat-out attempted to punt him in mid-air, he would have no power behind that kick because he would have no leverage and he wouldn't be able to generate force against the ground.

Making contact with the knee first solves that issue by Saitama being used as leverage, especially since he was already going faster than Saitama was flying. The alternative is Boros already transferred the momentum with the knee and launched Saitama with a snap of the limb, but there's still an issue with that as I mentioned above.

 

[Danny33wise]

Honestly, after reading this thread, I can say that their have been no reasonable disproval for what the op is suggesting. Lot of people here have already made it obvious that they are disagreeing due to favouritism.

Am not that interested in this thread, just wanted to point out what's happening.

 

[Worthless]

Saying it's due to favoritism shows how little you understand OPM. People with common sense would say the same thing about him, not out of favoritism. Anyway, I have no direct opinion about the thread. And I highly doubt that avenger guy is really a Boros fan like me. I'm just siding with the obvious.