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One Piece Scaling, Some Upgrades and Some Downgrades as I see it.
- Thread starter KinkiestSins
- Start date
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- one piece
- Status
- 131
- 5
I've already proven that Zoro > gear 2 luffy aswell with the hyouzu example, the only version of luffy stronger then Zoro is gear 4, you don't even need evidence for that it's common sense
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It isn't common sense for someone who has never read the series. I am simply going by what the OP stated and basically what others feel about the scaling. I agree that it is very suspect for all these guys to go from 7-A to 6-B all of a sudden. https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/659695Frozone54666 said:
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im confused here when did base Luffy become 6b i thought it was Gear 4th luffy is 6b
can some 1 tell which tier is base luffy pls
zoro>base luffy
zoro can even beat Gear 2nd
Gear 4th luffy stronger then zoro so Gear 4th luffy
and Gear 2nd+Gear 3rd+haki can beat zoro
not sure if he used Gear 2nd or not(image)
something like this------------------------------------------------------>
can some 1 tell which tier is base luffy pls
zoro>base luffy
zoro can even beat Gear 2nd
Gear 4th luffy stronger then zoro so Gear 4th luffy
and Gear 2nd+Gear 3rd+haki can beat zoro
not sure if he used Gear 2nd or not(image)
something like this------------------------------------------------------>
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@Frozone - proven how...?
@Dragon - the thing that makes it very inconsistent is Fishman Island Luffy. He is 7-C+ in base from punching hody jones into a cliff-side with the rest of the Monster Trio scaling to him, but I personally believe that we should change the tiering of Fishman Arc to Unknown, or re-evaluate feats from that arc.
The hole visible on the cliff-side came from Luffy's initial strike on Hody (the kick from here).
Before the under-water battle with the Noah, Luffy was clearly sizing up Hody with his attacks. This is after his first two kicks on Hody before displaying haki. Hody was clearly outmatched by Luffy's haki, damaging himself rather than applying damage, but this is the same Hody that tanked being launched into the cliff side with the feat we apply to Luffy.
Hody later ate handfuls of the drug that doubles his power with each dose, yet at the end of the fight, he was one-shot by Luffy's Elephant Gun.
We should honestly edit Fishman arc for the monster trio to "Unknown"
@Joseph - Lao G and Chinjao absolutely need a downgrade, but it looks like we are still discussing how other characters are affected.
How should Zoro and Sanji be affected? Sanji showed feats that should put him somewhat comparable to Luffy, I guess--though that may have been PIS.
@Dragon - the thing that makes it very inconsistent is Fishman Island Luffy. He is 7-C+ in base from punching hody jones into a cliff-side with the rest of the Monster Trio scaling to him, but I personally believe that we should change the tiering of Fishman Arc to Unknown, or re-evaluate feats from that arc.
The hole visible on the cliff-side came from Luffy's initial strike on Hody (the kick from here).
Before the under-water battle with the Noah, Luffy was clearly sizing up Hody with his attacks. This is after his first two kicks on Hody before displaying haki. Hody was clearly outmatched by Luffy's haki, damaging himself rather than applying damage, but this is the same Hody that tanked being launched into the cliff side with the feat we apply to Luffy.
Hody later ate handfuls of the drug that doubles his power with each dose, yet at the end of the fight, he was one-shot by Luffy's Elephant Gun.
We should honestly edit Fishman arc for the monster trio to "Unknown"
@Joseph - Lao G and Chinjao absolutely need a downgrade, but it looks like we are still discussing how other characters are affected.
How should Zoro and Sanji be affected? Sanji showed feats that should put him somewhat comparable to Luffy, I guess--though that may have been PIS.
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people here wank zoro a bit imho. Zoro hasnt fought anyone remarkable yet (post time skip) nor he has shown his upper limit unlike luffy so... Im not supporting this zoro > gear 2 luffy thingy.
and, @Cin (from the closed thread) Fujitora was selected by Akainu himself, so it makes sense for him to be comparable to previous generation Admirals. On a side note: I always considered the birdcage a big plot device in order to make things more dramatic (hell, Fujitora+ Zoro+ everyone couldnt cut it).
and, @Cin (from the closed thread) Fujitora was selected by Akainu himself, so it makes sense for him to be comparable to previous generation Admirals. On a side note: I always considered the birdcage a big plot device in order to make things more dramatic (hell, Fujitora+ Zoro+ everyone couldnt cut it).
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@PaChi - I don't either. IDK why people are trying to compare Zoro to Luffy. Sure, he wouldn't get stomped by him, but post time-skip REALLY shows that Luffy is top dog in the crew.
The issue is if: Sanji can compete against high tiers and hurt them (or take hits), Zoro scales since they are depicted and stated to be equals. The debate is if hurting Luffy = PIS, or true to both characters' power levels. Sanji did take a hit from Doflamingo and briefly put him in a defensive position, which kind of supports the latter.
The issue is if: Sanji can compete against high tiers and hurt them (or take hits), Zoro scales since they are depicted and stated to be equals. The debate is if hurting Luffy = PIS, or true to both characters' power levels. Sanji did take a hit from Doflamingo and briefly put him in a defensive position, which kind of supports the latter.
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@Cin In my opinion, Sanji didnt hurt Luffy severely, the guy stood there without eating and had to face the Big Mom's crew afterwards, so... the beating he took wasnt that much imo (but of course, luffy has insane pain tolerance and stamina, and sanji may have restrained) even if he was letting himself be kicked.
But yeah, Sanji is somewhat below base luffy, but not enough to be a tier below, imo.
But yeah, Sanji is somewhat below base luffy, but not enough to be a tier below, imo.
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@PaChi2 - he knocked out his tooth and broke his nose with a single kick. The only point i'm trying to make is that Zoro and Sanji are comparable to Luffy in SOME regard.
People trying to suggest Zoro > G2 Luffy are wanking Zoro and downplaying Luffy. Even Pre Time-skip, Luffy in Gear 2nd was wiping the floor with Rob Lucci, who was more than twice as powerful as Kaku, who Zoro was getting wrecked by for most of the fight.
Honestly, they probably shouldn't scale to Luffy post time-skip period. But Sanji did briefly contend with Doflamingo (though it was one-sided), and he did hurt Luffy to some degree (At least far far better than Chinjao could).
So what I am seeing is that you want Zoro and Sanji to be Possibly 6-B since Sanji could hurt Luffy as he did?
People trying to suggest Zoro > G2 Luffy are wanking Zoro and downplaying Luffy. Even Pre Time-skip, Luffy in Gear 2nd was wiping the floor with Rob Lucci, who was more than twice as powerful as Kaku, who Zoro was getting wrecked by for most of the fight.
Honestly, they probably shouldn't scale to Luffy post time-skip period. But Sanji did briefly contend with Doflamingo (though it was one-sided), and he did hurt Luffy to some degree (At least far far better than Chinjao could).
So what I am seeing is that you want Zoro and Sanji to be Possibly 6-B since Sanji could hurt Luffy as he did?
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I honestly agree more with Aizen and Bluedash's points on the last thread. I feel like Upper Mid Tiers should be 7-A. That's just my opinion. Just because it would make sense for Zoro and Sanji to be not so much behind Luffy, doesn't mean it is 100% correct.
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@Dragon - the thing that made the scaling horrible is that I once supported Chinjao being comparable to Base Luffy, but because of that, it ruined the scaling... Executives like Lao G and Gladius ended up scaling... so if we drop Chinjao from the mix, everything should work fine. Chinjao was stomped by Luffy, looking at the manga fight again.
It would mean Zoro and Sanji being High Tier (Possibly 6-B) as a result from what is being said here. Do you agree, or should Zoro and Sanji be downgraded as well? It's not scaling Sanji and Zoro to Luffy, it is scaling Sanji from hurting Luffy and taking a hit from Doflamingo and remaining in the fight.
It would mean Zoro and Sanji being High Tier (Possibly 6-B) as a result from what is being said here. Do you agree, or should Zoro and Sanji be downgraded as well? It's not scaling Sanji and Zoro to Luffy, it is scaling Sanji from hurting Luffy and taking a hit from Doflamingo and remaining in the fight.
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Luffy punched hyzou with a gear 2 jet pistol and it did basically nothing, Zoro beat the same guy with ease except he was literally a 100x stronger then when luffy punched him as he ate the steroid pills so this at the minimum proves Zoro = gear 2 if not Zoro >> gear 2, and then you have luffy in gear 3 only breaking picas head whereas Zoro cut picas entire body, 90% of one piece fans will tell you that Zoro > gear 2 luffy
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It is correct though. You should preferably leave it to people who read the manga, since it's difficult to have an opinion on the matter without context. Sanji has beaten Luffy to pulp in a recent chapter, without knowing the context one might think Sanji > Luffy. Also One Piece has its fair share of PISDragonmasterxyz said:
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Breaking a tooth and breaking a nose is not a big deal for luffy (he recovered in a gag scene). But, I thought the 6-B rating was for G4 luffy? Anyway, yes, if being somewhat scalable to base luffy means a possibly 6-B rating... well... you could say "At most 6-B"...
now that I think it, the 6-B rsting comes from the meteor right? The only one who broke doffy's threads was G4 Luffy... Im confused why base luffy is in the same tier as his strongest form.
now that I think it, the 6-B rsting comes from the meteor right? The only one who broke doffy's threads was G4 Luffy... Im confused why base luffy is in the same tier as his strongest form.
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@Frozone - Hyouzou dodged the punch and nicked Luffy's arm with his poison covered blade... Him being casual against fodder < Zoro intent on killing his opponent does not make Zoro even remotely comparable to Luffy. That's wank.
Luffy was holding back. It's not like he knew those people were going to be trying to dominate the entire island.
Then those 90% of One Piece fans are wankers for Zoro and downplayers for Luffy. It does not make sense how you scale them from Luffy missing a direct blow on that character.
Luffy was holding back. It's not like he knew those people were going to be trying to dominate the entire island.
Then those 90% of One Piece fans are wankers for Zoro and downplayers for Luffy. It does not make sense how you scale them from Luffy missing a direct blow on that character.
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@Joseph Like I said I agree more with LordAizenSama and Bluedash's points.
@Cin I support a downgrade to 7-A like what was suggested. However, I know nothing of OP. I will make a final judgement once Kuuichigo, Aizen and Blue comment here. As I agreed with their points. However, I know nothing of the context of the strawhats scalings past Rob Lucci and such.
@Cin I support a downgrade to 7-A like what was suggested. However, I know nothing of OP. I will make a final judgement once Kuuichigo, Aizen and Blue comment here. As I agreed with their points. However, I know nothing of the context of the strawhats scalings past Rob Lucci and such.
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Well regardless of whether Zoro is stronger then gear 2 or not he is at the very least >>>>>>>>>> base luffy and that's a FACT, so whatever base luffy is, Zoro is the same and the same applies for sanji
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"That's a FACT" and now you've lost me with your delusions.
@PaChi - Doflamingo scales to the durability of his threads since Gear 4th Luffy can break his threads with simple punches and kicks, but Doflamingo was capable of tanking several strikes from him while injured. Base Luffy is still capable of withstanding blows from Doflamingo, and even hurting him to some degree (like with Red Hawk and his other hawk attacks), suggesting he the AP required to hurt a tier 6-B.
As a result, characters who can outright tank hits from or hurt either character is automatically at an AP and Durability comparable.
@Dragon - I wouldn't mind the 7-A downgrade for Sanji and Zoro, but Sanji broke Luffy's nose and tooth and took a Goshikito slash from Doflamingo. He should not be capable of doing so if he is 3 full tiers lower than them. That's all I really have for input.
@PaChi - Doflamingo scales to the durability of his threads since Gear 4th Luffy can break his threads with simple punches and kicks, but Doflamingo was capable of tanking several strikes from him while injured. Base Luffy is still capable of withstanding blows from Doflamingo, and even hurting him to some degree (like with Red Hawk and his other hawk attacks), suggesting he the AP required to hurt a tier 6-B.
As a result, characters who can outright tank hits from or hurt either character is automatically at an AP and Durability comparable.
@Dragon - I wouldn't mind the 7-A downgrade for Sanji and Zoro, but Sanji broke Luffy's nose and tooth and took a Goshikito slash from Doflamingo. He should not be capable of doing so if he is 3 full tiers lower than them. That's all I really have for input.
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Im ok with "at most 6-B" Zoro and Sanji.
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Zoro >> base luffy is a fact though, if you think otherwise you don't read one piece
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@Frozone - Do not de-rail the topic.
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@Cin At the same time we have multiple characters who have done stuff like this but it has been considered an outlier or PIS. See Bayonetta, Plenty of Pokemon, etc. I am firm on 7-A. Of course I am being outvoted here. In the end I will still say I agree with the OP.
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I'm not, luffy with gear 3 only broke picas face and Zoro cut picas entire body in half despite not going out, so one of zoros moves is more powerful then luffys gear 3 elephant gun and we know gear 3 > 2 > base luffy in power, that's all I'm gonna say
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@Dragon - Some profiles have tierings such as "At least 6-X, At most 5-X"... should this be the same case as with Zoro and Sanji for 7-A, at most 6-B if everyone else agrees with the 6-B ranking?
I will wait for LAS, Kuu, and Blue to put input on this if they want to.
I will wait for LAS, Kuu, and Blue to put input on this if they want to.
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How about "7-A, possibly ot at most 6-B". That's my compromise even though I personally agree with the OP and the opinions on this thread of reverting it back to "7-A". Of course like I said I'm outvoted here as none of the ones on the last thread are here now. Which I honestly prefer to wait for their input.
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@Joseph - close in power is questionable, but their gap in power has been fairly consistent since pre time-skip and their showings in the first two post time-skip arcs. Zoro and Sanji are comparable, and Sanji breaking Luffy's nose and tooth with a single kick can support this, especially since Sanji was capable of briefly contending with Doflamingo himself.
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There is also Aizen and Blue's argument on the Bird Cage as well.
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Strongly disagree to 7-A, Sanji is in no way 3 tiers below Luffy in any shape or form. Possibly 6-B might be suitable as we don't know very well how Sanji and Zoro scale because of their limited screen time. But 7-A is out of question, it would completely wreck the power scaling between the Monster Trio.
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@Cin how many strings did Luffy break at a time?
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@Dragon - Doflamingo's bird-cage is made from millions of Doflamingo's threads. When the meteorites hit (strongest being 37.7 Teratons KE), the threads withstood the impact and proceeded to slice apart all 5 meteorites. The Bird-cage was perfectly fine, so it scales fully to the feat.
If we were to say that Doflamingo remained 6-C with a 6-B Bird Cage, that is suggesting that his combative threads are quite literally nothing compared to his bird-cage, which doesn't make sense due to him throwing up those threads instantly. It comes from his power, so what would limit him to threads <.1% of his Bird-Cage's durability? It is very unlikely for that to be the case.
If we were to say that Doflamingo remained 6-C with a 6-B Bird Cage, that is suggesting that his combative threads are quite literally nothing compared to his bird-cage, which doesn't make sense due to him throwing up those threads instantly. It comes from his power, so what would limit him to threads <.1% of his Bird-Cage's durability? It is very unlikely for that to be the case.
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