Eminiteable
He/Him- 7,401
- 6,631
Introduction:
Currently Kozuki Oden's profile it lists him as having Advanced Haoshoku Haki. The purpose of this thread is to revise that and have it be replaced with an Intermediate value as I believe there is a lack of evidence for him possessing that stage of Haki.
Evidence supporting Kozuki Oden possessing Haoshoku Infusion:
The only piece of evidence supporting Oden having this stage of Haoshoku is a statement made by Oda in Volume 100's SBS section, which states the following:
Evidence against Kozuki Oden possessing Haoshoku Infusion:
Oden's feat of scarring Kaidou which many attribute to his Haoshoku Infusion was credited to his strength in swordsmanship. With Haoshoku Haki not being mentioned at all.
The SFX for Haoshoku Infusion does not appear whenever Oden has a lightning effect in his attacks, similarly the actual lightning that does appear doesn't resemble Haoshoku Infusion where their lightning trails off his weapon, and instead resembles the attack used by the scabbards against Kaidou.
With the recent releases of the Digital Colored Manga for One Piece we can see that the lightning he produced against Kaidou (when he scarred him) was the color used to indicate Busoshoku Haki not Haoshoku Infusion. (I'll go into more detail on this in the next point)
Oden himself who dubs his sword style "The Greatest" tries to teach his retainers how to use it, however, when he goes into detail about it he talks about Ryuo (Busoshoku) not Haoshoku.
Regarding the consistency of Lightning as an effect & it's color:
It's true that the consistency of lightning's color and what it indicates to regarding Haki etc can be inconsistent in the manga; for example Chinjao & Luffy's Hao clash was yellow lightning but in the same arc Doffy's and Luffy's Hao clash was Red&Black Lightning.
However the inconsistencies have more to do with when the colored volumes were released rather than them being inconsistent in general. The recent releases of volumes 96, 97 and 98 all came at the same time and thus are consistent (which we'll show).
Regarding the color of Busoshoku Haki usage which was brought up above, in the recent release of the volumes it's shown to be indicated by black & red lightning, the proof is the following:
Conclusion:
So as brought up in the introduction Oden would have his Advanced Haoshoku rating removed in the Powers and Abilities section being replaced at the intermediate stage and in his Attack Potency sectionwhich could likely be replaced with "with Enma Unleashment" (as the feat was credited to Enma in it's introduction) just combined his Haoshoku Infusion feats with his regular rating assuming no one else has any other suggestions.
Currently Kozuki Oden's profile it lists him as having Advanced Haoshoku Haki. The purpose of this thread is to revise that and have it be replaced with an Intermediate value as I believe there is a lack of evidence for him possessing that stage of Haki.
Evidence supporting Kozuki Oden possessing Haoshoku Infusion:
The only piece of evidence supporting Oden having this stage of Haoshoku is a statement made by Oda in Volume 100's SBS section, which states the following:
The issue with this statement is that it's not really confirming Oden to have Haoshoku infusion as it could refer to Haoshoku in general or that it's just referring to Roger's attack. But another issue is it's probably not even referring to the attacks as they appeared in the manga as the attack referenced for Oden was used against Mountain God; before Oden had ever left wano.Q: I pretend to do Divine Departure and Tougenshirataki (Paradise Waterfall) at kindergarten. Can i be strong?
Oda: Be careful not to use too much Conqueror's!
Evidence against Kozuki Oden possessing Haoshoku Infusion:
Oden's feat of scarring Kaidou which many attribute to his Haoshoku Infusion was credited to his strength in swordsmanship. With Haoshoku Haki not being mentioned at all.
The SFX for Haoshoku Infusion does not appear whenever Oden has a lightning effect in his attacks, similarly the actual lightning that does appear doesn't resemble Haoshoku Infusion where their lightning trails off his weapon, and instead resembles the attack used by the scabbards against Kaidou.
With the recent releases of the Digital Colored Manga for One Piece we can see that the lightning he produced against Kaidou (when he scarred him) was the color used to indicate Busoshoku Haki not Haoshoku Infusion. (I'll go into more detail on this in the next point)
Oden himself who dubs his sword style "The Greatest" tries to teach his retainers how to use it, however, when he goes into detail about it he talks about Ryuo (Busoshoku) not Haoshoku.
Regarding the consistency of Lightning as an effect & it's color:
It's true that the consistency of lightning's color and what it indicates to regarding Haki etc can be inconsistent in the manga; for example Chinjao & Luffy's Hao clash was yellow lightning but in the same arc Doffy's and Luffy's Hao clash was Red&Black Lightning.
However the inconsistencies have more to do with when the colored volumes were released rather than them being inconsistent in general. The recent releases of volumes 96, 97 and 98 all came at the same time and thus are consistent (which we'll show).
Regarding the color of Busoshoku Haki usage which was brought up above, in the recent release of the volumes it's shown to be indicated by black & red lightning, the proof is the following:
- Ulti & Luffy's Busoshoku clash consistently produced black & red lightning sparks.
- Oden & Kaidou's Busoshoku clash produced black & red lightning sparks.
- The Scabbard's Tougen Totsuka produced black & red lightning.
- Roger's attack used on Oden produced black & red lightning.
Conclusion:
So as brought up in the introduction Oden would have his Advanced Haoshoku rating removed in the Powers and Abilities section being replaced at the intermediate stage and in his Attack Potency section
Last edited:
