Omni-Man vs Bardock | 2-3-0

[Fezzih_007]

Since when did Bardock have an Explosive Wave technique?

He do It in the games.
And like, everyone in Dragon Ball with master ki can do It, is just the characters exploding they Ki outwards. Not sure how high are the chances of Bardock doing It, since he apparently never done in a fight, why you asking?

If he wants to Omni Man to get off him, I not sure If he gonna do a explosive wave, he probally just gonna mouth Beam Nolam.

If he just nukes the area to catch omni, he's gonna be hurting himself even more?

No? Where did you getting that off?

It isnt like he's immune to his own attacks

Yeah, but he not exactly aiming at himself when he explode his energy outward. Like, when did you ever see someone using a explosive wave and hurting themselfs?

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Also, on the topic of ki attacks. Man does the wiki's usage of ki manipulation look weird as hell, like by it's own metrics Nappa is a master capable of sensing ki, generate light, reflect and nullify attacks, hide his power level and mask his presence, create weapons and forcefields, and manipulate the weather. And that's only going under the list of things that is specifically under Mastery since everything else is just implied he is capable of doing instead of directly stated on the profile, with the only thing stated that goes against this line of thought being a small note under a specific section that states Frieza Force members can't sense ki or conceal it.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Also, on the topic of ki attacks. Man does the wiki's usage of ki manipulation look weird as hell, like by it's own metrics Nappa is a master capable of sensing ki, generate light, reflect and nullify attacks, hide his power level and mask his presence, create weapons and forcefields, and manipulate the weather. And that's only going under the list of things that is specifically under Mastery since everything else is just implied he is capable of doing instead of directly stated on the profile, with the only thing stated that goes against this line of thought being a small note under a specific section that states Frieza Force members can't sense ki or conceal it.

Don't worry, I thinking in doing a CRT to change that.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

He do It in the games.
And like, everyone in Dragon Ball with master ki can do It, is just the characters exploding they Ki outwards. Not sure how high are the chances of Bardock doing It, since he apparently never done in a fight, why you asking?

Also, yeah practically every character in this franchise has that move available in games lol. I think it's actually one of, if not the most, common things in dragon ball when it comes to specific attacks

If he wants to Omni Man to get off him, I not sure If he gonna do a explosive wave, he probally just gonna mouth Beam Nolam.

I was thinking of the mouth beam too when I said that lol

Don't worry, I thinking in doing a CRT to change that.

Nice

 

[Zabazab]

Nolan gets a new rug FRA

 

[Fezzih_007]

This is probally a stomp, Bardock is animalistic here so he would't have much of skill in combat, making for him to win against someone who is good st fighting, and is 2x stronger.

Like, I not seeing any wincon for Bardock.

 

[Chariot190]

Tfw Nolan yeets the continent into space....

He do It in the games.

This aint the games dude.

And like, everyone in Dragon Ball with master ki can do It, is just the characters exploding they Ki outwards. Not sure how high are the chances of Bardock doing It, since he apparently never done in a fight, why you asking?

Because if he doesnt know the technique, he cant use it?

Burden of proof is on those saying he can.

If he wants to Omni Man to get off him, I not sure If he gonna do a explosive wave, he probally just gonna mouth Beam Nolam.

Huh? Why would nolan be in front of him? Ignoring the fact he can take it, Nolan is gonna be like an annoying fly aiming for vitals, the tail, or literally just rip chunks off him.

No? Where did you getting that off?

Dude, he'd have to hit him directly in which case Nolan is just dodging, or he NUKES the area, and it either does nothing to Nolan or it hurts himself more because Nolan is stronger to start so to AOE nuke with enough power to even make him flinch, he's gonna be hurting himself even more, which is bad given Nolan eclipses him in stamina.

Dbz dudes arent immune to their own ki attacks lad.

Yeah, but he not exactly aiming at himself when he explode his energy outward. Like, when did you ever see someone using a explosive wave and hurting themselfs?

Bardock doesnt have that, games arent canon.
To nuke the area he'd need to actually do so.

 

[Fezzih_007]

This aint the games dude.

Ok, but you asked when did Bardock have explosive wave, you din't specify If I need to bring canon examples, you just asked since when he have.

Because if he doesnt know the technique, he cant use it?

You din't ask Anything about him knowing It, you just asked If he have it. This a ability that everyone with Ki master ability can do It, is just someone exploding they energy outwards. Is just them having the capability of doing so, don't mean he knows how to. Like I said, he not gonna use It.

Huh? Why would nolan be in front of him?

Because Bardock gonna be aiming at him? What?

Dbz dudes arent immune to their own ki attacks

Ok, you din't answer my question.
You asked If Bardock does a explosive wave, If that would't hurt him.
I asking why you thinking that he would.
Everyone who does a explosive wave never hurt themself after doing It.

 

[Chariot190]

Ok, but you asked when did Bardock have explosive wave, you din't specify If I need to bring canon examples, you just asked since when he have.

Dude obviously I meant canon, it doesnt matter if it isnt canon as if it aint canon that mean he dont got it and thus not relevant to the match.

You din't ask Anything about him knowing It, you just asked If he have it. This a ability that everyone with Ki master ability can do It, is just someone exploding they energy outwards. Is just them having the capability of doing so, don't mean he knows how to. Like I said, he not gonna use It.

Well fir future reference I want actual proof of that claim.

Because Bardock gonna be aiming at him? What?

Anywhere? Nuke, AOE. To hit the dude who's gonna be up his ass with an explosion, he's gonna have to catch himself with it to? Explosions do be omnidirectional.

Ok, you din't answer my question.

Because there's nothing to answer.
Does Bardock, in canon, have this technique? No? Then conversation just ends there.

You asked If Bardock does a explosive wave,

I asked for proof he even has it, we havent even got to step 2 yet.

If that would't hurt him.

Given nolan has hundred million degree heat res, starts off twice as strong, and has pain tolerance that enables him to just ignore crippling wounds, I dont see this stopping him anyway.

I asking why you thinking that he would.
Everyone who does a explosive wave never hurt themself after doing It.

Because he doesnt have it? And if he doesnt have it, nuking would fall to actual nuking, in which they arent immune to their own attacks like that? Hell Goku even does that to train.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

If we go with showings, Bardock can really only use basic ki-blasts.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Dude obviously I meant canon, it doesnt matter if it isnt canon as if it aint canon that mean he dont got it and thus not relevant to the match.

Sure sure sure, but I can't exactly know your intentions when you asked, so I just had to cover all of my bases.

Well fir future reference I want actual proof of that claim

I asked for proof he even has it, we havent even got to step 2 yet.

Because there's nothing to answer.
Does Bardock, in canon, have this technique? No? Then conversation just ends there.

Because he doesnt have it?

Why you repeated yourself 4 times, I understand in the first time sheesh. Did just really like to write?

Anyway, I already answered your question, and I think this is a stomp, so I not aswering you others points about the match.

 

[Chariot190]

Sure sure sure, but I can't exactly know your intentions when you asked, so I just had to cover all of my bases.

Common sense. Im obviously asking for proof he can do what you claim, showing noncanon stuff isnt proof.

Why you repeated yourself 4 times, I understand in the first time sheesh. Did just really like to write?

Because as you just said yourself, you don't get it unless it's spelt out explicitly.

If we go with showings, Bardock can really only use basic ki-blasts.

Statement is fine too, or even something like 'anyone who can master ki can do it" and then a statement saying Bardock mastered Ki, idk.

Like im not asking for much, just canon evidence he can.

 

[Spinoirr]

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

What's being argued rn? It seems crazy from my pov.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Gotta read that Bardock fight sometime lol, herd it was so good

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

What's being argued rn?

Seems like the general argument is just 'what ki attacks are actually applicable to Bardock', though it also seems like Bardock has no win-cons due do Oozari animalistic intellegence

 

[Spinoirr]

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Seems like the general argument is just 'what ki attacks are actually applicable to Bardock', though it also seems like Bardock has no win-cons due do Oozari animalistic intellegence

Type shi. He's basically a walking nuke going off the common knowledge of the Ozzaru, although I'm pretty sure elite sayian have control over and while in this transformation.... Do they not?

 

[Chariot190]

Now imagine if he didnt have an arm, or a head, and against a dude who will hold on even if he wasnt already stronger than Bardock even if that very attack melted his face off.

This would hurt Bardock more than it would Nolan.
Also a anti-feat, Gas isnt even Class Z, imagine if it was Nolan doing that.

 

[Fezzih_007]

Common sense.

Yeah, I don't have that

Like im not asking for much, just canon evidence he can

I gonna can stop joking then.
In the SEG: Story Volume - The Truth About Dragon Ball, is stated that "In battle, the most important thing is the size of your ki, and your control over it".

So like, we accept this statement for everyone on similar levels of mastery and power to the Saiyan Saga and Namek Saga. Bardock is like that, so we assume that he can use most of the abilities, exceptions being the ones that he can't.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Also a anti-feat, Gas isnt even Class Z, imagine if it was Nolan doing that.

Gas is also 5-B compared to the Low 5-B Nolan, so ehhh

 

[Chariot190]

Yeah, I don't have that

I gonna can stop joking then.
In the SEG: Story Volume - The Truth About Dragon Ball, is stated that "In battle, the most important thing is the size of your ki, and your control over it".

So like, we accept this statement for everyone on similar levels of mastery and power to the Saiyan Saga and Namek Saga. Bardock is like that, so we assume that he can use most of the abilities, exceptions being the ones that he can't.

That literally isnt saying what youre saying it does.

Yeah obviously the exceptions being ones he can't, like this, till you prove he can. Can he use the special beam cannon, kamehameha and others too? Of course not, but those weaker than him can.

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

Nolan fra (assuming this is fair)

 

[Chariot190]

Gas is also 5-B compared to the Low 5-B Nolan, so ehhh

As before, LS can work and often does work, on different mechanics. Materials have differing values for shear, compressive, tensile, etc, Gas is using LS there. He isnt punching him, using Ki, AP. It's just grip strength, which is magnitudes below Nolan's.

 

[Fezzih_007]

That literally isnt saying what youre saying it does

How so?

 

[Fezzih_007]

Can he use the special beam cannon, kamehameha and others too? Of course not, but those weaker than him can

The Ki Manipulation page already adress that btw.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Seeing as this is the Great Ape. Omniman could easily maneuver his way around Bardock's swipes and grabs by flying especially when his opponent is massive reenacting a human trying to catch a fly in a sense. Omniman's durability is already above Bardock's AP and he resists heat so the explosions shouldn't do significant damage to omniman if they do reach him, cherry on top he can regenerate at Low-Mid standards so he'll be fine from critical condition should it strike which is unlikely.
Omniman can straight up pick up Bardock and fling him across the planet itself and has the AP to beat down bardock until he can no longer move. Im voting Omniman in that case.

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Pretty sure the fly comparison doesn't really work, cause they'd have the exact same speed here, so Bardock's size just ends up with him having a range advantage tbh

 

[Chariot190]

How so?

Where does it say "oh btw simply having high or bigger ki means you know every technique of those weaker than you".

It doesnt say this, it doesnt even implicate that. And we know it isn't true anyway.

Pretty sure the fly comparison doesn't really work, cause they'd have the exact same speed here, so Bardock's size just ends up with him having a range advantage tbh

If they have the same top speed, it would be like a fly.

Bardock's terminals would be where the speed peaks, not up close, if you wanna argue it that way.

Like if you swung your arm, it peaks quicker than a fly, but you still have to actually draw your arm in, arc it, whatever, it's a double edged sword. Bigger range maybe, but it also jerk movements harder.

But like, that's just getting technical, id imagine it like SSJ4 vs Baby.

 

[SlendVeny]

He probally doing more out of instinct tbh. I don't think he can do a full against Omni Man just using instincts.

No, he wasn't just rampaging and blowing shit up, he was hanging off the side of a building and surveying the streets to find people.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Pretty sure the fly comparison doesn't really work, cause they'd have the exact same speed here, so Bardock's size just ends up with him having a range advantage tbh

Why not? Humans are far faster than mosquitos but find them hard to kill because of the massive size difference. Iirc We see that aswell in some instances with great ape vegeta and goku back in sayian saga and some other showings of the great ape where it finds grabbing smaller opponents difficult despite belonging to the same tier of power

 

[Fezzih_007]

Where does it say "oh btw simply having high or bigger ki means you know every technique of those weaker than you".

Ah, I understand the problem.
You think doing a big ass explosion (Explosion wave) is a special technique like the Kamehameha.
Is not. Is just aplication of Ki, like using a Ki blast. Which Bardock would be able to do.

 

[Chariot190]

Ah, I understand the problem.
You think doing a big ass explosion (Explosion wave) is a special technique like the Kamehameha.
Is not. Is just aplication of Ki, like using a Ki blast. Which Bardock would be able to do.

Prove it.

If it's named it's a technique, you dont decide what does and doesnt count, so im asking you to prove it.

I dont even think it's true anyway based on Piccolo yap.

 

[Spinoirr]

Prove it.

If it's named it's a technique, you dont decide what does and doesnt count, so im asking you to prove it.

I dont even think it's true anyway based on Piccolo yap.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

If it's named it's a technique, you dont decide what does and doesnt count, so im asking you to prove it.

TBF, Dragon Ball names everything regardless of how minor it is. Even the most generic blast possible is considered a 'named attack', with characters having variations of it which are arbitrarily different only because one has a name.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Ah, I understand the problem.
You think doing a big ass explosion (Explosion wave) is a special technique like the Kamehameha.
Is not. Is just aplication of Ki, like using a Ki blast. Which Bardock would be able to do.

Whats the significance of this technique in this matchup? Is it dura neg similar to dirty fireworks or what?? If its just a huge explosion then Omniman should be able to survive based on his higher AP/Dura, Resistance to heat and Regeneration.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Omni Man starts stronger than Bardock, as Bardock is 10 times stronger than his base strength who is >29.6 Exatons, has thousands of years more combat experience, including fighting huge monsters before, can survive in space (not by breathing but he can hold his breath for weeks) while Bardock can't, and Oozaru Bardock has less mobility due to his larger ape body

Not to mention that if Nolan realizes at any point his power comes from the tail, cutting it won't be an issue. If anything he could easily grapple with the tail and throw him around with his far superior lifting strength (Class Z VS Class K)

Omni Man should win without much issues. Voting him

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Whats the significance of this technique in this matchup? Is it dura neg similar to dirty fireworks or what?? If its just a huge explosion then Omniman should be able to survive based on his higher AP, Resistance to heat and Regeneration.

Ki attacks are stronger than normal physicals, with many many of them being a few times stronger than the user. Basically Bardock gains a means to kill Omni Man with it.

Also don't know why heat resistance keeps getting mentioned, ki attacks don't usually kill opponents via heat and it's typically just due to sheer ap

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Ki attacks are stronger than normal physicals, with many many of them being a few times stronger than the user. Basically Bardock gains a means to kill Omni Man with it.

Bardock has never showed he can overcome such AP gaps with his blast. Reminder that Vegeta destroyed Dodoria effortlessly and their powers were 24k vs 22k, which is far less than 2 times

Also don't know why heat resistance keeps getting mentioned, ki attacks don't usually kill opponents via heat and it's typically just due to sheer ap

Which Bardock lacks even as a great ape. Nolan starts twice as strong compared to his Oozaru form

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Bardock has never showed he can overcome such AP gaps with his blast. Reminder that Vegeta destroyed Dodoria effortlessly and their powers were 24k vs 22k, which is far less than 2 times

I don't see how that's applicable since the entire basis around it is for a universal mechanic which Bardock has been shown to utilize. He's shown to use both the generic ki blasts and also more unique charged up ones such as his famous Final Spirit Cannon, in fact the Dodoria statement kinda falls on deaths door since Dodoria not only lacks any form of unique ki manipulation outside of just firing blasts but Dodoria also never actually lands a ki blast on Vegeta as they just get decimated physically and then obliterates them.

Which Bardock lacks even as a great ape. Nolan starts twice as strong compared to his Oozaru form

No, Oozaru are still capable of using ki. They commonly use it via their mouth cannons, though due to highly limited usages basically every other known abilities is derived from a game.