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Not knowing your value gives you a bad time, apparently. (GRACE FINISHED)

Ok, if it's not an attack, it might not matter.

... What are Four's fatal attacks against Sans? The Reality Warping conjures and doesn't guarantee a kill like an atomizer and shapeshifting is non- lethal. Four can transport Sans over lava or something with his Pocket Reality Hax but Sans could teleport away from harm.
 
Four got Biological Manipulation but since Four doesn't have an atomizer and Sans is already a skeleton, that can't do it.
 
It never says anything that Sans is resistant to Biological Manipulation, so he may still be affected.
 
(One sec. so many tabs open) Yeah, but the example of Four's Biological Manipulation was used to deform others so they'd die. Sans is already dead as a skeleton, moving around using his soul. The description of Biological Manipulation says it can range from minor body control to effecting matter on the molecular level, but since Four doesn't reach that level(no atomizer), it's hard to say how much(if at all) he can effect bones.

Well, at the very least if he could, I doubt it would be an issue for Sans, as his abilities don't really require much physical input.
 
Sans being a skeleton doesn't mean he is immune to that. His body can't just be twisted and turned or deformed out of shape and him survive. Nothing would suggest that. And we couldn't really assume he would survive.
 
Buttersamuri said:
Sans being a skeleton doesn't mean he is immune to that. His body can't just be twisted and turned or deformed out of shape and him survive. Nothing would suggest that. And we couldn't really assume he would survive.
Click to expand...
Is Sans "alive" even? I thought it was a soul controlling bones.
 
Umm.. he works just like any other monster or human.. nothing suggests he is just a soul who is moving the body. If that was the case, damaging his physical body wouldn't result in his death cause his soul would still exist. But much like other monsters. He fades away and dies.
 
Hes a physical body monster. I guess I would consider him alive.
 
Oh well. Since there is no other example of Frisk/Chara gaining exp other then killing, there is no other choice than to assume... ah, damn it. There is just an unknown factor of Sans that I can't get a handle on in my head.

Sans's biology is making me very unsure just how detrimental Biological Manipulation could be on Sans.
 
Well, no, that's not true. There is an example of an skeleton dying in Undertale, Papyrus. He still lived for a good minute before turning to dust without a body and just a head.
 
That would probably be Type 7 Immortality, something not even listed in either skelebros profiles. You gaining the EXP when they die proves that they are alive, and before you ask "What about Nabstablook?", well, hes dead. A ghost. And thus, you cant really kill him.
 
So, what does that mean for Four's Biological Manipulation? Does Sans get badly effected by it?
 
Potentially yes, however, from what I have seen, Four would have to be near his target to do the thing.
 
Hm. I'm not sold 100% but for now, i'm changing my vote to Sans.
 
Sorry, I didn't explain why I changed my vote. If Four's abilities are generally close ranged (including the Screech, in which, i didn't notice it effecting someone with considerable distance) and I didn't notice the OP describing the match starting anywhere relatively close to each other, with speed equalize and Sans teleportation along with fatal range attacks, I'm giving this to Sans.

Sans FRA
 
Psychomaster35 said:
The closest thing I see Four do in long range terms is his Zappy powers, which fires beams of energy which seemingly nigh instantly. There is also his limb extension, which expanded up to many times the diameter of Earth, shown when he was eliminating Loser.
Click to expand...
I don't mean to come off as stubborn, but doesn't Sans's Clairvoyance let him start dodging (speed equalized) before Four starts firing his beams of energy? He would have movement advantage with his teleportation.

And Sans has Genius Intelligence. If Four was extending his limbs, Sans would quickly pick up on the fact Four is trying to get close to him and would do what he could to avoid it.
 
Though, I don't think Sans need Genius Intelligence to find Four's limb extensions coming towards him suspicious.
 
Overall, this thread doesn't have a stomp. Both opponents will have a hard time killing the other. Sans is too cunning for Four but if Sans gets close, he is dead.
 
Set the distance but remember, too close and Four stomps. It would just come down to a sudden race to see if Four's abilities activates first or Sans's Clairvoyance on top of using Teleportation.

And would Bloodlust change Four's intelligence? I don't know if it would make much of a difference with Sans's cunning.
 
... Ok. I need to watch all the BFB episodes to figure out a rough estimate of Four's range. All I knew was Four's Screech range. It wasn't any of what I'd call 10 meters, but I haven't seen all that Four can do.
 
Ah yes, make the character that can hax at will bloodlusted, that surely help.

Seriously, why did you bloodlust him? He was losing, that doesn't mean things need to be changed. Anyways, 8 am pretty sure 4 used his screech from more than 10 meters away, and it's literal sound, there is no reason to assume that sound would stop working after an arbitrary range like that.

4 stomps.
 
I've seen Sans lose to a very similar opponent using a very similar attack. Like very very similar. Like it literally was them yelling. Which causes them to be stunned I really wish they were in the same tier
 
I mean, thats regardless in character anyway since Four has the tendency to attack people who hit him.

Does 50 meters look good then? Or further more?
 
Psychomaster35 said:
I mean, thats regardless in character anyway since Four has the tendency to attack people who hit him.

Does 50 meters look good then? Or further more?
Click to expand...
Sans can't attack from that distance with anything but ghaster blasters, which 4 dodges.

Bloodlust is not something you can keep on, and without I cast my vote already.
 
So, you consider this a stomp, or you vote Four? If this is a stomp, should I just have Four in character or extend the starting distance?
 
Did you... Read what I wrote? Extending range achieves nothing, and 4 bloodlusted stomps.
 
Yeah, Four's Screech is the issue. Do we look at it and say "since it's sound, distance is ignored." Or "Since we never seen it travel over a great distance, we can't assume the Screech's effects would work over 10 meters."?

I did watch BFB all last night. I think i'm just missing the last episode. But I actually did not notice Four using the abilities on someone past 10 meters, which I was actually surprised to find out.

There was a time characters were on the moon. Four wasn't there but someone had his powers. He didn't bring those characters back. He was communicating through a tv and reach into the live camera to hit the character on the moon. Then, through a live camera, pushed the earth through the camera out of the tv and next to the moon.

That feat was impressive, but it further confused me in finding in-character range.

There was also a time when Four came back. The robot is missing and Four wanted to eliminate the robot. I thought this would be a great opportunity to see Four use his powers in-character over a large distance. Well... that didn't happen. Four, using super speed and some kind of awareness, travel to the robot and then used his power to eliminate the robot.

So, in terms of in-character range, I actually did not notice any of Four's use of his powers being over 10 meters.


But yeah. Now that I got a better gage on Four's intelligence, bloodlusting Four is a very bad idea.
 
By the way, does speed equalized mean we are using Sans's Speed or Four's speed?
 
Hm. Well, after seeing Four's speed, if they are both speed equalized, I further don't believe Four can Stomp Sans. Doesn't mean Four can't win but he is running out of options.

Four's speed is crazy. I firmly believe if he faced someone with similar powers his own, Four's speed will save him from the fatal attacks/guarantee victory. And since Sans will have Four's speed in this fight, Four will not have an easy time.

Mostly what I really see going against Four is his range.
 
Also, I may have to rewatch the episodes again, but I didn't really notice Four using his abilities in-character being faster than a Gaster Blaster other than using his super speed to travel.
 
Buttersamuri said:
The faster one is always used
Click to expand...
What? No.

There was one thread arguing that, and Antvasime plain said it's not to be taken as a rule.

There is no rule for such a thing.
 
So, how fast are Sans and Four going? Cause it seems, from how I'm looking at this fight, how high the speed is is important to the outcome. How well Sans can avoid Four's Haxes is pretty necessary to know, as long as Four's range in-character is short range.
 
Actually, on the topic of those beams, it's not fatal. When Four use it on the fence, the fence was still alive and participating in the game.
 
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