- 97
- 7
but grands are for the beasts no?
-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
Nasuverse Discussion Board 28
- Thread starter Dangai_Ichigo
- Start date
- 3,792
- 209
@Regis sorry but thats dumb, the main reason counterforce summoned a grand is for a beast.
Grand Servants (Òé░Òâ®Òâ│ÒâëÒéÁÒâ╝Òâ┤ÒéíÒâ│Òâê?), also referred to as Grand Class (Òé░Òâ®Òâ│ÒâëÒé»Òâ®Òé╣?), are existences summoned by the Counter Force in order to prevent the extinction of mankind by the Beasts.
https://typemoon.fandom.com/wiki/Grand_Servant?mobile-app=false
Grand Servants (Òé░Òâ®Òâ│ÒâëÒéÁÒâ╝Òâ┤ÒéíÒâ│Òâê?), also referred to as Grand Class (Òé░Òâ®Òâ│ÒâëÒé»Òâ®Òé╣?), are existences summoned by the Counter Force in order to prevent the extinction of mankind by the Beasts.
https://typemoon.fandom.com/wiki/Grand_Servant?mobile-app=false
- 2,485
- 309
Is there a source that isn't just another wiki saying stuff? Because Orion definitely didn't say he was there for a Beast. So unless you have hard evidence that Orion or any Grand is only there when a Beast is around, this discussion is pointless as it's just speculation.GLHF22 said:
- 97
- 7
but orion did imply something of the same level as a beast is coming up right?
- 3,792
- 209
If you think you have all the correct information then go ahead and change the information in the Wiki, no one Will prevent you. Yes this discussion is pointless because you speculating that grand is summoned for something other than beast when the evidence say that the main purpose grand is there is for a beast.
- 9,253
- 2,731
It would seem that the Nasuverse treats Greek and Roman Gods as different entities, which also seems to be reinforced by Saber Venus non-mechanical design. I don't think it's a bad thing, considering that despite eventually sharing the same deities, Roman tradition was more severe in the deity-to-man relationship, and in this Lostbelt, the gods ave been so carefree and influenced by humans that they've basically become slaves to them.
Shit is gonna get real convoluted though if they ever decide to make Aeneas into a servant.
Shit is gonna get real convoluted though if they ever decide to make Aeneas into a servant.
- 8,753
- 1,617
As it is, the whole point of the Gods becoming slaves is that they are hyper susceptible to the influence of humans, at least the greek ones. So the Romans diverging a **** ton would make a lot of sense.
I wouldn't also trust to think of the other pantheons as "human-like" when the most we get are reduced avatars, bunreis or whatever else. Just look at Artemis looking human-like reduced as a Servant but looking like a Mech in her true form.
Also, no, to the person that asked before. There are Gods, and there are Divine Spirits. Divine Spirits are merely the strongest spirits, past Gods that have been reduced due to the decay of the Age of Gods and not wielding the same power nor influence as before, but still being more or less powerhouses. But as we've seen with Artemis who can look human, it is possible some Gods, if not all, can change form to some degree.
And about the whole debacle of Orion, don't quote the Wiki. The wiki is as unreliable as it gets unless it provides you a link to a confiable source. It doesn't? Don't use it, save yourself the trouble.
I wouldn't also trust to think of the other pantheons as "human-like" when the most we get are reduced avatars, bunreis or whatever else. Just look at Artemis looking human-like reduced as a Servant but looking like a Mech in her true form.
Also, no, to the person that asked before. There are Gods, and there are Divine Spirits. Divine Spirits are merely the strongest spirits, past Gods that have been reduced due to the decay of the Age of Gods and not wielding the same power nor influence as before, but still being more or less powerhouses. But as we've seen with Artemis who can look human, it is possible some Gods, if not all, can change form to some degree.
And about the whole debacle of Orion, don't quote the Wiki. The wiki is as unreliable as it gets unless it provides you a link to a confiable source. It doesn't? Don't use it, save yourself the trouble.
- 2,485
- 309
Orion said he was there for a reason that's not saving Artemis. Who knows what that is, but it's something big.PlsHelpmeIneedIt said:
- 2,485
- 309
The pointless discussion is because you don't have any evidence other than pure guesswork that Orion is there because of a Beast, something that is not confirmed anywhere, and disproven with the first Grand appearance when KH pops up in Camelot to briefly help you out. And using unsourced statements from a Wiki known for messing things up is pretty dumb. Maybe get a source next time?GLHF22 said:
- 16,606
- 1,791
Why are you being so fiery over people speculating on how they think the LB will go?
- 3,792
- 209
Eh? Really? Have you bought any evidence that grand is summoned for something other than beast? Thats kinda ironic. What's the purpose of grand existence? Tell me and briing your evidence here.
KH pops out on camelot because His temple is in camelot and yeah that is in His lore. See? Your argument based on nothing.
KH pops out on camelot because His temple is in camelot and yeah that is in His lore. See? Your argument based on nothing.
- 8,753
- 1,617
Can this dumb business honestly stop?
Its literally leading nowhere.
Its literally leading nowhere.
- 888
- 53
Why even debate it? Grands are summoned by CF only to take care of Beasts. KH appears in Camelot because that was his temple, his territory. He only helped because there was a deal, and he didn't even kill a single soul. He only actually springed into action in Babylonia specifically to deal with Tiamat.
You even just contradicted yourself there with Orion there originally not for Artemis. The story has told many times that Grands are summoned to fight Beasts, unless you are a bs level mage like Daybit who summoned a Grand as his Servant.
You even just contradicted yourself there with Orion there originally not for Artemis. The story has told many times that Grands are summoned to fight Beasts, unless you are a bs level mage like Daybit who summoned a Grand as his Servant.
- 8,753
- 1,617
LSirLancelotDuLacl said:
- 769
- 166
Why are the Two threads I am an active follower of just going into nonsense arguments? You know the ones I'm talking about Lancelot.
- 8,753
- 1,617
As long as he doesn't appear anymore I am happy. But still, ruminating on that is honestly a waste of time.
I myself prefer assuming nothing, as we've crossed about 4 different Beasts already and a Grand appeared for only 1. Nobody's guess has anything but bare information backing it up.
I myself prefer assuming nothing, as we've crossed about 4 different Beasts already and a Grand appeared for only 1. Nobody's guess has anything but bare information backing it up.
- 2,486
- 872
This.Iapitus The Impaler said:
- 8,753
- 1,617
I feel confused that Regis' whole point is that "we really don't know and shouldn't just suppose", not that "FOR SURE" Grands aren't related to Beasts at all.
Can everyone actually read if we are gonna go down this kind of unnecessary tangent? Considering we have a track record of 4 beasts and only one Grand came to battle it, and there's literally not a single source from anyone that states where this is ever said, I am tempted to join him in thinking we are shooting in the dark with no basis here.
Is fun to think about, but don't treat it like facts backed up by tons of stuff.
Can everyone actually read if we are gonna go down this kind of unnecessary tangent? Considering we have a track record of 4 beasts and only one Grand came to battle it, and there's literally not a single source from anyone that states where this is ever said, I am tempted to join him in thinking we are shooting in the dark with no basis here.
Is fun to think about, but don't treat it like facts backed up by tons of stuff.
- 2,485
- 309
Pointing out that there's no real basis for speculation other than Tiamat and the fact that no one has actually given a source that says Grands are for Beasts only is somehow bad? I mean if you're going to speculate actually discuss the chapter lol, like what the Mysterious Archer, Rider Kintoki, Medea Lily and a bunch of other Servants hiding in Olympus to help us out are gonna do. Beast stuff is pointless because no one knows much and it's not spoken about in the story.
John985
He/Him- 3,491
- 561
The reason they speculate that grand is for the beast is because of this. An interview back in 2005.
Q: About the power comparison between Arc and Servants, would the Arc being compared be the 30% one or the full one?
A: That would be the 30% Arc. It takes 7 Counter Guardians to control the Primate Murder and the Servants of the Grail War are based on these.
Q: About the power comparison between Arc and Servants, would the Arc being compared be the 30% one or the full one?
A: That would be the 30% Arc. It takes 7 Counter Guardians to control the Primate Murder and the Servants of the Grail War are based on these.
- 2,485
- 309
Still pointless when Beasts aren't mentioned in Atlantis and Goetia in Romani's body isn't said to be a Beast. Again, maybe actually read the chapter and accurate summaries and use that for speculation? I just posted some stuff up above for people to talk about.GLHF22 said:
- 8,753
- 1,617
... Counter Guardians are a completely different thing. Remember that Heroic Spirits naturally just go to the throne, while Counter Guardians are normally people that literally sign a contract for power and have to pay the price later in (un)life as the tools of Alaya.
- 8,753
- 1,617
Care to show where this is said?GLHF22 said:
- 2,485
- 309
Again, it's still pointless overall for the reasons above. Why speculate on imaginary stuff when you have actual mysteries like our secret Servant strike force in Olympus, what LB Zeus is doing, are Caenis/Odysseus gonna reappear again and so on? I just pointed out that Beast stuff is pure smoke when there's nothing to it in Atlantis unlike some of the stuff here.John985 said:
- 8,753
- 1,617
This bullshit about getting "baited" is getting tiring as well.
- 8,753
- 1,617
Post it if you get a chance later then, am curious about that.
John985
He/Him- 3,491
- 561
https://www.reddit.com/r/FGOGuide/comments/c503k3/tokugawa_kaiten_labyrinth_ooku_section_8/LSirLancelotDuLacl said:
Essentially, Beasts get recognized by the Counter Force, and a total of 7 Grand rank servants are sent to really fight them back.
However, since they're still immature right now in the "Ooku"; in that labyrinth…
No, they did that to seclude their body, their vessel, inside so that the Counter Force wouldn't pick up their presence as a Beast.
They did it to prevent a single grand ranking servant from finding them.
- 8,753
- 1,617
That is much better, thank you.
- 7,165
- 1,066
Another wave of Fate Revision. I'm going to make Revision for LB5 after this.
- 97
- 7
the day god was shot down... that meant this scene right
- 227
- 10
About Servants' power level:
"Q: How strong are Servants?
Nasu: Well you see, attack power is about the same as one fighter. A fighter has way too much power for one person too stand up against, **but to destroy one city they'll have to refuel many times**. But what makes these guys dangerous is that since they're spiritual bodies, regular weapons won't work against them. **As far as destructive power goes, there are _more numerous powerful weapons among modern ones_**, but as normal weapons won't do a thing to them, they're among the most powerful. **Anyway, just as fighters can load a nuclear warhead, they each have their own Noble Phantasms and among the Servants there are ones that have ridiculously powerful ones**. That's why when I meant strength being the same as a fighter I thought it would be easier to image. Oh and, if I were to say it in a sort of non-serious way, they'd be 1/4th of Tsukihime's Arcueid I suppose? The strength of one I mean. Against one Servant, Arc would probably win, but against two, while Arc's having trouble against the one, the other could get behind her and nail her... maybe."
"Q: How strong are Servants?
Nasu: Well you see, attack power is about the same as one fighter. A fighter has way too much power for one person too stand up against, **but to destroy one city they'll have to refuel many times**. But what makes these guys dangerous is that since they're spiritual bodies, regular weapons won't work against them. **As far as destructive power goes, there are _more numerous powerful weapons among modern ones_**, but as normal weapons won't do a thing to them, they're among the most powerful. **Anyway, just as fighters can load a nuclear warhead, they each have their own Noble Phantasms and among the Servants there are ones that have ridiculously powerful ones**. That's why when I meant strength being the same as a fighter I thought it would be easier to image. Oh and, if I were to say it in a sort of non-serious way, they'd be 1/4th of Tsukihime's Arcueid I suppose? The strength of one I mean. Against one Servant, Arc would probably win, but against two, while Arc's having trouble against the one, the other could get behind her and nail her... maybe."
Similar threads
