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I’ll never understand people’s willingness to believe Naruto surpassed Hashirama with Biju Mode, nvm BSM in the War Arc… 
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Naruto to Boruto Discussion Thread
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What's the most accepted size of the OP world on here again? Like, how many times the size of rl Earth?
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it's accepted to be a small star on vsbw lmao, I personally have it more as like 5-A
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That's kinda crazy
5-A is definitely better, and someone in Reddit calced it as 2.5 times the size of Earth. Not saying this is more accurate than KT's though.
MinatoSparkle
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Hashirama>Kurama, not >>>
BSM is understandable considering his feats against Juubito. Hashirama shoves KCM2 Naruto in a locker thoughI’ll never understand people’s willingness to believe Naruto surpassed Hashirama with Biju Mode, nvm BSM in the War Arc…
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It really depends on how much you want to suspend your disbelief of physics breaking realities in fiction. On one hand, it's like yeah, it's fiction it's obviously fine; on the other hand, it's like well we have to draw the line somewhere since we use physics to quantify fiction, so at what point are you just cherry picking what is allowed to be ignored.That's kinda crazy
5-A is definitely better, and someone in Reddit calced it as 2.5 times the size of Earth. Not saying this is more accurate than KT's though.
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Regardless of who you think wins BSM Naruto we saw in the war arc is def comparable to Prime Hashirama given his feats against Juubito lmao
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He's not.
Testarossa002
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Having BASE Hashirama this far above Juubito is nasty work ngl
Edo Hashirama is like 75% of Alive Hashirama and the former was self-admittedly inferior to "unstable" juubito
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I think the confusion stems from a misunderstanding of Naruto and Sasuke's feats against Juubito. They did NOT fight a Juubito who was really trying, nor was he in a good mental state in the slightest.
Like, I believed that Juubito was mentally nerfed long before I believed mental nerfs were even a thing in-verse lol. It's so blatant.
MinatoSparkle
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I mean either way he was in a worse state prior to physically stabilizing
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he better
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Not at first, he wasn't. The Juubito who Hashirama admitted inferiority to is not the same as the one who was nuking himself and being ripped apart lol.
Ntm, it's a moot comparison when we know both are at the end of the day vaguely inferior to Juubito. The only difference is that Hashirama's got avenues to scale above Naruto. While Naruto's mainly come from a mentally broken Juubito.
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its all wrong, EMS Madara is not >>> that sasuke either, the fact that Sasuke can even penetrate this madara proves that, and the argument people wanna use that madara was was nerfing his durability by a ridiculous degree so that he could intentionally get hit by sasuke as a roundabout way to stop him is so ridiculously stupid and a prime example of powerscaling brainrot, Madara using sasuke's sword against him is a tactical choice that serves both as a creative solution and a mark of Madara's character but a solution that doesnt need to happen if his apparently >>>
thats also not accounting that some of the best sensory ninjas in the verse at the time like hashirama and tobirama say as much about Juubito>Hash
and this same sasuke alongside naruto got literally clapped out of their avatars the moment juubito got serious
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Where are you getting this number?
Testarossa002
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The hokages were revived with powers close to their alive selves
Which Is anything from 51% to 99%
75% serves as a middle ground
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This Mf does love penetrating older men
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Does Obito removing a portion of the Jubi from himself to make the Shinju also count in nerfing himself?
MinatoSparkle
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Any version of Unstable Juubito is him in a mindless state with no sense of self. He clearly got better control of his powers when he stabilized even if he was mentally nerfed. 100% Juubito>Mentally nerfed Stable Juubito>Unstable Juubito>Hashirama
There are also avenues to put Naruto above too, like using BSM>>KCM2~>Madara~Hashirama in speed and arguing Hashirama's firepower doesn't matter if he can't hit Naruto or consistently block his attacks. I still have Hashirama above, but it's not a one sided debate.
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Even if I conceded to that scaling chain, I don't see what it changes given that stable Juubito (mentally nerfed or otherwise) is still >> Naruto. And he has no relevant scaling to or above stable Juubito.
I mean, Naruto has only shown significant superiority to Madara with Shunshin, which is fine. Having one move that makes him a lot faster isn't the end all be all.
And tbf, that was Edo Madara. So in reality it's more like
Naruto's shunshin >> Edo Madara < revived SM Madara ~ Prime Madara ~ Hashirama < SM Hashirama's reactions/senses. So I just don't see him getting blitzed here. Especially given all the avenues that puts him and Madara at this level or above it.
Well, I never said it was impossible to argue for it, but what's more likely/consistent? It's possible to argue for a lot of things, including Juubito ~ Hagoromo (not saying this is as ridiculous as that, just saying), but that doesn't make it the best possible take.
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Neirre is now a mod. Nice
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yeh
MinatoSparkle
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That's fine
He was also generally having no issues keeping up with Rinnegan Obito who's shown to be comparable to Edo Madara.
Surr, just saying speed is a notable advantage BSM Naruto has
What I moreso mean is that they have a lot of scaling chains you can link fairly close to each other and that they're pretty comparable as overall combatants considering that
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Bro was too busy wondering if Chris Hansen was going to show up or not.
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Congratulations Nierre
XSOULOFCINDERX
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This shit is stupidly OP.
MinatoSparkle
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The way Naruto's WA key is split up is kinda odd ngl. Wouldn't it make more sense to split it between pre- and post-Kurama cooperation rather than by arcs, cause that's when his power significantly changes?
XSOULOFCINDERX
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No because the initial KCM2 is weaker than the one later on when the Jūbi is active.
MinatoSparkle
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I mean actually mastered KCM2 happens before BOTTTJ anyways, which is his second WA key. Also his Base/SM/KCM get stronger after Kurama's cooperation so that's a big reason having a post-Kurama coop key would be good.
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I mean it’s just subjective,
A lot of verses will do it by arc rather than by the power up to makes keys easier to name as long as the profiles still get the point across of how their new power is attained and what it entails.
Not to mention all of Nards profiles are by arc so it would be weirder if WA Nard was the exception.
Also personally 4GNW and BOJJ Nard are both way better names for the keys than Pre and Post Kurama friendship.
and they’re easy ways to identify what part of the story it’s talking about for more casual ppl looking at his profile
Which is also why we call EoS Nard his “Six Paths key” instead of “Kaguya Strikes key”
MinatoSparkle
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Fair enough ig, but it is kinda a problem still that the arc splits aren't entirely accurate to the things listed in the keys
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There are like canon, official arcs, that the keys could be ordered in. But maybe the current ordering is just for relevancy.
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It’s been a year!Merry Christmas fellas
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It pm is
A mix between relevant terminology and official arc names that describe key points in a characters power progression without having to make a key for every ability they ever gain
That way it avoids the need for 20 keys of a character some of which for negligible gains or niche names that a casual fan wouldn’t understand.
Imagine if we had a Post Rasenshuriken Training Key or a pre Kaguya and Post Kaguya key for Six Paths Nard just because he demonstrates new hax and higher AP with certain abilities he didn’t have during the Kaguya fight.
MinatoSparkle
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I’m about to drink some coquito and celebrate we’re not doing this rn
MinatoSparkle
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I’m about to drink some coquito and celebrate we’re not doing this rn
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Let me know if this scaling is right or wrong (Pre-Six Paths Power Up):
- Base Naruto = 3TM Sasuke
- SM Naruto = EMS Sasuke (Skeletal Susanoo)
- KCM Naruto = EMS Sasuke (Armored Susanoo)
- BM Naruto = EMS Sasuke (Complete Susanoo)
- BSM Naruto > EMS Sasuke (Unless we think MAS is evidence Sasuke obtained PS prior to Meeting Hags)
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XSOULOFCINDERX
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Mastered KCM Naruto, EMS Sasuke and War Arc Sakura are stated to be equals and then Mastered KCM2 Naruto is several tiers above them in power with Sasuke only barely catching up to BSM Naruto through two outside amps, one from Naruto himself and the other from Jugo before he awakens the Perfect Susano'o when they do MAS.
