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My Little Pony: Equestria Girls Upgrade Top-Tiers : " At least Low 2-C "

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The_2nd_Existential_Seed

The_2nd_Existential_Seed

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Hello Everyone. This is an Upgrade attempt exclusively for the Equestria Girls, to receive an " At least Low 2-C " rating for those who scale to Midnight Sparkle . Explicitly the feat of almost destroying both worlds (Pony world + EQG World)

This is due to the fact that Equestria Girls is seen as a Universe as a general common consensus throughout the show as both humor and serious talk , even more importantly by those such as Sci-Twi , who is arguably the most intellectual girl in the EQG side of things. They also never refer to Planet being the totality of EQG... Ever. I checked every statement in the show to make sure, but they only ever stated Universe, not once Planets.So her word is likely the best to accurate the show can get aside from Pony Twilight


This, for now, is unscalable to the original Elements from the Pony World due to the dact they have well evolved since being compared to the originals, and nothing indicates Midnight IS scalable to anyone outside of EQG due to not being involved with anything Pony Related AP wise aside from it originally being Equestrian Magic, which as stated in the show can massively evolve over time.
 
This looks fine from a glance, but prefer a specific scan. And would also prefer more input.
 
I'll gather the stuff that implies Equestria Girl at least conttains a Universe (not doing Equestria because I believe in previous hreads we already implied it being a Universe). I contacted the other knowledgable members... I'm hoping they respond.
 
Okay here we go.

Statements:

In Mirror Magic, Sci-Twi states the following:

Twilight Sparkle : Overpowered by a magic I couldn't control and created a rift between two worlds, almost destroying both of them in the process.

The fact she said "almost" means she was very likely bordering on destroying them both had it not been for the timely intervention of Sunset Shimmer and the Equestria Girl Element Wielders. this means it is very safe to say she scales to the destruction of both somewhat for the feat alone (not taking into account how casual it was, but that's for the scaling part) , as well as Daydream for reversing it.

While I do believe we know that "Equestria" as a whole is in-fact a Universe, But: we do need some sort of implication in Equestria Girls that a Universe is present. Well... I believe we got one:

In Equestria Girls: Better Together, Sci-Twi mentions this:

Twilight Sparkle: Oh, I'm so excited for my, uh... "hang-out" with Timber Spruce. First, we're gonna peruse the exhibit on gravitational fields for thirteen minutes. Then, we'll marvel at the vastness of the universe during the planetarium show. And finally, we'll enjoy...
Spike: [yawns]
Twilight Sparkle: ...cups of hot cocoa and casual conversation as we spot constellations in the night sky.
Not only does this directly insinuate that a "Universe" does in-fact exist within, but a Night Sky with constellations, which seemingly implies it even further.

But, there are more aforementionings of "Universe" within Equestria Girls, much more than the assumption of Planets... Whether just for fun or not. For example:

  • EQG: Spring Breakdown: Why, hello, Rainbow Dash. If you're hoping for a glimpse of the ultimate power in the universe, you'll have to wait 'til tonight. [Yes it's for humor and obviously an outlier for Human Trixie, but it shows that a "Universe" in concept being mentioning isn't foreign to the verse]
  • EQG: Roller Coaster of Friendship: Will you, uh, excuse me for a moment? [muffled] OF ALL THE OUTLANDISH CIRCUMSTANCES IN THE UNIVERSE, WHY ARE ALL THE WRETCHED THINGS HAPPENING TO ME?! (Again, Humor, but shows even regular people are aware of the Universe in-verse)
  • EQG: Sunset's Backstage Pass: Universe, I promise to make the most of this do-over do-over! [This episode also implies Alternate Timelines too... So]
Scaling:

For the Scaling, it gets a bit weird. Here is a Sandbox of the potential Changes when/if accepted ( https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:The_2nd_Existential_Seed/Equestria_Girls_(Post-Discord) ) Basically the feat would be between 1/2 to the baseline of 2-C due to affecting two realities and almost destroying them. This means there is an extremely small multiplier, if we use it , to make it to 2-C. Because of how casual fixing it is, I'm unsure if those scaling to Daydream/Midnight would become actually 2-C or not... Hence the major reason of discussing this in full.

The upgrade (Whether "At least Low 2-C" or "At least Low 2-C, possibly 2-C" would apply to : All Geodes Elements (Rarity, Flutters, Apple, Dash, Sci-Twi, Sunset) for those far surpassing Gloriossa (who far surpasses Daydream) , & Those Scaling to/above Daydream Shimmer (Gloriossa, Midnight, Post-Friendship Games Sunset, Pony-Up Sci-Twi, Rarity's Exerting Crystal Shield) ,
 
In that case, Universal Equestria Girls seems legit to me given Doggo's input.
 
This all looks good to me. Doesn't something being Low 2-C though mean it has to incorporate time and space in the destruction or am I getting that wrong?
 
Okay, @Medeus, is there anyone else that needs to give input or is this all she wrote ?

@Cinnabar Well, it does. Almost destroying the fabric of two universes does imply Space-Time is affected. However, space-time is involved with both, so destroying both worlds period sort of hints space-time is affected unless it's explicitly hinted to be merely physical.
 
The 2nd Existential Seed said:
Okay, @Medeus, is there anyone else that needs to give input or is this all she wrote ?
@Cinnabar Well, it does. Almost destroying the fabric of two universes does imply Space-Time is affected. However, space-time is involved with both, so destroying both worlds period sort of hints space-time is affected unless it's explicitly hinted to be merely physical.
Click to expand...
Destroying the universe could've just meant collapsing it in with Equestria, which I don't think would mean affecting time. And I'm pretty sure the destroying part is referring to something like how humans could destroyt the world several times over. We couldn't literally destroy the planet, but we could destroy all semblance of order.
 
The 2nd Existential Seed said:
The upgrade (Whether "At least Low 2-C" or "At least Low 2-C, possibly 2-C" would apply to : All Geodes Elements (Rarity, Flutters, Apple, Dash, Sci-Twi, Sunset) for those far surpassing Gloriossa (who far surpasses Daydream) , & Those Scaling to/above Daydream Shimmer (Gloriossa, Midnight, Post-Friendship Games Sunset, Pony-Up Sci-Twi, Rarity's Exerting Crystal Shield) ,
Click to expand...
Why does Gloriosa far surpass Daydream? And the geodes elements don't far surpass Gloriosa. Even together, they couldn't do anything unti Twilight showed up. Also, why is this not applicable to Equestria? EQG might scale above, but it's a quantifiable increase, so it should still be Low 2-C.
 
In context with how the feat is presented, it's far more than merely "collapsing it with Equestria", which wasn't how the feat was described... at all . It showed that through rifts would destroy both worlds... And both worlds have shown including space-time ... Hence why the feat is what it is . There is nothing hinting it was how you described in the show. Please give us such besides just statements as I already gave my reasoning above.

And the reason why it "currently" isn't scalable with Equestria is one because the Elements explicitly grow drastically stronger unqiuantifiably, plus there is no cross reference to use when showing who would be affected due to Midnight, as nothing has been stated in Equestria Girls for comparison sake. The only one that would be affected is the Elements, and we'd need explicit (not implied) proof from EqG that shows a comparison between the two Elements from some feat or statement. Otherwise we can't just crosscale because they are from the same source of power. So until more feasible implications arise earlier in the series, and that makes it consistent... We have to assume the feat is only scalable to EqG for now.

Your statement is exactly how Gloriossa scales above them put together. Daydreamer is the power of the Elements [bar Sci-Twi] working together, and since we saw that together they couldn't do a thign [except Rarity but that's more her shield than anything else as AP wise she got fodderized like the others]. I do say however that the Geodes should give a significant increase, especially considering each of their power cords fired by them separately could harm her when their combination attacks didn't do anything, which prove each of them separately scale > Daydream, much less Sci-Twi who was already stronger than Daydream before the Geodes... Hence why I say they are far stronger than Gloriossa as a group.
 
I understand you support it...

I was asking earlier should we wait for more support from staff or can we apply changes to the profiles based on the aforementioned statements ?
 
I'm fine with tier 2. I just wasn't clear on the reasoning before.

There is a comparison. Each of the elements in Rainbow Rocks should still be at the normal element level, as nothing shows that it's stronger than before. So the elements of harmony and those that scale above should be Low 2-C as the characters should be at the same level of strength in Friendship Games, since they gained no new boosts. And this power combined made Daydream.

6 people separately is a lot less powerful than one person with the power of 6. And what do you mean each of the power cords fired by them could harm her when their combos did nothing? I have no idea what you're referring to.
 
It was more based on the statement that even if they combined their powers it wouldn't do a thing to Gloriossa or her Dome , and they know about combining their powers to form Daydream the entire time, yet stated the only chance they had was Sci-Twi.

Also I will say I was confused with the aforementioned "lights". What happened was that each of the lights could break through Gloriossa's shield ... That is what occurred. So I do apologize there.

The problem with your 2nd paragraph is that backscaling isn't realy the best case to do... When you stated before combining the elements into one is greater than combining their strength separately. Especially when the canon elements get stronger over time as well, hence why it's a lot better to merely wait for a canon comparison between the current elements (not the originals) to be made before making assumptions such as these.
 
That was with a special contraption thar made it possible. And can you show me this statement?

But what lights? Was this in the climax of the film?

It's not exactly stronger 1 x 6 and 6 x 1 have technically the same sum, but the power is usually more effective when concentrated into one person than if the same amount of power is divided among several. Also, either way, the elements of harmony together should scale to the RR elements together. Also, when have the elements ever been stated as getting stronger? If anything, they've gotten weaker, cause they could easily defeat Discord and an enhanced set of the elements plus Starlight and Sunburst struggled against The Pony of Shadows (I don't actually think they got weaker, I'm just saying it's unlikely they got stronger).
 
The 2nd Existential Seed said:
This, for now, is unscalable to the original Elements from the Pony World due to the dact they have well evolved since being compared to the originals, and nothing indicates Midnight IS scalable to anyone outside of EQG due to not being involved with anything Pony Related AP wise aside from it originally being Equestrian Magic, which as stated in the show can massively evolve over time.
Click to expand...
Where is this stated or implied that the EqG EoH grew stronger than the original EoH or even evolved? More importantly; where is it implied the EoH haven't evolved themselves? By this point they can channel the Elements by themselves seemingly at will. Not to mention Discord's chaos magic has at least 2 universe level statements, possibly 3 if you count the Season 6 Finale. Nothing suggests they are weaker.

Really, it's stupid to claim that the EqG EoH are stronger because they evolved due to being Equestrian magic...which ignores that this would mean the original EoH would also be evolving by your own words. And what a surprise: That's exactly what Treelight Sparkle said she's doing. Or, at least, was before Sombra got her. I want to make this clear: Not only did the Elements evolve, but they evolved to the point of becoming a sapient being. I'd like to see the EqG EoH do that. If anything, the original EoH are stronger not only for evolving for longer, but what they became with all that evolving is so much more than what we've seen the EqG version evolve to.
 
Firstly the MLP Elements did get stringer up until Season 6. Aside from overpowering 3 people who only are > Alicorn Princess level, it's weird to say they are at the same level as they were in S5 or S4 when feats strongly contradict that.

The EQG Elements evolved to defeat the Dazzlings as otherwise they would've gotten stomped by them. Then evolved in Geodes. The Elements are comparable in the sense they evolve over time to a certain extent unless contradicted severely.


However, I do say there is evidence that within Rainbow Rocks they are comparable [which would in fact upgrade the S2 - S3 Pony Elements] , but this is a thread solely on taking this a step at a time... Doing EQG first before dealing with the Pony Elements themselves. I figured there was no way to get the Pony Elements upgraded at all unless we got the EQG Elements.


So, could you please make a separate thread to deal with the matter of scaling Pony Elements to EQG Elements so this thread doesn't go on for the longest ?


@Sparkle I'll answer your question either on said thread or if another is made
 
They absolutely curbstomped someone with universe level claims (which may not be so farfetched now) under no reason to lie. We do not know their limits. And what do you mean "up until" or "to a certain extent"? Are you implying they grew to a certain point, then stagnated?

Now is the perfect thread for this. I don't see why this needs an entire thread. I'm already working on multiple different My Little Pony threads. I'd really rather not start an entire new one to add to my pile. Especially not when the topic is completely relevant. This one isn't even all that long.

Edited my first comment in case you didn't see btw.
 
I don't really see anything proving AP wise they gained in S6 that is superior to S5/S4 unless I missed something. Also, aI never said I didn't want to scale them, but I needed to get it accepted first. Now that it is finding a fair compromise to make it reliable should be relatively simple.

Fair enough on that end. So, if you can help me compile a list of things to scale the Pony Elements to the Human Variants I would be grateful... Because aside form being Equestrian Magic I honestly have nothing.
 
If Medeus and Promestein (or at least I think that I saw her agree with this on her message wall) are fine with this, it can probably be applied.
 
I don't know if this should scale to anything except the Elements though.
 
Thank you Antvasima, but Medeus already told me I can apply it on his message wall after showing him that Promestein agreed . It's already applied. We are just conversing what to do in the future with this being accepted.
 
The 2nd Existential Seed said:
I don't really see anything proving AP wise they gained in S6 that is superior to S5/S4 unless I missed something. Also, aI never said I didn't want to scale them, but I needed to get it accepted first. Now that it is finding a fair compromise to make it reliable should be relatively simple.
Click to expand...
They were never used again up until the Pony of Shadows as far as I remember. Really, why would the EqG versions keep growing indefinitely while the original versions just...stop? If it applies to one side then it ought to apply to another. Not to mention this directly goes against both what Treelight Sparkle said; because she certainly wasn't around during Season 6, and what you said:

Equestrian Magic, which as stated in the show can massively evolve over time.
So, what? does it grow or not? It can't go both ways here.

Fair enough on that end. So, if you can help me compile a list of things to scale the Pony Elements to the Human Variants I would be grateful... Because aside form being Equestrian Magic I honestly have nothing.
Occam's Razor for one. Curbstomping people with multiple safe-ish universe level statements, curbstomping people who curbstomp a very small chain of people who are comparable to said universe level. The fact that they grew to become a sapient entity which implies their level of growth is >>> The EqGs versions. Also, that they've been growing for far longer. I might be able to dig up some more, but maybe Darkanine knows something. Regrettably, he is not on Discord right now.
 
Just to get things straight. Should EOS pony Twilight not have a 2-C key? She can channel the EOH's power without them.
 
One... I don't mind it being posted on Discord.

Second, Based solely on what Light said I don't mind them scaling above it if enough evidence is provided.

Let me get this straight: Seemingly the Equestrian Magic, since they started around the same relative power level and both grow at similar rates [if not the Pony Elements growing faster and longer] , they should be comparable (if not the Pony ones being stronger)... Is this your reasoning ?

If so, aside from the Pony Elements... Who else do you plan to get upgraded ?
 
The 2nd Existential Seed said:
Let me get this straight: Seemingly the Equestrian Magic, since they started around the same relative power level and both grow at similar rates [if not the Pony Elements growing faster and longer] , they should be comparable (if not the Pony ones being stronger)... Is this your reasoning ?

If so, aside from the Pony Elements... Who else do you plan to get upgraded ?
Click to expand...
That and the fact that they've actively shown far more growth with their evolving with Treelight Sparkle being proof of it.

For now? Anyone who reliably scales to the Elements. Outside of that? I'm involved on other threads that could upgrade them, but I'm waiting for the right moment to respond to the comments. The thread is, well, lets just call it "frustrating" and leave it at that. I need time to form a proper response.
 
It's the visage of Twilight the Tree of Harmony takes on while talking to the Young 6. (I personally like Spirit of Harmony better, fits with how we already have a Spirit of Chaos)
 
I see. That's interesting to say the very least. Okay then, time to make some blogs alongside these for who I believe could scale to this with Light's explanation.
 
I mentioned this to the Admins when they accpeted it, but I'll go ahead and lay it all out in quite a bit of detail :

  • The feat is capable of "almost" destroying two realities casually, and Daydream effortlessly reversed it. Hence those who scale to Daydream and Midnight are into 2-C decently. Almost, due to it being extremely close to baseline 2-C, would make the feat 90% of 2-C, or closer to an Unknown degree.
  • Due to how casual the feat was, it was accepted as a 2-C feat due to the gap between the feat and 2-C is so ridiculously small [1/10 left to reach 2-C] that any effort of it being casual would result in a bump up to the next tier. Similar to how Whis is 2-C via scaling above Beerus, whose feat is actually far weaker than what Midnight / Daydream Shimmer did while effortless, while it was clear Beerus and Champa were borderline at full power when they accomplished a 1/2 of 2-C feat.
  • It's also due to how we treat casual feats such as Celestia, if we treat the same principle it would result in it being up to 2-3x 90% of 2-C, making the feat 2x above baseline 2-C
  • Due to the Dazzlings together being shown to be comparable to the combined power of the same Elements that created Daydream Shimmer, that makes her almost 2-C, but not actually there, hence "At least Low 2-C", and separately they'd be Low 2-C's of ridiculous power, but not at 2-C ... but extremely close. The Pony-Ups gain Low 2-C via being the power used to transform into Daydream and Midnight, but aren't at 2-C.
  • Sci-Twi was shown as needing Midnight to defeat Gloriossa, as she stated very explicitly she needed it's power but didn't want to in order to release her. This, in combination of being shown above their combiend power, is what makes Gloriossa 2-C.
  • After Sci-Twi surpassing Gloriossa merely by awakening her full capabilities, she and the others gained the Geodes. Due to surpassing Gloriossa's barrier which was stated to have taken Sci-Twi previously using Midnight to accomplish due to each permanently breaching it when using Midnight's power only somewhat affected the Vine Dome, it is what would make each of the Geodes separately 2-C... Much less Sci-Twi who has her OP Pony-Up form untop of Geode Form. So she would factually be the strongest of the Equestria Girls
So basically the hierarchy of Equestria Girls would kind of be lke this (First is Weakest, Last is Strongest):

  • Equestria Girls Rainbow Rock Pony Up / Powered Up Dazzlings: At least Low 2-C
  • Rainbow Rock Power of Friendship : At least Low 2-C, possibly 2-C (Oneshotting those borderline at 2-C would possibly result in this power being 2-C)
  • Daydream Shimmer: 2-C
  • Midnight Sparkle / Base Sci-Twi with access to Midnight Sparkle's powers: 2-C
  • Gloriossa: 2-C (She is at the same level as Midnight Sparkle roughly)
  • Everfree Pony-Up Sci-Twi / Geodes Main Six: 2-C
  • Post-Everfree Geodes Sci-Twi: 2-C
 
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