My Hero Academia - Scaling Revisions [Student Edition]

[Metalballrun]

We're no longer including his base physicals in his AP, right? Only his explosions?
8-B seems reasonable enough for War Arc Bakugo until he gets a calc or better feats.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Midoriya throughout the entire fight never generated that much air pressure or creates shockwaves like that, otherwise, he'd be generating shockwaves and breaking through ice easily. He would force Todoroki on the defensive early on. Not only that, why wouldn't he use One for All? The most logical conclusion we can make here based on consistency and common sense is that he's using it at its 5% output.

Understandable. Though he headbutted him too and he didn't use OFA there, so he does show that he's willing to not use OFA to attack. Also the air pressure of OFA was only shown to break Torodorki's ice at 100%, even at 5% Izuku can't destroy his ice with wind pressure. He never destroyed his ice with 5% at all.

Wouldn't it have been fixed in the volume release then, if he was suppose to be using OFA in this scene?

Removing Base Izuku wouldn't affect anyone if he's going to be Unknown, though I'm neutral on doing that.

Edit: I know the anime is filler/non canon, but the anime has scenes of him punching at Todoroki without OFA, though he missed all of them.

 

[TheRustyOne]

I agree with the Bakugo downgrades as well, I have a feeling he does scale to 30%, but the current evidence being used isn't clear enough. Also his physical AP should still be there, since it's difference from his explosions and has a rating.

His scaling will probably be more clear in the future, so At least High 8-C is fine by me. (Considering the upscaling revisions)

 

[Gitagon]

Can Tamaki's speed even be calced accurately.It depends on what he ate for breakfast. I think even his AP and durability would all be varied based on the occassion.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Tamaki's reaction haven't been something we've seen can change, but his physical abilities probably change. However he usually eats the same stuff in ordered to be prepared, what he showed off during the raid should be considered standard for him. I don't believe his base should have a rating.

 

[Axxtentacle]

Shouldn't his tier just be Varies (Heavily depends on what he consumes)? The wording is iffy but you get the idea.

 

[Earthyboy]

Understandable. Though he headbutted him too and he didn't use OFA there, so he does show that he's willing to not use OFA to attack. Also the air pressure of OFA was only shown to break Torodorki's ice at 100%, even at 5% Izuku can't destroy his ice with wind pressure. He never destroyed his ice with 5% at all.

What would air pressure being effective on ice change though? The reason Midoriya and the One for All users produce air pressure and shockwaves with their attacks is because of how their fists part the air particles around them via force. Endeavor even points this out by saying Midoriya's Finger Smashes are done through pure force.

If Base Midoriya isn't even capable of producing shock waves, or even the air pressure, that implies that there's a huge power gap between 5% of One for All and his base.

 

[Metalballrun]

Tamaki's feats during the Overhaul Raid was probably his regular arsenal, as he stated that those are the foods he usually consume (Takoyaki, chicken, etc).
During the War Arc he was using fruits and he also ate a horse, at that form it could be safe to assume his travel speed is Superhuman at least.

 

[TheRustyOne]

5% never produces any type of real air pressure, only at 15% or higher can air pressure be used as stated by All Might. What you call air pressure is just visual effect to look cool, since Izuku's punches on Stain doesn't produce any air pressure. Unless 5% suddenly gets weaker during the Stain Arc, and future arcs as well?

Finger Smashes are 100%, which has nothing to do with Base Izuku and 5%. 5% never produces any type of wind, the best we got from 5% is a filler scene in the anime were the air pressure knocks some cans over. Unless 5% does something with air pressure beyond looking cool, it's not an argument against anything.

With that argument, someone like Mirio or anyone who doesn't produce air pressure like that has to be weaker than 5%.

I've proven that Izuku has attack Todoroki without OFA (The headbutt), so his punch not having OFA on it is possible. As there's no visual effect on his arm, it's clear this punch is in his normal state. His headbutt and punch were able to send Todoroki flying back, though the punch sends him flying farther.

Your other argument against it was that if he was comparable to 5% he could break through Todoroki's ice easily, which is baseless. 5% Izuku never punches through the ice so you can't use that as a counter point. The only time he breaks his ice "easily" is with a 100% Finger Smash.

 

[Insert_creative_name_here_12]

5% never produces any type of real air pressure, only at 15% or higher can air pressure be used as stated by All Might. What you call air pressure is just visual effect to look cool, since Izuku's punches on Stain doesn't produce any air pressure. Unless 5% suddenly gets weaker during the Stain Arc, and future arcs as well?

Finger Smashes are 100%, which has nothing to do with Base Izuku and 5%. 5% never produces any type of wind, the best we got from 5% is a filler scene in the anime were the air pressure knocks some cans over. Unless 5% does something with air pressure beyond looking cool, it's not an argument against anything.

With that argument, someone like Mirio or anyone who doesn't produce air pressure like that has to be weaker than 5%.

I've proven that Izuku has attack Todoroki without OFA (The headbutt), so his punch not having OFA on it is possible. As there's no visual effect on his arm, it's clear this punch is in his normal state. His headbutt and punch were able to send Todoroki flying back, though the punch sends him flying farther.

Your other argument against it was that if he was comparable to 5% he could break through Todoroki's ice easily, which is baseless. 5% Izuku never punches through the ice so you can't use that as a counter point. The only time he breaks his ice "easily" is with a 100% Finger Smash.

5% does make air pressure as he moves Todoroki's arm by swiping his past it. He also made a small amoun that shook Gran Torino's ceiling light in their first fight. So yes 5% makes air pressure but it is minor and at best can be used to influence the movements of those weaker than yourself on a small scale.

Mirio would technically be weaker than 5% since Nighteye and the other heroes were relying on Deku and Kirishima to break down the walls which 5% can do with it's attacks if we consider 8% a small buff to it. Plus

Midioriya's headbutt made Todoroki stumble back a couple meters and he wasn't even visibly harmed and made no signs of discomfort besides what was already affecting him (the ice and Midoriya's words). Compare this to the OFA punch which lifted him off his feet, seemingly slammed him through some ice (we see multiple shards around him as he's sent flying and falls) and had him on the opposite end of the ring.

It makes no sense for base Midoriya to make that much wind and lift Todoroki that high with a punch (plus Horikoshi wasn't consistent with OFA at the time as Deku loses the visual effect when he moves Todoroki's arm, when he's wall jumping to Stain and vs Bakugo even though in all these scenarios we know he's using OFA). Your argument that it's meant to look cool makes no sense as Horikoshi doesn't do that with 5% in any fight I know of but generating some wind is consistent in the SF.

You're implying Todoroki's ice is harder than steel with no backing.

Also there's still the other points I brought up like base Deku can't track GT but 5% can keep up fine and even catch him by surprise. base is blitzed by Recipro but 5% is comparable to it. Base Deku screams from Bakugo's explosions while 5% shrugs them off and takes bigger blasts. Base Deku can only break a one point bot with momentum and a weapon while 5% is comparable to Iida who can oneshot them. I could probably find more examples but my point is made.

 

[TheRustyOne]

You know something funny, I never stated I believe in High 8-C Base Izuku. In fact I was stating I was fine with Unknown or removing the key in my first comment about this, why would I be saying that if I was arguing Base Izuku would downscale? I wasn't bringing this up in order to keep BoS Base Izuku at High 8-C, that's honestly wank.

I was bringing it up to see to see what people thought about an obvious mistake. But the response I got annoyed me beyond belief that I had to respond against it, which I now is a rather stupid on my part. I apologize for that. Realizing I'm clogging up this thread I'll make my stance clear this time, I'm fine with either Unknown or removing his base key. I do not believe Izuku's Base scales in anyway to his 5%.

However I do disagree with downgrading Mirio, we usually put scaling over something like this.

 

[Earthyboy]

5% never produces any type of real air pressure, only at 15% or higher can air pressure be used as stated by All Might. What you call air pressure is just visual effect to look cool, since Izuku's punches on Stain doesn't produce any air pressure. Unless 5% suddenly gets weaker during the Stain Arc, and future arcs as well?

I'm sorry, pardon? If that's the case, then what is all of this wind?

And this.

And also this... (I believe this is even a shockwave.)

Hell, at one point the air pressure managed to affect an object.

None of these are "special effects." You can obviously see the air swirling around Midoriya and his opponents any time he lands a good solid hit at 5%. In order for you to say that this would be special effects, you'd have to provide evidence of such a thing being the case.

With that argument, someone like Mirio or anyone who doesn't produce air pressure like that has to be weaker than 5%.

Mirio is weaker than 5%. At least physically, because the only reason he ever damages Midoriya and the students is that he targetted a sensitive spot in their stomachs.

Your other argument against it was that if he was comparable to 5% he could break through Todoroki's ice easily, which is baseless. 5% Izuku never punches through the ice so you can't use that as a counter point. The only time he breaks his ice "easily" is with a 100% Finger Smash.

Really? Because I recall Bakugo being able to break through Todoroki's ice multiple times with his weakest explosions. It wouldn't be hard for 5% of Midoriya to break it Midoriya knows his own power, so why won't he take advantage of it when he has the chance?

You know something funny, I never stated I believe in High 8-C Base Izuku. In fact I was stating I was fine with Unknown or removing the key in my first comment about this, why would I be saying that if I was arguing Base Izuku would downscale? I wasn't bringing this up in order to keep BoS Base Izuku at High 8-C, that's honestly wank.

I was bringing it up to see to see what people thought about an obvious mistake. But the response I got annoyed me beyond belief that I had to respond against it, which I now is a rather stupid on my part. I apologize for that. Realizing I'm clogging up this thread I'll make my stance clear this time, I'm fine with either Unknown or removing his base key. I do not believe Izuku's Base scales in anyway to his 5%.

Ok, that's fine. But you can't just say random stuff and expect people to not disagree with it.

However I do disagree with downgrading Mirio, we usually put scaling over something like this.

Mirio will get his own CRT eventually, given how this is a far bigger topic than downgrading Midoriya's base form or the students in general. A lot of people already agree with that anyways.

You're implying Todoroki's ice is harder than steel with no backing.

This is a very good point as well because while Todoroki's ice is very durable? Considering that it's literally justice made from freshwater, (presumably), it's not harder than steel. Sure, in larger quantities it might be tougher and harder to break down, but that's like comparing 500 kilograms of ice, to 1 kilogram of steel. 500 kilograms of steel would have a far higher compressive or tensile strength than even 1000 kilograms of ice.

 

[TheRustyOne]

This is about the student scaling, Mirio is a student and isn't special or affects so many characters that he needs his own CRT.

I don't see the problem with discussing that here.

 

[Earthyboy]

This is about the student scaling, Mirio is a student and isn't special or affects so many characters that he needs his own CRT.

I don't see the problem with discussing that here.

Very well then.

My argument would be that there is no solid reasoning for him to scale above or be equal to 8% Midoriya. The only reason he damages Midoriya and the students is that he targeted their weak points and hit their solar plexus, and it is debatable whether he scales to 8% Midoriya, to begin with. Hitting the solar plexus is one of the easiest ways to knock someone act according to this article.

 

[Metalballrun]

5% doesn't always make shockwaves, doesn't it? Neither does 8%. Just because Mirio and whomever doesn't make any shockwaves or air pressure, doesn't mean they're weaker than Deku at these states.

I agree that Mirio isn't stronger than 8% Deku but him knocking them out via hits in the solar plexus doesn't mean he is much weaker than them, he'd still require enough force to somehow get past through the durability of that part of Deku's body. I don't think he'll manage to pull off what he did if he was 9-A for example.

I'd note that changes in Mirio's profile would affect Chisaki's as well as the latter's justifications rely on Mirio.

 

[Gitagon]

I don't know about Mirio. To me he's clearly weaker than even 5% when he starts out but I think he can amp his striking power to way beyond 5% or 8% when he uses Phantom Menace.

And we can see that while he can't hurt High-ends in the war arc, he can knock them back when he uses a Phantom Menace to accelerate.

As for Mirio creating shockwaves with his strikes, again I've only seen this point once in the war arc during that group panel where everyone is fighting the High-ends.

I think people overestimate the degree of strength at which people without a strength quirk can reach. Without a significant technique (like Endeavor's flame enhanced punches or I'm Mirio's case, acceleration to increase striking power), they don't come close to people with actual strength quirks.

 

[DemonGodMitchAubin]

On one hand, I get why people have an issue with Base Deku being so strong, but on another hand, the logic that OFA makes him thousands of times stronger with only 5% when that is explicitly said to be a small increase is wrong to me

This is Manga/Anime, where teenagers are unrealistic superhumans that can survive explosions to the face, so I’m fine with Base Deku being that strong

 

[TheRustyOne]

I agree that Mirio shouldn't be superior to 8% Izuku, but I don't believe he should downscale from him. Even a 8-C+ with a Solar Plexus hit, shouldn't put Izuku down, especially considering his high pain tolerance. Mirio should at least be High 8-C based off that, but if this was the end than I could understand downscaling him... but.

Another point is Chisaki being able to take a hit from 8% Izuku, and Mirio can hurt Chisaki. Unless Izuku held back against Chisaki, he gave him a direct hit to his upper arm which isn't a weak point on the body (To my knowledge). Mirio himself can injure Chisaki and injure his arm in a similar way to 8% Izuku.

So I believe his profile is currently fine, Chisaki's should be changed however.

BoS Base Izuku, I'm against being something like 9-B. I'd prefer Unknown since it seems like the safer of the options.

Not saying anything, but this is the statement about 5%. "Given the level my body's at, even when I control it... It only gives a small increase in power." Edit: Might check the translation on this, a fan translation doesn't even say anything about a small increase. Just that he has a difficult time keeping his power output down to a proper level.

 

[Damage3245]

On one hand, I get why people have an issue with Base Deku being so strong, but on another hand, the logic that OFA makes him thousands of times stronger with only 5% when that is explicitly said to be a small increase is wrong to me

It could only mean it is a small increase relative to the much higher increases he's had before, like 100%.

 

[Earthyboy]

Not saying anything, but this is the statement about 5%. "Given the level my body's at, even when I control it... It only gives a small increase in power." Edit: Might check the translation on this, a fan translation doesn't even say anything about a small increase. Just that he has a difficult time keeping his power output down to a proper level.

If you have a source for RAW scans, it might be a good idea to link them. Since sometimes the translators always misinterpret ate that for the VIZ releases. Actually? It might be a good idea in general to check other fan translations.

 

[Earthyboy]

Never mind, I have found a site with a few RAWS.

 

[TheRustyOne]

I don't think we should be linking the raw manga, just as we shouldn't link to other illegal sites. I already have a place to get the raws anyway, so it's not needed.

 

[Insert_creative_name_here_12]

5% doesn't always make shockwaves, doesn't it? Neither does 8%. Just because Mirio and whomever doesn't make any shockwaves or air pressure, doesn't mean they're weaker than Deku at these states.

I agree that Mirio isn't stronger than 8% Deku but him knocking them out via hits in the solar plexus doesn't mean he is much weaker than them, he'd still require enough force to somehow get past through the durability of that part of Deku's body. I don't think he'll manage to pull off what he did if he was 9-A for example.

I'd note that changes in Mirio's profile would affect Chisaki's as well as the latter's justifications rely on Mirio.

Mirio actually never knocked Deku out he just stunned him

 

[TheRustyOne]

So we got another translation for the line.

"Even if I can succeed with my body as it is right now, I'll only be able to increase my power by a little bit."

This is very clearly stating the increase in power is a little.

 

[Damage3245]

So we got another translation for the line.

"Even if I can succeed with my body as it is right now, I'll only be able to increase my power by a little bit."

This is very clearly stating the increase in power is a little.

How strong was his 5% during the Sports Festival?

 

[TheRustyOne]

Should be around the strength as in the movie, since in the training camp (Which is after the movie) it was stated they haven't increased the strength of their Quirks. 5% did injure Gran Torino with a grazed attack, who can knock out Magne in one hit. Who scales to Tiger, who scales to 5% in the training camp.

If there is a difference, it's not very significant.

At the least he can't be 9-B or even 9-A. I'm still a little iffy on High 8-C, though maybe I'm just biased. But I'd prefer either Unknown or 8-C, but that's my opinion.

Edit: He also can injure Todoroki, who survived Bakugo's Howitzer Impact, which should be this strong. Todoroki did quickly make an ice shield, but I doubt a quickly made ice shield would've lowered the power to be below High 8-C.

 

[Earthyboy]

At the least he can't be 9-B or even 9-A. I'm still a little iffy on High 8-C, though maybe I'm just biased. But I'd prefer either Unknown or 8-C, but that's my opinion.

It can't be 8-C because that's just downscaling slightly from 5%. It's already been established that the difference between his base and 5% is absolutely massive. His base can't jump several meters, it can't react to Gran Torion's movements, he screams when hit with a minor explosion while 5% shrugs them off and even takes explosions sometimes hundreds of times bigger.

There are also these anti-feats that have been brought up many times.

• He needs to use a piece of metal and his own momentum to harm a robot that's only made out of steel (presumably.) If he downscaled from 5%, he'd at least be able to stun it a little bit.
• He got damaged over Shinsou punching him, and Shinsou didn't even have a chance at beating the Entrance Exams, like Midoriya. Which implies he wouldn't have a way of beating the robots.
• He has a grip strength of 55 kilos, which honestly isn't that impressive at all.

Do I honestly need to bring the guides into this? To start with, what even are the reasons that suggest that he should remain 8-C?

 

[TheRustyOne]

I'm not going to argue for anything other than Unknown, I'm simply stating the facts (Izuku stating his increase is small, which fits with him headbutting and possibly punching Todoroki in base) and my own personal beliefs. And guess what, your not going to change my mind on it so please do not waste your time.

It's just a personal belief, so you don't need to argue about it.

The guides are not and will not be accepted by this wiki, they're not important.

 

[Earthyboy]

The guides are not and will not be accepted by this wiki, they're not important.

Says who? It's been established in the main thread that the guides aren't all faulty and mainly depends on what context they're referring to.

 

[TheRustyOne]

No it's not, we do not accept the guides.

We never agreed on using them, they have far too many inconsistencies.

Unless Endeavor (A+) is actually faster than Hood (A)?

Edit: Izuku (A+) and Bakugo (A) being superior to Geten and Dabi (Both are B). This makes them 8-A, and it can't be talking about Geten and Dabi's physical strength. Unless were saying they're physically superior to Mirio, who is rated as a C. Can't be talking about Izuku's 100%, since that means Machia (S) is superior to 100% of OFA. Along with Endeavor, who is rating is S+. Which makes him stronger than Machia actually.

 

[Earthyboy]

No it's not, we do not accept the guides.

We never agreed on using them, they have far too many inconsistencies.

Unless Endeavor (A+) is actually faster than Hood (A)?

Edit: Izuku (A+) and Bakugo (A) being superior to Geten and Dabi (Both are B). This makes them 8-A, and it can't be talking about Geten and Dabi's physical strength. Unless were saying they're physically superior to Mirio, who is rated as a C. Can't be talking about Izuku's 100%, since that means Machia (S) is superior to 100% of OFA. Along with Endeavor, who is rating is S+. Which makes him stronger than Machia actually.

There's an easy explanation as to why Get and Dabi are both a B. Their quirks aren't reliant on physical strength but rather temperature. And as we know, power doesn't always equate to strength. Just looking at the definition. Looking at the Meriam webster, it has many definitions other than just brute force.

There are even many times where power is referenced for something other than brute strength in the series. Todoroki is an example. He stands no chance against the pure brute force of 100% Midoriya, and yet he still has the potential to beat him given his reaction time, how intelligent he is when it comes to split-second decisions, and even how versatile and unique his quirk is. This is why he's considered to be extremely powerful.

Geten shouldn't even be 8-A because of this calculation. Because do you honestly think he used his quirk to somehow create an explosion that destroyed portions of a city block? Well, that's wrong because apparently, he used the water in the city pipes to create ice and ended up taking down the entire town with it. Implying that he used the ice to rupture the grounds of the city. This disproves the fact that it's a shockwave and just shows how versatile Geten's quirk is. It isn't powerful on it's but the way he utilizes it makes him a force to be reckoned with. This kind of backs up what I've been saying.

Dabi's calculation is fine, but as I've said, it doesn't rely on physical force to deal out damage, it relies on the kinetic energy between the atoms which generates friction due to heat. This is how heat works. Basic physics. I'm not saying he isn't 8-A, but this is why Attack Potency doesn't just include physical strength.

• And just to note, I'm not saying that characters who withstand Dabi's fire at full power aren't 8-A, I'm just saying that the reason he's powerful is because of how his quirk functions off of heat energy, not off physical force.

And are we gonna pretend that the guide isn't consistent and concise with the majority of its characters? All Might is an S+, which makes sense given how he was one of, if not the strongest character in the series. Gran Torino is an S in speed, which is accurate considering how fast he's portrayed in the series. Stain is an S in speed for a good ******* reason considering how he managed to block Iida's Recipro Burst and take on 5% Midoriya so easily. Iida in the second guide book is an S in speed for being faster than Gran Torino who's an S in speed. You can't tell me that all of these statistics don't resemble an ounce of the consistency we retain for MHA on this wiki. Even factoring in Uraraka and her statistics for power, it's obvious that she's powerful for other reasons then physical power.

And a question I have:

• Why would you assume the entirety of the guides are wrong because of a few ratings you disagree with? You're assuming the entirety of the guides, which are hundreds upon hundreds of pages of material are wrong simply because one or five pages are inaccurate. That's not only an Association Fallacy, it's a certified bruh moment.

To put this into perspective, is it wrong to use Wikipedia for information just because some of its info is incorrect? Or do we say an entire series of books with everyone who has superpowers "dubbed" quirks is bad just because it has a few bad chapters and plot lines?

Whatever the reason for this irrational logic, I don't think I need to break down your argument any more than I already have at this point.

 

[TheRustyOne]

There's no reason to argue with someone like you, it'd just give me a headache.

The guide books will not be accepted, there are far more wrong with then what I mention.

If a good chunk is wrong then we drop everything, we don't cherry pick what does and doesn't fit. Getting some things right doesn't matter, also AP does not always equal temperature. Geten's 8-A calc is accepted for the shockwave he created, which can be treated as an explosion. Just like Re-Destro shockwaves or anyone else.

You clearly can't argue against the inconsistences, especially considering how you ignored the actual problem.

 

[Earthyboy]

If a good chunk is wrong then we drop everything, we don't cherry pick what does and doesn't fit. Getting some things right doesn't matter, also AP does not always equal temperature.

A good chunk? The first guidebook is almost 160 pages. Even if we high ball and say that there are only five pages of misinformation for the characters, a good 97 percent of the book would still be accurate with only 3.125 percent being misinformed. If a good chunk of the book is wrong, then I'd like you to prove so. Unless you'd be willing to not provide proof here, which falls under the burden of proof.

Geten's 8-A calc is accepted for the shockwave he created, which can be treated as an explosion. Just like Re-Destro shockwaves or anyone else.

Even if it was a shockwave, it wasn't the factor that destroyed several city blocks. That was the ice that ruptured the town. So the only thing we're left with here is you assuming the shock wave is within the 20 PSI air blast range for no reason. If it truly was within that range, the buildings would receive far greater damage than just being uprooted.

You clearly can't argue against the inconsistences, especially considering how you ignored the actual problem.

I'm sorry, I don't follow? What problem did I actually ignore? You never even made an attempt to actually prove what you're saying and you're just stating claims without any proof.

The guide books will not be accepted, there are far more wrong with then what I mention.

Ok, then actually prove so. If you can't back up your claims I'm in the rightful position to ignore them completely. It's called the Burden of proof. Ignoring you, how can you possibly ignore the fact that I've literally just listed several instances of the guidebook being consistent with canon?

 

[TheRustyOne]

How do people feel about using the Guidebooks? We would be able to find a lot of characters rating by using them, does anyone else agree with using them? I'm going to list some things about the Guidebooks, I promise to be more open to any arguments.

Gran Torino's power is 2 (D), weaker than Aizawa who is 3 (C). Yet can knock out Magne, who is 4 (B) in one hit. Also Tiger is 5 (A), which makes him stronger than Magne who rather evenly with him. So the difference between D and A must not be very big if Gran Torino can hurt Magne.

This means Aizawa would be High 8-C than, since he's stronger than Gran Torino. Also 2 (D+) to 4 (B-) are all High 8-C in this case. (Unless their Quirk is unconventional)

Nejire is 5 (A) in power, which means Izuku who is A+ is stronger than her. Once again having them scale to a 8-A. Considering Izuku rarely uses 20%, it'd be strange for this to be his 20% rating. And we know it's not his 100%, as Muscular is rated as S. But for the sake of argument, let's say this means 20% is 8-A.

Mirio is labeled as A+ in terms of speed, which means he's faster than Hood (A). Also Endeavor (A+), Hawks (S), and Mirko (A+) are faster than Hood as well.

What about characters who share the same rating, like Tiger being A along with Nejire, Ryukyu, Kendo, and Rappa being A as well. Do they scale to each other?

Just to note: But Gang Orca is labeled as 4 (B) in power, yet he can content with 5% Izuku while weakened. Note\ an inconsistency, just wanted to point this out. But this does mean 5% strength would be around a 4 (B) at best. It cannot be higher than that, though it could be lower. This also puts 5%'s speed around 3 (C), which is what speed Gang Orca has.

So 5% is at most Power: 4 (B) and Speed: 3 (C). This makes Mirio, who is 3 (C), weaker than 5%. Stain has 4 (B) strength, which is actually consistent with 5% rating. And his speed A, which makes him faster than 5%.

Shigaraki went from a A to B- in terms of speed, which contradicts him getting faster in the MVA arc. Stain's speed went from a S to an A, so apparently he's also gotten slower. Muscular was originally 5 (A), but was changed to a S, so he got stronger in prison?

Okay I get it, for the inconsistency between books you can say the first one was more rough. The second book gives there correct stats, which is fair enough, so ignore those points and keep going with some other.

Sir Nighteye is given a 3 (C) rating in speed, despite being able to dodge Rappa's punches (Without using foresight), who has a speed of 5 (A). Twice's clones are only less durable, so the Rappa clone has no reason to be slower. Especially not going down from A to a C. Also Nighteye could keep up with 8% Izuku, though he was using foresight there. He's still comparable to him in speed, as Izuku cannot blitz him or is even close to.

Sato is labeled as A+, which makes him superior to Nejire and Ryukyu. So 8-A Sugarman and 8-B Base as well, due to the multiplier of his Quirk.

Monama rating is for his physical strength most likely, which is 1 (E). The problem here is that Monama's AP is going to be At least 8-C, possibly High 8-C based on what I said above. Does that mean everyone who is higher than E, such as D will be Tier 8?

 

[Gitagon]

I'll just mention the reasons that the characters got lower ratings like Shigaraki and Stain in speed is because in the first Data Book, they were near the top in speed while by the 2nd, their speed wouldn't really rank them within the top of the verse considering they have no quirks to boost actual speed. They're are still within MHA peak human speed limits while people with speed quirks, power quirks, propulsion quirks and techniques can surpass that.

Nighteye - same thing as Overhaul. These 2 CANNOT surpass MHA peak human speeds because their physical bodies are NOT superhuman by MHA world standards. They're superhuman to us in the real world but Nighteye, Aizawa, Stain, and pre-modification Shigaraki even Toga & Ochako are peak humans in MHA world, not superhumans in physicality. Nighteye dodges things easily because even with his quirk not activated, he's still a master at prediction and that's what he taught Mirio.

Neither Nighteye nor Mirio without permeation can even replicate how 5% Izuku moved off pure speed when he ran towards Stain the same way Stain himself can't do the same despite jumping around.

As for Monoma, what's the point on even scaling him? His strength directly depends on which quirks he copies. Monoma with Explosion or Hell flame or even Half-hot half-cold would obviously be stronger than him with Froppy's quirk. So far the strongest quirks he's copied is Explosion, Hardening & Twin Impact.

For the speed issue, no matter the reaction speeds, whether through reflexes or prediction, it is necessary to understand that you cannot have superhuman movement speed past a given human barrier per MHA standards without a speed quirk, strength quirk or a specific movement technique.

Guys like Endeavor and Mirio achieve superhuman speeds via specific techniques they created. Their base bodies with quirks inactive cannot literally outrun 5% Deku. Same for characters like Bakugo or Shoto. Their speed comes from their propulsion techniques not base running.

I will say it but Mirio is weaker than 5%. The only time Mirio can strike harder than 5% or 8% for that matter is with significant propulsion, converting speed and thrust he gets from being shot out of the ground, into striking power.

Strength-wise, l scale guys like base Mirio (quirkless), Overhaul (CQC, no spikes), Stain, Shigaraki (pre-operation in CQC), Nighteye, Knuckleduster and Eraserhead around the same level. Without their quirks active, they are the MHA version of peak humans like Batman or Captain America. They have excellent reaction speeds, predictive capabilities etc so they seem superhuman.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Endeavor is a normal human as well, his Quirk just lets him shoot fire, yet he's far more durable and faster than 5% Izuku and even Ryukyu. His reaction time wouldn't increase in this case, only his travel speed can be increased by his flames. But he has far superior reaction. Stain himself could easily keep up with 5% Izuku and took little damage from a direct hit. And was able to keep going after getting hit by punch that was stronger than 5%.

Tiger has no strength Quirk yet is rated as stronger than Gang Orca, who is stronger than 5% Izuku. Vlad King and Aizawa are both rated as being faster than Gang Orca, who can block a surprise attack from 5%. Nighteye broke Fused Chisaki's arm, who's more durable than his base form, who can take a punch from 8% Izuku. You need to prove your claims, you aren't providing proof your just stating your opinion.

Toga was outpacing 5% Izuku as well, and is rated as a 4 (B-), which is faster than Gang Orca.

Mirio was able to heavily damage Chisaki, who can take a direct punch from 8% Izuku, without using any propulsion. You need to provide in universe proof that shows Mirio is weaker than 5% Izuku without using his Quirk. This is a fiction verse, the characters are as strong as Horikoshi writes them to be. Also Bakugo can injure and take hits from 5% Izuku without using his Quirk.

Monoma being Tier 8 is because of Twin Impact, which causes a second hit that is several times more powerful than the first. Monoma grazed Izuku, and later activated Twin Impact which caused 8% Izuku to bleed, unless Twin Impact became stronger when Monoma copied it. Then his base strength is High 8-C at most, at least 8-C.

Several means more than two, but not many. Several has to be less than a dozen, which is 12 so...

8.12/3 = 2.7 Tons Highest rating

8.12/11 = 0.73 Tons Lowest Rating.

 

[Gitagon]

I don't know about Endeavor's durability (he's definitely an outlier in this aspect cause even Todoroki and Dabi who have the same quirk aren't as durable) but his reaction time is not strange by MHA standards. As I said with guys like Mirio, Nighteye, Stain or Overhaul, peak human characters can possess top tier reaction speeds via experience, prediction and reflexes. We already saw this with Overhaul vs Rappa, Overhaul doesn't need to dodge every punch like O'clock/KD did, but if he can anticipate them, he can find an opening and end Rappa. Mirio and Nighteye can be scaled to him too, it doesn't mean that all these guys can somehow punch as fast as Rappa who has a literal shoulder mutation for this.


As for movement speed, we know Endeavor uses Flashfire to boost his running speed and now his flight has become even more polished. That's what I was talking about when I mentioned speed techniques. Bakugo's explosion enhanced speed and Mirio's speed via Phantom Menace fall in this category. They don't have speed quirks or strength quirks but created techniques to boost their movement speed.

Also by the war arc, all top tiers are in the same speed range in terms of reactions even if their movement speed varies widely. Unlike let's say season 1 or season 2 where USJ Nomu, All Might and sometimes Gran Torino were FTE to Deku and Bakugo. USJ Nomu outright statued Bakugo, Deku, Shoto and Kirishima. But now in the war arc, Bakugo can perceive Shigaraki and even react somewhat though he's still slower, + he can keep up in combat with multiple High-ends. That's a combo of movement speed + reactions/perception so clearly ones perception can be improved.

 

[TheRustyOne]

Is there a scene that shows your point? I mean, we don't scale anyone to movement speed anyway, it's all reaction time. You said Endeavor's running speed is slower than 5%, can you show me where that's shown? Aizawa was shown to be able to match 8%'s speed when they were going after Chisaki.

Did Izuku decided he wanted to go slower? Do you have any in universe proof to back up your claims?

 

[Earthyboy]

Gran Torino's power is 2 (D), weaker than Aizawa who is 3 (C). Yet can knock out Magne, who is 4 (B) in one hit. Also Tiger is 5 (A), which makes him stronger than Magne who rather evenly with him. So the difference between D and A must not be very big if Gran Torino can hurt Magne.

There's already an inconsistency and a half in canon regarding scaling for Gran Torino. He gets damaged by hits from 5% Midoriya, yet he knocks out Magne, someone who contends with Tiger who should be comparable to 5% Midoriya.

Sato is labeled as A+, which makes him superior to Nejire and Ryukyu. So 8-A Sugarman and 8-B Base as well, due to the multiplier of his Quirk.

That's an outlier as well, but it would invalidate the entire guide.

Mirio is labeled as A+ in terms of speed, which means he's faster than Hood (A). Also Endeavor (A+), Hawks (S), and Mirko (A+) are faster than Hood as well.

Mirio blitzed the entirety of Class 1-A in seconds and managed to clap someone who easily took down someone who scales to someone who has the potential to dodge gunfire. It would be strange if he wasn't an A+ in speed. He literally ***** on people who are high-tiers in terms of speed.

Just to note: But Gang Orca is labeled as 4 (B) in power, yet he can content with 5% Izuku while weakened. Note\ an inconsistency, just wanted to point this out. But this does mean 5% strength would be around a 4 (B) at best. It cannot be higher than that, though it could be lower. This also puts 5%'s speed around 3 (C), which is what speed Gang Orca has.

Ok, I'll be willing to admit that's an inconsistency.

Monama rating is for his physical strength most likely, which is 1 (E). The problem here is that Monama's AP is going to be At least 8-C, possibly High 8-C based on what I said above. Does that mean everyone who is higher than E, such as D will be Tier 8?

Monoma got manhandled and restrained by Uraraka. It's not hard to imagine him being an E in power. Unless your saying Uraraka is only a few times weaker then Midoriya, I don't see how you'd argue that.

Nejire is 5 (A) in power, which means Izuku who is A+ is stronger than her. Once again having them scale to a 8-A. Considering Izuku rarely uses 20%, it'd be strange for this to be his 20% rating. And we know it's not his 100%, as Muscular is rated as S. But for the sake of argument, let's say this means 20% is 8-A.

There's like one feat that determines how powerful 20% exactly is, and that calculation which calculates feat is incorrect. You can't even say this would be an outlier for 20% Midoriya.

Shigaraki went from a A to B- in terms of speed, which contradicts him getting faster in the MVA arc. Stain's speed went from a S to an A, so apparently he's also gotten slower. Muscular was originally 5 (A), but was changed to a S, so he got stronger in prison?

You do realize that the old guide is considered outdated in some areas, right? Which is why they've updated the rankings. Even All Might has a rating in Ultra Anaylsis, which suggests that it's likely a rendition of the old guide.

Sir Nighteye is given a 3 (C) rating in speed, despite being able to dodge Rappa's punches (Without using foresight), who has a speed of 5 (A). Twice's clones are only less durable, so the Rappa clone has no reason to be slower. Especially not going down from A to a C. Also Nighteye could keep up with 8% Izuku, though he was using foresight there. He's still comparable to him in speed, as Izuku cannot blitz him or is even close to.

Overhaul considered Night Eye to not be that fast, while he specifically pointed out how large Midoriya's power and speed is. Night Eye was unable to avoid multiple of Overhaul's spikes, while someone like Midoriya and Mirio was able to avoid dozens. Rappa's movements are extremely easy to predict, and predictability is something Night Eye exploits on a regular basis.

Tiger has no strength Quirk yet is rated as stronger than Gang Orca, who is stronger than 5% Izuku. Vlad King and Aizawa are both rated as being faster than Gang Orca, who can block a surprise attack from 5%. Nighteye broke Fused Chisaki's arm, who's more durable than his base form, who can take a punch from 8% Izuku. You need to prove your claims, you aren't providing proof your just stating your opinion.

Night Eye only broke Fused Chisaki's arm because he had a seal in hand. And the seal literally is able to move at Mach speeds. Not only that, it weighs approximately five kilograms and targets an extremely small surface area. It's essentially a bullet on steroids.

Mirio was able to heavily damage Chisaki, who can take a direct punch from 8% Izuku, without using any propulsion. You need to provide in universe proof that shows Mirio is weaker than 5% Izuku without using his Quirk. This is a fiction verse, the characters are as strong as Horikoshi writes them to be. Also Bakugo can injure and take hits from 5% Izuku without using his Quirk.

If you're trying to judge how strong Mirio is compared to Mdiroyia, Midoriya easily sent Chisaki flying several meters back with just a punch to the arm. Mirio delivered a punch to Chisaki's face (which caught him off guard) and it only sent him stumbling back slightly. Also, Chisaki could literally be weaker than both and he's just unlucky enough to get hit by both of them.

Monoma being Tier 8 is because of Twin Impact, which causes a second hit that is several times more powerful than the first. Monoma grazed Izuku, and later activated Twin Impact which caused 8% Izuku to bleed, unless Twin Impact became stronger when Monoma copied it. Then his base strength is High 8-C at most, at least 8-C.

It literally only broke his nose. It would only take a force of around seven pounds to break a normal person's nose. It's basically the weakest spot to hit in a fight. Not only that, the reason Midoriya was hit in the first place was that Monoma hit him with melt bolts using Reiko's telekinesis quirk when he wasn't using One for All. Monoma then proceeded to use Twin Impact.

• To note; the way Twin Impact works are that as long as the targets hit someone, they can strike them back eventually.

To summarize, Monoma used metal bolts and someone else's quirk to boost the AP of the attack and then tripled its AP when using it on Midoriya. Monoma wasn't even the one hitting Midoriya. He should definitely not scale.

But, I'll give the benefit of the doubt and assume that most of the profiles you talked about are outliers and inconsistent with canon. How would that invalidate the close to 50+ other profiles in the book? Especially when you consider that it has a lot of reliable and accurate information.

 

[TheRustyOne]

No Monoma physically hit Izuku, he was able to copy OFA because he made physical contact. If you make someone bleed from a punch you scale to them, have problem with that, change the wiki rules. Your nose thing means utterly nothing here and will not be regarded as being insufficient damage. Especially considering superhuman durability.

He hit Izuku, activated Twin Impact, which multiplied his strick by several times. So yes Monoma scales to At least 8-C, possibly High 8-C. The people above agreed with me as well. Actually Monoma jumps off the bolt he appeared on before hitting Izuku. I'm certain Monoma didn't even land a direct hit either, he only grazed his face. Since Izuku was surprised to see he copied OFA. Which further helps since a graze multiplied by several times can injure 8%.

Also the impact was on his cheek, not on his noise. Since his head went to the side, not backwards. It was just strong enough to make his noise bleed.

Sending someone flying back means nothing, case in point, Endeavor punches Shigaraki away and doesn't scale. Both of their attacks did visually similar damage to Chisaki's arm. If Chisaki was thousands of times weaker he'd be dead from the 8% punch. Mirio and 8% Izuku are comparable to each other.

Nighteye things is wrong as well, it only moves that fast because he's throwing it. They don't have little engines on them, and only weigh five kilograms. Their surface areas is far higher than a bullets, so that is false to. His seals appear bigger than a human knuckle. (Yes they'd hurt more than a punch, but not by a large amount)

Edit: I'd prefer if other people shared their own opinions, this back in fourth isn't going anywhere.
Also you still haven't brought up the 20% calc being wrong to Damage. Nothing is going to happen unless you talk to the calc group members.

Endeavor, Miriko, and Hawks are all faster than Hood. Despite the manga itself telling us the opposite?