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Unless my argument counters it, I still agree.So you still agree with low 5-b naruto sage mode and up?
Star Wars: episode 10 KingTempest strikes back!He strikes again
Reio. You’re really upping the stupidity each time.How is that actually base naruto if he's using the golden nine tails chakra?
Fair, but then again this is a Naruto thread.Aight chill out, let's not turn this into a shit show.
Okay don't insult someone like that, We were joking with KingTempest.Reio. You’re really upping the stupidity each time.
No, it was about Reio that always comes to Naruto threads to act like thatOkay don't insult someone like that, We were joking with KingTempest.
Ah okayNo, it was about Reio that always comes to Naruto threads to act like that
Ahhh so base naruto has golden chakra and not blue? Okay got uHe’s just using his chakra.
Yes, actually.Ahhh so base naruto has golden chakra and not blue? Okay got u
People usually be confused about this because they prolly only watched the anime that chakra is usually blue, but The Last movie used golden/yellow, which is the way that the manga treatsI completely missed that Valley of the End point.
So:
EDIT: I forgot to add in the Delta thing, but her rating comes from Six Paths Sage Mode Naruto, so eee...
- Briefly held his own against a Fused Momoshiki, which should put him above base Momoshiki, at the very least.
- Momoshiki also commented on how enormous his energy was when he was draining Naruto, but that could also be in reference to Kurama.
- Clashed with Rinnegan Sasuke, who is Moon level, at the Valley of the End.
- Engaged in an intense slugfest with Rinnegan Sasuke; albeit, while the two were heavily weakened.
Yes, actually.
He uses a golden Rasengan here, too. Even his Rasenshuriken was golden, just like in the manga.
One victory before another.maybe naruto does have reactive power level after all
Naruto at the end of the series is 5-C for equaling Sasuke in strength, who contributed half of the Chibaku Tensei and received half of Hagoromo's power.Base Naruto (Shippuden/Boruto) is 5-C for managing to keep up with Sasuke and Momoshiki fused. And in Sage Mode he is Low 5-B. And so Sasuke and Momoshiki scale to Low 5-B for being equivalent of Naruto Rikudō (who is much stronger than himself in Sage Mode). This basically makes:
Naruto Base = Sasuke/fused Momoshiki < Naruto Sage < Naruto Rikudō = Sasuke/fused Momoshiki...
With Six Paths Sage Mode, he would be well into Low 5-B, and the only person in the original series who scales to that is Sasuke's Susano'o.VotE Naruto = Sasuke
Sasuke then absorbed the Chakra from the Tailed Beasts and reached the level of Hagoromo, making him more powerful than Naruto. However, Naruto managed to reach his level of strength again by drawing in all of the available nature energy in the area.VotE Naruto = Sasuke < SoSP Naruto = Sasuke's Susano'o
Then, of course, a couple of years into the future, Naruto briefly battles with Fused Momoshiki but feels the need to use Six Paths Sage Mode against him, so he obviously does not scale to Fused Momoshiki completely. As the Hokage, Naruto had little wiggle room to train and such, but he know that he is, at least, no longer rusty like he was in Naruto Gaiden and obviously put some effort into upkeeping his strength over the years.VotE Naruto = Sasuke < SoSP Naruto = Sasuke's Susano'o < Sasuke's Indra Susano'o = SoSP Naruto w/massive nature energy amp
Sasuke had time to train and do battle between Naruto and Boruto, so he has obviously grown stronger over the years. He held his own against Fused Momshiki, but Naruto did most of the heavy lifting, especially in the anime, so he also does not fully scale to Momoshiki; however, he did perform better than base Naruto.VotE Naruto = VotE Sasuke ~< Adult Naruto < Fused Momoshiki < SoSP Naruto ~< SoSP Adult Naruto = Sasuke's Susano'o < Sasuke's Indra Susano'o = SoSP Naruto w/massive nature energy amp
VotE Naruto = VotE Sasuke ~< Adult Naruto ~< Adult Sasuke < Fused Momoshiki < SoSP Naruto ~< SoSP Adult Naruto = Sasuke's Susano'o < Sasuke's Indra Susano'o = SoSP Naruto w/massive nature energy amp
This is also a good point, although worded kinda funky.Doesn't Sage Mode Naruto body One Rinnegan Madara, the one that got bodied by Eight Gates Guy using Night Guy? Could that be used to justify his rating?
Why does only Sasuke scale? If you are proposing that Naruto Base is 5-C in the Shippuden, that would make it Low 5-B in Sage Mode. Not only Sasuke with Susanoo would scale, Madara Jinchuuriki would also scale (Directly blocked Naruto's attack with the Rikudō mode after duel with Guy). Kaguya would also scale (obvious reasons), and Guy would also scale (Burst the Madara who managed to block Naruto's attack in Rikudō Mode). This puts Madara Jinchuuriki 1 Rinnegan at Low 5-B, for being able to block an attack from Naruto Rikudō who is above himself in Sage Mode.With Six Paths Sage Mode, he would be well into Low 5-B, and the only person in the original series who scales to that is Sasuke's Susano'o.
Naruto used SPSM for that.but on top of that, in Sage Mode—a measly ten-times amp—he managed to nearly kill One Rinnegan Madara,
Where did he almost kill Madara with a mere Sage Mode? Naruto was using Rikudō + Kurama Chakra Mode. See his eyes again, he just wasn't wearing the "mantle" (so obviously he wasn't at his peack), but he still had a lot more power than a measly Sage Mode. He was in "KN0" + Rikudō Mode. Similar to the time he got like this in the fight with Nagato.Sage Mode—a measly ten-times amp—he managed to nearly kill One Rinnegan Madara,
It's just SPSM. Toad sage mode + kurama chakra has pigmentation around the eyes.Where did he almost kill Madara with a mere Sage Mode? Naruto was using Rikudō + Kurama Chakra Mode. See his eyes again, he just wasn't wearing the "mantle" (so obviously he wasn't at his peack), but he still had a lot more power than a measly Sage Mode. He was in "KN0" + Rikudō Mode. Similar to the time he got like this in the fight with Nagato.
He blocked a punch but was still almost overpowered; he was shweatin' and everything.Madara Jinchuuriki would also scale (Directly blocked Naruto's attack with the Rikudō mode after duel with Guy)
That Madara could not do anything against Naruto. He had to absorb the God Tree in order to increase his strength; however, how much power he gained from the God Tree is unknown. Still, One Rinnegan Madara has no reason to completely scale to Six Paths Sage Mode Naruto or Sasuke, especially considering he never managed to get any hits in on the two of them. The only feats he demonstrated in that fight was knocking Naruto away once and then having his Limbo take their Rasen-Chidori. Hell, even when he acquired both of the Rinnegan, he was still being upstaged by Naruto, who took on his Limbo clones, who are as powerful as he is, and destroyed his meteors without breaking a sweat, really.Guy would also scale (Burst the Madara who managed to block Naruto's attack in Rikudō Mode)
Naruto used SPSM for that.
You're right. My bad.Where did he almost kill Madara with a mere Sage Mode? Naruto was using Rikudō
Why is this argument?Wouldn't Rinnegan Sasuke (with or without Susanoo) as an adult also scale to Low 5-B since he's irrevocably equal to SPSM Naruto? If he was any weaker, he wouldn't be keeping up with Naruto against Momoshiki or Isshiki/Jigen.
Why are their avatars indicative of their own combat ability? The Susano'o is portrayed countless times as being superior to its user's own stats, and the Wiki accepts the Susano'o as such. Sasuke being able to generate a Susano'o that is comparable to Six Path Sage Mode Naruto's Kurama Avatar, which would literally just be his own power but in the form of a Tailed Beast, since Kurama Mode already allows him to utilize 100% of Kurama's power, does not mean that Sasuke is comparable to Six Paths Sage Mode Naruto.Especially considering how blatantly their avatars are portrayed very equally with each other in their VotE fight, and during the Isshiki fight.
The Databook differentiates the two, and says SPSM provides much more chakra than Kurama Mode. Naruto combines two powers, the SPSM and the Kurama Chakra.It's just SPSM. Toad sage mode + kurama chakra has pigmentation around the eyes.
Did you even read what I said? I mentioned that if Naruto is 5-C, he with a mere Sage Mode is already Low 5-B, and that would make Madara scale, as he blocked a direct attack from Naruto SPSM, which is much stronger than Naruto Sage Mode. This makes Madara 10x above Sasuke...That Madara could not do anything against Naruto. He had to absorb the God Tree in order to increase his strength; however, how much power he gained from the God Tree is unknown. Still, One Rinnegan Madara has no reason to completely scale to Six Paths Sage Mode Naruto or Sasuke, especially considering he never managed to get any hits in on the two of them. The only feats he demonstrated in that fight was knocking Naruto away once and then having his Limbo take their Rasen-Chidori. Hell, even when he acquired both of the Rinnegan, he was still being upstaged by Naruto, who took on his Limbo clones, who are as powerful as he is, and destroyed his meteors without breaking a sweat, really.
About this, in a translation I saw, it is said that limbos have ALMOST the same abilities as the original. It doesn't say they have the same attributes. We'll probably need to get the Japanese scan and ask for a translation here on the Wiki.Naruto, who took on his Limbo clones, who are as powerful as he is
You do not have to equals with somebody to battle an opponent alongside them. And even then, Sasuke's performance, both in the manga and the anime, paled in comparison to Six Paths Sage Mode Naruto, who was doing all of the heavy lifting.
So just because Naruto got more hits in this immediately means he's superior to Sasuke? This is illogical, especially considering Sasuke physically kept up during the fight, as well as the Momoshiki fight. Also, you're arguing like using his space-time Ninjutsu isn't part of his usual arsenal. Remember, Sasuke isn't a brawler. Just because he tactically does not engage as much as Naruto doesn't mean he's any weaker.Sasuke got one kick in while he was stunned by Naruto, and then used a bunch of Ninja Tools and Space-Time Ninjutsu in order to distract him, whereas Naruto was the one getting in all the punches and knocking him around and whatnot.
The wiki literally accepts the Avatar as a power-up, so your point is moot. Regardless, Sasuke's Susano'o is blatantly equal to Naruto's avatar, which means Rinnegan Sasuke is most definitely comparable to SPSM Naruto. Unless, you're gonna suggest that the Susano'o gives an even bigger power-up to Sasuke than SPSM does to Naruto.Why are their avatars indicative of their own combat ability? The Susano'o is portrayed countless times as being superior to its user's own stats, and the Wiki accepts the Susano'o as such. Sasuke being able to generate a Susano'o that is comparable to Six Path Sage Mode Naruto's Kurama Avatar, which would literally just be his own power but in the form of a Tailed Beast, since Kurama Mode already allows him to utilize 100% of Kurama's power, does not mean that Sasuke is comparable to Six Paths Sage Mode Naruto.
Naruto combines SPSM and Kurama chakra to make this:The Databook differentiates the two, and says SPSM provides much more chakra than Kurama Mode. Naruto combines two powers, the SPSM and the Kurama Chakra.
I know. But why is Kurama's eye present here? At no point did I say anything about Toad Sage Mode, and yes that he used KN0 + SPSM. It's the only justification for Kurama's eye being present.This is what he used against Madara. This is SPSM:
You mentioned Nagato, hence why I bought in SM as well. You'll have to ask Kishimoto on why he chose that design. But that's just SPSM there is not kurama involved. If there's any KN0 involvement his whiskers would be thicker.I know. But why is Kurama's eye present here? At no point did I say anything about Toad Sage Mode, and yes that he used KN0 + SPSM. It's the only justification for Kurama's eye being present.
You’re forgetting Kurama’s chakra is part of the SPs, which was originally the Ten Tails.I know. But why is Kurama's eye present here? At no point did I say anything about Toad Sage Mode, and yes that he used KN0 + SPSM. It's the only justification for Kurama's eye being present.
As well as all nine bijuus. Why just her eye there?You’re forgetting Kurama’s chakra is part of the SPs, which was originally the Ten Tails.
SPSM Naruto is actually superior to Rinnegan Sasuke?
If you assume that Kurama's eye is present because of the design, it leaves a margin for me to assume that the absence of the "thick whiskers" is also due to the design...You mentioned Nagato, hence why I bought in SM as well. You'll have to ask Kishimoto on why he chose that design. But that's just SPSM there is not kurama involved. If there's any KN0 involvement his whiskers would be thicker.
As adults. I could see SPSM Naruto during the power-up as being somewhat superior considering it was made clear that Sasuke's Rinnegan was gimped and "new".VotE fight?