(Mod Input needed) Kamen Rider Saber Wonder Almighty, Tiering, Keys Revision

[IxaSaga]

Starting up my Saber revisions again to make them usable again. They are an essential part of Reiwa, Outsiders, and Girls Remix scaling so its high priority to work on these now. I will work on post series stuff at a later time.

Upgrade

With the Toei Cosmology being accepted, Kamen Rider Saber's Wonder Almighty form is now High 1-A, being the new version of the Almighty Book. This will only apply and scale to Wonder Almighty key of Touma. Unlike the regular Wonder Ridebooks that come from the Almighty Book and does not give the characters High 1-A, Wonder Almighty is the direct successor to the Almighty book.

A short summary from the blog is this: "All of creation in Saber was created by a single book that we will henceforth refer to as the「Almighty Book」. This book contains the sum total of all knowledge and concepts, with human history and all its knowledge making up merely a fraction of its contents. Almighty Book stems from the Akashic Records, which relates to the real world idea of a record containing「all universal events, thoughts, words, emotions and intent ever to have occurred in the past, present, or future」. This is further expanded upon by the Kamen Rider Dictionary for Den-O, which explains that the Akashic Records in Kamen Rider is a concept from which all of human history is recorded. The Almighty Book, or the Akashic Record, is the universal truth, the force behind the very fabric of reality. Humans are incapable of creating anything on their own; every achievement they’ve ever made is merely the result of the Almighty Book's control. To it, humans and everything else are nothing more than minuscule, meaningless existences."

Touma was able to create this while not even in his Kamen Rider form.

Next up, the riders are going to have different key names. I've been thinking about this for a while now because Saber's Kamen Riders has different "breakpoints" in which they permanently get stronger. So, each rider will have the revised keys as below.

Keys

Spoiler: New Keys

Saber:
Megid War (1-20) | Awakened Rekka (21-35) | Post-Promised Place (36-47) | Wonder Almighty | Post-Series

Blades, Kenzan, Slash, Buster:
Megid War (1-15) | Traitor Arc (16-35) | Post-Promised Place (36-47) | Post-Series

Espada:
Megid War (1-15) | Kurayami's Curse (24-38) | Espada's Return (38-47) | Post-Series

Calibur (Daichi):
Pre-Series | Megid War (1-15)

Calibur (Sophia):
Priestess (1-44) | Current Calibur (45-47) | Post-Series

Saikou:
Traitor Arc (16-35) | Post-Promised Place (36-47) | Post-Series

Sabela:
Traitor Arc (25-35) | Post-Promised Place (36-47) | Post-Series

Durendal:
Traitor Arc (28-35) | Post-Promised Place (36-47) | Post-Series

Falchion:
The Phoenix Swordsman and the Book of Ruin | Traitor Arc (34-35) | Post-Promised Place (36-38)

Solomon:
Master of Logos (23-35) | Kamen Rider Solomon (36-40)

Storious:
Megid Arc (1-15) | Traitor Arc (16-35) | Forming Grimoire (36-42) | Grimoire (43-47)

Now for the tiering, we will be using this

Very simple. Medusa summons a rock that falls, which can destroy Tokyo. So, we can just use this calc (non-nuclear): https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blogMUA/Destroying_Tokyo

This scales to King of Arthur Saber so any forms below it will downscale with multipliers. This is also REALLY good because it is extremely consistent with both multipliers scaling and the Blades snowstorm feat. Somehow, the destroying tokyo calc and the multiplier scaling chain totaled up to Blades THS to near perfection.

We can just use Blades' snowstorm feat

Here's the updated scaling chain that we will be using now. PS: Lifting Strength portion is not done but AP is. LS is not being revised yet.

Tiering

Spoiler: New Tiers

Saber:
9-B as Touma Kamiyama, 7-A while wielding Rekka or in Brave Dragon, Varies from 7-A to 6-C with stronger forms, higher with amplifications or finishers | 9-B as Touma Kamiyama, High 7-A while wielding Rekka or in Brave Dragon, Varies from High 7-A to High 6-C with stronger forms, higher with amplifications or finishers | 9-B as Touma Kamiyama, 2-C while wielding Rekka or in Brave Dragon, Varies from higher to far higher while wielding Xross Saber, or using other forms, amplifications or finishers | High 1-A | 9-B as Touma Kamiyama, 2-C while wielding Rekka or in Brave Dragon, Varies from higher to far higher while wielding Xross Saber, or using other forms, amplifications or finishers

Blades, Espada, Buster, Kenzan, Slash:
9-B as (Civilian), 7-A while wielding (their weapon) or in (base form), Varies from 7-A to 6-C with stronger forms, higher with amplifications or finishers | 9-B as (Civilian), High 7-A while wielding (their weapon) or in (base form), Varies from High 7-A to High 6-C with stronger forms, higher with amplifications or finishers | 9-B as (Civilian), 2-C while wielding (their weapon) or in (base form), higher using stronger forms, amplifications or finishers | 9-B as (Civilian), 2-C while wielding (their weapon) or in (base form), higher using stronger forms, amplifications or finishers

Calibur (Daichi):
9-B as Kamijo Daichi, 7-A while wielding Rekka or in Brave Dragon | 9-B as Kamijo Daichi, High 7-A+ while wielding Kurayami or in Jaaku Dragon, 6-C in Jaou Dragon

Calibur (Sophia):
9-B | 9-B as Sophia, 2-C while wielding Kurayami or in Jaaku Dragon | 9-B as Sophia, 2-C while wielding Kurayami or in Jaaku Dragon

Saikou and Sabela:
9-B as (Civilian), 6-C while wielding (their weapon) or in (base form), higher with amplifications or finishers | 9-B as (Civilian), 2-C while wielding (their weapon) or in (base form), higher using amplifications or finishers | 9-B as (Civilian), 2-C while wielding (their weapon) or in (base form), higher using amplifications or finishers

Durendal:
9-B as Ryoga Shindai, High 6-C while wielding Kaiji or in Ocean History, higher with amplifications or finishers | 9-B as Ryoga Shindai, 2-C while wielding Kaiji or in Ocean History, higher using amplifications or finishers | 9-B as Ryoga Shindai, 2-C while wielding Kaiji or in Ocean History, higher using amplifications or finishers

Falchion:
9-B as Bahato, High 6-C while wielding Kyomu or in Eternal Pheonix, higher with amplifications or finishers | 9-B as Bahato, High 6-C while wielding Kyomu or in Eternal Pheonix, higher with amplifications or finishers | 9-B as Bahato, 2-C while wielding Kyomu or in Eternal Pheonix, higher using amplifications or finishers

Solomon:
High 6-C | 2-C, higher using amplifications or finishers

Storious:
High 7-A, 6-C with energy blasts | 6-C, higher with energy blasts | 2-C, higher with energy blasts | 2-C, higher with energy blasts, far higher with Grimoire

Summary

• High 1-A for Saber's Wonder Almighty Form
• The riders will now scale to Tokyo destroying calc and forms will scale explained in the scaling blog
• New tiers to match their breakpoints
• New scaling page

Agree: Jamesthetaker, Kisaragi Megumi, Harith0cell, Xstars1998, BERRIES555, Firestorm, Medeus
Disagree:
Neutral:

 

[Shadowslash125]

Following.

 

[Jamesthetaker]

I hate to point this out given how hard you've worked on this man, but while the feat of Medusa's rock destroying Tokyo is fine, the calc used isn't completely accurate given the context.

The calc used the air blast formula, which would only apply if the explosion occurred in the air. However, Rintaro explicitly stated that if the rock falls down, the city will be destroyed. It means that the rock will destroy the city through fragmentation or a ground-based explosion.

 

[IxaSaga]

I hate to point this out given how hard you've worked on this man, but while the feat of Medusa's rock destroying Tokyo is fine, the calc used isn't completely accurate given the context.

The calc used the air blast formula, which would only apply if the explosion occurred in the air. However, Rintaro explicitly stated that if the rock falls down, the city will be destroyed. It means that the rock will destroy the city through fragmentation or a ground-based explosion.

Is there an accepted fragmentation calc that I can use?

The biggest thing here is to get Saber Wonder Almighty on the board. Since I already figured the scaling multipliers, I can just re-calc with the new value so it shouldn't be too hard to get the new values

 

[The_King_of_Prudence]

Touma's a cut above the rest.

 

[Jamesthetaker]

Is there an accepted fragmentation calc that I can use?

Unfortunately, that is the only calc I could find and yet to be evaluated.

As for the scaling and multipliers, I think they are fine, but you probably would need to add scans for them since staff aren't familiar with Saber's scaling.

Aside from that, I'd like to offer another suggestion to the OP:

Given how many Kamen Rider series have their own scaling (some of which we've already made, such as Zero-One and Showa Riders), keeping track of them all can be difficult with how scattered they are. Not to mention that we usually kept them on personal blogs, making it impossible for other users to edit if the scaling chain had to be changed. Therefore, I would like to suggest that we create a universal page that compiles every scaling chain of each Kamen Rider series.

 

[IxaSaga]

Unfortunately, that is the only calc I could find and yet to be evaluated.

As for the scaling and multipliers, I think they are fine, but you probably would need to add scans for them since staff aren't familiar with Saber's scaling.

Added scans and additional explanation to the scaling page, thanks for the suggestions

Aside from that, I'd like to offer another suggestion to the OP:

Given how many Kamen Rider series have their own scaling (some of which we've already made, such as Zero-One and Showa Riders), keeping track of them all can be difficult with how scattered they are. Not to mention that we usually kept them on personal blogs, making it impossible for other users to edit if the scaling chain had to be changed. Therefore, I would like to suggest that we create a universal page that compiles every scaling chain of each Kamen Rider series.

Oh man, I think we have to reach out to the rest of the boys and girls for that. Since Saber does scale to Ghost, I was thinking of stacking Saber's EOS multipliers on top of Ghost's multipliers but that requires everything before too. Xross Saber at his strongest already gets up to 99,841,749,811.2x stronger than base.

 

[IxaSaga]

Good update though, we can just use Blades' calc and I already updated everything. I mentioned that its reallly consistent. That means absolutely nothing changed for the tiers. So everything is good to go now

 

[EvoltOz]

following

 

[Jamesthetaker]

Oh man, I think we have to reach out to the rest of the boys and girls for that. Since Saber does scale to Ghost, I was thinking of stacking Saber's EOS multipliers on top of Ghost's multipliers but that requires everything before too. Xross Saber at his strongest already gets up to 99,841,749,811.2x stronger than base.

Guess that's fair.

Anyway, I skimmed through the scaling and see no problems, so consider me in agreement.

 

[EvoltOz]

I think High 1-A stuff needs some input from the staff. (unless I'm mistaken)

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Agree here

 

[Harith0cell]

Agree with op

 

[Jamesthetaker]

I think High 1-A stuff needs some input from the staff. (unless I'm mistaken)

High 1-A Almighty Book is already accepted in the cosmology thread, so this is simply to apply it to Saber's profile.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

High 1-A Almighty Book is already accepted in the cosmology thread, so this is simply to apply it to Saber's profile.

So I guess we only need two staffs for the approval of this thread then

 

[Ren_amamya]

I had a question about the 2_C key.
This key is related to the creation of three worlds by Kamen Rider Saber,
and one of them was the real world.
Wouldn’t that make the key change to higher tier?

 

[IxaSaga]

I had a question about the 2_C key.
This key is related to the creation of three worlds by Kamen Rider Saber,
and one of them was the real world.
Wouldn’t that make the key change to higher tier?

2-C is from Xross Saber being able to freeze the universe and Wonder World from converging and collapsing. At the same time, Storious is able to destroy the two space times. They also scale to post Heisei Generation Final Ghost from the crossover special.

By real world, I'm assuming you mean Super Hero Senki? Super Hero Senki Saber is not on his profile and might not ever be. If it ever gets created then it will probably get its own profile. Its a form that includes all of Kamen Rider (including Oma Zi-O) and all of Super Sentai. Soooo yea, might take us a decade to complete unironically

 

[Shadowslash125]

Bump

 

[Shadowslash125]

Bump

 

[Shadowslash125]

bump

 

[Shadowslash125]

bump

 

[Xtars1998]

agree

 

[Zarovut]

Following

 

[BERRIES555]

I agree. The scaling was already something we’ve had for years. This is just updating the numbers due to the new cosmos

 

[Shadowslash125]

bump

 

[Shadowslash125]

bump

 

[Shadowslash125]

Bump

 

[IxaSaga]

Oi bump

 

[IxaSaga]

Bump

 

[Shadowslash125]

Wow this is dead.
Bump

 

[IxaSaga]

After this I'm tempted to do the biggest revision of all time if it's going to take this long for revision part 1 of 10 anyways.

 

[Shadowslash125]

After this I'm tempted to do the biggest revision of all time if it's going to take this long for revision part 1 of 10 anyways.

You know something is very wrong when small ass crts take about a week or more to even get one staff vote, let alone two more often than not.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

How about you guys make a question thread about "why the mods are so ******* slow to respond/evaluating a small revisions/niche verses" instead? Rather than wasting time ranting kekw

 

[Shadowslash125]

How about you guys make a question thread about "why the mods are so ******* slow to respond/evaluating a small revisions/niche verses" instead? Rather than wasting time ranting kekw

Do not test me, I'm on the verge of making it a reality as we speak

 

[Shadowslash125]

bump

 

[Mr. Bambu]

burn the mods at the stake! burn the mods at the stake! kill and eat the mods!

anyways I'm not touching this but I was commissioned to at least tag the Usual Suspects of tiershit.

@Ultima_Reality @DontTalkDT @Planck69 @Everything12 @ActuallySpaceMan42 @Oblivion_Of_The_Endless

(this list is largely comprised by my subjective experience of who is more willing than others to bathe in the Tiers)

 

[Shadowslash125]

bump

 

[Firestorm808]

The revised OP seems okay.

 

[Shadowslash125]

Noice, now need one more staff

 

[Omazio2019]

Agree, though I propose that "far higher with Grimoire" should be change into "High 1-A with Grimoire" as it's almost-completion of Almighty Book.