Mob Psycho 100 upgrade

[Maitreya12]

To be more clear what happens in the mental world or whatever is kind of bizarre because there’s two “cities” or “worlds” in the space. I think if we go by representation and interpretation then this would be a battle between Mogami’s “world” and Mob’s “world” that he’s trying to maintain.

During the course of the battle the two “worlds” become engulfed in flames that appear as “stars” in I suppose the mental void that is Asagiri’s mind. Mob’s loses control and becomes ??? Mob at which he immediately erases Mogami’s presence and all the spirit energy within from the void and restores it back to how it’s meant to be, thus restoring Asagiri.

That’s just my interpretation of the events I guess ¯\(ツ)/¯

 

[Maitreya12]

Low 2-C Mob will most likely never happen lol.

Don’t tempt me.

 

[Antvasima]

I'm still of the opinion that the cosmic scale of the dimension might potentially make it an outlier but NikHelton seems to make some decent arguments about that part not being relevant to the feat. I suppose I'll see what other supporters say about that.

I originally thought to implement the agreed tiers then tackle this in another thread but Nik seems sure that it can be finished here so I suppose I can wait for that.

@NikHelton Actually, small question. If 6-B is from Toichiro's explosion, why would the peak levels of 100% scale? Doesn't the explosion scale above them?

@Maverick_Zero_X @CloverDragon03

What do you think about this?

 

[CloverDragon03]

I’m on the fence here. The starry sky would make this 4-A theoretically, but like Nik said, the stars are never actually interacted with unlike the city.

Although, normally whether the stars were interacted with or not doesn’t affect whether or not the feat is 4-A

 

[Dienomite22]

Why doesn't it have a basis? We don't know what the space inside looked like before the Mogami moved in.
When Mob first got inside, we saw only the void, inside which the world was created.

Let me try to get my point across.

If the stars were created by the Mogami, then we would have this order of destruction of the world: the destruction of cities / planets => one space remains => the destruction of space => the void remains.

With the complete destruction of the Mogami dimension, Mob banishes him.

However, we have a different order: the destruction of cities/planet => the void remains => the destruction of the void => space remains.

The Void is part of the Mogami World. Space is not part of his world.

Mob does not affect the last location in any way, because this is no longer the Mogami dimension. It was here originally. The spirit has already been cast out.

If I continue to entertain this idea of mental world feats being usable, you know that means Mogami took over the entire space and created his own white void and world which would still be 3-A?

And from the way the scene was put together, Mogami was defeated when the void appeared and the space didn't appear until the instant Mob calmed down. If the space was there before Mogami took over you wouldn't have Mob appear in the void first and then the space that conveniently appears the instant he goes back to normal.

 

[Maitreya12]

If I continue to entertain this idea of mental world feats being usable, you know that means Mogami took over the entire space and created his own white void and world which would still be 3-A?

And from the way the scene was put together, Mogami was defeated when the void appeared and the space didn't appear until the instant Mob calmed down. If the space was there before Mogami took over you wouldn't have Mob wouldn't have appeared in the void first and then the space that conveniently appears the instant he goes back to normal.

I still stand by this for the interpretation of events

To be more clear what happens in the mental world or whatever is kind of bizarre because there’s two “cities” or “worlds” in the space. I think if we go by representation and interpretation then this would be a battle between Mogami’s “world” and Mob’s “world” that he’s trying to maintain.

During the course of the battle the two “worlds” become engulfed in flames that appear as “stars” in I suppose the mental void that is Asagiri’s mind. Mob’s loses control and becomes ??? Mob at which he immediately erases Mogami’s presence and all the spirit energy within from the void and restores it back to how it’s meant to be, thus restoring Asagiri.

That’s just my interpretation of the events I guess ¯\(ツ)/¯

I also want to know the proposal because this feats is either gonna be discarded or there’s gonna need to be a lot better justification and blogs being written for this writes to justify these ratings

 

[NikHelton]

If I continue to entertain this idea of mental world feats being usable, you know that means Mogami took over the entire space and created his own white void and world which would still be 3-A?

And from the way the scene was put together, Mogami was defeated when the void appeared and the space didn't appear until the instant Mob calmed down. If the space was there before Mogami took over you wouldn't have Mob appear in the void first and then the space that conveniently appears the instant he goes back to normal.

It doesn't make sense. Just because there was originally space, and then the white void created by the Mogs, the Mob appeared in the void, destroyed it and left only space.

Mogami has nothing to do with space. We see the cosmos only after Shigeo finally destroys the Mogami dimension and returns everything as it was

 

[Dienomite22]

It doesn't make sense. Just because there was originally space, and then the white void created by the Mogs, the Mob appeared in the void, destroyed it and left only space.

What doesn't make sense? Mogami completely possessed Asagiri. Her "mental/spiritual" space became his and his spirits' space. What doesn't make sense is that you are saying Mogami's world is a planet and Asagiri's original space is the cosmos at the end of the fight and that Mogami only took over a small piece of that space and created a void there. That's adding far too many hypotheticals to an already questionable mental world scaling you're arguing for. It is """"less"""" of a leap of logic to simply say Mogami and Mob are 3-A for affecting the entire mental world which housed constellations than to say they affected only the planet and void inside the space cosmos of Asagiri.

Mogami has nothing to do with space. We see the cosmos only after Shigeo finally destroys the Mogami dimension and returns everything as it was

Mogami had total control over Asagiri's mental world and physical body through possession and you don't see any signs of a starry sky in the white void.

 

[NikHelton]

We have not seen the interaction of the characters with the cosmos to speak for its size and reality. However, we have seen the interaction of the characters with the city

 

[Dienomite22]

We have not seen the interaction of the characters with the cosmos to speak for its size and reality. However, we have seen the interaction of the characters with the city

So what is the cosmos?

 

[Recon1511]

How did we go from "possibly High 6-A" to 4-A up to Low 2-C????

Most staff here agreed with "possibly High 6-A" alteady why hasnt this been closed yet?

 

[Maitreya12]

So what is the cosmos?

The cosmos was either created by or restored to by Mob.

It was originally just a black void filled with two worlds of Mogami and Mob battling with each other until ??? Mob erased everything, turning it into a white void filled with nothing and restored/created that cosmos in the mental/spiritual scape.

 

[NikHelton]

Mob vs Toichiro match2

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[NikHelton]

I'm not sure about the correctness of the math, but I tried with the data

 

[Dienomite22]

How did we go from "possibly High 6-A" to 4-A up to Low 2-C????

Most staff here agreed with "possibly High 6-A" alteady why hasnt this been closed yet?

Because the "parallel world" that Mogami created scales to physicals and said world overwrote Asagiri's mental/spiritual space which is depicted as a cosmos. If you believe in the High 6-A stuff that means you believe that everything related to the parallel world scales to physicals and that means you would believe the overwriting Asagiri's mental space is a 3-A feat.

 

[NikHelton]

The cosmos was either created by or restored to by Mob.

It was originally just a black void filled with two worlds of Mogami and Mob battling with each other until ??? Mob erased everything, turning it into a white void filled with nothing and restored/created that cosmos in the mental/spiritual scape.

No. The mob destroys the city and only a white void remains. The same emptiness that was when the Mob first moved into the body. Before Mogami created his world.
After that, he destroys the void. But it does not create space in any way.

 

[Dienomite22]

No. The mob destroys the city and only a white void remains. The same emptiness that was when the Mob first moved into the body. Before Mogami created his world.
After that, he destroys the void. But it does not create space in any way.

So what is the cosmos in relation to Asagiri?

 

[Maitreya12]

No. The mob destroys the city and only a white void remains. The same emptiness that was when the Mob first moved into the body. Before Mogami created his world.
After that, he destroys the void. But it does not create space in any way.

Mob does a lot more than destroy a city here.

Here we see two “worlds” (one is on top of Mob that you can only see part of here) engulfed in flames in a black void that Mogami has created. Mob then erases everything in the void. Meaning all the spirit energy there which in turn purges Mogami from Asagiri’s mind leaving but an empty white void in its wake.

Mob then restores/creates the cosmos in the mental/spiritual world as shown by how Mob himself turns from black to white as the void is turned from white to black in conjunction. Only now filled with the cosmos.

What happened was clearly Mob’s doing in restoring Asagiri’s mind as immediately after Mogami is purged from her body and Asagiri wakes up fine.

 

[Maitreya12]

So what is the cosmos in relation to Asagiri?

Personally I take it as Mob restoring Asagiri’s mental scape since she wakes up perfectly fine seconds after this and the white void that was beforehand was Mob erasing/purging Mogami from Asagiri’s mind.

 

[NikHelton]

Mob does a lot more than destroy a city here.

Here we see two “worlds” (one is on top of Mob that you can only see part of here) engulfed in flames in a black void that Mogami has created. Mob then erases everything in the void. Meaning all the spirit energy there which in turn purges Mogami from Asagiri’s mind leaving but an empty white void in its wake.

Mob then restores/creates the cosmos in the mental/spiritual world as shown by how Mob himself turns from black to white as the void is turned from white to black in conjunction. Only now filled with the cosmos.

What happened was clearly Mob’s doing in restoring Asagiri’s mind as immediately after Mogami is purged from her body and Asagiri wakes up fine.

Mob destroyed the landscape, leaving only a white void. This white void was even before the creation of the city and in fact was the dimension in which Mogami is located. We can see it in this frame. The white dimension is his domain and he himself let Mob in there. Therefore, the Mob first destroys the landscape, then the white dimension Mogami and eventually expels him. No creation of the cosmos. Just a white void destroyed.

 

[Dienomite22]

Personally I take it as Mob restoring Asagiri’s mental scape since she wakes up perfectly fine seconds after this and the white void that was beforehand was Mob erasing/purging Mogami from Asagiri’s mind.

I want hear from Nik what is the relationship between Asagiri’s mind and the cosmos.

 

[NikHelton]

@Planck69
People directly say above that this is the expulsion of Mogami and there is no direct space. No one interacted with the cosmos. However, we have seen how the characters interact with the city. The whole argument looks like running after your own tail. In the end, nothing has changed. We also see that the city behaves quite real, that the strength of the espers is the same in the real world and the spirit world. There is nothing that contradicts the use of exploits with the city.

 

[NikHelton]

So what is the cosmos in relation to Asagiri?

I have already answered you above

 

[Maitreya12]

Mob destroyed the landscape, leaving only a white void. This white void was even before the creation of the city and in fact was the dimension in which Mogami is located. We can see it in this frame. The white dimension is his domain and he himself let Mob in there. Therefore, the Mob first destroys the landscape, then the white dimension Mogami and eventually expels him. No creation of the cosmos. Just a white void destroyed.

Ok so this actually works to my point and let me explain and I wanna hear you @Dienomite22 and others opinion on it.

The white void is essentially the “blank” version of Asagiri’s mind that spirit users like Mogami and Mob can “fill” with whatever they desire as they control that person’s mind.

Mogami created the world Mob suffered in for months and during the battle between him and Mob, Mob erased Mogami’s “world” returning it back to the empty blank void. Mob the. Proceeded to once again fill that void with the cosmos around him thus restoring Asagiri’s mind.

 

[Maitreya12]

@Planck69
People directly say above that this is the expulsion of Mogami and there is no direct space. No one interacted with the cosmos. However, we have seen how the characters interact with the city. The whole argument looks like running after your own tail. In the end, nothing has changed. We also see that the city behaves quite real, that the strength of the espers is the same in the real world and the spirit world. There is nothing that contradicts the use of exploits with the city.

Mob either directly restored or created that cosmos as it was never shown previously and as we are shown that white void is capable of being filled with the user’s “world.”

 

[Dienomite22]

I have already answered you above

You have not explained what you think the cosmos is in relation to asagiri’s mind

 

[Maitreya12]

Essentially to answer this:

Blank white void=“empty” Asagiri’s mind.

Black void=Mogami’s “world” inside Asagiri’s mind.

Cosmos=“Filled/restored” Asagiri’s mind.

Make sense?

 

[NikHelton]

You have not explained what you think the cosmos is in relation to asagiri’s mind

"Mogami did not create stars. The void existed above them.

And the cosmos probably symbolizes the human soul, but One did not develop the metaphysics of the verse in any way."


However, Planck decided that this was an arbitrary interpretation

 

[DarthSorox]

Mob in the parallel world uses his powers and emotions just like in reality, and I don't see why this battle shouldn't be a representation of his real powers. One can argue about whether the cosmos was real in this world, but I don't see the point in the feats we see and can appreciate being a hoax. As for the cosmos, there is no evidence that it was created by Mogami, no one on screen interacted with it, and apart from a second scene, no emphasis was placed on it. I don't think this is a good reason to completely cancel scaling and abandon all calculations. In context, it doesn't really matter what the cosmos is, because we still have a city that has a realistic interaction with everything, tends to collapse and is believable. But even with all this, we use "possibly" even though we have seen many times that espers are equally strong in the real world and in the spiritual.

 

[Dienomite22]

"Mogami did not create stars. The void existed above them.

And the cosmos probably symbolizes the human soul, but One did not develop the metaphysics of the verse in any way."


However, Planck decided that this was an arbitrary interpretation

So you are saying the cosmos is fake and not tangible?

 

[NikHelton]

I’m on the fence here. The starry sky would make this 4-A theoretically, but like Nik said, the stars are never actually interacted with unlike the city.

Although, normally whether the stars were interacted with or not doesn’t affect whether or not the feat is 4-A

No one created the stars. They were originally, most likely being the embodiment of the girl's soul. It doesn't make sense to scale, since it's literally a 3-second scene where we don't even see it working. But we see how the city works, so we have no problems with it

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

I still don't buy that this mental world is a 1 to 1 representation of their powers
If it is then we also have to accept that Mob has low-high regen

 

[Dienomite22]

No one created the stars. They were originally, most likely being the embodiment of the girl's soul. It doesn't make sense to scale, since it's literally a 3-second scene where we don't even see it working. But we see how the city works, so we have no problems with it

Mogami took over and usurped Asagiri’s body, mind and soul.

 

[Edutyn]

How did we go from "possibly High 6-A" to 4-A up to Low 2-C????

Very Good Question

 

[NikHelton]

I still don't buy that this mental world is a 1 to 1 representation of their powers
If it is then we also have to accept that Mob has low-high regen

Mob's soul has regeneration, yes

 

[NikHelton]

So you are saying the cosmos is fake and not tangible?

It doesn't matter, because we scale not the cosmos, but the city, which in turn is a copy of the real one

 

[Shmeatywerbenmanjenson]

No one created the stars. They were originally, most likely being the embodiment of the girl's soul. It doesn't make sense to scale, since it's literally a 3-second scene where we don't even see it working. But we see how the city works, so we have no problems with it

I agree with this interpretation of the events

I really think we had things settled when everyone was for "Possibly High 6-A" and I don't know why everyone deviated from that

Point is since we've established that the void and the stars apply to the girls mental scape and that only the city applies to Mogami I think we can reach a conclusion

 

[NikHelton]

Mob in the parallel world uses his powers and emotions just like in reality, and I don't see why this battle shouldn't be a representation of his real powers. One can argue about whether the cosmos was real in this world, but I don't see the point in the feats we see and can appreciate being a hoax. As for the cosmos, there is no evidence that it was created by Mogami, no one on screen interacted with it, and apart from a second scene, no emphasis was placed on it. I don't think this is a good reason to completely cancel scaling and abandon all calculations. In context, it doesn't really matter what the cosmos is, because we still have a city that has a realistic interaction with everything, tends to collapse and is believable. But even with all this, we use "possibly" even though we have seen many times that espers are equally strong in the real world and in the spiritual.

I myself don't fully understand why we are still stretching this

 

[Dienomite22]

It doesn't matter, because we scale not the cosmos, but the city, which in turn is a copy of the real one

It does matter because the cosmos is in the space that was referred to as the parallel world.

 

[NikHelton]

I agree with this interpretation of the events

I really think we had things settled when everyone was for "Possibly High 6-A" and I don't know why everyone deviated from that

Point is since we've established that the void and the stars apply to the girls mental scape and that only the city applies to Mogami I think we can reach a conclusion

I've been trying to explain this to people for over an hour, but one of them wants to get a Low 2-C Mob Psycho, and the second one is having fun with it