Minecraft Speeds

[EsotericDichotomy]

Endermen can teleport from arrows, even if they are facing the wrong direction. Or if the player is hidden. Perhaps they can use sound (since arrows are subsonic), but it literally looks like an unconscious reflex that they are not actually in control of. That is Head Canon on my part I will admit. It makes way more sense than shoehorning Cinematic time into a game that is clearly realtime, but headcanon nonetheless.

What I cannot accept is that all of the other mobs that can get tagged by Subsonic Arrows, are all listed as Massively Hypersonic. For crying out loud, the Skeletons fire these arrows as their main attack. They should at least on their page be listed as Subsonic with their Arrows.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Headcanon that makes sense is still headcanon, and we can't use it.

Again, no other mobs dodge.

 

[EsotericDichotomy]

It two people are arguing about the veracity of something, it is a debate by definition.

And debates shouldn't have one side saying their decisions just need common sense and the other side is just coming up with excuses.

Some of this is undeserving, I will admit. Never on this wiki has anyone ever acknowledged in a thread a downgrade that I have talked about in the chat. In the chat several people agree so I make the thread, and then no one comes to support what they just agreed to.

Few have been as egregiously blatant as this thread though.

I have a very difficult time understanding what is so bad about making a mistake, and downgrading something? The Arrows are clearly Subsonic and in absence of the Endermen, EVERYTHING ELSE looks Subsonic.

IF ANYTHING Endermen reactions is an outlier. NO other mob exhibits ridiculous traits like that. And scaling an entire verse to a single character when there are countless examples of otherwise, is quite frankly against the spirit of this Wiki.

 

[Therefir]

''Make sence that Skeletons should not be Massively Hypersonic since they can't hit Enderman''

 

[The_Everlasting]

"looks Subsonic"

I guess every video game ever is Peak Human because we can see the fights happen.

 

[EsotericDichotomy]

"looks Subsonic"
I guess every video game ever is Peak Human because we can see the fights happen.

I was using "looks" as in appears to be. Not visually, but through data, like the arrow speed and the attack speed of weapons, and the movement of entities and mobs. LIke seriously...

It's like you are not taking any of the data I have presented as serious. And it is tiresome to try to contribute to the wiki, when the deathgrip on the status quo and the pride of people who don't want to admit they are wrong prevents any progress on trying to be a more accurate and consistent wiki.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Yeah, and that's visual-based, hence it's not something really important.

Your entire second paragraph is completely unnecessary and frankly quite aggressive.

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

We are taking it seriously. But it doesn't use good arguments to be used.

1. Monsters never dodges anything anyway.

2. MHS should scale to Steve because he can punch an Enderman in the face.

3. Steve CAN react to an arrow at point blank, though it is hard to accomplish for players.

And it's somewhat tiring dealing with someone who thinks they're factually right despite having like 5 people against them.

 

[Fllflourine]

And it is tiresome to try to contribute to the wiki, when the deathgrip on the status quo and the pride of people who don't want to admit they are wrong prevents any progress on trying to be a more accurate and consistent wiki.

Ok

 

[Therefir]

My question is Skeleton's arrows are massyvely hypersonic?

 

[EsotericDichotomy]

Yeah, and that's visual-based, hence it's not something really important.
Your entire second paragraph is completely unnecessary and frankly quite aggressive.

Data from the game and the characters being able to move... it isn't just visual, it's literally the physics of the world. That's like ignoring that a block is a cubic meter because you decided you didn't like that number. The game has speeds and time frames given to you, but because of a fan made calc, you are ignoring the in-game physics.

My second paragraph is me venting and being frustrated with this. Yes, it is aggressive because you aren't listening. And this wiki has never listened. It's frustrating to see a wiki with so much potential stagnating in the pursuit of accuracy/consistency for the sake of wank, and status quo.

 

[The_Everlasting]

"Data from the game" puts FFXV characters at not even Superhuman speed, what's the point of it.

"The game has speeds and time frames given to you, but because of a fan made calc, you are ignoring the in-game physics."

Uh, yeah, that's how it works. Toei officially gives the speeds of all the Kamen Riders and Super Sentai Rangers, and they're all Subsonic. Do we take that and ignore any better speed feats they have? No, of course we wouldn't.

Now you're just being ridiculous. You're continuing to act as if you're completely right on the subject and we're completely wrong.

 

[EsotericDichotomy]

We are taking it seriously. But it doesn't use good arguments to be used.
1. Monsters never dodges anything anyway.

2. MHS should scale to Steve because he can punch an Enderman in the face.

3. Steve CAN react to an arrow at point blank, though it is hard to accomplish for players.

And it's somewhat tiring dealing with someone who thinks they're factually right despite having like 5 people against them.

Monsters never dodging is game mechanics, they are scripted to do that. And in fact Skeletons actually strafe in the newest edition of the game so it's factually inaccurate. Assuming that the mobs don't dodge being part of the lore is just an assumption.

MHS shouldn't scale to Steve, because as you said, "Mobs don't dodge" so he could be Peak Human speed and still hit them. Because "Mobs don't dodge".

Steve CAN react to an arrow, so he's Subsonic+ based on his feats alone, if you don't count the outlierish number you got from your calc.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Most monsters are either undead creatures with no higher thought process, or animals. They don't have thought processes to let them dodge. We don't assume it's part of the lore, we just use common sense.

Endermen do dodge, though, it's just that the rest don't.

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Why did they buff Skeletons. They didn't need buffing.

(Rest of my argument said by Ever)

 

[Therefir]

Endermen do dodge, though, it's just that the rest don't.

The why all mobs have massyvely hypersonic combat speed? all mobs can attack enderman?

 

[The_Everlasting]

Because they can fight Steve.

 

[EsotericDichotomy]

Do you know how many arrows, Steve could fire a second if he was Massively Hypersonic?

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

Do you know how much this is game mechanics? You keep re-telling the same arguments.

 

[The_Everlasting]

And do you know how overpowered that would make bows in the game? So overpowered it wouldn't be fun, and do you really think that the creators would take note of this?

 

[Fllflourine]

My second paragraph is me venting and being frustrated with this. Yes, it is aggressive because you aren't listening. And this wiki has never listened. It's frustrating to see a wiki with so much potential stagnating in the pursuit of accuracy/consistency for the sake of wank, and status quo.

Two words: High Horse.

 

[EsotericDichotomy]

This isn't game mechanics anymore than the Mob's walking speed or the cubic meter measurements of the blocks.

I recognize that the game would be unplayable, if they were moving that fast. That's why the creators did not make the characters even remotely that fast. They made them with Normal Human movement speed and Subsonic+ reactions, allowing characters to dodge arrows and stuff.

"Speed: Below Average Human with Massively Hypersonic combat and reaction speed (Can react to their own arrows. Should be comparable to Enderma)"

This is what Skeleton says. But their arrows are Subsonic... so what's the deal with this...

 

[Saikou_The_Lewd_King]

"That's why they made Sonic Subsonic because otherwise the game would be unplayable". Same argument, different games. Both equally valid.

"Can react to their own arrows" is an old artefact from ancient ratings. Don't pay attention to it.

 

[The_Everlasting]

"I recognize that the game would be unplayable, if they were moving that fast. That's why the creators did not make the characters even remotely that fast. They made them with Normal Human movement speed and Subsonic+ reactions, allowing characters to dodge arrows and stuff."

I'm going to be blunt, do you even get how this works?

Because that is not how it works.

By your logic literally no video game can be fast because the creators specifically don't make it fast, rather than just making scenes depicted in a way that can be viewed.

Star Wars won't magically become Peak Human because we can see lightsaber fights, nor will Dragon Ball become Subsonic because we can view their battles.

 

[EsotericDichotomy]

-calms down-

You know what. Sorry for wasting everyone's time. Most battles on this wiki are Speed Equalized, so it doesn't really even matter.

I think this will be my last thread though, there's no point in content revisions with mob rule siding towards status quo and tradition, over consistency and honesty to the source material.

 

[Fllflourine]

I think this will be my last thread though, there's no point in content revisions with mob rule siding towards status quo and tradition, over consistency and honesty to the source material.

Ugh, it's one thing to argue for a downgrade against a commonly accepted stat. But this...

 

[Amelia_Lonelyheart]

With all due respect, constantly acting like you're right and we're wrong isn't the right way to go about these things. We don't go by "status quo" or "mob rule", people here go by what they think makes more sense, and it just so happens more people think Saikou makes more sense then you on this issue.