Summer Time Rendering Revision Edition #5 FT. Tier 1 Upgrade Revision

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Hiruko's creation feat is limited to herself only. It has nothing to do with her eyes, Haine explicitly states Tokoyo is connected to Haine's memories and if she ever died the whole thing disappears. Tokoyo was created from a healthy haine with both eyes but her weakened self would still scale to it because her weakest state still destroys tokoyo when she died. The whole reason she wasn't displayed as powerful in the series as there was no conflict before her corruption and after said corruption she literally got weak to the point she couldn't walk..... And her avatars are still able to whoop the cast so...
Please don't downplay this character

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Hiruko even on her death bed, eyes destroyed, mentally unstable, nerfed and handicapped to a child still scales to Tokoyo as her death makes it vanish, and people who are comparable/can harm her like ushio and shide also die. So i think everyone should be wherever tokoyo is

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

I think i might have saved Summer Time Rendering. It seems Haine can be 2-B/Low 1-C after all. It seems the world depends on haine's existence as if she ever leaves the world the flow of time will stop.
Also it seems Haine scales to her own eyes, when she dies, they get destroyed along with Tokoyo and the shadows. Its just that others with said eyes get a dimensional boost it seems

 

[Worthless]

I guess likely or possibly should be fine.
But, let's see what the admin thinks about it. At the moment, the only thing that's solid low 1-C here is her eyes, imo. Her scaling to creation feats and the creation she created being low 1-C is kinda unclear.

 

[Qawsedf234]

@Qawsedf234 @Elizhaa @Firestorm808

Can you help here with the Low 1-C downgrade.

The realm can only be Low 1-C if it's a 4D+1 situation. But going by the one woman's statement of "time does not move here", that means there's no snapshot situation happening, only making it 4D.

Now the size of said 4th Dimension can be argued, but on its own it wouldn't be treated as equal to a 5th Dimensional space.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Now the size of said 4th Dimension can be argued

Treating it as 4D even as a Likely is fine as shinpei's statement leaves it as a possibility. Although since it contains the island Hitogashima it will be something like
"At least Island level, Likely Universe level+ (Implied to have created Tokyo which is a dimension with no time existing above the mortal world and is treated as the fourth dimension)"
Although Haine/Hiruko herself should scale to the eyes seeing my earlier statement

I think i might have saved Summer Time Rendering. It seems Haine can be 2-B/Low 1-C after all. It seems the world depends on haine's existence as if she ever leaves the world the flow of time will stop.
Also it seems Haine scales to her own eyes, when she dies, they get destroyed along with Tokoyo and the shadows. Its just that others with said eyes get a dimensional boost it seems

Someone please address

 

[Satanichia_Chlammy_Mafahl]

Someone please address

I dont think so, the world doesnt depend on Haine. The scan only implying that if Haine returns to her home (go to the Tokoyo), the flow of time would stop there.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

the flow of time would stop there.

Then..... Haine is important for the mortal world..... She keeps time flowing as long as she exists in it.
If it doesn't scale ap then where does that scale or give. What about her eyes getting destroyed when she dies

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

All these link to haine being important. Just as the existence of every shadow and tokoyo itself relys on her living

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

the flow of time would stop there.

I don't think it's referring tokoyo. It specifically says if she goes home (to tokoyo) the flow of time will stop. Seems like it's talking about the real world to me. If it was Tokoyo she'd say "there"

 

[Worthless]

Someone please address

With the evidence you've provided, I can see a possibly low 1-C argument for it.

I dont think so, the world doesnt depend on Haine. The scan only implying that if Haine returns to her home (go to the Tokoyo), the flow of time would stop there.

Haine explicitly states Tokoyo is connected to Haine's memories and if she ever died the whole thing disappears.

• Stated that Tokoyo is connected to Hiruko's memories.​
• If she dies or disappears, Tokoyo will vanish along with her.​
• Stated to come from a higher dimension​
• Stated that if Hiruko died, the eyes would lose their power and become just a normal eyes.​

Connecting all the statements together, the argument for her being low 1-C doesn't seem far-fetched anymore.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

With the evidence you've provided, I can see a possibly low 1-C argument for it.

It's gonna be weird seeing
"At least Island level, Likely Universe level+, Possibly Low Complex Multiverse level" on a half dead Haine

 

[Satanichia_Chlammy_Mafahl]

What I meant was, when Haine returns home or goes back to the Tokyoo, time there would become stagnant, and the "the flow of time would stop" was simply referring to the Tokoyo itself.

I'm not disputing the possibility that the world (Tokoyo) and Haine might be interconnected in some way. What I don't agree with is the notion of dependence between Haine and the mortal realm, that's all.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

What I don't agree with is the notion of dependence between Haine and the mortal realm, that's all

Hm that's fine, the wording ushio used has many possibilities to it anyway

 

[Satanichia_Chlammy_Mafahl]

Hm that's fine, the wording ushio used has many possibilities to it anyway

Yea, its implication is ambiguous.

 

[Worthless]

It's gonna be weird seeing
"At least Island level, Likely Universe level+, Possibly Low Complex Multiverse level" on a half dead Haine

From the way I interpreted all the feats together, an argument can be made that she herself is low 1-C. Tokoyo being reliant on Hiruko's memories, along with the fact that if she vanished, it would vanish along with her, can be interpreted as r>f. And also the statement about Hiruko originating from a higher dimension. While Tokoyo is most likely only 4D, but, if the feats you've provided imply that Tokoyo is nothing more than her thoughts/memories, then... Also that scan you've sent in which, if Hiruko dies, the eyes would lose their power, which could either mean the source of the eyes' power is Hiruko or her existence is on par with the eyes, being part of her.

TL;DR:

The statement about Hiruko originating from a higher dimension, coupled with the idea that Tokoyo, a 4th-dimensional construct, is merely a byproduct of her memory, and the assertion that her eyes, arguably low 1-C, will lose power upon her death, implies she is 5D.

 

[Satanichia_Chlammy_Mafahl]

I've run out of things to say. Curious to hear other thoughts on this issue.

 

[Worthless]

The main issue is how messy this thread is, new scans and ideas keep popping up in the comments, making it harder for admins to actually give a f enough to read the entire thread and grasp the whole situation.

 

[NIK_FARIS]

I kinda busy so I will give my opinion on latter time but yeah… I think you better make TLDR for everything starting from Haine’s eye user and why they should be low 1-C so that staff can look at that instead of having to check each and every single comments.

 

[Worthless]

Either that or just nuke the whole thread and create a new one that addresses and is composed of every scan and reasoning supporting this low 1-C argument for Hiruko, her eyes, and some others.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

I'll post the final argument of Haine being Low 1-C later and i think it clears up the uncertainty. Tbh I had other ideas to bring up like Peak Human speed for the main cast... A different thread could be a possibility.

feats you've provided imply that Tokoyo is nothing more than her thoughts/memori

Nah, Tokoyo actually exist since its a dimension that can be opened up to from the mortal realm. Its just that its connected to Haine's memories, it isn't a memory nor was it created memory

 

[Worthless]

I'll post the final argument of Haine being Low 1-C later and i think it clears up the uncertainty..

Discuss it on the discussion thread first before presenting an argument here that may not be fully complete.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

So basically Ushio is actually a fragment of Hiruko. Infact she is Hiruko's eye itself. It split apart after she forced Haine's data, personality and memories out through her eyes and that same eye gained sentiment as a shadow becoming its own. But that same eye is still Haine but overwritten with Ushio's personality. This proves The eyes actually scale to Haine and upscale the people who can hurt Ushio to Low 1-C
Proof
if it needs More evidence, please tell me what it needs

 

[Worthless]

So basically Ushio is actually a fragment of Hiruko. Infact she is Hiruko's eye itself. It split apart after she forced Haine's data, personality and memories out through her eyes and that same eye gained sentiment as a shadow becoming its own. But that same eye is still Haine but overwritten with Ushio's personality. This proves The eyes actually scale to Haine and upscale the people who can hurt Ushio to Low 1-C
Proof
if it needs More evidence, please tell me what it needs

You would still have to explain on why the eyes are low 1-C

 

[GarrixianXD]

I agree with Qaws here.

 

[Qawsedf234]

can be interpreted as r>f.

No, it cannot. Especially with the new standards and assumptions with R>F.

 

[Worthless]

No, it cannot. Especially with the new standards and assumptions with R>F.

I suppose so, but with the new scans presented by the OP suggesting that Heina = her eyes, which have the power to make anyone who uses them ascend to a higher dimension where the user can control time and space and destroy the world, similar to how players turn off a video game, I believe it's r>f.

And wdym by new standard?

 

[Qawsedf234]

I believe it's r>f.

Its not. Ascending to a higher level isn't R>F in of itself. There's a bunch of qualifications regarding it, one of the major ones being the complete inability for someone lower than the character being able to interact with them in any capacity.

And wdym by new standard?

1-A, High 1-A and 0 can only be gotten with R>F once the new standards are changed. It was a major staff thread that finished recently. But that's off topic.

 

[Worthless]

Its not. Ascending to a higher level isn't R>F in of itself. There's a bunch of qualifications regarding it, one of the major ones being the complete inability for someone lower than the character being able to interact with them in any capacity.

I mean, the eyes ascend the user to a level where they treat the world like a video game that they can easily turn off. I can't provide scans, though. I still remember all the events that unfolded in this anime, but just not the specific chapters in which those statements appeared. But they did happened.

 

[Worthless]

But, in any case, even if it's not 'r>f' on its own, I think it can still be used to prove the 5D tiering for Heina, or at least for her eyes.

 

[Satanichia_Chlammy_Mafahl]

If it's not R>F then it cannot be tiered. It would just be 5D, yeah, but isn't Low 1-C tho. Giving it an Unknown rating would be appropriate, it seems.

 

[Worthless]

If it's not R>F then it cannot be tiered. It would just be 5D, yeah, but isn't Low 1-C tho. Giving it an Unknown rating would be appropriate, it seems.

Heina? Or the eyes?

 

[Satanichia_Chlammy_Mafahl]

The eyes or the ascending.

Basically it's been shown in the anime. So, whenever the user dies in reality/world, they'll be data, then ascend to said higher dimension and overlook all the timelines, multiple parallel worlds.

 

[NIK_FARIS]

Its not. Ascending to a higher level isn't R>F in of itself. There's a bunch of qualifications regarding it, one of the major ones being the complete inability for someone lower than the character being able to interact with them in any capacity.

1-A, High 1-A and 0 can only be gotten with R>F once the new standards are changed. It was a major staff thread that finished recently. But that's off topic.

Sorry to quote you like this but I have a question. How do we treat verse where there exist R/F but does not fulfill all criteria necessary to be treated as full ascension to 1-A and higher. Does that mean it fully disprove its notion of superiority? Will the verse keep their rating if it simply a single dimensional transcendence. I have some verses in mind but I will use KEVIN since you are familiar with him. We treat Kevin as 7D since it R/F entire MCU cosmology which is currently 6D. He however does not qualify as Ultima justification for R/F to get 1-A since he can technically been interact like case of She-Hulk etc etc. I know that he now can’t get 1-A but would he still keep his 7D or not since there still notion of qualitative superiority but doesn’t qualify the new standard of R/F?

I ask because there quite lot of verses I know been in similar situation (have QS of some kind of R/F but not fully fulfill the new standard)

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Can't even get a "Possibly"? Or " At least" 2-B since there's proof of higher dimensionality, i did agree on that in op. Unknown seems crazy to me.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Can't even get a "Possibly"? Or " At least" 2-B since there's proof of higher dimensionality, i did agree on that in op. Unknown seems crazy to me.

At least 2-B is fine. Dunno why Unknown would be used when there's an existing scaling chain available.

How do we treat verse where there exist R/F but does not fulfill all criteria necessary to be treated as full ascension to 1-A and higher.

It's no longer R>F but just a version of superiority. Sometimes it can entail a higher dimensional upgrade and sometimes it can't.

 

[Reiner04]

Especially with the new standards and assumptions with R>F.

I heard that new standards talks about specific strict version of R>F but not necessarily how we have been dealing with R>F regularly. And it's still a question if R>F itself will get stricter or stricter R>F will be used for 1-A and above.

 

[Qawsedf234]

specific strict version of R>F but not necessarily how we have been dealing with R>F regularly.

There's no a special version of R>F with the proposal. The proposal was that R>F would under the Tiering System always be Tier 0 due to logical conclusions. Which is why the upper tiers are being changed again.

There's not a bad version of R>F that's useable to my understanding, it'll be called something else since R>F is specifically about the new 1-A and higher tiers.

And it's still a question if R>F itself will get stricter or stricter R>F will be used for 1-A and above.

R>F will get stricker, since that was part of Ultima's proposal.

 

[NIK_FARIS]

It's no longer R>F but just a version of superiority. Sometimes it can entail a higher dimensional upgrade and sometimes it can't.

Thank you for the clarification.

Would this be enough superiority to qualify for low 1-C?

The user of Haine's Right Eye, is able to view multiple parallel worlds from a higher dimension. The eye had the ability to make the user stand in a higher dimension which allows to control space, time, and the lower dimensional world, in comparison to a three-dimensional being who can arbitrarily grab, flip, and burn a comic that is two-dimensional[23]With this, the user can bring the world he observes into reality— rendering it[51]. Said parallel worlds are basically infinite with equal possibilities as the eye seeks out creates worlds where user will succeed and discard the ones when and where he dies[52].

TLDR. The user of the eye can ascend to higher dimension (in this context would mean 5D) viewing an entire multiverse(near infinite 4D structures) similar to how 3D beings can easily control 2D being.

 

[Fallen_Angelicx]

Haine herself would be scale highest. Everyone else scales to tokoyo which has an unknown scaling currently. Although it can be possibly Uni+ (since it's implied). Im thinking about getting the energy to create hitogashima calculated