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Mario P&A Revision Thread

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Maverick_Zero_X

Maverick_Zero_X

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Resistances​

Several of his Resistances have no explanation given.



Fate Manipulation Removal​

I noticed that the conditions of Mario’s Fate Manipulation have been contradicted in-canon.

The reason behind the Fate Manipulation ability is due to the lore established Super Mario RPG, where there's a place named Star Road which grants people's wishes and turns them into stars once granted. Mario's wish was to always be able to save Princess Peach. Geno, someone who is sent to fix the Star Road and has extended knowledge on it, stated that without the wish, Mario wouldn't have been able to stop Bowser and save Peach, meaning Mario will succeed in his wish in rescuing people such as Peach or the world, regardless of the interference he faces. It is also likely that this can also influence outside events, like against the Shadow Queen in Paper Mario: The Thousand Year Door, which also explains times where Mario is kidnapped by the likes of Bowser/King Boo. However, it should be noted that this ability does not fully prevent him from being knocked out or incapacitated.
Click to expand...

But Mario there have been occasions where Mario hasn’t always been there to save Peach, such as in Luigi’s Mansion 3 where Luigi has to save her due to Mario being incapacitated. Due to contradictions I’m proposing to axe this power.
 
Honestly the petrification resistance might just be a universal weakness of the spell, idk. Is it shown to work permanently on anything?
 
Adem_Warlock69 said:
Mario was saved by Luigi tho, so he wasn't incapacitated forever
Click to expand...
You missed the point. The wish is for Mario to always be there to save Peach, with the profile assuming Mario has Fate Manipulation that helps him circumvent obstacles that’d prevent him from saving her (death or incapacitation), but Mario wasn’t able to save Peach here, so the Fate hax is contradicted.
 
Also, Super Princess Peach in another game where she is in danger considering she's fighting Bowser's armies, yet Mario stays locked up and unable to save her.
 
man it took way too long for him to finally get resistance to ee and void hax
I agree with pretty much all of this.
 
He can resist the petrification outright and be unaffected with the white racoon suit, so it should at least be applied to optional equip resistances.
The official prima guide states it turns him to stone too, it's not just like an outer layer of rock on him or something. (can update with screenshot image in a bit; EDIT: here)
The transmutation the magic wands induce on the kings didn't really seem to wear off normally and needed the wands to go and change them back during SMB3, so I think it is less a weakness of the spell and more that base Mario being able to resist it since its a subset of transmutation.
Rest of the additions look good to apply to me.
 
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I agree but share Armorchompy's view that it might be a weakness of the magic that turned him to stone, and at the same time I don't see it as objectively wrong. How about a "likely Petrification" in his resistances?
 
Maverick_Zero_X said:

Resistances​

Several of his Resistances have no explanation given.



Fate Manipulation Removal​

I noticed that the conditions of Mario’s Fate Manipulation have been contradicted in-canon.



But Mario there have been occasions where Mario hasn’t always been there to save Peach, such as in Luigi’s Mansion 3 where Luigi has to save her due to Mario being incapacitated. Due to contradictions I’m proposing to axe this power.
Click to expand...
If all it took was a single contradiction to remove fate manipulation we'd need a massive overhaul of characters with Fate Manipulation on this site.

Anyways, whatever. The OP looks fine I guess.
 
I agree with likely Petrification but Meph's suggestion about the Kings from SMB3 should be part of the new reasoning, to give an example some of the wand's spells are permanent.
 
Foxthefox1000 said:
Though I'll say for this she was literally able to save herself so idk about that one
Click to expand...
I mean, yeah? But Mario didn't save her. The wish is "I want to be able to always save Peach", not "I want Peach to always be safe", and if it was, the fatehax wouldn't really protect him at all, cause even if he permanently dies Luigi or someone else could save her instead.
 
Armorchompy said:
I mean, yeah? But Mario didn't save her. The wish is "I want to be able to always save Peach", not "I want Peach to always be safe", and if it was, the fatehax wouldn't really protect him at all, cause even if he permanently dies Luigi or someone else could save her instead.
Click to expand...
The wish was also "i want peach to be safe"
 
No? It keeps her safe, but the wording of the wish specifically includes Mario too.
 
Regarding the wish to always be able to save Peach, I'm not seeing where Mario made the wish. The links I've seen seem to be to part of Super Mario RPG where they're recapping why they need to find the 7 Stars?
I don't understand what the relevant dialogue is supposed to be, sorry.
 
XXKINGXX69 said:
The scans don't say it

So yeah, its not even contradicted. Its just more limited than how it was explained
Click to expand...
XXKINGXX69 said:
The wish was also "i want peach to be safe"
Click to expand...


So the profile incorrectly explains it? Oof.

Anyway if the wish is literally just for Peach to be safe I don’t see how the ability applies to Mario at all.
 
Imaginym said:
Where was the wish made & what is the exact dialogue for it, presuming it exists at all?
Click to expand...
From what I’ve gathered based on clips sent on this thread it’s just this line:
IMG_2865.png

It doesn’t necessitate that Mario needs to be the one to save her like the profile claims.
 
Maverick_Zero_X said:
From what I’ve gathered based on clips sent on this thread it’s just this line:
IMG_2865.png

It doesn’t necessitate that Mario needs to be the one to save her like the profile claims.
Click to expand...
Strange. Maybe it's something about the original Japanese version of the line??
That or it has to do with the Star Road granting wishes, including Mario's to be able to save Peach? But if so, is there anything (Ex: Other dialogue in that scene, or in the game at all?) that makes clear that it's Mario's wish responsible for her repeated rescues, or what exactly even IS Mario's wish for the purposes of that?

(Plus, isn't that Peach's retainer (He has a name, right?) speaking? Could he even be a reliable figure about what exactly Mario wishes to the Star Road, even if Mario always wanting to save Peach is fairly easy for anyone, even in-universe, to intuit.)
 
Imaginym said:
Strange. Maybe it's something about the original Japanese version of the line??
Click to expand...
No, the profile cites the english version of the line.
Imaginym said:
That or it has to do with the Star Road granting wishes, including Mario's to be able to save Peach? But if so, is there anything (Ex: Other dialogue in that scene, or in the game at all?) that makes clear that it's Mario's wish responsible for her repeated rescues, or what exactly even IS Mario's wish for the purposes of that?
Click to expand...
Not sure, if this is the case I haven’t seen the scans supporting it.

VegetaFan756 said:
But Mario was fated to be rescued, therefore would later be able to save the princess.
Click to expand...
Okay, nice theory, where is this stated?
 
ElixirBlue said:
I agree with likely Petrification but Meph's suggestion about the Kings from SMB3 should be part of the new reasoning, to give an example some of the wand's spells are permanent.
Click to expand...
That was with their rods off-screen, this is with their clown car thing.
XXKINGXX69 said:
There is also in SPM, where its stated the four heroes nullified the prophecy causing the prophecy to lose its power. and its stated they changed the destiny foretold by the Dark Prognosticus
Click to expand...
That is the book's fault and said destiny not being set in stone.
 


Well, it was on-screen during this version. Granted if you want to think that it is the carriage doing the magic instead of their magic wands they have in their hands that they seem to raise when it happens then so be it. Personally, I only care about the optional equip resist getting added
 
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Eficiente said:
That was with their rods off-screen, this is with their clown car thing.

That is the book's fault and said destiny not being set in stone.
Click to expand...
Its destiny wasn't set in stone only because of the 4 heroes. Everything else was predicted accurately

Maverick_Zero_X said:
So the profile incorrectly explains it? Oof.

Anyway if the wish is literally just for Peach to be safe I don’t see how the ability applies to Mario at all.
Click to expand...
The thing is that Mario is one of the people they're talking about in the scan that says the Star Road is what causes Peach to be rescued, because he's the person who mostly rescues Peach. Its probably just Peach having fate manipulation instead, or Mario having a pretty limited form of it
 
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