Mario CRT (Low 2-C Upgrade)

[Greenshifter]

The feat. Not the dimensional level.

So low 2-C feat was brought up and not contested I think, now we're talking scaling.

People "empowered" by Grand Stars often have no feats above Tier 8 if you're being honest. Hell, Bowser himself explicitely can't touch the Grand Star Reactor without burning himself in the same game series showing that he doesn't scale to it.

If there are legitimate anti-feats then I'd agree with you, but that is something I'll leave for the rest to decide. I mainly wanted to clear up the being empowered by something doesn't scale you to their AP misconception. That said even Low 2-C's like Goku can get hurt by sufficient heat... And before you bring up that he shouldn't be tier 2, if he were planet level then my point still stands.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Matthew... you mentioned mechanic..... game mechanics is a page.

Look at you. You can't even read an argument. This is a scripted mechanic where Bowser is harmed by the reactor and Mario wouldn't be able to defeat him otherwise. And the Prima Guide you guys love bringing up so much outright states that Bowser can't touch the reactor without burning himself because of the power in it. Meaning Bowser doesn't scale.

 

[TheGatememer]

You're talking nonsense. You can't even form a coherent sentence. The reactor by itself is much less powerful than the ensuing Grand Star Explosion. This is factual. Bowser is harmed by the former and that is a key mechanic to his boss fight. Therefore you cannot argue that he scales to the later without actively ignoring the whole game and lying to yourself. It requires too much cognitive dissonance, an alternate explanation ought to be proposed and was accepted in past threads.

Can you for once tone down the insults? Being a former staff doesn't give you the authority to talk down on others like this.

Heat. Resistance. Isn't. Equal. To. Physical. Durability. What part of that do you not understand?

 

[Starsprite53]

He still able to tank it

 

[DaReaperMan]

Look at you. You can't even read an argument. This is a scripted mechanic where Bowser is harmed by the reactor and Mario wouldn't be able to defeat him otherwise. And the Prima Guide you guys love bringing up so much outright states that Bowser can't touch the reactor without burning himself because of the power in it. Meaning Bowser doesn't scale.

Look at the supporters for Mario for me Matthew, which name do you not see on there?

 

[Greenshifter]

Most often of the time they don't have that many good feats actually.

Waverider was gonna get destroyed by being in the sun for too long yet can tank a nuke point-blank.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Frankly, I would agree with a "possibly Low 2-C

 

[deonment]

You're talking nonsense. You can't even form a coherent sentence. The reactor by itself is much less powerful than the ensuing Grand Star Explosion. This is factual. Bowser is harmed by the former and that is a key mechanic to his boss fight. Therefore you cannot argue that he scales to the later without actively ignoring the whole game and lying to yourself. It requires too much cognitive dissonance, an alternate explanation ought to be proposed and was accepted in past threads.

of course, but that doesnt mean it still wouldnt be on the tier 2 scale. Harmed my ass, he was in pain yes but not hurt. It is heat does not equal dura you can get burned by a stove while being 9-C cause heat does not care about dura

 

[DaReaperMan]

of course, but that doesnt mean it still wouldnt be on the tier 2 scale. Harmed my ass, he was in pain yes but not hurt. It is heat does not equal dura you can get burned by a stove while being 9-C cause heat does not care about dura

Heat generally harms, that part of your argument sucks lol

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

of course, but that doesnt mean it still wouldnt be on the tier 2 scale. Harmed my ass, he was in pain yes but not hurt. It is heat does not equal dura you can get burned by a stove while being 9-C cause heat does not care about dura

"He was in pain but not hurt."

You are incoherent.

The heat feat is literally grasping at straws. You're literally arguing that he is Low 2-C via an explosion which would also involve much greater heat.

Can you for once tone down the insults? Being a former staff doesn't give you the authority to talk down on others like this.

I give you the right to talk down to me.

Waverider was gonna get destroyed by being in the sun for too long yet can tank a nuke point-blank.

Don't care about CW. Address the argument with Mario itself. If you can't and need to grasp at straws chances are your argument isn't solid.

 

[deonment]

Heat generally harms, that part of your argument sucks lol

I am going of the you can touch a seatbelt without getting harmed but you can still feel pain

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

Absorbing a small portion of an infinite power source seemingly doesn’t mean you scale to its Tier (i.e. not every single Speedster in DC is Low 1-C for drawing power from the Speed Force), but since Bowser literally swallowed it whole why couldn’t he scale to the full yield?

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

"He was just harmed by heat he wasn't physically harmed" is an insane argument. If you are burned you are harmed. And you're literally arguing for Bowser being infinitely powerful meaning he shouldn't be harmed by any heat whatsoever.

You're simultaneously arguing that a tiny fraction of Low 2-C is Low 2-C and that Bowser's heat durability is infinitely lower. This is cognitive dissonance / dishonesty and you can't do both at once.

 

[Greenshifter]

This literally means that you can't make someone Low 2-C based on having a tiny fraction of Low 2-C.

Show me where this is stated in the rules, cause again several staff would disagree and you haven't even argued why this would be the case aside from "it's not allowed".

 

[DaReaperMan]

I am going of the you can touch a seatbelt without getting harmed but you can still feel pain

Burning something harms it...

 

[Ari64-SP]

"He was just harmed by heat he wasn't physically harmed" is an insane argument. If you are burned you are harmed. .

Bro, most characters are hurt by lava. We gonna downgrade all Mario characters to tier 9 For not surviving lava? 9-B Sonic for burning himself? No! Heat is different from straight durability.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Bro, most characters are hurt by lava. We gonna downgrade all Mario characters to tier 9 For not surviving lava? 9-B Sonic for burning himself? No! Heat is different from straight durability.

This is the "But Goku would be downgraded" fallacy. This is irrelevant to the discussion at hand and it's just an attempt to derail the conversation and simultaneously move the goalpost.

Bowser's durability with lava is inconsistent with in some games it melting him to bones and in others him tanking it. But this is irrelevant to my point as the inside of the reactor is nothing but pure energy, not fire or lava.

 

[DaReaperMan]

This is the "But Goku would be downgraded" fallacy. This is irrelevant to the discussion at hand and it's just an attempt to derail the conversation and simultaneously move the goalpost.

Bowser's durability with lava is inconsistent with in some games it melting him to bones and in others him tanking it. But this is irrelevant to my point as the inside of the reactor is nothing but pure energy, not fire or lava.

Hey Matthew, have you ever heard of Thermal Energy?

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Yeah, no. Heat doesn't ignore durability up to Low 2-C. That asinine. You're implying the sun could feasibly hurt someone who can bust the universe.
If this were 3-B or something, you'd have an argument, but an infinite durability gap is something that some hax just can't bypass, and heat and radiation are among them. Not all hax is equal guys.

 

[TheGatememer]

"He was in pain but not hurt."

You are incoherent.

The heat feat is literally grasping at straws. You're literally arguing that he is Low 2-C via an explosion which would also involve much greater heat.

Create a sitewide revision giving anyone above/around Tier 9 Extreme Heat Resistance before trying to argue that Bowser being harmed by heat is an anti-feat. You can't argue that it's an anti-feat without proving heat scales to physical durability. Besides, even if it was, if he was really that weak, Bowser would've been instantly incinerated rather than just hurt.

I give you the right to talk down to me.

That's not the ******* point. This is already a controversial thread as is. Stop trying to gaslight and cause this thread to become another toxic mess. Quit it or I'm reporting you to the RVR.

 

[DragonLord]

Bro, most characters are hurt by lava. We gonna downgrade all Mario characters to tier 9 For not surviving lava? 9-B Sonic for burning himself?

It feels kinda funny to mention Sonic when I feel like the same verse would be used against you, like Shadow says he uses the Maximum Power of the Emeralds, Emeralds are stated to have unlimited and Infinite Energy numerous times, therefore High 3-A at minimum, obviously that would be a flawed argument as Shadow hasn’t Destroyed a Infinite Universe or something, wouldn’t Grand Star Bowser go by the same rules?

 

[DaReaperMan]

Yeah, no. Heat doesn't ignore durability up to Low 2-C. That asinine. You're implying the sun could feasibly hurt someone who can bust the universe.
If this were 3-B or something, you'd have an argument, but an infinite durability gap is something that some hax just can't bypass, and heat and radiation are among them. Not all hax is equal guys.

Agreed

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Heat cannot bypass infinite durability, guys. It's not that good of a hax.

Exceptions of course for heat sources with proper feats and such.

 

[Starsprite53]

This is the "But Goku would be downgraded" fallacy. This is irrelevant to the discussion at hand and it's just an attempt to derail the conversation and simultaneously move the goalpost.

Bowser's durability with lava is inconsistent with in some games it melting him to bones and in others him tanking it. But this is irrelevant to my point as the inside of the reactor is nothing but pure energy, not fire or lava.

Being hurt doesn't mean he cannot scale at all
He is still able to tank a fraction of low 2-C,
This going to waste time like how you argued surface area for low 2-C

 

[Starsprite53]

It feels kinda funny to mention Sonic when I feel like the same verse would be used against you, like Shadow says he uses the Maximum Power of the Emeralds, Emeralds are stated to have unlimited and Infinite Energy numerous times, therefore High 3-A at minimum, obviously that would be a flawed argument as Shadow hasn’t Destroyed a Infinite Universe or something, wouldn’t Grand Star Bowser go by the same rules?

Cool, the problem is chaos emeralds are much different, in lore their power varies depends on emotions and other things

 

[TheGatememer]

Either way, it really isn't that strong of an anti-feat. The main thing that is actually harming Bowser is Mario attacking him, the heat is basically just stunning him allowing him to be attacked.

I was using the sun as an example. It's not the sun, but a Low 2-C power source.

 

[DragonLord]

Cool, the problem is chaos emeralds are much different, in lore their power varies depends on emotions and other things

But the Character in Question is directly said to be Using it’s Maximum, kinda nullifies it having Varying Power

I mean Hell they Mention the Unlimited Power of all 7 Emeralds when they put them into Emerl saying how dangerous Emerl will be

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Hey, guys, chill a bit. Remember that this is a thread about making Mario occupy the same tier as Goku. There's no need for personal insults.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

He is still able to tank a fraction of low 2-C,

This is meaningless. The end result would be to have literally everything in the Mario Universe be Low 2-C because "you can't divide infinity". The simpler explanation is that it's simply not scalable.

 

[Starsprite53]

This is meaningless. The end result would be to have literally everything in the Mario Universe be Low 2-C because "you can't divide infinity". The simpler explanation is that it's simply not scalable.

Again, what makes you think that fraction is lower than low 2-C? And what makes you think grand star amped bowser is lower low 2-C?
Just because he is able to spit it out it doesn't mean he didn't use all of it's power like at all,

 

[TheShieldToronto76]

Most often of the time they don't have that many good feats actually.


He didn't. Do you understand that the Big Bang's heat is trillions of times higher than that of a reactor that just served as a catalyst for that same explosion. You can't simultaneously argue that he survived the former while being weak to the later.

HEADCANON dude

 

[The_Wright_Way]

HEADCANON dude

How exactly?

 

[Starsprite53]

Matt you're basically saying (like usually) "this can be something" but doesn't mean that it has to be those,keep your interpretations to yourself.
Again, Bowser absorbed all of the power source itself not just a part of it, the second phase already implied that.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

So, the argument here is that Bowser isn't Low 2-C because heat from a Low 2-C reactor can hurt him and kept him from interacting directly with the reactor, am I getting that right?

 

[DaReaperMan]

So, the argument here is that Bowser isn't Low 2-C because heat from a Low 2-C reactor can hurt him and kept him from interacting directly with the reactor, am I getting that right?

I believe so

 

[The_Wright_Way]

...But wouldn't heat from a Low 2-C reactor be Low 2-C in itself, thus negating the argument thanks to heat's ability to ignore durability?

 

[InfiniteDay]

So the argument is Bowser is not Low 2-C because he was damaged by a Low 2-C source of power. But from what i've read, he never died from it? The argument and counterargument are flawed. You can be Low 2-C and be damaged by Low 2-C's, this should be known?

 

[Starsprite53]

So, the argument here is that Bowser isn't Low 2-C because heat from a Low 2-C reactor can hurt him and kept him from interacting directly with the reactor, am I getting that right?

Yeah, and because of that he couldn't survive the supernova in the end, which the guide and the cutscene implied otherwise ("shooken by his narrow escape from a horrible fate"), espacially if he got effected by the reset he should be just as fine as the birds and toads and other things, but he can barely wake up and he even seems hurted

 

[Starsprite53]

So the argument is Bowser is not Low 2-C because he was damaged by a Low 2-C source of power. But from what i've read, he never died from it? The argument and counterargument are flawed. You can be Low 2-C and be damaged by Low 2-C's, this should be known?

Yeah

 

[The_Wright_Way]

I support Low 2-C as well.