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Major Mario CRT 2: The Lost Levels

Finished. I didn't add the Gentle Pull scan since I would prefer if I can see the scan in mind and maybe evaluate it.
 
So I'd like to discuss the potency of the Gentle Pull's fate manipulation. As in, how good is it?
 
Is there anything left to do here?
 
We already addressed that detail, and more importantly. Dino said it's a really bad time to be making too many big upgrades like that given the Forum move is WIP.
 
I'm personally for it. Can't be worse than some other ratings/upgrades and there's enough evidence I'd say. But meh.
 
As for the Gentle Pull stuff, here are her exact quotes:

"When that evil monster took our star power... I was separated from my precious little one... But I knew we'd see each other again." "Because..." "There is a force that binds us, defying even time and space... Not even the laws of the universe can stop it. I knew its gentle pull would prevail." "It is the desire to be reunited with someone who is important to you. That pull is what brought us together." "We have come through so much to meet again. This is not some mere whim of the stars... I am sure of that."

Basically you can corroborate this with Mario's wish to always save Peach since she states the boundless force is the desire to be reunited with someone important to you. This gentle pull that binds a set of people who wish to reunite with others cannot be stopped by the laws of the universe, defying time and space. As long as anyone in the Marioverse wishes/desires to be reunited with soneone, it will happen even despite the laws of physics and such. You can wrtie this off as some big fancy way of saying if you love someone then that love will always let you defy the odds, but it's vague for a reason, I'd bet.

Anyways, I"m gonna try amd see if I can find the Japanese dialogue to see if that version differs or gers into more specifics.
 
Managed to get one line of her Japanese dialogue translated so far.

She talks about "The power that connects us, transcending time and space..."

I also roughly translated the rest of tbe dialogue and it's more or less similar to the English dialogue from the snippets I can pick out. I can post the japanese scans here if y'all would like
 
Here's the whole translation of the important dialogue from 2 sources:

Translation 1:

"The strength which binds us together, that we may overcome time and space"

"That not even the cosmos can obstruct"

"Because we know the existence of that warm 'gravitation'"

"The desire of wanting to see those which we hold dear"

"That "gravitation" is what binds us together"

"The fact that through this pilgrimage I was able to meet you

is not something as whimsical as a phenomenon brought upon by the stars"

Translation 2:

µÖéÚûôÒü¿þ®║ÚûôÒéÆÞÂàÒüêÒÇüÒéÅÒüƒÒüùÒüƒÒüíþÁÉÒü│þÂÜÒüæÒéïÒÇîÕèø]

"The power to connect us beyond time and space"

- Õ«çÕ«ÖÒü«þÉåÒüºÒééÚÿ╗ÒéÇÒüôÒü¿Òü«Õç║µØÑÒü¬Òüä

"Not even the laws of the universe can stop it"

- µ©®ÒüïÒüäÒÇîÕ╝òÕèøÒÇìÒü«Õ¡ÿÕ£¿ÒéÆÒéÅÒüƒÒüùÒü»þƒÑÒüúÒüªÒüäÒéïÒüïÒéëÒüºÒüÖ

"Because I know there is a warm 'gravitation'"

- ÒÇîÕñºÕêçÒü¬õ║║Òü½õ╝ÜÒüäÒüƒÒüäÒÇìÒü¿ÚíÿÒüåµ░ùµîüÒüí

"The feeling of wanting to meet a 'Special Someone'"

- ÒüØÒü«ÒÇîÕ╝òÕèøÒÇìÒüîÒéÅÒüƒÒüùÒüƒÒüíÒéÆÕ╝òÒüìÕÉêÒéÅÒüøÒéïÒü«ÒüºÒüÖ

"And that 'gravitation' brings us even closer together"

- ÒüôÒü«ÕÀíÒéèÒüºÒééÒüéÒü¬ÒüƒÒü½Õç║õ╝ÜÒüêÒüƒÒü«Òü»

"The reason I met you on this journey was..."

- µÿƒÒÇàÒüîÒüèÒüôÒüùÒüƒµ░ùÒééÒüÉÒéîÒü¬þÅ¥Þ▒íÒüºÒü»þäíÒüäÒü¿

"...not just a fickle occurrence caused by the stars"

So basically she says that it's fate that brought them all together and not some weird cosmic coincidence, and that there is a warm "gravitation" (likely what the "Gentle Pull" was translated as) that binds them all, being the desire to see people they consider special which allows them all to overcome and defy the laws of the cosmos, time and space included. Overall there's many different interpretations it seems, but it all generally has the same overall meaning and corroborates with the English translation.
 
Please do, this is actually useful. If the Gentle Pull defies time and space, as well as transcend it...we should be to give it immeasurable speed. Along with that, would this make the potency of Mario's fate hax on a higher dimensional scale? Because the Gentle Pull is stated to transcend time and space. I think this might actually upgrade the Gentle Pull AND how powerful Mario's fate manipulation is.
 
Well, every quote, from English to three separate fluent Japanse speakers translating the text has lead to statements of "A force that connects us beyond time and space" or "The power that connects us, transcending time and space", and "The strength that connects us, that we may overcome time and space" as well as all mentioning the cosmos/universe can't stop it or obstruct it.

So it looks pretty likely.

Screenshot 2020-04-08-02-01-31-1
Here are the Japanese scans btw in case you guys want to verify the translations yourselves
 
I still think Dimentio should have dark prognosticus abilities since he is owner of it,maybe possibly fate manipulation?
 
I'd say low 2C to 2B @datoneweeb. Plus the gentle pull tier needs to come back. We can talk about but not make anymore huge changes since the forum move is at play so we need to hold off on that
 
I still think the Dark Prognosticus shouldn't count as Fate hax. It's kind of implied Dimentio had been pulling the strings all the time, so I'd more say he was the one making sure the prophecy he wrote would go right
 
I have to unsubscribe from this thread due to time constraints. You can notify me later via my message wall if you need my help after you have reached a conclusion.
 
Those translations could be quite useful as people were wondering if it applies to Tier 2 and speed ratings for Gentle Pull.
 
Well it's all up to y'all. If you need anything else to be translated like maybe from a few vague items descriptions or whatever I think I could try and get some translations for those. My next attempt will be to get the Crystal Stars lore translated and I'll post it in the Discussion Thread if I find anything useful.
 
Oh yeah. I only got one difference in that "hold the essence of the heavens" thing translates to the demons gathering the power of the stars that fell from the heavens and using their power to create the Star Stones (Crystal Stars). Not sure what stars they're talking about there. Maybe the Star Pieces? But either way it's not that relevant.
 
As for Low 2-C Mario casts, it should be worth noting that "the power of the stars" that Bowser gloats about acquiring is also, by a fellow Luma, said to be gifted to Mario by the young Master Luma. Whether this "power of the stars" was just the spin is still up for debate though. This could potentially justify a Low 2-C rating for Mario when gifted the Power of the Stars by the Luma since it could directly combat Giant Galaxy Bowser who's Low 2-C with the Power of the Stars (because of the Grand Star) he obtained. And it should be noted this isn't base form Mario, and that just because he's beaten Powwr Star users in base doesn't mean he scales to their full potential, as a Grand Star, Big Star (Bowser has this in 64 and claims he had the "Power of the Stars" there), and many Power Stars (as seen by endgame 64 Mario) are needed in order for you to be able to fully utilise this "Power of the Stars". Hell, the name even implies it's plural, and since a Grand Star and the Big Star are proven > a single Power Star, it's fitting IMO. And the Lumas all sacrificing themselves are like multiple Power Stars (since they can become them) being used to combat the Low 2-C Black Hole, aka the Power of the Stars, a Low 2-C force being used to revert a Low 2-C event. And Master Luma is considered special and should be considered special, as he's the only Luma who directly aids Mario in fighting as well the evidence from the pics below.

Screenshot 2020-04-09-22-12-05
Lumas stating that Master Luma could help Mario use the Power of the Stars

Screenshot 2020-04-09-22-12-49
Lumas making the distinction that they can only help "a little" when in comparison to what Master Luma could do, showing he's a special case among Lumas as well

Given Luigi, Mario, even Bowser, and Rosalina (in 3D World) could use the spin and canonically have access to the Power of the Stars, this would obviously scale to them. Bowser Jr. via Grand Star-powered mechs would also stay at his rating. Anyone who's never used multiple Power Stars at once, a Grand Star, or the Big Star likely wouldn't scale. However, luckily Wario and Yoshi do gain access to several Power Stars and share the same power soirce as Mario in 64, so they likely had the Power of the Stars in 64 as well. Peach is arguable and DK never had any of this so he'd stay where he is from scaling to Base Mario.
 
Yes, we can hold off on any upgrades being added, but I just wanted to provide something that's more substantiated for the argument and hopefully more agreeable. Upgrades can be added after the forum move and this thread is supposed to just be for what we agree on to be added when the forum move happens.
 
I might as well dump some stuff here.

Mario, Luigi, Peach, Bowser, and Dimentio: Resistance to Time Stop, they were able to move inside the Void after being able to destroy time. Timeless Void speed feats were negged but some have said over there that you can resist time stop with it.

Mario, Luigi, Peach, Bowser: Resistance to Ice & Sleep manipulation. You can break out of being frozen or asleep in Super Paper Mario along with breaking free from ice in New Super Mario Bros Wii.

Literally anyone who doesn't get affected by Kamek: Resistance to transmutation. Kamek can turn objects into several things like Koopas, Mushrooms, etc. The cast doesn't change form when getting hit by this, and Kamek uses the exact same spells.

Anyone who can use Power Stars: Resistance to Mind Manipulation. Wiggler stated that ever since he's gotten the Power Star, he started feeling strange and acts a lot more agressive. He then claims that he feels better when giving you the Star, essentially meaning Power Stars can corrupt you. Mario and everyone else feel fine when using one.
 
Also, since Super Mario Maker is canon via its sequel, this should give Mario resistance to:

Existance Erasure: Completely unaffected by the Rocket which erases your entire level, as well as the eraser and Undo Dog.

Possibly Telekinesis/Reality Warping...?: He can break out of the players grip who you know, creates levels, enemies, and power-ups out of nowhere. He also reacts to you when attempting to erase Mario.
 
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