Magi Revision

[Lormac_CC]

I will give some counter arguments for low 1-A stuff lla

Alright

 

[Bernkastelll]

I disagree with Low 1-A as well

 

[Lormac_CC]

he will need prove and not statements about defeating gods inside

What prove, I don't even understand you anymore.

 

[Lormac_CC]

I disagree with Low 1-A as well

Reasons

 

[Bernkastelll]

Reasons

No scans even prove Low 1-A

 

[Lormac_CC]

No scans even prove Low 1-A

But one does prove High 1-B

 

[PrinceofPein]

Sorry for not making it clear, it is an infinite hierarchy, they are climbing it one step a time, they will never reach the top, it is like an infinite stairwell climbing one step at a time you will never reach the top.
Now the palace works by swapping hierarchy with the person directly above you, hence it works one step at a time so they will never truly reach the top. All of David statements are flowery and none of it implies that they will exist outside the hierarchy things like "take my hand let us see the destiny that exists beyond this infinite battle" in the context of him motivating sinbad to use the palace to swap hierarchy with higher gods is a flowery statement coupled with the way the palace works of swapping hierarchy one step at a time hence totally disagree they will never reach the top.

 

[Lormac_CC]

My agurment for High 1-B

Sinbad potentially Key taken to be superior to the gods who are in a High 1-B Hierarchy, His destiny is to destroy this, the destiny rule affects all of the gods in their Infinite number. David also had and saw same destiny as Sinbad, in this scan he says he and Sinbad would break the dimensions, defeat the gods and see the end of destiny (this mean their destiny) that spreads beyond the Infinite battles(gods). This is pretty simple.

 

[Delta333]

Quick response for low 1-A stuff:

1.Throughout this series nothing imply that a place outside of this hierarchy actually exists,you just randomly find only one page about being beyond infinite battles and quickly come to this conclusion.As for the context of this chapter,Sinbad,who was used to be an ally of David,suddenly fought against David and since David want Sinbad to be on his side again he literally continuously said all kinds of flowery language to persuade Sinbad (since Sinbad completely gave up to defeat higher gods). I mean if a teacher said to student with something like "working hard and you will reach a far better future which lies beyond this blue sky" it doesn't mean that if said student works hard he can go to outer space lol

2.But even if a place outside of this hierarchy actually exists they will still never reach there.Keep in mind that they use magic to absorb the rukh of lower world to ascend to higher plane (which is a part of the hierarchy and I think I don't need to explain why) unless you want to say that one random plane of existence suddenly go to beyond this hierarchy with totally no reason.

About the high 1-B stuff,as the one who found this scan to upgrade some characters recently I can confidently said that I have read chapter countless times and the scan that you use is completely out of context.Sinbad doesn't say that he will destroy this high 1-B hierarchy,he only want to bring down the higher gods system,which means using SP to reduce dimensionality of gods and defeat them (just like what Ugo did with Ilah like he said by himself).He said he need bigger power to do that because he needs to use rukh of one entire world to step to higher plane,so again it has nothing to do with the destruction of high 1-B hierarchy

 

[Lormac_CC]

My agurment for High 1-B

Sinbad potentially Key taken to be superior to the gods who are in a High 1-B Hierarchy, His destiny is to destroy this, the destiny rule affects all of the gods in their Infinite number. David also had and saw same destiny as Sinbad, in this scan he says he and Sinbad would break the dimensions, defeat the gods and see the end of destiny (this mean their destiny) that spreads beyond the Infinite battles(gods). This is pretty simple.

 

[Antvasima]

I agree with Delta and Pain. That is the way that I remember things as well.

 

[Lormac_CC]

Quick response for low 1-A stuff:

1.Throughout this series nothing imply that a place outside of this hierarchy actually exists,you just randomly find only one page about being beyond infinite battles and quickly come to this conclusion.As for the context of this chapter,Sinbad,who was used to be an ally of David,suddenly fought against David and since David want Sinbad to be on his side again he literally continuously said all kinds of flowery language to persuade Sinbad (since Sinbad completely gave up to defeat higher gods). I mean if a teacher said to student with something like "working hard and you will reach a far better future which lies beyond this blue sky" it doesn't mean that if said student works hard he can go to outer space lol

2.But even if a place outside of this hierarchy actually exists they will still never reach there.Keep in mind that they use magic to absorb the rukh of lower world to ascend to higher plane (which is a part of the hierarchy and I think I don't need to explain why) unless you want to say that one random plane of existence suddenly go to beyond this hierarchy with totally no reason.

About the high 1-B stuff,as the one who found this scan to upgrade some characters recently I can confidently said that I have read chapter countless times and the scan that you use is completely out of context.Sinbad doesn't say that he will destroy this high 1-B hierarchy,he only want to bring down the higher gods system,which means using SP to reduce dimensionality of gods and defeat them (just like what Ugo did with Ilah like he said by himself).He said he need bigger power to do that because he needs to use rukh of one entire world to step to higher plane,so again it has nothing to do with the destruction of high 1-B hierarchy

Will reply this

 

[Delta333]

BTW I forget to say that even if a place outside of this hierarchy exists for real (which currently doesn't) David only said that he will see the fate beyond those battles instead of going outside or transcending the hierarchy,they're two different things

 

[OriginFox]

I agree with pretty much everything here, except the key upgrades, the reasons are already given above by Delta and others. But I'll explain if I have to.

 

[Lormac_CC]

Throughout this series nothing imply that a place outside of this hierarchy actually exists

Didn't say this in the thread, there isn't anything outside

As for the context of this chapter,Sinbad,who was used to be an ally of David,suddenly fought against David and since David want Sinbad to be on his side again he literally continuously said all kinds of flowery language to persuade Sinbad (since Sinbad completely gave up to defeat higher gods). I mean if a teacher said to student with something like "working hard and you will reach a far better future which lies beyond this blue sky" it doesn't mean that if said student works hard he can go to outer space lol

Why are we assuming that David and Sinbad weren't Allies when he made this statement, or that Sinbad had given up on defeating the gods, this says otherwise, the only reason they fought at that point was the one god per dimension policy, so throwing away the scan because you think it is a motivational speech doesn't really add up.

But even if a place outside of this hierarchy actually exists they will still never reach there.Keep in mind that they use magic to absorb the rukh of lower world to ascend to higher plane (which is a part of the hierarchy and I think I don't need to explain why) unless you want to say that one random plane of existence suddenly go to beyond this hierarchy with totally no reason.

I really don't see how this counters my point, my point it is Sinbad's Destiny to do things, I don't really understand your point here.

About the high 1-B stuff,as the one who found this scan to upgrade some characters recently I can confidently said that I have read chapter countless times and the scan that you use is completely out of context.Sinbad doesn't say that he will destroy this high 1-B hierarchy,he only want to bring down the higher gods system,which means using SP to reduce dimensionality of gods and defeat them (just like what Ugo did with Ilah like he said by himself).He said he need bigger power to do that because he needs to use rukh of one entire world to step to higher plane,so again it has nothing to d

I never said he was going to destroy the Hierarchy, the scan clearly say destroy destiny rule and bring down the system, both my Low 1-A and High 1-B agurment are the same, but it seems I would leave the low 1-A as Sinbad would require a huge jump

 

[Delta333]

Why are we assuming that David and Sinbad weren't Allies when he made this statement, or that Sinbad had given up on defeating the gods, this says otherwise, the only reason they fought at that point was the one god per dimension policy, so throwing away the scan because you think it is a motivational speech doesn't really add up.

...
I think you have this series but...no offensive did you even read this damn manga? I mean what I have said blantantly happens in this arc??????? That is probably one of the most important part of this series bruh,I can find scan for non readers but if you seriously want to see scan then I will leave this thread

I really don't see how this counters my point, my point it is Sinbad's Destiny to do things, I don't really understand your point here.

Yes it counters your point,David want both will together go to defeat higher gods by using a magic that I forgot its name,said magic will use rukh of lower world to ascend to higher plane,which means it can't be used to go outside the hierarchy since higher plane is a part of hierarchy and you said it didn't counter your point? Or if they have another kind of magic pls show me

I never said he was going to destroy the Hierarchy, the scan clearly say destroy destiny rule and bring down the system, both my Low 1-A and High 1-B agurment are the same, but it seems I would leave the low 1-A as Sinbad would require a huge jump

Bringing down the system in this context is doing same thing as what Ugo did to Il Ilah,as Sinbad said by himself and to do it this he would need a greater power to reach the higher plane,so it has nothing to do with affecting the entire high 1-B hierarchy at all

 

[Lormac_CC]

Sorry for not making it clear, it is an infinite hierarchy, they are climbing it one step a time, they will never reach the top, it is like an infinite stairwell climbing one step at a time you will never reach the top.

You might not like this but I have to use other cause it seems you have forgotten that characters have reached higher tier via a step at a time. The Umineko ladder is considered infinite even if all witches reach the top by climbing one step at a time, same with SCP 3812's shenanigans. Even if you want to use Yuri context, if wouldn't change the fact that Featherine reached her level by moving one step at a time, so this isn't any reason to discard it.

All of David statements are flowery and none of it implies that they will exist outside the hierarchy things like "take my hand let us see the destiny that exists beyond this infinite battle" in the context of him motivating sinbad to use the palace to swap hierarchy with higher gods is a flowery statement coupled with the way the palace works of swapping hierarchy one step at a time hence totally disagree they will never reach the top

First point I made counters this

 

[Rabbit2002]

Everything seem fine except low 1-A and high 1-B

 

[Antvasima]

Just a note that Umineko has evidence of characters reaching beyond the hierarchies, whereas that is not the case here. We should evaluate different fictions on an individual basis.

 

[Lormac_CC]

I think you have this series but...no offensive did you even read this damn manga? I mean what I have said blantantly happens in this arc??????? That is probably one of the most important part of this series bruh,I can find scan for non readers but if you seriously want to see scan then I will leave this thread

I am not saying that it didn't happen, I am saying that at the time David made that statement, David believed that Sinbad was an ally

Yes it counters your point,David want both will together go to defeat higher gods by using a magic that I forgot its name,said magic will use rukh of lower world to ascend to higher plane,which means it can't be used to go outside the hierarchy since higher plane is a part of hierarchy and you said it didn't counter your point? Or if they have another kind of magic pls show me

They want to defeat higher gods but they aren't using any Magic, ascending to a higher layer requires large amount of magoi which is why they needed Aladdin world to return to rukh, they needed all the rukh they could get, I don't still get your point here.

Bringing down the system in this context is doing same thing as what Ugo did to Il Ilah,as Sinbad said by himself and to do it this he would need a greater power to reach the higher plane,so it has nothing to do with affecting the entire high 1-B hierarchy at all

Seriously, that context is so wrong in so many ways, the main thing is destiny, here is the full stuff, you can read it and tell me the context

 

[Lormac_CC]

Just a note that Umineko has evidence of characters reaching beyond the hierarchies, whereas that is not the case here. We should evaluate different fictions on an individual basis.

But it doesn't really change the fact that they followed the Infinite ladder step by step. This isn't really different

 

[Delta333]

I am not saying that it didn't happen, I am saying that at the time David made that statement, David believed that Sinbad was an ally

Uhhh no both continuously fought against each other and you said they're allies???

They want to defeat higher gods but they aren't using any Magic, ascending to a higher layer requires large amount of magoi which is why they needed Aladdin world to return to rukh, they needed all the rukh they could get, I don't still get your point here.

My point is,they can't go outside the hierarchy because they don't even have any ability to do that?Like I said ascending to higher plane is the best thing that their magics can do

Seriously, that context is so wrong in so many ways, the main thing is destiny, here is the full stuff, you can read it and tell me the context

Okay I have read it and nothing say what will he do to to affect the entire high 1-B hierarchy

 

[Delta333]

Anyways my arguments are done here,it would be a joke if low 1-A stuff is accepted

 

[Antvasima]

But it doesn't really change the fact that they followed the Infinite ladder step by step. This isn't really different

We don't know if they only took one step at a time during an eternity or not, but we do know that the Magi hierarchy has to be climbed in this manner.

You are being rather unreasonable here.

 

[Antvasima]

Anyways my arguments are done here,it would be a joke if low 1-A stuff is accepted

Yes, we should move on from that discussion.

 

[Lormac_CC]

Uhhh no both continuously fought against each other and you said they're allies???

Please read till the end

My point is,they can't go outside the hierarchy because they don't even have any ability to do that?Like I said ascending to higher plane is the best thing that their magics can do

Your agurment is the Infinite one step at a time

Okay I have read it and nothing say what will he do to to affect the entire high 1-B hierarchy

There are Infinite gods, controlling each other destiny, Sinbad destiny = Stopping/destroying the destiny rule for which he has to fight the Infinite gods to do so

 

[Lormac_CC]

Anyways my arguments are done here,it would be a joke if low 1-A stuff is accepted

Did you read what I said earlier, I said High 1-B was more appropriate, I am not arguing for low 1-A but High 1-B

 

[Lormac_CC]

We don't know if they only took one step at a time during an eternity or not, but we do know that the Magi hierarchy has to be climbed in this manner.

You are being rather unreasonable here.

This was Sinbad Destiny, it is more something that he and David are destined to do.

 

[Delta333]

Did you read what I said earlier, I said High 1-B was more appropriate, I am arguing for low 1-A but High 1-B

I disagree with both,you just use one random image about bringing down the system,which just simply means defeating 1-B gods to free all ppl from the fate instead of affecting entire high 1-B hierarchy

I highly recommend next time you prepare better thread with good structure instead of just one or two images on OP for attempting any pointless upgrade,especially for high tier like high 1-B or low 1-A

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, High 1-B is not going to be accepted, and I do not have enough free time to continue to repeat myself about that, so I would appreciate if you are reasonable and focus on the other suggested revisions here instead.

 

[Lormac_CC]

I disagree with both,you just use one random image about bringing down the system,which just simply means defeating 1-B gods to free all ppl from the fate instead of affecting entire high 1-B hierarchy

I highly recommend next time you prepare better thread with good structure instead of just one or two images on OP for attempting any pointless upgrade,especially for high tier like high 1-B or low 1-A

I did bring two scans, one of Sinbad defeating the 1-B gods and the second of David saying that they defeat the 1-B gods and go beyond. You have tried to pass off the David agurment as flowery but you haven't proven why it is flowery

 

[Delta333]

I did bring two scans, one of Sinbad defeating the 1-B gods and the second of David saying that they defeat the 1-B gods and go beyond. You have tried to pass off the David agurment as flowery but you haven't proven why it is flowery

What? I have proved it, you just simply don't accept it that's why you said I haven't,anyways I don't care about this problem anymore since I don't think it will be accepted,after all you're the only person in this thread who still want to defend for this headcanon

 

[Lormac_CC]

What? I have proved it, you just simply don't accept it that's why you said I haven't,anyways I don't care about this problem anymore since I don't think it will be accepted,after all you're the only person in this thread who still want to defend for this headcanon

Would love to continue this discussion but Ant has said I should stop so I will respect that.

 

[Elizhaa]

Large Type 10 seems fine, from the points above; llah and David would have it from seeing 4-D structures as fiction.

The other stuff besides the key upgrade seems fine, also from the points above.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

I agree with Elizhaa and OriginFox. Everything seems perfectly fine to me, but I'm not very convinced about the upgrade personally, sorry.

 

[Lormac_CC]

I guess only the potentially Key was rejected. I believe this is accepted

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, except for the High 1-B part, this is probably fine to apply.

 

[Lormac_CC]

Right now gods have no regeneration at all. Well this point was brought up by @Delta333, I do believe at the very least they should scale or be comparable to Sinbad or David

 

[Delta333]

Yes, except for the High 1-B part, this is probably fine to apply.

Can those profiles be unlocked now?

 

[Lormac_CC]

Right now gods have no regeneration at all. Well this point was brought up by @Delta333, I do believe at the very least they should scale or be comparable to Sinbad or David

After thinking about yes mid godly should be removed, we don't even know much about them, we don't even know if they have souls.