Lord Boros Speed Issue still hasn't been resolved.

[USklaverei]

We can use type:

At least Relativistic+ (Kicked Saitama to the moon near the speed of light, according to Newtonian mechanics, for Boros to launch Saitama with only one leg, his speed would have to be greater than how he was launched.)

 

[USklaverei]

Oh, so you're just trying to argue that the description be changed?

Taking advantage, could you take a look at the question about speed (sandbox) and give your opinion?

 

[Slacjow]

That same energy is explicitly stated in both the manga and the databook to provide Boros with his "meteoric power" and his heightened speed.

The same energy was stated to boost Boros's speed, not the speed of anything that it coats into.
You can't prove your opinion because there's no actual statements supporting it, I already looked over it many times.

Oh, so you're just trying to argue that the description be changed?

Not just the description, the way he got the speed, because current justification relies on that "his energy can move stuff at SOL". You can't change the description so it could fit him, we have to give him new justification for Rel+, and if there's none, he loses it.
Unless USK's proposal gets accepted.

 

[Duedate8898]

Taking advantage, could you take a look at the question about speed (sandbox) and give your opinion?

Sure, it might be a little bit before I respond to that though.

 

[Axxtentacle]

The same energy was stated to boost Boros's speed, not the speed of anything that it coats into.
You can't prove your opinion because there's no actual statements supporting it, I already looked over it many times.

Other than the statement that says Boros’ energy has a repulsive force.

 

[Axxtentacle]

There’s also the statement about the energy having “repulsive force”, no? Doesn’t that support the notion that the energy had a part in it?

Also, I don’t see why it has to be black or white. If the energy has repulsive force, it very easily could just be that he got flung at that speed because of the energy, and didn’t have friction as well because of the energy, when both are stated.

You should probably address what I said.

 

[Duedate8898]

Not just the description, the way he got the speed, because current justification relies on that "his energy can move stuff at SOL". You can't change the description so it could fit him, we have to give him new justification for Rel+, and if there's none, he loses it.
Unless USK's proposal gets accepted.

I don't think that's how it is. At least it doesn't look like that, if he's shown physically moving someone at Relativistic speeds then he would naturally be rewarded that speed as well, especially since he's shown using a physical attack to do so. So the current rating sounds accurate and is only in need of change in description.

That's how I see it at least.

 

[Slacjow]

Other than the statement that says Boros’ energy has a repulsive force.

Sure, the statements says he uses his energy as propulsive force to enhance his body. Quoting word by word:
"Meteoritic burst achieves the speed beyond the bodies limit by releasing internal energy as propulsive force".
See? He enhances his body with his energy and uses it as a propulsive force for his body. Never is it stated that his energy moves everything it coats into at SOL.

I don't think that's how it is. At least it doesn't look like that, if he's shown physically moving someone at Relativistic speeds then he would naturally be rewarded that speed as well, especially since he's shown using a physical attack to do so. So the current rating sounds accurate and is only in need of change in description.

That's how I see it at least.

I don't think we grant speed to characters if they send someone flying with a punch, unless they intercept that character mid flight.
It's a strength feat, and it's not something Boros can do casually, Moon Kick used a lot of energy.

 

[Axxtentacle]

Why would the energy propel his body at those speeds, but not other things it comes in contact with, if it’s the same energy with the same propulsive force?

 

[Slacjow]

Why would the energy propel his body at those speeds, but not other things it comes in contact with, if it’s the same energy with the same propulsive force?

Because you have to prove that? I don't decide that, you have to prove that his energy carries everything its wrapped in at SOL, I don't need to prove it doesn't.
Anime characters use energy to enhance themselves all the time.
It's like you are giving a character an ability that has never been stated.

 

[USklaverei]

The impulse is equal to the momentum variation of a body (Qf - Qi). Saitama weighs 70kg, and was launched at 100 m / s
I = Qf - Qi
I = (100 m / s * 70) - (0)
I = 7000 kg.m / s

Here, the momentum is nothing more than the amount of movement that Boros' leg had when kicking Saitama.
Assuming your leg is 25kg.
Q = mv
7000 kg.m / s = 25 * v
25v = 7000 kg.m / s
v = 7000 kg.m / s / 25
v = 280 m / s

About 2.8x higher

 

[Axxtentacle]

Because you have to prove that? I don't decide that, you have to prove that his energy carries everything its wrapped in at SOL, I don't need to prove it doesn't.

I don’t see how the scans already there DON’T prove it. Logically, if the energy has propulsive force and the energy also stuck to Saitama, the conclusion should be that the energy played a part in it. Just because there’s a statement that the energy removed friction, it doesn’t mean the energy lost it’s propulsive force when that’s not shown to be the case.

Anime characters use energy to enhance themselves all the time.

That’s a false equivalency, this is entirely it’s own situation. This means nothing.

It's like you are giving a character an ability that has never been stated.

It’s very blatant in the feat and description of the energy, though.

 

[Slacjow]

I don’t see how the scans already there DON’T prove it. Logically, if the energy has propulsive force and the energy also stuck to Saitama, the conclusion should be that the energy played a part in it. Just because there’s a statement that the energy removed friction, it doesn’t mean the energy lost it’s propulsive force when that’s not shown to be the case.

I read the manga and I don't remember Boros saying "My energy can move things at SOL", if I am not mistaken he said "My body achieves the speed beyond its limits", not Saitama's body, Boros's body.
You are repeating redundant headcanon you can't prove, the manga doesn't prove, Murata doesn't prove, don't you think it's time to stop? It's irritating. I am going to be as blunt as possible, I don't care about your interpretation of whatever the manga says, I care about what the manga "actually" stated, without adding my own part of the story.

Can we have some staff opinion now? I think there's enough evidence to remove current justification that has literally ZERO support aside from unsupported fan theories.

 

[Axxtentacle]

No, don’t just dismiss me. You don’t need every little tidbit of information spoonfed to you like an infant, it’s the logical assumption that the energy can propell things it touches when it’s stated to have a propulsive force. I’m not writing part of the story, i’m using critical thinking.

Things don’t have to be directly stated when they’re shown and it’s very clearly portrayed to work in said way. This is a complete non-point.

Unsupported fan theories? I guess using basic logic to make a simple deduction based on what’s clearly shown in the manga is an unsupported fan theory. You’ve proven nothing, your points are wrong, and you’re openly admitting you don’t care about the other side’s points, which is a blatant fallacy.

 

[Slacjow]

Redundant circular debate is pointless.
I don't care about your interpretation, again. I am going to dismiss it because its wrong and it's headcanon that you came up with.
It isn't stated in the manga, isn't stated by Murata, isn't implied.

 

[Axxtentacle]

It IS implied. The energy is directly stated to have a propulsive force, and very clearly is shown on Saitama. It’s not just incorrect headcanon I came up with.

If you’d stop stonewalling and actually disprove literally anything, then this could go somewhere.

It doesn’t have to be one or the other, it can be that the energy propelled him + removed friction. There’s no reason to completely dismiss the propulsion part other than “I don’t believe statements in the manga”.

 

[Slacjow]

It IS implied. The energy is directly stated to have a propulsive force, and very clearly is shown on Saitama. It’s not just incorrect headcanon I came up with.

A propulsive force for BOROS"S BODY. Not Saitama's, nowhere its stated or implied. What is wrong with you?

 

[Axxtentacle]

The ENERGY ITSELF IS STATED TO HAVE A PROPULSIVE FORCE, SLACJOW. If the energy ENVELOPS SAITAMA, THEN THE MOST LOGICAL CONCLUSION IS THAT THE ENERGY LIKELY PLAYED A FACTOR IN SENDING HIM FLYING. It IS implied.

What even is this claim about only Boros’ body? The statement is that the ENERGY he uses is stated to have a propulsive force, and the energy is VERY BLATANTLY SHOWN on Saitama. That’s complete headcanon that’s contradicted in the exact same fight.

Are you ever going to disprove anything?

 

[ZoroNotZolo]

I disagree with the OP, the justification seems fine to me.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Redundant circular debate is pointless.
I don't care about your interpretation, again. I am going to dismiss it because its wrong and it's headcanon that you came up with.
It isn't stated in the manga, isn't stated by Murata, isn't implied.

Saying that you don't care about someone's interpretation, dismissing it and calling it wrong and headcanon is incredibly good if you want to rile people up and escalate the argument. Not so good if you are actually trying to have a civil discussion. The same goes for redundant and circular. Shouldn't you simply be presenting your arguments and trying to figure out what the other side isn't understanding that is apparently clear to you?

 

[Axxtentacle]

He claimed my interpretation was an “unsupported fan theory” when his interpretation of the energy only being used as a propulsive force for Boros’ body is quite literally contradicted by the existence of Boros’ beam attacks, where he takes his internal energy and blasts it at people. He uses this same internal energy as a propulsive force, and there’s a very distinct beam on Saitama as Boros kicks him. It’s self evident, but he argues against the actual manga while claiming other people’s interpretations are “unsupported fan theories”.

It’s just blatantly wrong. I have the scans from mangasee if they’re required, but they really shouldn’t be.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Well, if the energy has a propulsive force, then the idea of him being able to move other people or objects with them isn't far removed, especially if they are specifically getting wrapped in it. In that case the conclusion is that the energy is capable of propulsing anything it is wrapped in.

 

[Axxtentacle]

Exactly, yet he dismisses it and just claims it’s “wrong”.

 

[Nehz_XZX]

Well, the energy shouldn't have randomly changed its properties when it was wrapping around Saitama, so it should still have its propulsive force traits. It would by this logic also have the same protecting-against-heat-friction-effect that protected Saitama's clothes when wrapped around Boros.

 

[InfiniteDay]

Slacjow doesn't do himself any favors by massively committing the Ad Hominem fallacy.

 

[Qawsedf234]

The speed was accepted, but the current reasoning

At least Relativistic+ (Faster than before. Used his latent energy to generate an aura around himself and others that can move them at near lightspeed)

Isn't the reason why it was fully accepted. These were the following given reasons

• The Artbook description said that the aura negates friction which is why Saitama could be launched at high speeds
• Boros describes his energy as a propulsive force that increases his speed and strength
• The manga databook also back the above, saying he uses his energy to give him super speed

It should read something like

At least Relativistic+ (He uses his internal energy as a propulsive force to increase his speed, which allows him to move and launch targets at near-lightspeeds. Faster than before)

 

[ZoroNotZolo]

This is just my OCD, but I think the "Faster than before" should be first.

 

[Qawsedf234]

Faster than before is supporting evidence for an increased level in speed, not the main evidence. If Boros was being kept in the same speed level it'd go first, but because we're moving him up the evidence for that increase must come first. At least that's how I view it.

 

[ZoroNotZolo]

Faster than before is supporting evidence for an increased level in speed, not the main evidence. If Boros was being kept in the same speed level it'd go first, but because we're moving him up the evidence for that increase must come first. At least that's how I view it.

Like I said, that's just my OCD and weird way of viewing it, probably because most evidence for new speed keys start off with "Faster than before".

 

[Qawsedf234]

Everyone okay with me just changing the wording and closing the thread?

 

[Axxtentacle]

I mean, with how the thread has gone, the wording doesn't even need to be changed. Slac had an issue with the wording and his issue was debunked.

 

[USklaverei]

Everyone okay with me just changing the wording and closing the thread?

yes, it's fine

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Also fox the durability section, there's an editing mistake on my part

 

[Kachon123]

Everyone okay with me just changing the wording and closing the thread?

Im fine with it, but for me, im just dumbfounded how slacjow only takes things from statements and feats. Thats not the only way to do stuff.

 

[Qawsedf234]

I'll apply the changes.

 

[Antvasima]

Slacjow told me that he wants to respond before this discussion thread is closed again. My apologies for the inconvenience.

 

[Slacjow]

I asked Ant to reopen this thread cause I think it's unfair how you came here decided all on your own and closed the thread without giving me a chance to reply. I hope you don't close it again, I might not be able to respond immediately.

• The Artbook description said that the aura negates friction which is why Saitama could be launched at high speeds

The bold part here is the issue. You said "which is why Saitama could be launched at high speeds", which is practically wrong. This isn't what the quote actually states.
It states: "I basically resolved the whole question of heat friction by wrapping Saitama in Boros's energy while he was being launched near the speed of light".
Nowhere is it stated that the energy or the lack of heat friction allowed to launch Saitama at near Light Speed like you said. It only said that the lack of heat friction allowed Saitama's clothes to remain intact, that's it. Everything else is your addition to the statement, not canon.

• Boros describes his energy as a propulsive force that increases his speed and strength

The key part is "his", not anyone who is wrapped in his energy.

• The manga databook also back the above, saying he uses his energy to give him super speed

I never denied MB gives super speed, again, the key part is "his", not everybody else's.

It should read something like
At least Relativistic+ (He uses his internal energy as a propulsive force to increase his speed, which allows him to move and launch targets at near-lightspeeds. Faster than before)

The issue here is bold italic statement you made. Never ever is it stated that Boros can move at near-lightspeed, you basically wrote this and linked a calc to his profile that doesn't support what you wrote in there. If that link has a statement "Boros can move at near-lightspeed" as you wrote on the link itself, then quote it.

Your whole argument stands on the idea of his energy moving things at near Light Speed, which is as I already mentioned, wrong. I want you to try and respond to everything I wrote.

 

[Kachon123]

I asked Ant to reopen this thread cause I think it's unfair how you came here decided all on your own and closed the thread without giving me a chance to reply. I hope you don't close it again, I might not be able to respond immediately.

The bold part here is the issue. You said "which is why Saitama could be launched at high speeds", which is practically wrong. This isn't what the quote actually states.
It states: "I basically resolved the whole question of heat friction by wrapping Saitama in Boros's energy while he was being launched near the speed of light".
Nowhere is it stated that the energy or the lack of heat friction allowed to launch Saitama at near Light Speed like you said. It only said that the lack of heat friction allowed Saitama's clothes to remain intact, that's it. Everything else is your addition to the statement, not canon.

The key part is "his", not anyone who is wrapped in his energy.

I never denied MB gives super speed, again, the key part is "his", not everybody else's.

The issue here is bold italic statement you made. Never ever is it stated that Boros can move at near-lightspeed, you basically wrote this and linked a calc to his profile that doesn't support what you wrote in there. If that link has a statement "Boros can move at near-lightspeed" as you wrote on the link itself, then quote it.

Your whole argument stands on the idea of his energy moving things at near Light Speed, which is as I already mentioned, wrong. I want you to try and respond to everything I wrote.

You realized we changed it... right...

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Isn't it just a rephrase?

It's like I mentioned, Boros kick speed >>> speed at which Saitama was launched.
But the question is why in the justification.

It'd probably be better to use Uskla's suggestion for Rel+ than the current one. Like I know FTL can't be applied due to relativistic speeds can't be applied to that. But I think the solution to that would just be to put him at "At least Relativistic+", since like Uskla said, Boros kicking speed should logically be superior to the speed he kicked Saitama at, which was near lightspeed.

 

[Kachon123]

Slacjow. There was a calc for the speed that Boros kicked Saitama. It was calced to be 75% SOL, though we changed it to 90% iirc. here. The speed of Boros' kick would logically be faster than the speed that launched Saitama.