Lady Nagant vs Vindicare Assassin!

[DaReaperMan]

Speed Equal

Start 2 Kilometers away

Lady Nagant: 0

Vindicare Assassin: 0

Incon: 0

 

[azontr]

 

[Setsuna_tenma]

Vindicare probably. They have better aim and their turbo bullets will negate durability

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

So looking at this Seriously, they Likely can eye each other and see each other if not specified (If you have an answer please clarify OP). Knowing this Lady Nagant vs the Sniper is essentially just who hits first, and knowing that, Lady Nagant is the only one who can actually amp her speed (even if it does have a chance of jamming),

also she survived imploding from the inside out (as shown in Chp 315 if I’m correct), so unless shot right through the brain and such, the durability neg bullets aren’t an instant win, though as said above, this likely is just a fight of who hits first.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Also looking at profile her rifle bullets have a higher speed than her own combat speed, so they are still faster than the vindicare even without the speed amp

 

[Kingofwolves999]

If Nagant gets a bullet off the assassin is dead even if it hits her afterwards. Her bullets will reach them regardless of how they move since she’ll predict them.

Might be incon, but she can possibly dodge their bullets in speed equal by propelling herself. These guys seem to be more about “kill in one perfect shot” rather than direct combat from someone that knows they’re trying to kill them. So maybe Nagant can win.

 

[PsychoWarper]

Honestly the Hellfire bullets might better here, basically rounds filled with super chemicals/acid that reduce the target to nothing but a pill of black goo.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Honestly the Hellfire bullets might better here, basically rounds filled with super chemicals/acid that reduce the target to nothing but a pill of black goo.

That is a... terrifying sentence if I do say so myself

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Honestly the Hellfire bullets might better here, basically rounds filled with super chemicals/acid that reduce the target to nothing but a pill of black goo.

Assuming they use that shot first, it would be incon cause Nagant would still kill them too.

This is honestly just a “Do they both insta die or does Nagant manage to live longer” match up. Only other possible argument is Nagant’s first bullet also propels her away so they can’t hit her.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Vindicares have a very nasty tendency to pull off ridiculous shit like land perfect shots under heavy fire and of course the moon to surface feat. Also I'd love to see Nagant dodge a guy who hits FTL people with Relativistic rounds lol

That is a... terrifying sentence if I do say so myself

Welcome to 40K, your casual apocalyptic plague in any other sci-fi verse is the comedy relief here

 

[DaReaperMan]

Assuming they use that shot first, it would be incon cause Nagant would still kill them too.

This is honestly just a “Do they both insta die or does Nagant manage to live longer” match up. Only other possible argument is Nagant’s first bullet also propels her away so they can’t hit her.

Which they would because the time a member of the Officio Assassinorum pisses around is never

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Welcome to 40K, your casual apocalyptic plague in any other sci-fi verse is the comedy relief here

Huh

but yeah my vote is Incon right now, it Was for Nagant based off bullet speed (nagant’s bullets are faster then her combat speed, meaning it gets to be faster even in speed equalized) and her speed amp, but with the hell fire round I’m gonna say Incon

 

[DaReaperMan]

Huh

but yeah my vote is Incon right now, it Was for Nagant based off bullet speed (nagant’s bullets are faster then her combat speed, meaning it gets to be faster even in speed equalized) and her speed amp, but with the hell fire round I’m gonna say Incon

Vindicares don't really have a "combat speed" per say since their reactions and attack speeds are seperate, like, maybe Hypersonic if we go by any dodging feats they may have? But at that point might as well give up cause FTL reactions+Rela rounds means Nagant would be very lucky to land a hit

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Vindicares don't really have a "combat speed" per say since their reactions and attack speeds are seperate, like, maybe Hypersonic if we go by any dodging feats they may have? But at that point might as well give up cause FTL reactions+Rela rounds means Nagant would be very lucky to land a hit

That’s why speed is equal.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Vindicares don't really have a "combat speed" per say since their reactions and attack speeds are seperate, like, maybe Hypersonic if we go by any dodging feats they may have? But at that point might as well give up cause FTL reactions+Rela rounds means Nagant would be very lucky to land a hit

So doesn’t that make this unfair? Like if she can’t hit em in any reliable way and they one shot then like... shit tf she gonna do

 

[DaReaperMan]

That’s why speed is equal.

Doesn't work like that, combat speed is equalized down to the slower Party's, everything else of that party is reduced by the same multiplier.

So doesn’t that make this unfair? Like if she can’t hit em in any reliable way and they one shot then like... shit tf she gonna do

I mean yeah I wasn't really thinking about that when I made the match though, plus it isn't on the file so kinda don't know what to do about it lol

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Doesn't work like that, combat speed is equalized down to the slower Party's, everything else of that party is reduced by the same multiplier.

I mean yeah I wasn't really thinking about that when I made the match though, plus it isn't on the file so kinda don't know what to do about it lol

Ask for a mod to close this? Idk

 

[DaReaperMan]

Ask for a mod to close this? Idk

Eh, probably should ask the guy who actually knows Warhammer 40K here and isn't going off of past matches, IE psycho lol

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Doesn't work like that, combat speed is equalized down to the slower Party's, everything else of that party is reduced by the same multiplier.

Uh, what? That doesn’t mean anything to what happens in the fight though? If they both fire at the same time they both die. Speed equal so they shoot at the same speed, it’s just the bullets fly at different speeds. The Vindicare doesn’t amp or have any multipliers, so the only thing faster for them is the bullet speed, and that’s only if we’re not assuming FTL reactions, otherwise the bullets would be slower and Nagant would dodge them.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Uh, what? That doesn’t mean anything to what happens in the fight though? If they both fire at the same time they both die. Speed equal so they shoot at the same speed, it’s just the bullets fly at different speeds. The Vindicare doesn’t amp or have any multipliers, so the only thing faster for them is the bullet speed, and that’s only if we’re not assuming FTL reactions, otherwise the bullets would be slower and Nagant would dodge them.

As I said earlier I'd love to see Nagant dodge a guy who hits FTL people with Relativistic rounds and outskills her to apsolute and utter hell and back. If you want to contest that bring me even a single feat of a shot as ridiculous as a moon to surface shot or really anything to deal with 40K's fuckery in skill.

Of course as this is SBA since I actually remember now they actually don't start in line of sight of eachother because of a bunch of trees in the way, Nagant would need to first find the Vindicare before he finds her and vice versa.

Also, I'd like to ask what are Nagant's analytical prediction feats? Cause I see a grand total of nothing explained on her file for that.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Also just remembered the under heavy fire feat, it was against T'au which are all about using firearms and super assisted aim programs. So make of that as you will

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Also just remembered the under heavy fire feat, it was against T'au which are all about using firearms and super assisted aim programs. So make of that as you will

Ah so this shit really ain’t fair

 

[Kingofwolves999]

As I said earlier I'd love to see Nagant dodge a guy who hits FTL people with Relativistic rounds and outskills her to apsolute and utter hell and back. If you want to contest that bring me even a single feat of a shot as ridiculous as a moon to surface shot or really anything to deal with 40K's fuckery in skill.

Of course as this is SBA since I actually remember now they actually don't start in line of sight of eachother because of a bunch of trees in the way, Nagant would need to first find the Vindicare before he finds her and vice versa.

Also, I'd like to ask what are Nagant's analytical prediction feats? Cause I see a grand total of nothing explained on her file for that.

First off, the moon feat is a range example. Constantly citing it like it’s something crazy doesn’t mean much when they’re starting at 2k kilometers.

Second, what FTL people have they hit with their bullets? I’m under the impression they are assassins so they would do that against people that are off guard, something Nagant is not, so I’m gonna need context. Nagant would see the bullet coming and dodge while shooting 3 bullets right back that are FASTER than the Vindicare is.

Nagant’s feats? She can curve bullets so precisely from pre firing that she can tag people before they even know what’s happening despite being comparable to her. She can accurately predict where someone will be, how they will move and how they will react near instantly to hit them dead on with 100% accuracy. She can curve bullets around buildings to places she cannot see because she is so good at predicting where people are going to be and how they are going to move that it is irrelevant to her where they are or if they see the bullets coming. She can multikill people through buildings from a single curved bullet with ease because her ability to predict is literally unrivaled.

In her fight with Deku, who was flying and bouncing between buildings sporadically, she predicted where he would be from a curved shot around a building before he even got there, then predicted that he would block that bullet to shoot him with a different bullet near instantly afterwards, all while she couldn’t see where he actually was because he’s behind buildings away from her sight.

Being behind buildings is irrelevant to Nagant, she will shoot bullets in advance that will hit the Vindicare even if she can’t see them. She will curve one around the building and it will hit the assassin before they even realize the other 3 that were sent right after that one from different directions. She can also fly so she’s the one that’s going to find them first if neither know where the other is.

Also just remembered the under heavy fire feat, it was against T'au which are all about using firearms and super assisted aim programs. So make of that as you will

Is this supposed to mean much? They can fire accurately while being shot at, that’s not entirely impressive unless I’m missing context. That is irrelevant to Nagant who is going to predict their movements and kill them instantly without fail if she ever sees them, which she will, because her shots are faster than her reaction speed and thus theirs.

Nagant is tagging people who have literal precognition with ease because her shots are literally impossible to keep track of. The Vindicare is dead if Nagant sees them and they don’t fire at the same time she does.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

If they start knowing each other’s positions Nagant wins because the Vindicare’s bullets are slower than their equalized reaction speed while Nagant’s are faster.

If they don’t know, Vindicare can win if they find Nagant first, which is gonna be hard when she can see just as perfectly at 2km as she can up close and can fly. So I’d go incon with that.

 

[Insert_creative_name_here_12]

Considering neither know of the other’s location I guess I’ll vote incon cause they’re likely to kill eachother.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

And Nagant’s bullet curving feats aren’t a power of hers. She is calculating the trajectory of every single shot to do exactly what she wants them to do in advance of her opponents off of sheer intelligence. She can do this with no prior knowledge of her targets.

If she sees the Vindicare they are dead instantly.

 

[PsychoWarper]

So basically who ever sees the other first wins

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

So basically who ever sees the other first wins

Ye, why im also saying Incon

 

[DaReaperMan]

First off, the moon feat is a range example. Constantly citing it like it’s something crazy doesn’t mean much when they’re starting at 2k kilometers.

Second, what FTL people have they hit with their bullets? I’m under the impression they are assassins so they would do that against people that are off guard, something Nagant is not, so I’m gonna need context. Nagant would see the bullet coming and dodge while shooting 3 bullets right back that are FASTER than the Vindicare is.

Nagant’s feats? She can curve bullets so precisely from pre firing that she can tag people before they even know what’s happening despite being comparable to her. She can accurately predict where someone will be, how they will move and how they will react near instantly to hit them dead on with 100% accuracy. She can curve bullets around buildings to places she cannot see because she is so good at predicting where people are going to be and how they are going to move that it is irrelevant to her where they are or if they see the bullets coming. She can multikill people through buildings from a single curved bullet with ease because her ability to predict is literally unrivaled.

In her fight with Deku, who was flying and bouncing between buildings sporadically, she predicted where he would be from a curved shot around a building before he even got there, then predicted that he would block that bullet to shoot him with a different bullet near instantly afterwards, all while she couldn’t see where he actually was because he’s behind buildings away from her sight.

Being behind buildings is irrelevant to Nagant, she will shoot bullets in advance that will hit the Vindicare even if she can’t see them. She will curve one around the building and it will hit the assassin before they even realize the other 3 that were sent right after that one from different directions. She can also fly so she’s the one that’s going to find them first if neither know where the other is.


Is this supposed to mean much? They can fire accurately while being shot at, that’s not entirely impressive unless I’m missing context. That is irrelevant to Nagant who is going to predict their movements and kill them instantly without fail if she ever sees them, which she will, because her shots are faster than her reaction speed and thus theirs.

Nagant is tagging people who have literal precognition with ease because her shots are literally impossible to keep track of. The Vindicare is dead if Nagant sees them and they don’t fire at the same time she does.

Ah, so your average day at the office for dodging shit for a Vindicare. Imagine an army just wailing on one guy with various fire-arms. now make those fire arms be able to straight up one-shot that guy with AOEs and Homing Attacks out the ass. So no, in a fire fight Vindicare will 100% of the time win. and the Vindicare himself can actually pretty easily just shoot the bullet out of the air with a gun that is guaranteed to be much faster then his combat speed anyway not even counting the fact hes got them reactions.

Proof of Nagant having reactions speeds vastly above her combat speed? Cause no matter what a Vindicare aint gonna have FTL combat speed.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Ah, so your average day at the office for dodging shit for a Vindicare. Imagine an army just wailing on one guy with various fire-arms. now make those fire arms be able to straight up one-shot that guy with AOEs and Homing Attacks out the ass. So no, in a fire fight Vindicare will 100% of the time win. and the Vindicare himself can actually pretty easily just shoot the bullet out of the air with a gun that is guaranteed to be much faster then his combat speed anyway not even counting the fact hes got them reactions.

Proof of Nagant having reactions speeds above her combat speed? Cause no matter what a Vindicare aint gonna have FTL combat speed.

Forgive me if I’m HEAVILY skeptical that they will just ignore their movements being predicted when they have no feats to suggest that other than homing attacks which Nagant doesn’t have. It’s not like a shot is coming at them and follows them, it is already landing where they are going to be and is followed by several other bullets that are doing the same thing but are instead covering the reactions to the first bullet.

Shoot her bullets out the air? Are you serious? Her bullets are 7-A. They will destroy the opposing rounds even if the bullet itself doesn’t go anywhere due to the dura negging nature. That will just stop both their bullets and Nagant has the higher firing rate.

So are their guns faster than their reactions or no? Because their guns seems to be sub rel while they are FTL. So wouldn’t that mean their guns are also FTL?

She doesn’t have higher reaction speed. Her attack speed is higher than her combat speed. Which is all that matters in speed equal since everything else is equalized for both of them.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Forgive me if I’m HEAVILY skeptical that they will just ignore their movements being predicted when they have no feats to suggest that other than homing attacks which Nagant doesn’t have. It’s not like a shot is coming at them and follows them, it is already landing where they are going to be and is followed by several other bullets that are doing the same thing but are instead covering the reactions to the first bullet.

Shoot her bullets out the air? Are you serious? Her bullets are 7-A. They will destroy the opposing rounds even if the bullet itself doesn’t go anywhere due to the dura negging nature. That will just stop both their bullets and Nagant has the higher firing rate.

So are their guns faster than their reactions or no? Because their guns seems to be sub rel while they are FTL. So wouldn’t that mean their guns are also FTL?

She doesn’t have higher reaction speed. Her attack speed is higher than her combat speed. Which is all that matters in speed equal since everything else is equalized for both of them.

Which gets shot out of the air with a bullet that, in case you didn't read the profile before you actually made arguments, ***** over matter.

No, their guns aren't faster then their reactions cause they don't have the feats to be that way.

"The combat speed of that faster character is assumed to be equalized to the combat speed of the slower character. Every other speed the faster character has is reduced by the same multiplier. This includes the speed of any attacks, projectiles, reactions, perception, flight etc." ~ Versus Thread Rules

Unfortunately, no, it does not work how you say it works.

 

[Nierre]

incon fra

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Which gets shot out of the air with a bullet that, in case you didn't read the profile before you actually made arguments, ***** over matter.

No, their guns aren't faster then their reactions cause they don't have the feats to be that way.

"The combat speed of that faster character is assumed to be equalized to the combat speed of the slower character. Every other speed the faster character has is reduced by the same multiplier. This includes the speed of any attacks, projectiles, reactions, perception, flight etc." ~ Versus Thread Rules

Unfortunately, no, it does not work how you say it works.

I literally already said that shooting her bullets is irrelevant since it’ll just stop both their shots. And then they have to deal with the other bullet she shot because she predicted they would shoot her bullet.

So Nagant can dodge and react to their bullets just as well as they can.

Except that’s working exactly how it should? All of their speeds are being moved down to a relative playing field. Including reactions. So they can move and react to each other, and therefore their rifles are going to be as effective against each other as they would if they were shooting at themselves. This means the Vindicare’s shots are slower than they and Nagant are, while her shots are faster than she and they are.

 

[DaReaperMan]

I literally already said that shooting her bullets is irrelevant since it’ll just stop both their shots. And then they have to deal with the other bullet she shot because she predicted they would shoot her bullet.

So Nagant can dodge and react to their bullets just as well as they can.

Except that’s working exactly how it should? All of their speeds are being moved down to a relative playing field. Including reactions. So they can move and react to each other, and therefore their rifles are going to be as effective against each other as they would if they were shooting at themselves. This means the Vindicare’s shots are slower than they and Nagant are, while her shots are faster than she and they are.

Which would get countered again, you get the point.

I'll highlight a few things in the quote then.

"The combat speed of that faster character is assumed to be equalized to the combat speed of the slower character. Every other speed the faster character has is reduced by the same multiplier. This includes the speed of any attacks, projectiles, reactions, perception, flight etc."

As the Vindicare sure as **** doesn't have FTL or Relativistic combat speed, they are 100% the slower party here, so their speed wouldn't have even a single finger layed on it, also notice the wording here, "Combat speed". Not reactions, not attack speed, but Combat speed. Vindicare Assasins don't have "Combat speeds and reactions" on their possibly FTL reaction speed, and they don't have it with their attack speed.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Which would get countered again, you get the point.

I'll highlight a few things in the quote then.

"The combat speed of that faster character is assumed to be equalized to the combat speed of the slower character. Every other speed the faster character has is reduced by the same multiplier. This includes the speed of any attacks, projectiles, reactions, perception, flight etc."

As the Vindicare sure as **** doesn't have FTL or Relativistic combat speed, they are 100% the slower party here, so their speed wouldn't have even a single finger layed on it, also notice the wording here, "Combat speed". Not reactions, not attack speed, but Combat speed. Vindicare Assasins don't have "Combat speeds and reactions" on their possibly FTL reaction speed, and they don't have it with their attack speed.

And they do that how? They can’t see her bullets coming nor know she’s shooting them in that manner or know how smart she is or even know her moveset. They just gonna react to everything because they can?

Ah, I see what’s happening here. You’re basically claiming “She has the faster combat speed, so the Vindicare gets to keep everything while she get nerfed, so they win cause their other speeds are higher”

In that case then this match shouldn’t have been made and I’m questioning why you even did this if you knew that the Vindicare could blitz even under speed equal. Now it’s seeming like a spite match if you were intentionally trying to use the rules like that.

 

[DaReaperMan]

In a position they'd be fire fighting, yes, the Vindicare would apsolutely see the bullets coming and shoot them right the hell out of the sky.

I wasn't thinking at the time I made this thread, as shown by the fact I clearly had realizations at like two points in this thread, plus, like has been said, one wins when they see the other and vice versa even if it'll be hard cause it's, ya know, an Assassin. It's just that the Vindicare would win a straight up fire fight like if this was closer in distance.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Plus, everyone's voting for incon cause it could go either way based on who spots the other first.