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Kirby's Low 1-C Discussion of sorts

vsbattles.com

Kirby General Discussion Thread (fun edition)

Aight make sure not to cause fights here and discuss kirby. Any kirby news? Notify us here. Any kirby buff? do it here. any juicy meme? send. now. Pinboard: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ETFQB_joXKdPfALyVtGy3xDFZu_Wbm6lohlwN9fETVI/edit#
vsbattles.com vsbattles.com

boutta link dem docs
 
I'll respond to @ThatOneMofo 's points when I have the time for it, but why do people wanna close the thread, really? And why hasn't anyone else stated any reason for disagreeing? Like I said, I'm really busy right now, and even if I wasn't, this debate would still (probably) be far from over. That being said, I'd still like to brain-storm a solution right now, just to see what people think of it:
I admit that Low 1-C is extremely complex to explain, but so is 2-C, and yet the latter is still agreed upon despite not being applied on the profiles. One way we could settle this, is to accept 2-C as a low-ball and low 1-C as a highball until the Japanese guides confirm one or the other. Kirby's post-Star Allies tier would go as follows

At least 4-A (Same reason as before), Likely 2-C, Possibly Low 1-C
(Whatever happens to the pre-Star Allies keys, I don't really care, since I usually debate with characters' most recent incarnations.)

Even if our standards don't allow for a Low 1-C ranking of any kind despite the evidence, It's inarguably a possibility, and it should be kept in mind as a future possibility even if "possibly Low 1-C" can't be applied for whatever reason.

I'll leave you with this until I can actually give this thread the attention it deserves.
 
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I was gonna continue too but apparently, 2-C/2-B Kirby was already Pseudo confirmed. But imma still remain open minded to the idea of low 1-C while am still neutral on the matter since am also neutral on 2-C
 
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Ultima_Reality said:
All of these statements are extremely vague and don't even necessarily have to refer to the Another Dimension or the Extra-Dimlensional Road existing on a level which is qualitatively superior to the universe.

All of them can just as easily refer to the two of them being alternate planes of existence that exist apart from the normal universe without being superior to it in any way that would result in a Low 1-C rating, just like people can say something lies "Beyond this door" without having to make reference to a higher plane of existence which completely transcends the door. Interpreting them as such is not interpreting them as flowery language at all, because those terms simply don't necessarily align with Tier 1 ratings to begin with, context is extremely relevant in cases like this, and from what I've seen of these scans, it's something that Kirby severely lacks.
Click to expand...
wait wait wait wait... I did agree with this until I found something very crucial.

The word "transcend" in Japanese isn't actually a fluid term like in English. There's two kanji that refers to the two separate meanings of transcend. 越える, which refers to crossing over, passing though, going outside/beyond. And the second is 超える, which refers to being more, surpassing, being above, exceeding. And turns out the translation uses the second one.

- "Another world beyond time and dimension" (時も次元も超えて、別の世界に通じちゃうから). (If this refers to one specific universe in Another Dimension rather than Another Dimension itself, this this has major implications to the size of the cosmology)

There's kind of a problem though, the last kanji doesn't match up in the statement. And when I searched it up on jisho, I basically got nothing. It could easily be a spelling error, but I'm not entirely sure.

For now just take this link. I have a picture that shows the definition off clearly, but I don't know how to insert saved images.
 
This is the main body of my argument. Thanks for adressing it in a way that my blog apparantly failed to do. You might have worded it better than I did.
 
My Current Standing On Low 1-C

The document @ThatOneMofo sent about Another Dimension makes things a whole lot more complicated. I'm gonna summarize some of the more important parts relating to this thread and see where to take it from here.

New info aquired from the doc:
-I was right about Halcandra being outside of the road, at the other end of it.
-Galacta-Knight can "destroy everything due to his strenght", which, going by Twitter posts, includes dimensions. Make of that as you will for now.
-Another Dimension/Ikukkan is referred to as "the dimension with that road" by one of the Mage Sisters.

Evidence that is no longer applicable:
-"Extra Dimensions" turned out to be a mistranslation.
-So did "extra-dimensional road".

Evidence that is still applicable:
-It's still the space between dimensions.
-It's still refered to as a dimension exceeding time and space at least twice in official posts.
-The dimensional walls that move through it still seemingly move through time.
-It still allows users to move anywhere they want through time and space, not unlike the boundary from Blazblue, which is apparantly accepted as a Low 1-C structure on the Wiki for seemingly identical reasons or less.
-The road's superiority over the concepts of space and time is mentioned in the OG texts more blatantly than it is in english.

The main focus of the discussion should be what @liluzivert said above. Like I said, it is the main body of my argument.
 
Peptocoptr27 said:
My Current Standing On Low 1-C

The document @ThatOneMofo sent about Another Dimension makes things a whole lot more complicated. I'm gonna summarize some of the more important parts relating to this thread and see where to take it from here.

New info aquired from the doc:
-I was right about Halcandra being outside of the road, at the other end of it.
-Galacta-Knight can "destroy everything due to his strenght", which, going by Twitter posts, includes dimensions. Make of that as you will for now.
-Another Dimension/Ikukkan is referred to as "the dimension with that road" by one of the Mage Sisters.

Evidence that is no longer applicable:
-"Extra Dimensions" turned out to be a mistranslation.
-So did "extra-dimensional road".

Evidence that is still applicable:
-It's still the space between dimensions.
-It's still refered to as a dimension exceeding time and space at least twice in official posts.
-The dimensional walls that move through it still seemingly move through time.
-It still allows users to move anywhere they want through time and space, not unlike the boundary from Blazblue, which is apparantly accepted as a Low 1-C structure on the Wiki for seemingly identical reasons or less.
-The road's superiority over the concepts of space and time is mentioned in the OG texts more blatantly than it is in english.

The main focus of the discussion should be what @liluzivert said above. Like I said, it is the main body of my argument.
Click to expand...
Little Note: you can't long unless your staff
 
Peptocoptr27 said:
Evidence that is still applicable:
-It's still the space between dimensions.
-It's still refered to as a dimension exceeding time and space at least twice in official posts.
-The dimensional walls that move through it still seemingly move through time.
-It still allows users to move anywhere they want through time and space, not unlike the boundary from Blazblue, which is apparantly accepted as a Low 1-C structure on the Wiki for seemingly identical reasons or less.
-The road's superiority over the concepts of space and time is mentioned in the OG texts more blatantly than it is in english.
Click to expand...
So what I got from this is; the road is 4th dimensional now?
 
I mean destroying dimensions in general is 4D. So once we get 2-C it is automatic
 
ThatOneMofo said:
doesn't only destroying space-time continuums/timelines count for Low 2-C?
Click to expand...
Bro.. You do know that 4D kinda gives you nothing right? Even before the 2019 revisions it only gave high 3-A.
5D to 6D is low 1-C
7D+ is 1-C and so on

The final dimensional tiering is high 1-B with ∞D
 
The doc doesn't say anything about the kanjis that got translated to "transcend" and "beyond" in the official english translations. In japanese, the kanjis used actually translate to "exceed". In context, the road and the dimension containing it SURPASS time and space.
 
So it's a 5th temporal dimension, but it also transcends Space making it a 4th spatial dimension. Is it 1 or the other? Or is it both? Sorry for the slight naivety
 
Now that the Japanese text has made it clear that the road is superior to space and time, I think Low 1-C should be looked at further.

This is most likely a higher dimensional "bulk" space that embeds the lower ones, and it also has multiple statements of transcendence to support. If someone could get Ultima and other staff to look into this, that would be great!
 
DownrightDecisiveAzurevasesponge-size_restricted.gif
 
If anyone knows other mods who needs to know about this, please notify them while we wait for Ultima.
 
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