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Katekyo Hitman Reborn Revisions (Continued)

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^ Like we do to scale to Byakuran and Enma, we can use this to scale Daemon in Mukuro's body.

And how can we use this statement to scale speed?
 
So, what further statistics changes do you specifically want to perform, and why?
 
I already updated blog by put my further statistic changes on this part. Everyone can check and tell me if it ok to use it.

And @POH I still don't understand how can we scale speed from amount of power statements. Since power and speed is irrelevant. It's not like 10x stronger make that characters 10x faster anyway.
 
I think he's saying that 10x stronger is an overall measurement, not just a statement to be used with regards to DC. If a character is 10x stronger, then I believe he's saying that it might not be too much of a stretch for the character's physical body to be 10x stronger. If their physical durability has increased, then why not their physical movement as well?

@POH, please correct me if my reasoning for your statement is incorrect.
 
I do not have the time to check through your blog post. Can you write a summary here instead?
 
Ok, It's about Daemon Spade stated that "I can only use less than 10% of his usual powers in this body". So I use this statement to scale full power of him.

10% Daemon can comparable to Mukuro who comparable to Enma who have "12.32 gigatons of tnt" from previous topics. So Daemon should be 10x of 12.32 gigatons of tnt = 123.2 gigatons of tnt or High 6-C. Then I suggest that strongest form Daemon should be High 6-C.

Is this ok?
 
I suppose so, yes.
 
@Litentric Teon Exactly.

@Xanxussama So, as I said, their speed should increase along with their AP and durability, as it is clear that their overall physical performance is heightened.
 
We do not know by how much their speeds are increased, so we cannot use guesswork estimations.
 
@Antvasima We do, I'm referring to the statements we used to scale the characters but they were only applied to AP and durability.
 
I really have an issue with these upgrades, the best feats from what i can tell come out to be like what city or mountain level, and we are boosting characters to island level and from what i can see now large island level, and now even their speeds are gonna be boosted based on statements of characters using a certain percent of their power, why are we taking their statements seriously? Do we upgrade every character who says they have only used a certain percent of their power? Could just be hyperbole.
 
Well, we accepted it for Kaio-ken in Dragon Ball, but yes, I am not entirely comfortable with this either. However, in lack of further input from the staff, I couldn't come up with a better solution.
 
That's different, kaoiken is a multiplier stated to increase all stats, power and speed etc, but here it's not about a in verse multiplier but entirely based on character statements on how much of their power they are using, they could just be boosting about their power.

The best feat in the series is city level and mhs, and based on character statements we are putting them all the way up to large island level and probably their speed as well will get boosted to like sub-relativistic if we accept this.
 
Also, speed does not increase linearly with the amount of energy that a character can exert.
 
That's what piercer of heaven was arguing for above, which i don't agree with, but i also don't agree with boosting the characters this far above any feats in the series, based on statements of how much power they are using.
 
You do make good points. However, it would take quite a lot of revisions to appropriately adjust the pages to their previous statistics.
 
Are any other participants in this thread willing to collaborate?
 
Haven't actually paid attention to this thread (My knowledge of KHR has significantly dwindled over the past year). However, I agree with Celestial here. I could understand if there was some other trustworthy source saying it, but when it's from a villain who is literally wiping the floor with the others, then there is a high chance of it being hyperbole seeing as they are obviously drunk with power and such. Now if their is an outside reliable source that says they are using X% of their power, then we have something more to discuss.
 
Well, Tsuna does have the only Sub-Rel+ feat. And the MHS feat is done so early in the series, it should be an extreme lowball to the later arcs.

I do think it would be more reasonable to have the stats closer to the calc values for most of these cases. Personally, I could see City Level up through Byakuran. Mountain Level for Vongola Gear Guardians after that, and Large Mountain/Small Island Level for the god tiers of the verse.

Because while we do make a distinction between direct AP and range, the fact of the matter is that there aren't any feats outside of a certain range shown.
 
@Dragonmasterxyz

Okay. I suppose that the statistics should be adjusted then. Are any other participants in this thread willing to collaborate?
 
@Ant Are we resetting them all to the previous values? Because the original values weren't completely accurate either with the new calcs that we discovered in previous CRTs.
 
Well I believe the original values weren't correct either. Here is my suggestion.

City level- For Byakuran Arc Guardians

City level+- For Tsuna and Byakuran?

Mountain level- For Guardians

At least Mountain level+- For God Tiers.

How's that?
 
You seem to be basing this of your own opinions on what you think sounds alright, rather than what is actually correct.

Burden of proof is on those who make the positive claims, so prove the statements are hyperboles or exaggerations. Simple.

Tsuna's X-Burner was Mountain level in Choice Arc, lol. Zukuro was casually City level in Base, via a low end calc. This isn't even EOS.

KHR as a verse may lack in the quantity of feats but that's completely irrelevant. Lack of feats doesn't contradict a set powerscale.
 
Well, if the previous values were also inaccurate, we need to discuss where to place them.

What do you think about Dragonmasterxyz's suggestions?
 
"You seem to be basing this of your own opinions on what you think sounds alright, rather than what is actually correct."

Is that not what you are doing as well? We are doing nothing different than how we treat other verses.

"Burden of proof is on those who make the positive claims, so prove the statements are hyperboles or exaggerations. Simple."

Didn't you not support your claims with legit evidence? All you showed was the statement, not a lick of evidence or reasoning to support why this is legitimate. Especially when said statements contradicts feats in the series.

"Tsuna's X-Burner was Mountain level in Choice Arc, lol. Zukuro was casually City level in Base, via a low end calc. This isn't even EOS."

I suggest you drop that tone. I wasn't disrespectful to you, don't get disrespectful to me. Also also, just because this wasn't EoS, does not mean that they are automatically a tier above.

"KHR as a verse may lack in the quantity of feats but that's completely irrelevant. Lack of feats doesn't contradict a set powerscale."

They do when you don't have anything to powerscale from. What island level feat are they powerscaling from? What Large Mountain level feat are they powerscaling from. All I see is a City level feat and a possible Mountain level feat.
 
Regarding the main quotes.

"Byakuran is the final and strongest antagonist of this arc. He absorb all of power from Real Funeral Wreaths, Vongola Guardian and Varia and got supreme power enough to stomped Tsuna with 1/10 of his full power."

Is this 1/10 reliable? Where's the proof that it is. To compare X-Antibody Digimon are far superior to their X-Antibody forms that said forms cannot ever hope to compare. Yet we do not allow them to jump a tier nor gain a "+" rating. They just get an "At least" rating.

"At beginning of Inheritance Ceremony Arc. Enma stomped all Vongola Guardians and also Tsuna, and it appears that Enma's power is only 1/7 of his full power on that time."

Once again, is this reliable? From the scene itself, while Enma is clearly stronger (Thus a Mountain level+ rating is fine) this 1/7 comment came from someone who was clearly overconfident at the time. How do we know if this is legit?.

What makes these statements reliable? What gives them credibility?
 
I don't really know much about KHR, but Dragon's suggestions sound good to me here. It's best to be conservative than abuse statements like that to get higher results.
 
Dragonmasterxyz said:
Regarding the main quotes.
"Byakuran is the final and strongest antagonist of this arc. He absorb all of power from Real Funeral Wreaths, Vongola Guardian and Varia and got supreme power enough to stomped Tsuna with 1/10 of his full power."

Is this 1/10 reliable? Where's the proof that it is. To compare X-Antibody Digimon are far superior to their X-Antibody forms that said forms cannot ever hope to compare. Yet we do not allow them to jump a tier nor gain a "+" rating. They just get an "At least" rating.

"At beginning of Inheritance Ceremony Arc. Enma stomped all Vongola Guardians and also Tsuna, and it appears that Enma's power is only 1/7 of his full power on that time."

Once again, is this reliable? From the scene itself, while Enma is clearly stronger (Thus a Mountain level+ rating is fine) this 1/7 comment came from someone who was clearly overconfident at the time. How do we know if this is legit?.

What makes these statements reliable? What gives them credibility?
Click to expand...
For the 1/10

It's reliable for some simple facts, such as:

•Ghost absorb huge amounts of life force, which later byakuran finish obtaining

•After he stated that he was using the 10%, later in the combat even after tsuna with the original ring launch him a burning axle, he stated he was at 80% which support the 10x upgrade


For the 1/7

•You yourself said a point there, enma completely beat Tsuna's group.

•She state that the rings would need 7 days to get at full power, which does actually happen because a couple of chapter later, daemon confirm that his ring is finally awake, also his body is affected by the ring each day until the awaken of the ring, like what happen in chapter 318

•After she mention the 1/7 thing, enma confirmed that after his ring awake, tsuna would not be able to touch him

•After a little fight with tsuna, Enma's ring get out of control because of the seven days the ring need to awaken


That statement she did wasn't just coming from a overconfident character, what she said about the seven days actually happen and Enma just overpower tsuna and the guardians, I don't really know what proofs you need to be agree with the power up.
 
I should note that according to our rules, we only use the "+" sign if there is a calculation that places a feat in the upper half of a tier.

I do not mind downgrading the characters to "At least City level, likely considerably higher", but it is likely not a good idea to use guesswork regarding the ratings.
 
I'm fine about downgrading. I know that this isn't good way to scaling, just try to find another way to scale them since there're no one can calc XX-Burner feats.

Anyway, Mountain level Tsuna's X-Burner is come from a legitimate calc feat. So I think that mountain level still be ok unless there're something wrong on that feat.
 
Well, if there is a legitimate accepted Mountain level calculation, we can obviously scale from that.
 
If that calculation scales for Shimon Arc Tsuna, it can still make the God Tiers High 7-A. Checker Face is 10x more powerful than Tsuna by simply breathing. Giotto is the only other one that possibly scales.
 
Checker Face or Kawahira that created the system of the Arcobaleno. Giotto is the original leader of the Vongola Family.

Tsuna and Bermuda wouldn't scale because they're both inferior to Checker Face.
 
I don't know if they're comparable. As I remember it Giotto far outshined him, but they were still friends regardless.
 
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