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Kamen rider black vs esdeath
- Thread starter Artorimachi_Meteoraft
- Start date
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What are their wincons
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Kamen Rider Black's Satan Saber kinda just ****** Esdeath up if she get caught lacking in anyway shape or form. Kingston Flash is just also a giant 'no' button.
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- Thread starter
- #4
This is bilgenia arc Black he doesn’t have satan saber yet
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The question is though can black resist her aura, I’d assume he can because of willpower.
Though given he did resist things that can cut space and time would he resist esdeath’s dura neg?
I don’t think physical ice is a worry given the power stripes resistance feat
Though given he did resist things that can cut space and time would he resist esdeath’s dura neg?
I don’t think physical ice is a worry given the power stripes resistance feat
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She does have the AP advantage btw
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Yeah, Black is also supposed to have fear hax resistance as the Coward Hormone also raises someone's fear to a degree enough to make someone commit suicide.
Her dura neg seems to be a mix of ice manipulation + deconstruction. Ice manipulation can be nullified with Power Stripes or Kingstone Flash, and he already resists deconstruction-based attacks, and yeah, he also resists space-time cutting.
If she starts with CQC, then Black is first move tends to be Kingstone Flash, which not only blinds his foes with light but completely nullifies any abilities they are using. Black has better ESP which is mixed with clairvoyance, precognition, information analysis and disguise negation. Kingstone can allow Black to act instinctively regardless of his will, plus Battle Hopper and Road Sector massively amps his versatility/mobility.
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Even without those things I remember she’s a skilled fighter and swordswoman and
Her AP in high 6-C is this
The High 6-C+'s like Tyrant Tatsumi and Base Esdeath upscale far above base Shikoutazer's Calc (550 gigatons)
However I still think black can take this via pressure points and what you said
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The AP gap isn't big at all, Black scales to 325.1 Gigatons while Esdeath upscales to 381.03 Gigatons, the 550 Gigaton value is wrong. Plus Rider Punch and Rider Kick gets Black to 975 Gigatons, which is higher than Esdeath's stats. Plus BIlgenia, who had 30000 years of experience in Gorgom and the potential of becoming the next Creation King succumbed to Black in combat at their later encounters.
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So who do you think honestly wins this fight
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This isn’t a stomp is it?
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So you voting for black yes?
Also zeed I was planning on using another toei character called Inazuman have you heard of him?
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I wish I could use him only problem is his whole reflector power is annoying as hell
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If you’re curious I actually watched the first two episodes, they were really nice
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Black FRA.
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Kamen Rider Black FRA
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In Spanish
"Black fra"
"Black fra"
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Comparison Analysis
Attack Potency and Durability: Esdeath is stronger than 1,594,243,800,000,000,000,000 joules and Kamen Rider Black is stronger than 453,419,300,000,000,000,000 joules, meaning Esdeath is at least 3.516× stronger than Kamen Rider Black. I write "at least" because Esdeath's profile states that she "effortlessly one-shot Tyrant Tatsumi," Tatsumi's profile states that form of him is "far stronger than his previous form," and his previous form was able to overpower the character who performed the feat Esdeath scales to, whereas Kamen Rider Black is directly and straightforwardly stronger than the character who performed the feat he scales to. Esdeath would be able to injure Kamen Rider Black without many hits. However, Kamen Rider Black can use his Rider Punch and Rider Kick techniques to become three times stronger than usual, which would mathematically be 1,360,257,900,000,000,000,000 joules, making this attack only 1.172× weaker than Esdeath's regular attacks. Nonetheless, Esdeath has the advantage in this category and would be able to injure Kamen Rider Black without many hits.
Range: Both characters have Extended Melee Range and certain abilities that have a lot farther range. However, Esdeath's freezing ability is ranked as "Hundreds of Meters" and a storm she can make is ranked as "Thousands of Kilometers," whereas Kamen Rider Black's abilities that have similar range are merely super hearing, the sight of a telescope, and an ability to summon his motorcycle regardless of the dimension he is in. This means Esdeath has the option of outranging Kamen Rider Black while forcing the latter to approach, so Esdeath has the advantage in this category.
Stamina: Esdeath is ranked as "Superhuman" while Kamen Rider Black is ranked as "Infinite," so Kamen Rider Black automatically has the advantage in this category.
Skill: Based on the Intelligence section in each combatant's profile, both are skilled fighters and they seem roughly even, albeit they don't specialize in the exact same things. However, Kamen Rider Black's main enemy group is over 50,000 years old, and despite being "notorious for its terrorist activities" and even their leader being capable of combat and manipulating humanity for as long as his group has existed, Kamen Rider Black is able to successfully fight it. Esdeath's analytical prediction and other skills would let her keep up, but I think Kamen Rider Black has the advantage in this category.
Abilities: Kamen Rider Black seems to have the advantage in this category, based on the observations listed below.
Concern
Battle
Kamen Rider Black's abilities and skill would otherwise probably allow him to compensate for being a little weaker physically. On top of that, Kamen Rider Black would know of Esdeath's weaknesses as mentioned before, and Esdeath is willing to delay winning fights to enjoy the suffering of her opponent, so Kamen Rider Black would probably be able to take advantage of this. Esdeath's range advantage wouldn't be much of a factor when she would probably prefer to be close to Kamen Rider Black in this match.
This match-up scenario seems close, but I vote for Kamen Rider Black winning the battle based on my analysis.
Attack Potency and Durability: Esdeath is stronger than 1,594,243,800,000,000,000,000 joules and Kamen Rider Black is stronger than 453,419,300,000,000,000,000 joules, meaning Esdeath is at least 3.516× stronger than Kamen Rider Black. I write "at least" because Esdeath's profile states that she "effortlessly one-shot Tyrant Tatsumi," Tatsumi's profile states that form of him is "far stronger than his previous form," and his previous form was able to overpower the character who performed the feat Esdeath scales to, whereas Kamen Rider Black is directly and straightforwardly stronger than the character who performed the feat he scales to. Esdeath would be able to injure Kamen Rider Black without many hits. However, Kamen Rider Black can use his Rider Punch and Rider Kick techniques to become three times stronger than usual, which would mathematically be 1,360,257,900,000,000,000,000 joules, making this attack only 1.172× weaker than Esdeath's regular attacks. Nonetheless, Esdeath has the advantage in this category and would be able to injure Kamen Rider Black without many hits.
Range: Both characters have Extended Melee Range and certain abilities that have a lot farther range. However, Esdeath's freezing ability is ranked as "Hundreds of Meters" and a storm she can make is ranked as "Thousands of Kilometers," whereas Kamen Rider Black's abilities that have similar range are merely super hearing, the sight of a telescope, and an ability to summon his motorcycle regardless of the dimension he is in. This means Esdeath has the option of outranging Kamen Rider Black while forcing the latter to approach, so Esdeath has the advantage in this category.
Stamina: Esdeath is ranked as "Superhuman" while Kamen Rider Black is ranked as "Infinite," so Kamen Rider Black automatically has the advantage in this category.
Skill: Based on the Intelligence section in each combatant's profile, both are skilled fighters and they seem roughly even, albeit they don't specialize in the exact same things. However, Kamen Rider Black's main enemy group is over 50,000 years old, and despite being "notorious for its terrorist activities" and even their leader being capable of combat and manipulating humanity for as long as his group has existed, Kamen Rider Black is able to successfully fight it. Esdeath's analytical prediction and other skills would let her keep up, but I think Kamen Rider Black has the advantage in this category.
Abilities: Kamen Rider Black seems to have the advantage in this category, based on the observations listed below.
- Kamen Rider Black could escape being frozen by releasing all the energy within the Power Stripes at once and probably by using Keystone Flash to nullify Esdeath's freezing ability and disorient her.
- Esdeath could use the Mahapadma technique to freeze time, but she can only use it once per day and this drains her. However, Kamen Rider Black resists time stop and other abilities related to the temporal dimension, so Kamen Rider Black himself wouldn't be affected by Mahapadma.
- Multi-Eye and other gadgets allow Kamen Rider Black to know Esdeath's weaknesses and not lose track of her. Esdeath has a similar yet less versatile ability.
- Esdeath has an overwhelming fear inducing aura that works on capable opponents. There is a good likelihood that Kamen Rider Black could resist this based on the feat from what justifies his resistance to madness manipulation and mind manipulation.
- Kamen Rider Black can regenerate from wounds, allowing him to survive Esdeath for longer.
- Kamen Rider Black has the potential to directly remove Esdeath's life and soul, but Kamen Rider Black's profile implies he has never done this in a fight before without his Satansaber.
Concern
Kamen Rider Black's profile has his Satansaber in his Standard Equipment section, so that's weird if what you claim is true. I have never watched his series and I don't see anyone else refuting your claim, so I'll presume you're correct instead of the profile.
Battle
Kamen Rider Black's abilities and skill would otherwise probably allow him to compensate for being a little weaker physically. On top of that, Kamen Rider Black would know of Esdeath's weaknesses as mentioned before, and Esdeath is willing to delay winning fights to enjoy the suffering of her opponent, so Kamen Rider Black would probably be able to take advantage of this. Esdeath's range advantage wouldn't be much of a factor when she would probably prefer to be close to Kamen Rider Black in this match.
This match-up scenario seems close, but I vote for Kamen Rider Black winning the battle based on my analysis.
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For the millionth time, non-quantitative values like "50,000 years of combat" have no real meaning without feats to back them up.
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Just a small correction, Bilgenia Arc Black scales to 325.1 Gigatons, and with the Rider Kick/Punch to 975.2 Gigatons. The latter is above Esdeath's values.
Even if she could use with no restrictions, Black has resistance to a way better time manipulation.
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50,000 is a quantity, but I think you meant to argue that I should focus on quality. That is something I did as well. A terrorist organization existing for that long with no one in humanity having been able to combat it before Kamen Rider Black did is a quality. No one would be impressed if Kamen Rider Black fought against a 1 day old terrorist organization with no infamy.
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that is still not quality, there are verses where an organization survives purely because their opponents (the police or whatever) is complete garbage in skill.
When i say combat skill then we need actual combat feats, for example Ley being simply called a culmination of each generations best in skill, with no one being unable to reach his level of skill for atleast another 100,000 yrs means absolutely nothing without him actually showing feats of skill like dodging danmaku, reading their opponent etc
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All the more reason to vote for Kamen Rider Black winning the battle.
Indeed, I corrected my analysis because I didn't notice that when I initially posted it.
1,594,243,800,000,000,000,000 joules, which I wrote, is 381 gigatons of TNT. The calculation blog post states the wrong tier but features the implemented stat in joules.AnAverageUsername said:
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A number of years existing alone is indeed not a useful detail, which is why I didn't leave it at that. The Gorgom group having done what they did, that being notorious terrorism that no one on the planet could do anything about, for 50,000 years, whereas Kamen Rider Black is considered as only 19 years old, means the Gorgom group had an immense experience advantage against Kamen Rider Black, yet the Gorgom group is considered as Kamen Rider Black's comparable enemy.
Important notes to keep in mind:
- I'm not claiming some sort of overplay like "Kamen Rider Black has fighting skill equivalent to 50,000 years of combat training," because there's no evidence that the Gorgom group specializes in combat training as far as I'm aware. This doesn't take away from Kamen Rider Black's skill in fighting terrorism under an enormous experience disadvantage.
- I presume that Kamen Rider Black the series isn't an idiot plot and features a setting with a realistic societal foundation, where terrorism that's too effective for humanity to deal with doesn't just mean humanity is inept in the setting.
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what i am saying is that it doesnt quantifiably translates to combat skill
What you have mentioned here is just him being capable of beating them which looking at his hax page..yeah
and again having fighting skill of 50k yrs is also not a quantifiable combat feat
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That makes enough sense to me. Kamen Rider Black does seem to use a lot of hax against the Gorgom group, rather than purely outsmarting them. Due to how I'm not familiar with the characters, my analysis was based on the profiles only and it wasn't my best anyway. I'll further justify my vote.
At the very least, based on the profiles, Esdeath and Kamen Rider Black are similar in combat skill. Either of them may be more skilled than the other when judging them in an even more pinpointed fashion, like how it looks to me that Esdeath has better analytical prediction and Kamen Rider Black is better at using advanced technology in battle, but neither would entirely outclass the other in the general category of combat skill. Even when neither of them have the advantage in the entire category of combat skill, my analysis doesn't change very much. Kamen Rider Black would still be able to use his hax and take advantage of Esdeath's weaknesses to compensate for Esdeath's strength being a little higher than Kamen Rider Black's base durability.
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Kamen Rider Black mostly resorts to brawling against Gorgom Kaijins, and he did defeated the Spider Mutants pretty fast despite transforming for the first time.
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