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Jujutsu Kaisen Discussion Page #1

They literally do? One of the main themes, if not THE main theme, in JJK is this notion of suffering and humanity, and so when we have situations like Higuruma needing to prove his own humanity through death or Choso dying as a consequence of living as a human there's clearly a very unique message being conveyed and narrative weight applied to these things. To say "pointless death" is to take a very surface level analysis.
What's surface level is the main theme being suffering and humanity, especially when it's still being done towards the end of the story, when we've already gotten that point in the story a hundred+ chapters ago. Death is something that comes to both curses and humans, it has less to do with being human, and more to do with being in conflict with life itself, as Sukuna made clear nearly 50 chapters ago and what Sukuna, Gojo and Kashimo's "strongest" theme comes from. And this is my point in calling it pointless death, we've already seen the theme beaten to the ground in the story, why are we still getting it in the final arc? Maybe that's just me, but the arc should've shifted to something deeper, to show Gege can take his story in a different direction.

Never said they're contradicting, I said you call ANYTHING Gege could do a writing flaw to the point there's no alternative and you've demonstrated this by providing no alternative when that was literally my question.
I don't though.

You complained about Todo being removed from the story for a single arc, claiming he side-lines them. Again, Gege gives the side characters purpose and it's bad writing, he doesn't give them the spotlight and it's bad writing, he kills them and it's bad writing. Where's your ideal solution here? What should he have done with Ryu, Yorozu, Todo, Yuta, Choso, Higuruma, etc?
It's all about how he's doing it and when he does it. He removed Todo from the Culling Games, a massive arc where his power could've been shown. And now look where Todo is, just another character to throw at Sukuna and be support. This purpose you talk about is very lazy for several characters: Miguel came in, fought, dipped, served no purpose, Larue same thing, Ino same thing, Kashimo same thing.

He's giving them spotlight at the end of the story, like so many authors do and it tends to come off cheap and lazy. Ryu, Yorozu, Uro, Kashimo could've specifically have been used to develop the history of the world. We get nothing from them displaying the way the past sorcerers fought, how they interacted with their society, who was the big shots, ZERO on what went down during Sukuna vs the sorcerers in Heian Era, nothing on the main three clans throughout history. A simple 10 chapter Heian Era flashback or Edo flashback would've been good and have suited such a big arc.

Don't think there's anything wrong with Yuta really, maybe could've seen his relationship with his classmates more? Choso's fine, just don't think him dying is needed, you knowing living is also what being human is about right, especially for your fellow sorcerer, something Todo made clear. Higuruma was good during the culling games just ended up being another side character in the end so I think he should've been given a bigger role where he's trained to be part of the main force like Yuta and Yuji are. I was hoping we'd see Kamo become a stronger sorcerer, one part of the anti-Sukuna force having been a semi grade 1 and the heir of the kamo clan, maybe developing something to finish off his character, as the heir to a main clan but no he's just made into an abandon, sad, and forgotten kid by his parents and removed from being heir then runs off.
 
What's surface level is the main theme being suffering and humanity, especially when it's still being done towards the end of the story, when we've already gotten that point in the story a hundred+ chapters ago.
I really don't see how this is a writing issue. A story should keep its core themes consistent and continuously explored imo, but if you dislike the themes of JJK and wanted to see other things that's acceptable and fine as your preference, but to say it's vacuous / meaningless and that Gege is doing nothing with his story is just evidently not true.
It's all about how he's doing it and when he does it. He removed Todo from the Culling Games, a massive arc where his power could've been shown. And now look where Todo is, just another character to throw at Sukuna and be support. This purpose you talk about is very lazy for several characters: Miguel came in, fought, dipped, served no purpose, Larue same thing, Ino same thing, Kashimo same thing.
I mean it's been 1 chapter, I don't we should jump the gun and say "wow Todo's done NOTHING", but for Miguel him and Laru fought as an expression of love and mourning whilst symbolising the impact our cast has on other characters, with love and connection also being another main theme especially with Sukuna, whilst Kashimo served to explore the concept of the strongest and the isolation it brings in more detail (although I will agree Gege rushed it), with Ino also serving to show the legacy of Nanami which is inline with Todo's ideology that sorcerers never really die but live on in their successors with Ino never really being a focal point of the story and so I actually really appreciated his small moments in this fight as a relatively weak sorcerer just trying his best to help his friends. I thought it was a sweet addition for Gege to add with such a small character.
He's giving them spotlight at the end of the story, like so many authors do and it tends to come off cheap and lazy. Ryu, Yorozu, Uro, Kashimo could've specifically have been used to develop the history of the world. We get nothing from them displaying the way the past sorcerers fought, how they interacted with their society, who was the big shots, ZERO on what went down during Sukuna vs the sorcerers in Heian Era, nothing on the main three clans throughout history. A simple 10 chapter Heian Era flashback or Edo flashback would've been good and have suited such a big arc.
I do agree with this largely, I think Gege should explore the past some more and I think he will do so with all the hints we're getting about the heian era, although this so far is more so "man it'll be cool if Gege did x and y" and less "man this story has actual holes in it because we never got x and y" - we don't need to see the heian era for the current story to work, seeing the heian era would just amplify the story imo.
I was hoping we'd see Kamo become a stronger sorcerer, one part of the anti-Sukuna force having been a semi grade 1 and the heir of the kamo clan, maybe developing something to finish off his character, as the heir to a main clan but no he's just made into an abandon, sad, and forgotten kid by his parents and removed from being heir then runs off.
I liked Kamo's conclusion, his entire life he's been suffering with the burden of being the head and that reputation, with him losing the acceptance of his family because of his weakness, him being able to save his family and live with them away from the jujutsu world is a happy end for him where his weakness turns into a strength, I appreciated that.
 
Guys… what the ****.


I read the Todo chapters all the way to now with no leaks.

I read the most recent one begrudgingly after two friends told me to read it and my jaw legit dropped.

Everyone’s gonna hate Gege, but it takes some big nuts to do what Gege is doing right now. No one thought he was actually gonna do it
 
Why doesn't Maho have size manip? His size consistently alters in the manga to match his action and in the anime they exaggerate this even further to insane degrees, has there been a CRT about it that was rejected or does one need to be made?
 
I really don't see how this is a writing issue. A story should keep its core themes consistent and continuously explored imo, but if you dislike the themes of JJK and wanted to see other things that's acceptable and fine as your preference, but to say it's vacuous / meaningless and that Gege is doing nothing with his story is just evidently not true.
There's nothing wrong when its explored in new ways, Gege's just kept it constant with the theme of death being the same thing tackling the same aspects: suffering, mortality and the purpose of sorcerers. When you make a theme there needs to be other ways its explored and there has to be more themes to go along with it that are big as it or compliment it well and I don't believe that's the case, maybe the strongest theme does but its only for two characters and I have issues with Sukuna's portrayal of the strongest on its own.

I mean it's been 1 chapter, I don't we should jump the gun and say "wow Todo's done NOTHING", but for Miguel him and Laru fought as an expression of love and mourning whilst symbolising the impact our cast has on other characters, with love and connection also being another main theme especially with Sukuna, whilst Kashimo served to explore the concept of the strongest and the isolation it brings in more detail (although I will agree Gege rushed it), with Ino also serving to show the legacy of Nanami which is inline with Todo's ideology that sorcerers never really die but live on in their successors with Ino never really being a focal point of the story and so I actually really appreciated his small moments in this fight as a relatively weak sorcerer just trying his best to help his friends. I thought it was a sweet addition for Gege to add with such a small character.
Todo's relatively done nothing for the story though? If he does something new now, it won't come off the same way. Miguel and Laru's expression of love is about Geto as their "king" what he means to them, Sukuna's theme with love isn't really similar to theirs, considering how unused Geto's group is, I don't find this to be sufficient for writing, it just seems lazy. Glad you agree Gege rushed Kashimo, but I think its fine to say he ruined Kashimo's character as another representation of the strongest. True on Ino, but was that not already Yuji's point in Shibuya? Ino doesn't explore another aspect of it either, its just given through the weapon and him fighting, could've been done with better creativity.

I do agree with this largely, I think Gege should explore the past some more and I think he will do so with all the hints we're getting about the heian era, although this so far is more so "man it'll be cool if Gege did x and y" and less "man this story has actual holes in it because we never got x and y" - we don't need to see the heian era for the current story to work, seeing the heian era would just amplify the story imo.
It's not about the story not working without it, its about the writing lacking a major representation of Gege's biggest group not being explored in the story during a different time period. The history of a story is big in developing how we got to the current world. You can take Naruto showing us the previous ninjas wars moments or showing us previous events like Obito infiltrating Konoha, Uchiha massacre, Madara and Hashirama's backstory, Gaara's backstory, etc. Not showing historical events in your story when you reference them can make the story feel like it's lacking something writing wise.
 
Who's Yuji again?
The GOAT
main-qimg-2d433f840fff57f0ba0138e8ac9d2b7b

You aren't ready for him to become top 1 in the verse
 
Oh don't get me wrong, my support for Yuji is part of why I don't like the most recent chapter
Most importantly, the cast shouldn't even BE in the current situation. Yuta got hit with a slash that Sukuna charged with his secret pair of arms lmao

He's got another title and it's the Six Arms

I also blame he shall not be named. But from a meta perspective, I don't like this
 
Hakari got more stamina, stronger, more durable, faster domain, domain, auto rct, even for poison.

Dude gets clipped by a random lightning discharge and gets destroyed in close combat. He won't even need ct but that'll be overkill.

Debatable
Sad that Maki is debatable. He can't sense her, she's got better senses, his rct not saving from SSK, and she's a better fighter.

Definately not, Yuji is a complete counter to Ryu
Get spammed by granite blast, the thing Yuji literally scales to. GB blocks anything Yuji has.

Sad to say but Shrine requires him touching them, blood manip he sucks at and can be blocked by their cts, simple domain won't matter he'll just get his ass beat in domain, especially by Hakari.
 
Hakari got more stamina, stronger, more durable, faster domain, domain, auto rct, even for poison.
maybe like 100 chapters ago but not now, he does not have the level of black flash control, CE control and CT offense yuji does and its unknown if he can heal soul damage and yuji has been flatout pushing out soul strikes left right and center he loses and he loses badly to yuji
Dude gets clipped by a random lightning discharge and gets destroyed in close combat. He won't even need ct but that'll be overkill.
random lighting bolt would remove a hand and yuji would blood bend it back into place like he did post sukuna's domain, hand to hand combat in this situation is likely the worst choice for kashimo because not only does yuji have the CQC benefits of his CT's such as cleave and blood bursting he also can pop off with black flashes and soul punches which are even more effective against kashimo as a reincarnated player, kashimo legit needs his CT to win if he doesn't use it he loses.
Sad that Maki is debatable. He can't sense her, she's got better senses, his rct not saving from SSK, and she's a better fighter.
sure he can't but with how a 1v1 would go thats not all that necessery, true, he knowns the shape of his soul you silly goose much like sukuna he can heal that, debatable.

Now lets go over the advantages that yuji has over maki shall we? better AP with his attacks doing some seriouse damage to sukuna while anything that wasn't a sneak from maki doing exactly jack shit, better durability yuji flat out tanked a black flash from sukuna in 258 (he landed 7 black flashes and got hit by one from sukuna) while maki was either put on her ass with each of sukunas black flashes or taken out of the fight all together, greater versitility; maki's one big trick against yuji is SSK which he can heal due to his knowledge of the soul while yuji now has Black flash control, blood manip for better heals and light offense and shrine which at the bare minimum gives him cleave and finally yuji just flat out has better regen to maki by a country mile, any damage short of decap or bisection is not enough to put him down while something like damage to the heart will kill maki.
Get spammed by granite blast, the thing Yuji literally scales to. GB blocks anything Yuji has.
yuta who yuji is relative too if not flat out superior in stats post awakening was able to avoid GBS no problem and was only ever struck either off guard or in point blank situation and got into CQC more often than not and the moment it gets to CQC yuji's soul strike are putting Ryu as an incarnated player in the ground because his one big shtick aka output is going straight out the window after a few punches or god forbid a black flash at which point Ryu who has no RCT is getting his shit rocked like there is no tomorrow and with droping output his one answere is domain and consisdering yuji was able to withstand sukuna's domain for 90ish seconds with his simple domain Ruy's domain is doing jack shit meaning no sure hit for Ryu while yuji's output is buffed by the simple domain and every time yuji gets close Ryu's ouput further drops.

Ryu stands a 0% chance here
Sad to say but Shrine requires him touching them, blood manip he sucks at and can be blocked by their cts, simple domain won't matter he'll just get his ass beat in domain, especially by Hakari.

my guy your poor taste and lack of long term memory perturbs me.
 
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maybe like 100 chapters ago but not now, he does not have the level of black flash control, CE control and CT offense yuji does and its unknown if he can heal soul damage and yuji has been flatout pushing out soul strikes left right and center he loses and he loses badly to yuji
The Yuji you are talking about is a highly mental amped Yuji, it's not regular Yuji like we saw during his fight with Yuta and Sukuna. And Soul strikes are strictly for Sukuna, they are not and have never been shown to work on people with one soul in their body. Not sure where this belief came from but it seems like wank for Yuji fans.

random lighting bolt would remove a hand and yuji would blood bend it back into place like he did post sukuna's domain, hand to hand combat in this situation is likely the worst choice for kashimo because not only does yuji have the CQC benefits of his CT's such as cleave and blood bursting he also can pop off with black flashes and soul punches which are even more effective against kashimo as a reincarnated player, kashimo legit needs his CT to win if he doesn't use it he loses.
To the head, to the head, to the head. He's going for the head. Cleave is only good if it can adjust to the target, we see Yuji's cleave harms Sukuna but not enough to cut off his foreleg, let alone cause any serious harm, looks like it left basic cuts. Sukuna supports how weak it is as it's freshly awakened. Kashimo ~ Ryu ~ Sukuna Dismantle & Cleave > Yuji Cleave. Blood bursting does what? Kashimo just dodges or vaporizes it off his body.

yuta who yuji is relative too if not flat out superior in stats post awakening was able to avoid GBS no problem and was only ever struck either off guard or in point blank situation and got into CQC more often than not and the moment it gets to CQC yuji's soul strike are putting Ryu as an incarnated player in the ground because his one big shtick aka output is going straight out the window after a few punches or god forbid a black flash at which point Ryu who has no RCT is getting his shit rocked like there is no tomorrow and with droping output his one answere is domain and consisdering yuji was able to withstand sukuna's domain for 90ish seconds with his simple domain Ruy's domain and doing jack shit meaning no sure hit for Ryu while yuji's output is buffed by the simple domain and every time yuji gets close Ryu's ouput further drops.
In what way is Yuji higher post awakened? I think ya need to separate the feats they have from Black Flash zone amps from base cuz they aren't the same, nor is Yuji fighting the same person here. Also Ryu's GB output won't decrease, that's the point of the ct. Also just not harming him with bf, it's not strong enough at all besides beating on a weakened Sukuna. Simple Domain and Shrine are his only advantage here which Ryu fought in a era with strong sorcerers already using HWB, I doubt simple domain is gonna be enough here with every hit from Ryu rocking Yuji.

Realistically this is the only fight I see Yuji likely winning and it's definitely not easy.
 
The Yuji you are talking about is a highly mental amped Yuji, it's not regular Yuji like we saw during his fight with Yuta and Sukuna. And Soul strikes are strictly for Sukuna, they are not and have never been shown to work on people with one soul in their body. Not sure where this belief came from but it seems like wank for Yuji fans.
you see long term memory really isn't your strong suit.
2024-05-26_015225.png

every single one of the incarnated sourcers has two souls in the body they are just sunk deeper than with megumi due to the CE difference between the two, the barrier is still very much there and breaking it down against a person with far less knowledge on how to fix that shit (unlike sukuna) is gonna be fatal.
To the head, to the head, to the head. He's going for the head. Cleave is only good if it can adjust to the target, we see Yuji's cleave harms Sukuna but not enough to cut off his foreleg, let alone cause any serious harm, looks like it left basic cuts. Sukuna supports how weak it is as it's freshly awakened. Kashimo ~ Ryu ~ Sukuna Dismantle & Cleave > Yuji Cleave. Blood bursting does what? Kashimo just dodges or vaporizes it off his body.
one those was dodged and hit the arm, the other didn't even hit the base of the head and instead the head that WAS BIGGER THAN THE ******* BODY and the one that actually hit the head was when kashimo was specifically going after it and took hakari's balls to the wall approach in jackpot to his advantage, none of that is killing yuji who would dodge most of them into making them none leathal to him.
That's sukuna my guy his durability is leagues beyond kashimo (without CT) and Ryu and even then the only reason yuji didn't take that leg is because sukuna flat out prevented it with a bunch of dismantles the exact moment yuji used shrine
2024-05-26_015831.png

and it still left a massive gash on his leg, neither kashimo nor Ryu who will have their output lowered by yuji in CQC will be able to just tank a cleave and since neither has RCT they both lose the second that cleave mark pops up.
In what way is Yuji higher post awakened? I think ya need to separate the feats they have from Black Flash zone amps from base cuz they aren't the same, nor is Yuji fighting the same person here.
Sukuna has flatout pointed out that yuji was climbing in power throughout the blackflash streaks and the blackflash amp isn't a one off as its been pointed out from the get go that getting off a blackflash allows for a greater understanding of CE as a whole permenantly, you will not have the 120% amp on for ever but your CE reinforcemetn and manipulation will see a drastic improvement none the less after pulling off a black flash
Also Ryu's GB output won't decrease, that's the point of the ct.
His CT is that his attacks will always be at their max POSSIBLE output when yuji starts smashing the soul barrier that max will drop down, ryu will keep up that max possible output on all attacks but his actual top output will lower drastically with each hit.
Also just not harming him with bf, it's not strong enough at all besides beating on a weakened Sukuna. Simple Domain and Shrine are his only advantage here which Ryu fought in a era with strong sorcerers already using HWB, I doubt simple domain is gonna be enough here with every hit from Ryu rocking Yuji.
yuji and yuta are in relative leagues of power with yuji being able to keep up with yuta in yuta's domain which already buff all his stats, both were taking simlar levels of damage from dismantles and cleaves from the same sukuna and both where doing similar levels of damage with their phyiscal strikes, much like how Ryu wasn't able to 'rock' yuta throughout their fight neither will he be able to do so with a person who will lower his max output and a black flash from an opponent relative to you in strength can do quite a bit

2024-05-26_020707.png
 
you see long term memory really isn't your strong suit.
2024-05-26_015225.png

every single one of the incarnated sourcers has two souls in the body they are just sunk deeper than with megumi due to the CE difference between the two, the barrier is still very much there and breaking it down against a person with far less knowledge on how to fix that shit (unlike sukuna) is gonna be fatal.
My response was in reference to your response about Hakari. Looks like you got memory problems.

one those was dodged and hit the arm, the other didn't even hit the base of the head and instead the head that WAS BIGGER THAN THE ******* BODY and the one that actually hit the head was when kashimo was specifically going after it and took hakari's balls to the wall approach in jackpot to his advantage, none of that is killing yuji who would dodge most of them into making them none leathal to him.
That's sukuna my guy his durability is leagues beyond kashimo (without CT) and Ryu and even then the only reason yuji didn't take that leg is because sukuna flat out prevented it with a bunch of dismantles the exact moment yuji used shrine
Hakari >Yuji in speed. Not debating further.

What Sukuna? The weak Sukuna's who can't even reinforce his body to no sell hits from Rika and Yuta? Stop it.

and it still left a massive gash on his leg, neither kashimo nor Ryu who will have their output lowered by yuji in CQC will be able to just tank a cleave and since neither has RCT they both lose the second that cleave mark pops up.
It didn't leave a massive gash.

Sukuna has flatout pointed out that yuji was climbing in power throughout the blackflash streaks and the blackflash amp isn't a one off as its been pointed out from the get go that getting off a blackflash allows for a greater understanding of CE as a whole permenantly, you will not have the 120% amp on for ever but your CE reinforcemetn and manipulation will see a drastic improvement none the less after pulling off a black flash
Aka prior to hitting all those Black Flash Yuji won't be that powerful. He needs to hit those in the fight to actually reach this level. You're thinking of a post Shinjuku Yuji with all his amps, I'm talking about Shinjuku Yuji, not 8 black flashes lmao. Does that even sound reasonable?

His CT is that his attacks will always be at their max POSSIBLE output when yuji starts smashing the soul barrier that max will drop down, ryu will keep up that max possible output on all attacks but his actual top output will lower drastically with each hit.
? After doing domain, the thing which uses up the greatest amount of ce, he still outputs the same amount. Where is this max possible thing coming from? Is that stated?
 
My response was in reference to your response about Hakari. Looks like you got memory problems.
ok so not just long term but short term too.... noted
"And Soul strikes are strictly for Sukuna, they are not and have never been shown to work on people with one soul in their body" these are your words my guy come on
Hakari >Yuji in speed. Not debating further.
hakari = yuta in speed, yuji is relative to yuta in speed.
What Sukuna? The weak Sukuna's who can't even reinforce his body to no sell hits from Rika and Yuta? Stop it.
neither can Ryu nor kashimo, one punch from rika ******* cracked Ryu's skull open while the "weak" sukuna was eating them fro breakfast.
It didn't leave a massive gash.
my guy what do you consider a massive gash exactly? to me leaving a gash to the point where blood is actually gashing out the body is a massive gash, like do you need the body part to be hanging on by a tread to consider a gash big?
Aka prior to hitting all those Black Flash Yuji won't be that powerful. He needs to hit those in the fight to actually reach this level. You're thinking of a post Shinjuku Yuji with all his amps, I'm talking about Shinjuku Yuji, not 8 black flashes lmao. Does that even sound reasonable?
dude we are talking awakening yuji aka yuji post the black flash amps like what are you even on about.
? After doing domain, the thing which uses up the greatest amount of ce, he still outputs the same amount. Where is this max possible thing coming from? Is that stated?
No the **** it wasn't
2024-05-26_022840.png


like no honestly man... memory do you have it?
 
ok so not just long term but short term too.... noted
"And Soul strikes are strictly for Sukuna, they are not and have never been shown to work on people with one soul in their body" these are your words my guy come on
But then I follow up for clarification "they are not and have never been shown to work on people with one soul in their body".

hakari = yuta in speed, yuji is relative to yuta in speed.
Why Hakari = Yuta?

neither can Ryu nor kashimo, one punch from rika ******* cracked Ryu's skull open while the "weak" sukuna was eating them fro breakfast.
You mean the Ryu post domain? You forget when he took a punch from Rika and smiled it off, like it didn't do any significant damage? It's almost like the head punch was off guard and on a weaker Ryu.

And you're speaking on output, Yuji and an amped domain Yuta still aren't above Ryu's reinforcement.
 
But then I follow up for clarification "they are not and have never been shown to work on people with one soul in their body".
yeah I was talking about output and soul strikes, strike the soul my man everyone got a soul, if the person has one soul their output won't be touched but soul damage is soul damage no matter how you slice it.
Why Hakari = Yuta?
are seriouse or just grasping for anything at this point.
You mean the Ryu post domain? You forget when he took a punch from Rika and smiled it off, like it didn't do any significant damage? It's almost like the head punch was off guard and on a weaker Ryu.
he also smiled after his head was cracked open, he was sent flying by one solid hit from rika.
And you're speaking on output, Yuji and an amped domain Yuta still aren't above Ryu's reinforcement.
what do ya think reinforcement depends on exactly? or do you think yuji's current reinfrocement is on sukuna level?
 
yeah I was talking about output and soul strikes, strike the soul my man everyone got a soul, if the person has one soul their output won't be touched but soul damage is soul damage no matter how you slice it.
Oh okay, please explain the damage percentage on the soul, so I can understand how significant it is.

are seriouse or just grasping for anything at this point.
I'm asking a question. I genuinely don't know where you got Hakari = Yuta in speed.

he also smiled after his head was cracked open, he was sent flying by one solid hit from rika.
Nice ignoring when I said one was off guard lmao. Big difference here but sure ignore it. Either way you prove these attacks meant nothing to Ryu.

what do ya think reinforcement depends on exactly? or do you think yuji's current reinfrocement is on sukuna level?
I'm not sure what it depends on exactly, but they do it by putting more ce to certain parts of the body or all around. And Yuji's reinforcement is below Ryu's by Sukuna's own words so no I don't think Yuji's reinforcement is on Sukuna level.
 
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