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I'm talking about Base Luffy vs Base Lucci.
Luffy did that feat w/ Enel in his base.
Lucci in his base kept up with Luffy in his base
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Izuku Midoriya vs Rob Lucci
- Thread starter CiscoTheSoto
- Start date
Luffy did that feat w/ Enel in his base.
Lucci in his base kept up with Luffy in his base
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Yeah, and i am saying Lucci, just like Enel, was using Kenbu.
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and i'm saying Lucci, unlike Enel, wasn't spamming it the entire fight, and he's visibly and canonically more skilled than Luffy
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Lucci fraDeku has no prior knowledge. Deku has no experience with anything Lucci does except Geppo (as it's common sense) and maybe Rankakyu. You act as if Deku knows everything he can do. Deku will analyze him, but remember that he's also getting read as well in the middle of the fight.
Luffy tagged Kuro while he was using Shakushi, which is Relativictic. Kuro passed by him, scratched him, then Luffy managed to grab him before he left and slammed him, all while Kuro is FTE to him. Check Kuro's profiles, the people Kuro scales to, and why this is the case.
Haki in definition gets stronger by fighting stronger opponents. This isn't a Lucci rule, this is a technique rule. And this is done by fighting people stronger than you. Luffy is not stronger than Lucci. So it didn't grow. Guess who's stronger than Lucci in this scenario? Deku.
Tagging someone who is capable of using pure skill to tag someone thouasands of times faster than them is a counter to this.
The technique is durability negation. There is no "isn't stronger", it's durability negation.
That isn't even an argument. He didn't use it in that scenario.
A. Predict his movement and tag him
B. "Not caught cause danger sense" why are you acting as if Deku has never been tagged after he got danger sense?
C. He's not tanking the super dura neg technique, so let's stop acting as if his organs are made of steel
Ok.
From the get go he's only probably using his base just to test the waters. Lucci is skilled enough to flat out not get hit, especially when he has knowledge that the dude fighting can break his limbs with a finger flick. On that point he'll use Soru to get around. then he'll use Hybrid. Then he'll use Soru. Then he'll use Kamisoru. Then he'll use Life Return.
A. Lucci fought Luffy, who kept up with a dude reading his mind + predicting his movements + was faster than him. He's capable of handling this.
B. Read A
C. I don't think you understand what Utsugi is. He's not taking the force, it's all being shot back out. This isn't a "I take it and send it back". This is a "
Luffy couldn't tag inferior users of Kami-e. Luffy could predict the movements of Enel, who's Haki was easily able to predict the movements of Zoro, who could register 6 swords all trying to attack him off guard. This paper in the wind is hard to keep track of.
The highest speed amp he has is Kamisoru, which he won't use in the beginning of the fight.
He might actually. He used Soru on Luffy off the bat.
And atp I need scans of Deku's quick adapting. You guys are acting like he's garou or something.
And I quote Rayleigh
And I quote our Haki page
Plenty characters do awaken Haki by fighting people stronger than them. We just don't know of it because its not blatantly stated "they use Haki".
That's why Blackbeard sensed Luffy's Haki all the way back in Jaya even though we never see him explicitly use Haki.
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- Thread starter
- #45
I realize now that Lucci has to have had Busoshoku Haki, since he was capable of staggering Luffy with just his regular blows while they were fighting in their base forms. It's the only thing that makes sense. Otherwise, it would just be an error on Oda's part. So yea, looks like Lucci does have the advantages that Busoshoku and Kenbunshoku Haki provide
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Also Tekkai and Buso are intertwined so that's that
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IDK if skill stomps are a thing, and honestly I no longer try to figure out what is and isn't a stomp unless it's very clear.
But at least I think it's clear that Lucci wins this fight based on KingTempest reasons.
However I don't think this match up is very fair. Lucci is being given prior knowledge on Izuku's AP and abilities, how exactly is this fair or noticeable victory?
We're giving Lucci an extreme advantage over Izuku and no reason is given. Why does this need to be a thing?
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Give Midoriya prior knowledge on him too then
RandomGuy2345
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Just realized this lol
Mapl3Sy4up
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What about no prior knowledge for either
lol looking at this thread once was chaotic to read
lol looking at this thread once was chaotic to read
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Regardless Lucci would still win based on your reasoning.
I just don't see why Lucci needs to be given prior knowledge of Izuku. I say both should have no prior knowledge at all, why do either of them need it?
Lucci wins in either scenario.
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- Thread starter
- #52
I thought Lucci would need prior knowledge because of the AP disadvantage and Deku’s Quirks, but after seeing the arguments made, I realize Lucci doesn’t really need prior knowledge.
Mapl3Sy4up
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So anyways I’ve read through this thing and I’m invested.
Deku throws out two attacks that are 5.1x Lucci’s ap and he turns into paste?
idk how the range is, assuming it’s SBA Deku’s got like 4km to work with
Deku throws out two attacks that are 5.1x Lucci’s ap and he turns into paste?
idk how the range is, assuming it’s SBA Deku’s got like 4km to work with
Mapl3Sy4up
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Also @CiscoTheSoto Lucci scales to Wanze who scales higher than Skypiea SanjI, who is stated to be comparable to Zoro of the same arc who are all Class G. so i think Lucci is just baseline T. While Deku scales to Shigaraki who scales to the USJ Nomu/ USJ All Might who is stronger than his state in two heroes where he holds back 2.65e12 kg (correct me if I’m wrong).
So Blackwhip is an incredibly useful tool here. As is Fa-Jin which is essentially just a GG if it’s used while Lucci is in his base, but will be incredibly damaging even if Lucci goes above (as Faux 100% is going to shred through him, as it’s baseline high 7-A (like 100%) via nearly killing a character who scales to 748 GT (Sigaraki scales above Nine’s physicals) in a singular tap
So Blackwhip is an incredibly useful tool here. As is Fa-Jin which is essentially just a GG if it’s used while Lucci is in his base, but will be incredibly damaging even if Lucci goes above (as Faux 100% is going to shred through him, as it’s baseline high 7-A (like 100%) via nearly killing a character who scales to 748 GT (Sigaraki scales above Nine’s physicals) in a singular tap
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Eminiteable
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Nah he scales to Luffy
Mapl3Sy4up
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Eh.
His profile directly links Wizen for his first key, which directly links to skypiea sanji
Mapl3Sy4up
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Unless I’m blind Skypiea is sanji’s third key, so Class G Zoro and Luffy as well
Mapl3Sy4up
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Eminiteable
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No Wanze scales to At least Class T, post skypiea Luffy scales to this and Water 7 Luffy and those who scale to him also scale there.
Mapl3Sy4up
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Lifting Strength: Class K (Swings with this much force) | Class G (Gripped Arlong's sword to the point of where he couldn't pull it out) | Class G(Stronger than before) | Class G (Stronger than before) |
Key: Young | East Blue Saga | Alabasta Saga | Skypiea Arc
how blind am I if I can’t read this properly
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Mapl3Sy4up
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Skypiea luffy isn’t downscaling, his LS is class G, he’s scaling to class G, if he was downscaling from that Class T it would say Class T
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He scales to Post-Skypiea Sanji. Error in the typing. It's supposed to be Post-Skypiea Sanji who scales relative to post Skypiea Luffy
Mapl3Sy4up
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ah thank you.
Then **** idk
wait doesn’t post Skypiea Sanji downscale heavily from Zoro and Luffy? So he’s life baseline Class T?
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Nada
Here’s how it goes
PS Luffy ~ PS Sanji < W7 Sanji ~ Wanze < CP9 (who already shows feats above the SHs regularly)
Mapl3Sy4up
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Ah, ok (I more meant Sanji who is stated to be lower than Zoro and Luffy),
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Easier more canon way
CP9 are superhumans in the case of "superhuman doriki".
Luffy and the other SHs were not at that time. So they scale above him.
Wasn't that... like hie strongest black whip that he used on Shigaraki?
He scales to 2.63e12 kg.
Lucci scales to 9.045e13 kg
Lucci literally scales to like 30x more than what Deku with Blackwhip can do
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There is no strongest black whip, it depends on the amount of whips he uses and his OFA percentage plus Rage Power can make black whip even stronger
Mapl3Sy4up
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No, Yes?
Idk it states that Class T's scale to Fujitora's calc of 3.6e12 kg, so either the page hasn't been updated or the gold ball is outdated and not used.
But Deku can spawn more than 1 blackwhip, 10% can casual spawn 8 (Four from each hand) and 100% throws out dozens of them
Eminiteable
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the verse page is outdated.
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He was using that rage power to subdue Shigaraki, plus several whips
gold ball was just recently added
and none of them scale to issho's calc. they scale above luffy in late skypiea
Mapl3Sy4up
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I think he’s saying it’s more of the AM Calc (2.89e12 kg) scales the Hideour Raid AM, who is scaled to 100% Shie Hassaki Deku who is weaker than JT who is weaker than USJ AM, who is comparable to AFO Shigaraki (or scaling chain of 45% ~ Shigaraki >> JT 100% >> Shie Hassakai 100% ~ Hideout Raid AM = 2.899e12 kg)
and only 100% used Rage Power (which is when Shigaraki couldn’t move), normal 45% Could grapple but not completely restrain
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Ngl that's a mad confusing scaling chain but I'll take ur word for it Acer
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Izuku just scales to Shigaraki, who scales to All Might. Who actually has the Class T feat. 100% Izuku has nothing to do with this.
Lucci is scaling to around 30X higher than the Class T calc they scale to from what I read above. No scaling chain would jump pass such a gap.
In case I wasn't clear. I'm voting Lucci still for King's reasons. Izuku can't defeat Lucci in combat, I just don't see it happening. While Fa Jin + Blackwhip for Faux 100% would be game changing if it lands. I don't see him landing it. Lucci can amp his speed as well, and Faux 100% is a very predictable attack.
Since he just slingshots himself he can only move in a straight line, and has an obvious tell before doing it.
Lucci is scaling to around 30X higher than the Class T calc they scale to from what I read above. No scaling chain would jump pass such a gap.
In case I wasn't clear. I'm voting Lucci still for King's reasons. Izuku can't defeat Lucci in combat, I just don't see it happening. While Fa Jin + Blackwhip for Faux 100% would be game changing if it lands. I don't see him landing it. Lucci can amp his speed as well, and Faux 100% is a very predictable attack.
Since he just slingshots himself he can only move in a straight line, and has an obvious tell before doing it.
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What about the attack where he uses his leg with fa jin?
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Fa Jin by itself is an unknown speed boost. We don't really have anything to go off of. We know it isn't fast enough to blitz Nagant, since it was stated that launching out of the smokescreen would get him shot. Only Faux 100% has the blitzing speed, and that is a slingshot. Just Fa Jin makes him faster, that is it.
And strength increase is an unknown amount as well. We just know it's stronger. Doesn't compare to Lucci's speed boosts.
Mapl3Sy4up
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Eh fair enough
Lucci FRA
doesn’t Even matter lol, but yeah if this isn’t an absolute skill **** in Lucci’s favor the only thing I can see letting Deku win is Lucci not immediately going Zoan and taking two 5.1x AP hits
Lucci FRA
doesn’t Even matter lol, but yeah if this isn’t an absolute skill **** in Lucci’s favor the only thing I can see letting Deku win is Lucci not immediately going Zoan and taking two 5.1x AP hits
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- Thread starter
- #79
I’ll also vote for Lucci based on his more advanced techniques, the MASSIVE speed boosts that he can pile on each other, and his ability to bypass durability with his strongest technique. When I made this thread, I thought people would say it’s an easy win for Deku, but I was wrong. My vote starts grace, and quickly at that.
