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Isekai at Peace Discussion Thread

Body Strengthening Magic, or at least the important parts I've found.
"Indeed, if we're talking about combat ability, I’m the stronger one… but in terms of raw physical strength, you’re actually stronger than me, Kaito-san."

“R-Really?”

I have more physical strength than Sieg-san…? Sure, from appearances, Sieg-san doesn’t look particularly muscular, but I’ve seen her send Lilia-san and Rei-san flying with punches. Even though I know that was due to body strengthening magic, the idea that I’m physically stronger than her still doesn’t quite feel real.

"Yes, elves naturally don’t build muscle easily… Though we have plenty of magic power, so we can compensate with body strengthening magic."

"I see, so it’s a racial trait."
~chapter 204
With her full-powered body strengthening magic, Lilia closed in on Neun at top speed from the very first step, her superhuman strength surpassing the limits of human capability.
~chapter 353
[……How surprising…… She suddenly…… got better…… at Body Strengthening Magic.]

As a result of imitating the Body Strengthening Magic that Isis was doing, Iris succeeded in catching Isis’ fist. Even though some of her fingers were bent in the wrong direction and blood was pouring out of her palms……
~chapter 738
What I was drinking was a Fruit of the World Tree given to me by Nebula and made into a drink by Alice. The Fruit of Nebula’s World Tree has the effect of increasing physical and magical abilities by 1.5 times for about an hour.

This means that my physical abilities are 1.5 times stronger than normal…… not. It should be noted here that my magical power has also increased by 1.5 times.

By strengthening the amount of magic power I have, the effect of Body Strengthening Magic is also increased.

With the combination of the physical enhancement due to the enhanced magic power and the increased physical abilities due to the effect of the fruit…… my physical ability has increased to “three times” what it normally is.
~chapter 1111
……Well, incidentally, Hina-chan is good at Body Strengthening, as her Body Strengthening Magic has an enhancement rate of tens to hundreds of times higher than normal. Hina-chan, she’s already crossed the speed of sound…… Isn’t she on a pretty strong level even compared to those in battle mangas?

As a side note, Aoi-chan, who isn’t good at Body Strengthening Magic, has an enhancement rate of around 10 times…… Unnn, battles really ain’t my cup of tea. If anything, even Aoi-chan would be able to unleash a powerful one punch.
~chapter 1111
[Think about the flow of magic power throughout the body, not just on certain parts of your body. The key is how densely and rapidly your magic power can circulate.]

[Kyuu!]

[Hoh…… That’s good, definitely better than the last one. Keep it up, keep it going!]

While gently defending against her attacks so that the recoil of Eulpecula’s attacks wouldn’t strike back at her, and giving advice on her still rough Body Strengthening Magic, Sirius often accompanied Eulpecula’s training.
~chapter 1267
  1. Superhuman Physical Characteristics
  2. The more skilled you are at magic power control, the stronger the effect of Body Strengthening Magic
  3. The amount of magic power a person has correlates to a stronger effect of Body Strengthening Magic too
  4. Those who aren't good at Body Strengthening Magic can increase their power by 10 times. Those who are good at it have a rate of tens to hundreds of times higher.
I'm not too knowledgeable about UES, but doesn't this show we have a pretty good shot at getting it accepted for IaP?

When Kaito increased the amount of magic power he had, it did have a noticeable effect on his other magic too.
It’s true that my magic power had increased to the point where I could even see it. There’s a good chance that I’ll be able to use Offensive Magic now.

A magic circle appeared in my right hand, I put all the magic power I could into it. The amount of magic power I had had overwhelmingly increased, and even I’m afraid of the amount of magic power gathering in my right hand.

In response to my words, a ball of blazing hell fire was released from the magic circle on my right hand…… It was “around the size of a pingpong ball”……

No, I guess this is a big improvement compared to the me when I couldn’t shoot a Fireball at all. But the effect was too weak for the amount of magic power I put into it. Where the heck did all the magic power I put in go?
~chapter 470


Anyway, if it was just the amount of magic power I had, I had already surpassed the limits of Humans and possessed magic power as high as High-ranking Demons.

As for my Offensive Magic, the size of my Fireball had grown rapidly from the size of a pingpong ball to the “size of a baseball”. Well, rumor has it that even a first year student at a magic school can already produce a Fireball the size of a volleyball……
~chapter 471
Click to expand...
The shameplay of Kaito's abysmal magic talent will prove UES for IaP...

This one here too where Alice, who stopped growing in magic power, can grow stronger the more skilled she is at it. Skill = magic.
With Kuro-san’s guidance, I was able to make use of my magic power to the fullest…… but I haven’t grown a bit since then.
~chapter 522
Click to expand...
More skillwank
[……Isn’t that simply because Zwei-san hasn’t “leaked out her magic power out of her body”?]

[U- Unnn?]

[Errr, to put it simply…… Miyama-kun’s Sympathy Magic reads emotions from the faint traces of magic power emitted from others’ bodies. That’s why, you can’t read the emotions of someone who has perfect control over their body and keeps it inside their body…… I could also do something like that, just like this…… See?]

[I- Indeed, I can’t read Dr. Vier’s emotions anymore.]

I see, so that’s why there are times when I could read Ein-san and Lillywood-san’s emotions and times where I could not……

[This is one of the most difficult magic control techniques, but I think there are only a few Demons who can do it…… In battle, it’s very effective to prevent your opponent from reading the flow of magic power.]

[I- I see……]

[Well, using it is quite tiring, so not many people stay in such a state all the time. Shalltear-sama uses it when she’s going incognito. Meanwhile, Isis-sama’s magic power is too powerful and it seems like she couldn’t completely control it? Well, her magic power is more intimidating when she’s releasing it…… For their dignity, it seems that Megiddo-sama and Magnawell-sama weren’t holding back their magic power.]
~chapter 495
Click to expand...
I see. When I first met her, I could only feel Natasha-san’s magic power through Sympathy Magic, so I guess Gluttony-san was trying to keep their magic power from leaking out at all, just like how Zwei-san usually do. This alone conveyed her high level of ability.
~chaper 854
Click to expand...
Magic aptitude determined by the soul
However, there was a reason for this. When Miyabi reincarnated, her soul had been damaged. From her perspective, she only believed she had lost part of her memory, but in truth, she had also lost the innate magical aptitude unique to otherworlders.

That aptitude had now been restored thanks to Makina repairing her soul. As a result, she had regained her magic akin to Spirit Speech. Miyabi often muttered “be delicious, be delicious” while cooking, and that subconscious invocation had become magically effective, enhancing the flavor of her dishes. But there was no clear indication that would make her aware of it.
~chapter 2259
Click to expand...
 
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The road paved towards Isekai at Peace UES is paved by using Kaito's shameplay, but it was paved nonetheless...
 
@Legacy30 Great work, yes I think this will qualify for UES.

You just saved me a lot of trouble having to look for all this. Some time before the lifting strength CRT, we have to do one on UES, thus we can argue for Stellar lifting strength later.
 
If we leave that to author, we're NOT reaching there ever 🥀

I don't think it will accepted tbh but I can see an argument to be made for that. This occurred to me when I was reading the tier 1 CRT, there is an argument that can be made due to 1. Concept of Nothingness 2. Prologue
Well, as I said, it getting accepted is pretty unlikely but the argument can still be made. The argument is logical enough that almost every tik tok/reddit battle boarder will accept it tho.
 
Wait till they know we tried for H1-A+ Shiro 😭 they won't care if it got rejected or not, they're gonna use it either way 😭
 
Basically, skill = magic, more magic = more aptitude for body strengthening magic = the stronger you can get in stats. 10 times for less skilled magic individuals, tens to hundreds for more skilled ones. Then, magic aptitude is determined by your soul. Very neat...

This also coincides with barrier magic. Anyone can do it, but the stronger the magic power, the stronger the barriers. You're not getting through to someone at the least physically with a stronger barrier, as that's stronger magic
 
Was thinking about possibly Soul Manipulation and Non-Physical Interaction for magic users, at least those really skilled at it like counts and peak counts. We know of Spiritual Form to become intangible for counts, so for them to fight between each other they'd obviously have to know how to interact with Spiritual Form and thus easy NPI.

Now about souls, magic power I think comes from the soul too. Chapter 1909 goes into a lot of details into this.

Magic aptitude is determined by the soul. Negative magic power can bind souls, souls with a lot of negative magic power gather and are born as Undead Demons. Some dwell in objects, others stay as magic power and become ghost-like demons without a physical body. Necromancers can create souls by altering their magic power.

There's a lot of potential here, and it leads me to think that counts can even fight with just their souls and use body strengthening magic but on their souls too. Soul manipulation and resistance to it seems like obvious conclusions in this train of thought.
 
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I read some initial pages.....to think Shiro started off as... ******* planet level 😭 those jumps were huge lmao.
From planet level to uni+ to Complex multi to directly ******* outer...then a downfall to "possibly outer" to again clear cut outer.....and now, this. Never imagined I'll actually see H1-A Shiro on the wiki.... this kinda leads me to think that whatever those out of the world thoughts I've sealed up in my head might actually have a chance to pass if I try to word them.....welp, time to pull for H1-A Nebula
 
I was there when Shiro was 2-C with low 1-C Epilogue, she even have Archie Sonic in her notable win section

Good ol days
 
Must be a nostalgia hit for you guys lol be honest with me, did you, like any of you ever thought the verse would reach 1-A, let alone the current H1-A bs?
 
1-A is the most accurate description for her, anything above will be considered as meme came true
 
Welp, the meme just came true soooo W? Well, now we got H1-A+ Shiro to meme lol
Well, as high as the scaling goes, the verse unironically lacks alot of hax as we go higher. No NEP, not TD, no ND, just power absorption and plot manipulation as the top hax so....hope we get something for that now since the scaling is done.
 
Like I said in the tier 1 Isekai at Peace thread, Shiro may be the weakest High 1-A in vsbw, no ND, no NEP, the only thing she got is like, plot based abstraction, which is cool but 99% if not all of the characters in High 1-A tiers has at least Plot manipulation or something that can bypass abstraction, so yeah
 
Didn't want to clog the other thread, but "Ultimate End" seems to vary in power, Shiro as of the afterstories has regained her original power, and she is just omnipotent, but originally she was one being with Kuro, now both of them are as strong as they were as one being, separately....

So if the fuse now they will obviously be above omnipotent, but will it get them to omnipotent and omniscient? Most likely, but it's not confirmed, so for the moment only ultimate end on the profiles should probably just be for the main story, because we don't know how strong it is excluding the Epilogue.
 
it's probably the same 7-D but higher in stats, it was never explored again ever since they fused at the end of the main story so safe to say that the ranking has changed by a lot, especially after Tiana and Nebula was introduced

also, maybe we should call the calc mod to ask for evaluation for Polaris throwing stars towards Iris feat
 
chapter 534, Ultimate End Kuro fused with Shiro was beating up the main body of Makina. The chapter should be depicting events in the afterstory because the two never fused in the main story, but also because it is an extra chapter content.

Also, Ultimate End Kuro appeared again in the afterstories, not main story.
 
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(……Fusing with Shallow Vernal is unfair. Gununu, Shallow Vernal. She’s an enemy too huh…… I mean, how dare they hurt my main body so badly? No thanks to them, I still haven’t finished regenerating yet……)



Eden’s plan had worked well in the beginning. She had succeeded in inviting Kaito to her world, and she had even successfully led him to this different dimension.

And just when she thought she was going to give Kaito her love to her heart’s content…… After fusing with Shallow Vernal, Kuromueina, who had acquired her Perfect form, attacked from beyond the walls between worlds.
Ch 534
Click to expand...
L1-A range for fused Shiro/Kuro?
 
Legacy30 said:
chapter 534, Ultimate End Kuro fused with Shiro was beating up the main body of Makina. The chapter should be depicting events in the afterstory because the two never fused in the main story, but also because it is an extra chapter content.
Click to expand...
True, but it's unclear whether she was doing this with the Epilogue or not.

@Fantric Same as what I said above, we can't tell whether this involved the Epilogue or normal Ultimate End Kuro's abilities.
 
Celestial_Pegasus said:
True, but it's unclear whether she was doing this with the Epilogue or not.
Click to expand...
I think it's reasonable to say Epilogue was not in the equation. Makina was fighting her with all her strength in her madness. Makina has trauma from the mention of Epilogue, so she would've stopped herself had Epilogue being used was ever put on the table.

Double reminder to not put Ultimate End in main story keys, but only for afterstory stuff 🥀
 
Its too speculative imo. We should just wait until Ultimate End shows up in the afterstories so we can see how it scales excluding the Epilogue.

Incomplete and Complete keys don't really work anymore, because the Afterstories incomplete Shiro is equal to her completed self before she gave up her power. Think renaming them Quasi-Omnipotent and Omnipotent will work best for now.
 
Can Epilogue even do this level of damage control tho? From what we know, Epilogue is an instant death button. Here we see Eden getting her half body broken, and her main body being damaged. It kinda implies they just punched so hard the attack hit the main body. Add this with the statement of Kuro and Shiro interacting with higher dimensions and I think it makes sense? Honestly, usage of Epilogue is limited from what we've seen and add in what Lagacy said as well for a bonus 🥀
 
Here's what chapter 662 has to say about it at least 🤔 This is afterstory btw, the main story ends at chapter 660.
[Unnn. Me and Shiro were originally one after all….. Well, it’s not exactly like going back to our original form, since the base of our fused body is me.]

I see, Kuro and Shiro-san were originally one omnipotent being that was split in two. And with them fused, they’ve regained their original power…… returning back to the state of being an omnipotent and omniscient God, so to speak.

I see, I guess that tremendous presence around her makes sense then. However, why did they fuse with each other again? Does it mean that it’s actually difficult to move to another world without fusing?

[No, that’s not it…… It’s just, well, Shiro and I were arguing over who should pick up Kaito-kun. Our match took too long…… and we couldn’t come to an agreement, so we finally agreed to fuse……]
~chapter 662
Click to expand...
Yeah, I think Ultimate End, fused together, should be omnipotent and omniscient. The main body Makina that Kuro fought in chapter 534, it might just be the human main body and not the sphere in that unreachable space, so fair to say it wasn't that one and they don't scale to the space.

I think the keys for Shiro will look something like this
Main Story - quasi-omnipotent
Afterstories - omnipotent
Ultimate End - omnipotent and omniscient
True Form - Epilogue
 
@Fantric Epilogue isn't limited, it can end specific things, there was a statement about this somewhere, but there are some examples like when Shiro killed the explosion created by Shiro and Eden clashing, she ended the concept destruction, but didn't affect anything else. There was also some statements about it nullifying defense, resistance, resurrection etc, so it can have various effects.

@Legacy30 I have seen that statement but it runs into an issue where Afterstories Shiro is stated to have regained her original power, but is still only omnipotent currently....
 
btw, what's your opinion on soul manipulation and resistance to it from my comment above? Peak count Sechs can use negative magic power to bind souls and create souls by altering his magic power. The few times he fought, it was against Shea and Vier. At the very least, they and Six Kings will scale and have resistance to soul manipulation.
 
Technically the Kuro fusion being stronger than the Shiro fusion, you could probably argue that the Kuro fusion is Omnipotent and Omniscient while the Shiro fusion is only Omnipotent, but there being a whole dimensional difference between the 2 makes me kinda question that, because the fusion comes from the same 2 beings. Overall i think we should just ignore Ultimate End for now until we get more information.

Necromancers can manipulate souls, and magic comes from the soul, but not much more there imo. Count ranks can turn intangible so it probably is a thing where they can interact with each other, but it's not a confirmed thing. Alice knowing how to bypass intangibility most likely indicates its something the 6 Kings can do, but its not confirmed for those below them, implied though.
 
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Legacy30 said:
Was thinking about possibly Soul Manipulation and Non-Physical Interaction for magic users, at least those really skilled at it like counts and peak counts. We know of Spiritual Form to become intangible for counts, so for them to fight between each other they'd obviously have to know how to interact with Spiritual Form and thus easy NPI.

Now about souls, magic power I think comes from the soul too. Chapter 1909 goes into a lot of details into this.

Magic aptitude is determined by the soul. Negative magic power can bind souls, souls with a lot of negative magic power gather and are born as Undead Demons. Some dwell in objects, others stay as magic power and become ghost-like demons without a physical body. Necromancers can create souls by altering their magic power.

There's a lot of potential here, and it leads me to think that counts can even fight with just their souls and use body strengthening magic but on their souls too. Soul manipulation and resistance to it seems like obvious conclusions in this train of thought.
Click to expand...
I said something like this earlier about
NPI due to intangibility, but yeah this works for soul manip as well. Just like Isis they go intangible in a similar way, just without that physiology. That stuff about magic aptitude and binding the soul is good support, I think? Idk about resistance though
 
I wonder why kuro base is stronger than Shiro tbh. Is it because kuro has better close quarter combat, and can use the prologue more? It has to be some reason like this..
 
Can't it be just that she has more brute force/combat power than Shiro? I mean, the difference isn't described as any big one, just that Kuro will have a slight edge in physical department, her having advantage in close combat makes sense and goes perfectly with this. Tho adding in Prologue bs would unnecessarily complicate things.....
 
I just noticed something

So Makina's true true form resides outside the dimensional stratum right?

That means her true form transcend causality as a whole, and not even Makina herself can reach it

The only way to reach it is by following
1. Alice as she was given key to access her core
2. By being Nebula and Shiro, the notoriously outlier among outliers

Does that mean Makina's true true form has type 5 acausality
 
Well there isn't exactly direct statement but given that world creators transcend time, space and life, with time and causality interconnected with each other, I think it's worth the shot

But the uninteractability, I don't think there is a statement that her core can't be interacted
 
Makina's true form is uninteractable unless the mother brain is defeated, and mother brain can't be defeated unless true form is there. So, I think it's safe to say the true form just can't be interacted with. Will it actually qualify for AC5? I have absolutely no idea....
 
That just makes it hard to interact with due to immortality shenanigans, and other conditions such as location. Not being completely uninteractable, and it does not say due to transcending causality. World creators already transcend these things and arent acaus 5. Its hard to reach due to being in a place with no dimensions, hence you can reach it only with a key given by her. Not being completely uninteractable due to specifically being disconnected by all causality(but I guess you could argue same thing, since time and causality are connected)

I think youd also need to be eternal, unchanging, some other shenanigans...acausality 5 is really hard to get. Plus, the core and the brain seem to be connected, which I'm not sure should be a thing, with one having acausality 5, and the other one not, if we are going for a completely disconnected and unchanging object.

This immortality is busted tho, can't reach the core without defeating the brain, can't defeat the brain without destroying the makina, can't destroy makina without destroying the core. The heck is this? 😭
 
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