Is Arrowverse High 1-C? Let's Find Out.

[AxilityIsReal]

Are you sure you know the series? The Speed Force is constantly mentioned as an extra-dimensional realm. This is even mentioned in the summary of it profile. Speed Force is a 10-dimensional structure with 3-dimensional structures in it. In this way, Barry and others can travel in this three-dimensional space inside the Speed Force.

It's already mentioned in the OP

Bro, you do realize right that the terminology "extra-dimensional" just means external space unrelated to the Einsteinian space time continuum? Extra-dimensional spaces have NOTHING to do with higher dimensions, so such statements in the TV series have no correlation with the structure being 10th dimensional

Lastly, I don't get how you can say that it is a 10th dimensional structure with 3d structures. I thought the speed force was a single structure, I see nowhere it having other "structures in it"

 

[Shadowbeast]

The authors aren't the same, and for they have different views on the cosmology, that's the reason why of the multiple contradictions and general controversy present within the comics about the cosmology

If my memory don't fail, the novels of the arrowverse takes place in a alternate universe but within the same cosmology.

Barry Lyga

Barry Lyga (born September 11, 1971) is an American author. He has written a series of books based on The Flash which take place in an alternate multiverse where Flashpoint never happened. The Flash: Hocus Pocus The Flash: Johnny Quick The Flash: The Tornado Twins The Flash: Green Arrow's...

arrow.fandom.com

 

[ByArrow]

Bro, you do realize right that the terminology "extra-dimensional" just means external space unrelated to the Einsteinian space time continuum? Extra-dimensional spaces have NOTHING to do with higher dimensions, so such statements in the TV series have no correlation with the structure being 10th dimensional

Look again at what it means.

Lastly, I don't get how you can say that it is a 10th dimensional structure with 3d structures. I thought the speed force was a single structure, I see nowhere it having other "structures in it"

You do realize that the Speed Force contains Multiverses, right? Also, ByAsura explained the matter quite well.

 

[ByAsura]

Also, ByAsura explained the matter quite well.

By the way, even if what I said wasn't enough, it doesn't matter because Speedsters/the Speed Force are outright capable of violating physical laws.

• “I mean . . . in the moments before the Big Bang, there’s no there there,”Ray told him. “Nothing to run on. No oxygen to breathe. This is beyond impossible.” “The Speed Force lets me violate the laws of physics on a regular basis,” Barry said with surprising calm and confidence. “I suspect we’ll actually be translated into pure math, an encoded bolt of electrical information shooting across the universe.”

- The Legends of Forever

Look again at what it means.

Extra-dimensional can mean either, depending on who you're speaking to.

If my memory don't fail, the novels of the arrowverse takes place in a alternate universe but within the same cosmology.

Barry Lyga

Barry Lyga (born September 11, 1971) is an American author. He has written a series of books based on The Flash which take place in an alternate multiverse where Flashpoint never happened. The Flash: Hocus Pocus The Flash: Johnny Quick The Flash: The Tornado Twins The Flash: Green Arrow's...

arrow.fandom.com

To be specific, Flashpoint split the multiverse into two identical versions (even beyond the local 52 group). The TV show is the version where Flashpoint happened, and the books are set in the part of the multiverse where Flashpoint didn't happen.

 

[ByAsura]

At this point, I don't think we have enough for 10-D, and I can't find anything despite trying my damndest.

However, I might make a new thread because I do have evidence for a Low 1-C multiverse and Speed Force.

 

[ByArrow]

Since two staff who are knowledgeable about Tier 1 accepted the OP, I can say that what we have is sufficient.

We have enough staff votes to applied the OP.

I can't apply the changes right now because I'm having trouble with my computer. Can someone applied these changes?

 

[ByAsura]

That's not how it works.

Accepting something needs two staff members, unless two or more staff members oppose the upgrade. Currently, the changes have been outvoted.

Plus, while I think it's correct personally, I don't actually agree or disagree with making the changes because I'm not knowledgeable enough.

Even Planck69 only said he 'can see' High 1-C, which isn't direct agreement.

Edit: I forgot about Elizhaa.

 

[ByArrow]

Can you call Planck69 to tell if he agrees with the OP?

 

[ByAsura]

@Planck69

 

[Planck69]

With the various statements about the Speed Force being infinite in its full extent, I think that High 1-C should be fine. I don't see anything that'd imply the other 6 dimensions are compactified or fundamentally different in scope from the 3 spatial and 1 temporal of the regular multiverse. Or at worst, it'd be "2-A, likely High 1-C".

 

[Firestorm808]

With the various statements about the Speed Force being infinite in its full extent, I think that High 1-C should be fine. I don't see anything that'd imply the other 6 dimensions are compactified or fundamentally different in scope from the 3 spatial and 1 temporal of the regular multiverse. Or at worst, it'd be "2-A, likely High 1-C".

What context of superiority are you applying?

 

[Planck69]

What context of superiority are you applying?

These are spatotemporal dimensions. They just have to be significant in size for it to qualify for a higher tier. And based on the repeated statements of the Speed Force being endless/infinite as well as being a 10-dimensional construct, I don't see any reason to assume the remaining axes are compact or aren't being referred to as infinite as well.

I can see the skepticism though, hence my suggestion of a Likely/Possibly compromise in case it doesn't seem sufficient for the full tier.

 

[AxilityIsReal]

If my memory don't fail, the novels of the arrowverse takes place in a alternate universe but within the same cosmology.

Barry Lyga

Barry Lyga (born September 11, 1971) is an American author. He has written a series of books based on The Flash which take place in an alternate multiverse where Flashpoint never happened. The Flash: Hocus Pocus The Flash: Johnny Quick The Flash: The Tornado Twins The Flash: Green Arrow's...

arrow.fandom.com

Understood, thank you for sharing this

So, by assuming that there's no need for consistency in the TV series, because it is an alternate universe, the problem number #2 I've mentioned still remains tbh

and I never read those novels so take what I'm about to say with a grain of salt, but my instinct tells me that it's very possible how even in the novels they could still be 3-dimensional and featless, kinda fodders, with a single statement of a 10th dimensional speed force with no extrapolation from the author on how it works or similar stuff, but I could be wrong

 

[AxilityIsReal]

Look again at what it means.

You do realize that the Speed Force contains Multiverses, right? Also, ByAsura explained the matter quite well.

You're commiting equivocation fallacy the link you gave was for the wikipedia page "extra dimension" which refers to the ENGLISH terminology "extra" which means "additional", WHICH IS DIFFERENT FROM "extra-dimensional". You don't realize that the term extra comes from latin, which means "external to", "outside of". In fact the terminology extra-dimensional is a single world, unlike "extra dimensions" being different as it is composed by two words, thus giving a different concept

Also how the speed force being a multiverse implies it's 10th dimensional? A multiverse can easily be a 2D one, that doesn't correlate with the speed force being 10D...

 

[AxilityIsReal]

By the way, even if what I said wasn't enough, it doesn't matter because Speedsters/the Speed Force are outright capable of violating physical laws.

• “I mean . . . in the moments before the Big Bang, there’s no there there,”Ray told him. “Nothing to run on. No oxygen to breathe. This is beyond impossible.” “The Speed Force lets me violate the laws of physics on a regular basis,” Barry said with surprising calm and confidence. “I suspect we’ll actually be translated into pure math, an encoded bolt of electrical information shooting across the universe.”

- The Legends of Forever

Extra-dimensional can mean either, depending on who you're speaking to.

To be specific, Flashpoint split the multiverse into two identical versions (even beyond the local 52 group). The TV show is the version where Flashpoint happened, and the books are set in the part of the multiverse where Flashpoint didn't happen.

1. Speed force permitting you to violate physical laws has no correlation and doesn't give evidence

2. The term you posted for extra dimensional doesn't talk about higher dimensions

 

[ByAsura]

So, by assuming that there's no need for consistency in the TV series, because it is an alternate universe, the problem number #2 I've mentioned still remains tbh

If there is an inconsistency, which there isn't. So this isn't a problem yet.

We consider sources like this to be secondary canon.

Also how the speed force being a multiverse implies it's 10th dimensional?

GFArrow's point is that, even if 10-D was invalid, your point about 3-D interaction doesn't make sense because the Speed Force is provably on par with or above an infinite collection of 4-D space-times when simply considering the facts/tv show.

1. Speed force permitting you to violate physical laws has no correlation and doesn't give evidence

The quote literally shows that he can travel to and survive outside and utterly beyond normal space-times due to the Speed Force allowing him to violate physics. So, yes, it absolutely debunks your point.

2. The term you posted for extra dimensional doesn't talk about higher dimensions

Yes, that's literally what I was telling GFArrow. I agree with you here.

 

[AxilityIsReal]

If there is an inconsistency, which there isn't. So this isn't a problem yet.

We consider sources like this to be secondary canon.

GFArrow's point is that, even if 10-D was invalid, your point about 3-D interaction doesn't make sense because the Speed Force is provably on par with or above an infinite collection of 4-D space-times when simply considering the facts/tv show.

The quote literally shows that he can travel to and survive outside and utterly beyond normal space-times due to the Speed Force allowing him to violate physics. So, yes, it absolutely debunks your point.

Yes, that's literally what I was telling GFArrow.

The "consistency" you've given is not consistency of it being 10 dimensional

No, that's non sequitur, because 3D beings can interact with 4D space time continuums as the fourth dimension here is time, not a spatial axis, so they dimensionally interact with the 3 dimensional speed force, which becomes 4 dimensional just because of time, not because of a spatial axis. It having multiversal size doesn't defeat this point as it just increases the "range" in which the seed force exists.

No, it doesn't debunk my point, the speedforce allowing you to survive in it (or similar stuff) isn't evidence of it being higher dimensional. On the other posts where you said it's not tangible, that doesn't defeat that it is still dimensional. Non dimensional and non physical are two different concepts. If you have the fabric of space and time but no matter in the universe, the universe is literally intangible, you cannot "touch" the fabric itself unless you have 4D AP, which no one in the TV series has. So again, there's 0 evidence of it being 10 dimensional, sounds like wanks

 

[ByAsura]

The "consistency" you've given is not consistency of it being 10 dimensional

I wasn't claiming to give consistency. You do realise that a lack of consistency doesn't just regulate something to being false, right?

3D beings can interact with 4D space time continuums as the fourth dimension here is time, not a spatial axis, so they dimensionally interact with the 3 dimensional speed force, which becomes 4 dimensional just because of time, not because of a spatial axis. It having multiversal size doesn't defeat this point as it just increases the "range" in which the seed force exists.

Setting aside the fact that I've already addressed this previously, doesn't what you're saying here defeat your entire point to begin with?

You're claiming that the Speed Force isn't 10-D because 3-D beings can interact with it. But now you're saying that the Speed Force can have a 3-D spatial and 4-D temporal axis. So what exactly is there to stop it from still having a 3-D & 4-D axis if it's 10-D?

In fact, correct me if I'm wrong, but how would your logic even make any kind of sense when we literally have verses (like Doctor Who) where the normal universe has 10, 11, 12 or infinite dimensions?

No, it doesn't debunk my point, the speedforce allowing you to survive in it (or similar stuff) isn't evidence of it being higher dimensional.

I didn't say it was evidence. I was debunking your argument that 3-D characters interacting with the Speed Force is some kind of contradiction for 10-D.

Non dimensional and non physical are two different concepts.

I'm really not sure what you're trying to say here because I never brought non-dimensions into this, but intangible =/= non-dimensional.

Not having physical or necessarily even 3-D substance doesn't mean that something doesn't have, for example, time. The Speed Force explicitly has energy and a form of time, albeit a different form of time than the universes of the multiverse.

no matter in the universe

Matter and energy are interchangeable, my guy.

 

[karo_senpaii]

The "consistency" you've given is not consistency of it being 10 dimensional

No, that's non sequitur, because 3D beings can interact with 4D space time continuums as the fourth dimension here is time, not a spatial axis, so they dimensionally interact with the 3 dimensional speed force, which becomes 4 dimensional just because of time, not because of a spatial axis. It having multiversal size doesn't defeat this point as it just increases the "range" in which the seed force exists.

No, it doesn't debunk my point, the speedforce allowing you to survive in it (or similar stuff) isn't evidence of it being higher dimensional. On the other posts where you said it's not tangible, that doesn't defeat that it is still dimensional. Non dimensional and non physical are two different concepts. If you have the fabric of space and time but no matter in the universe, the universe is literally intangible, you cannot "touch" the fabric itself unless you have 4D AP, which no one in the TV series has. So again, there's 0 evidence of it being 10 dimensional, sounds like wanks

It's like you're not even understand what you are arguing about.
1. You mentioned something about the speed force and 3d beings interacting with it, which is not meant to be possible.

They are providing you of scans showing the speed force allowing them to break the laws of physics to tell you that it can in fact be possible as the speed force can allow it. You are now saying "it is not proof of higher dimensional existence ". Of course it isn't, they have already provided you with the right scans they need for the higher dimensionality. They are just attacking an antifeat you mentioned. Simple

 

[AxilityIsReal]

I wasn't claiming to give consistency. You do realise that a lack of consistency doesn't just regulate something to being false, right?

Setting aside the fact that I've already addressed this previously, doesn't what you're saying here defeat your entire point to begin with?

You're claiming that the Speed Force isn't 10-D because 3-D beings can interact with it. But now you're saying that the Speed Force can have a 3-D spatial and 4-D temporal axis. So what exactly is there to stop it from still having a 3-D & 4-D axis if it's 10-D?

In fact, correct me if I'm wrong, but how would your logic even make any kind of sense when we literally have verses (like Doctor Who) where the normal universe has 10, 11, 12 or infinite dimensions?

I didn't say it was evidence. I was debunking your argument that 3-D characters interacting with the Speed Force is some kind of contradiction for 10-D.

I'm really not sure what you're trying to say here because I never brought non-dimensions into this, but intangible =/= non-dimensional.

Not having physical, 3-D substance doesn't mean that something doesn't have, for example, time. The Speed Force explicitly has energy and a form of time, albeit a different form of time than the universes of the multiverse.

Matter and energy are interchangeable, my guy.

1. Okay then that's shifting the burden of proof, negative claims are always assumed to be true as long as no evidence of the positive is provided, there's no room for consistency (so if you can show it it'd be better) and btw inconsistency is literally the lack of consistency lol

2. No, it doesn't defeat my point at all, you're not reading apparently: A) if the structure is 10th dimensional then it is a single structure, I've asked for evidence of it containing 4D substructures and i received none. B) I think you're confused. What I said is that WHEN a structure is 4D (3D space + 1D time) even HUMANS can interact with it because that place would still be 3 dimensional, time doesn't count as time is simply the principle of cause and effect, which all spaces need in order to have instances/snaps of themselves. "What is stopping it from being 10D and have 3D or 4D" as of my knowledge there's nothing stopping it from being true, what I said is that you guys lack proofs of this being the case, meaning that this is an alleged certainty.

3. What? That doesn't follow at all, nobody denied the existence of such universes we're putting into question wether the speed force is 10 dimensional so this point was useless NGL

4. Well my point was entirely asking for proofs of it being higher dimensional, and you guys argued about the speedforce violating laws of physics, so I just said that that is not proof, and it's not even a defeater for my point, because "violating the laws of physics" only means violating the laws of physics of their universe, as the speedforce is a different continuum with both space, time, energy and thus physical laws...

5. you said that it was intangible, but I wanted to specify that intangible means non-material, and not aspatial or atemporal, so that doesn't disqualify the speed force from being an actual tangible continuum

6. Idk why you're making this point buddy I just told you that having no matter isn't related to not have time or space (which are axis, they are defined as "dimensional", not "physical". Dimensional interaction and physical interaction are 2 different notions

7. Ok lol if matter and energy are interchangeable that defeats your point of the speed force being intangible, and that also proves that Einsteinian physics still applies to the speedforce, meaning that when they say "Barry was able to violate the laws of physics" was in context to his normal universe where he normally lives as a fodder, so he still has to obey to the physical laws of the speed force, thus there's still 0 evidence of the speedforce being 10D

 

[AxilityIsReal]

It's like you're not even understand what you are arguing about.
1. You mentioned something about the speed force and 3d beings interacting with it, which is not meant to be possible.

They are providing you of scans showing the speed force allowing them to break the laws of physics to tell you that it can in fact be possible as the speed force can allow it. You are now saying "it is not proof of higher dimensional existence ". Of course it isn't, they have already provided you with the right scans they need for the higher dimensionality. They are just attacking an antifeat you mentioned. Simple

1. Buddy my argument was exactly that such a thing cannot happen, and yet Barry and co. Do interact with the speed force, contradicting that it's an actual 10D construct

2. And I refuted them by explaining how "violate the laws of physics" is in context to Barry violating the laws of HIS universe, not the ones of the speedforce "thus permitting to barry to interact with it" or some bs, and they conceded already that Einsteinian physics applies there thus there are physical laws in the speed force. And finally Btw the 10D Scan they sent is what's in question so it cannot be used as evidence

 

[Phoenks]

I don't think that just mentioning that there's higher spatial dimensions gives you enough evidence for them qualifying.

For example, Tet isn't even granted that despite what I'd say is a bit more of a statement than what's offered in this thread.

 

[AxilityIsReal]

I don't think that just mentioning that there's higher spatial dimensions gives you enough evidence for them qualifying.

For example, Tet isn't even granted that despite what I'd say is a bit more of a statement than what's offered in this thread.

I agree with you, that's what I'm telling them. A single statement like that isn't evidence, same reason why I said that trying to defend this so badly feels like they're just wanking. DC comics (DC in general) is one of the most overrated and over scaled verses, when by PLOT ITSELF it has the 6th dimension literally as a 6D spatial plane (making it a 7D continuum with the addition of time to it)

 

[ByAsura]

Okay then that's shifting the burden of proof

That's not shifting the burden of proof. We literally have the proof that it's 10-D and higher-dimensional. What's under debate is whether or not it's High 1-C.

inconsistency is literally the lack of consistency

I don't think you understood my point.

If there's a single piece of non-contradictory evidence, then we don't really need consistency.

I've asked for evidence of it containing 4D substructures and i received none.

Clarify what you mean by 4-D substructures in relation to the Speed Force, please. Like are you asking if the Speed Force extends to other universes, or if there's continuums separate from the multiverse that exist inside of the Speed Force?

you guys argued about the speedforce violating laws of physics, so I just said that that is not proof, and it's not even a defeater for my point, because "violating the laws of physics" only means violating the laws of physics of their universe, as the speedforce is a different continuum with both space, time, energy and thus physical laws...

What you said was 'Barry & co. have been shown to be physically limited by the third dimension multiple times, so how come that 3D beings can exist and interact with a supposed 10-dimensional place?' I was specifically addressing how that's not actually a contradiction.

I'm assuming you're a non-native English speaker given the (Italian?) in your chat GPT question. Maybe there's just a language barrier there, so I'm going to just skip over most of this.

5. you said that it was intangible, but I wanted to specify that intangible means non-material, and not aspatial or atemporal, so that doesn't disqualify the speed force from being an actual tangible continuum

I never said/implied or didn't say/imply it wasn't a type of continuum, so ok there.

Ok lol if matter and energy are interchangeable that defeats your point of the speed force being intangible

Can human beings grab light, gravity, dark energy, etc? No. Then I don't see how this contradicts my point that the Speed Force openly lets them interact with it when they normally couldn't, which is a fact anyway.

and that also proves that Einsteinian physics still applies to the speedforce

No it doesn't because it's an extra-dimensional form of energy that can create metahumans specifically because it doesn't correspond to the laws of physics.

Hell, the other space-time continuums that the Speed Force extend to (let alone the Speed Force itself, which extends to a multitude of different universe) don't even have precisely the same laws of physics.

• “There must be some difference in the way our Earth interfaces with the Speed Force,” Cisco said. “Something about our local physics renders John Quickie’s—” “Johnny Quick,” Barry interrupted. “—formula inert.” “In other words, it only works there, not here,” Caitlin said. “So Barry is back to Slowpoke Rodriguez speed here on Earth 1.”

 

[ByAsura]

Anyway, I don't see a point in responding if you respond.

After going over the Tier 1 rules again, I fully agree that High 1-C doesn't work at all, even as a likely/possibly rating.

So I'm just going to leave it at that.

 

[AxilityIsReal]

That's not shifting the burden of proof. We literally have the proof that it's 10-D and higher-dimensional. What's under debate is whether or not it's High 1-C.

I don't think you understood my point.

If there's a single piece of non-contradictory evidence, then we don't really need consistency.

Clarify what you mean by 4-D substructures in relation to the Speed Force, please. Like are you asking if the Speed Force extends to other universes, or if there's continuums separate from the multiverse that exist inside of the Speed Force?

What you said was 'Barry & co. have been shown to be physically limited by the third dimension multiple times, so how come that 3D beings can exist and interact with a supposed 10-dimensional place?' I was specifically addressing how that's not actually a contradiction.

I'm assuming you're a non-native English speaker given the (Italian?) in your chat GPT question. Maybe there's just a language barrier there, so I'm going to just skip over most of this.

I never said/implied or didn't say/imply it wasn't a type of continuum, so ok there.

Can human beings grab light, gravity, dark energy, etc? No. Then I don't see how this contradicts my point that the Speed Force openly lets them interact with it when they normally couldn't, which is a fact anyway.

No it doesn't because it's an extra-dimensional form of energy that can create metahumans specifically because it doesn't correspond to the laws of physics.

Hell, the other space-time continuums that the Speed Force extend to (let alone the Speed Force itself, which extends to a multitude of different universe) don't even have precisely the same laws of physics.

• “There must be some difference in the way our Earth interfaces with the Speed Force,” Cisco said. “Something about our local physics renders John Quickie’s—” “Johnny Quick,” Barry interrupted. “—formula inert.” “In other words, it only works there, not here,” Caitlin said. “So Barry is back to Slowpoke Rodriguez speed here on Earth 1.”

That's shifting the bop. You have no proof that it's 10D, you're failing to understand that if it's REALLY 10D then it is automatically High 1C. I'm putting into question the speedforce being 10D and THUS high 1C.

"If there's no inconsistency, we don't need consistency" again that's shifting the burden of proof and going under alleged certainty. Each positive claims needs its proofs in order to be asserted, not having proofs means that there's no consistency, so unless you show proof it is inconsistent by its very definition.

Okay I'll clarify: my original point is that if the speed force is 10D, then it is contradictory for 3D characters to interact with it, as it is higher dimensional. Arrow tried to argue that there are substructures inside of the speedforce (like a 5D construct having a 4D multiverse in it, like a subset) so it's not contradictory for barry and co to interact. I replied by saying "there's no evidence for the speedforce having lower dimensional substructures INSIDE OF IT, and I'm still waiting for that evidence

Yeah I got already that this is what you're trying to defend, that's what I put into question by extrapolating via deductive reasoning and counterexamples why the "violating the physical laws" refers to Barry's standard universe (where he lives), berry still exists and acts by following the physical laws of the Speedforce which isn't possible if it is 10D, because it would be a 3D entity following 10D rules (and I proved already why there are the laws of physics)

Yes I'm non-native, but I speak English fluently so ion think there's any language barrier, I understood that you're not arguing for it being 10D, but for my anti feat not being a valid argument. What I'm telling you is that the refutation you guys are giving aren't valid refutations, that's it. The only part that is unclear to me is how can you say that you've established it's 10D but not high 1C, when they are the same thing. In transformers higher dimensions are contradicted, so although they are higher dimensions, they don't have the property of the infinite difference, you follow me? So when it comes to powerscaling, their tier in crossverse isn't 20D or something, but lower, because those "higher dimensions" aren't real higher dimensions that grants infinite difference, therefore altough they have their name, they are to be treated not as "true higher dimensions". If the speedforce isn't a real 10D then it's not high 1C. I'm putting into question the speedforce being a real 10D. Also btw that was Bing's GPT 4 (more reliable, uses internet and checks sources)

what? Yes humans can interact with light, dark energy LOL, dark energy is just non visible and it looks like we need different way to physically interact with it, but it is possible to touch it, just like you can touch light lol, light is literally photons particles, explain to me how you gonna see another person if light doesn't physically bounce on them and comes back to your eyes, physically interacting with your eyes, and giving physical information to your brain you just have the same effect of touching air, it looks like you can't but in reality you're touching it. And the Gravity one is intellectual dishonesty, because gravity is the curvature of space and time, so it's not physical but dimensional, meaning that humans cannot have physical touch on it, you'd need 4D AP for doing that. So yeah it does contradict what you say because we literally interact with energy every day, with photons etc, but you don't feel them just like you don't feel air or a gas or whatever

Bro... That proves my point... The speedforce has its own physical laws that permits you to violate the physical laws of the normal universe where Barry lives in... So the speedforce has laws, and if they were 10D then Barry, 3D entity, would follow 10D rules while he's in the speedforce, which is not possible and thus contradictory

 

[Phoenks]

That's one hell of an essay. He already conceded on High 1-C.

 

[ByAsura]

It seems you're still not getting what I'm trying to say in a lot of places, and a lot of what you said changes literally nothing / glosses over my points, so I'm just not going to bother with this like I said before.

All I'll address is a couple of things.

And the Gravity one is intellectual dishonesty, because gravity is the curvature of space and time

I meant gravitational energy, which is a form of potential energy. I wasn't being intellectually dishonest, I just assumed that people would understand what I was referring to.

Bing's GPT 4

Btw, you're not supposed to use chat GPT for wiki arguments as far as I recall.

 

[AxilityIsReal]

It seems you're still not getting what I'm trying to say in a lot of places, and a lot of what you said changes literally nothing, so I'm just not going to bother with this like I said before.

All I'll address is a couple of things.

I meant gravitational energy, which is potential energy stored in an object.

Btw, you're not supposed to use chat GPT for wiki arguments as far as I recall.

At this point I'll just take it as you not being able to give proper refutation, there's no way someone could analyze what I said without biaseness and come up to the conclusion that I didn't get what you said, I honestly feel like I gave proper reasons with deductive reasonings, counterexamples and logical proof, if you know what prop logic is

Okay, if you meant gravitational energy then it would still fit my narrative as it is energy, thus it's physical energy.

I don't see why chat gpt cannot be used, especially the bing version that gives you the direct sources. At the end of its message (in my screen) he literally gave 3-4 sources. That is not ai generated by chat gpt, but that's a copy pasted summary of what those websites (the actual sources) say about the extra dimensional stuff. Also I don't recall you disagreeing with my definition of extra dimensional, so I don't see why even making this chat gpt point, or why indirectly implying that "you shouldn't use it for wikis", when it literally gave you sources that contain a definition you agree with ...

 

[ByAsura]

No, I just don't want to have to bother with a useless argument, like I said above. Why argue with you about why something is or isn't High 1-C if we both don't agree that it's High 1-C? You get why that's just a waste of time and energy, right?

Take up the chat GPT rules with the wiki, my guy. I don't make the rules there (that's if I'm remembering them correctly, anyway) and I'm not levying it as a point against you. I just mentioned it now because you confirmed that it was GPT.

 

[ByAsura]

My mistake anyway, the guidelines were made less strict than the original OP.

 

[AxilityIsReal]

No, I just don't want to have to bother with a useless argument, like I said above. Why argue with you about why something is or isn't High 1-C if we both don't agree that it's High 1-C? You get why that's just a waste of time and energy, right?

Take up the chat GPT rules with the wiki, my guy. I don't make the rules there (that's if I'm remembering them correctly, anyway) and I'm not levying it as a point against you. I just mentioned it now because you confirmed that it was GPT.

I told you that the only part I don't understand is how can you claim it's 10D but not high 1c. Mate, if it is 10D then it's automatically high 1c, there's no other conclusion. Wait, you think that even if it is 10D, it doesn't have the actual property of having infinite differences above 3D, 4D etc...? Then it's not a damn true 10D to begin with, but only a 4D realm with different laws

Anyways dw for the gpt stuff

 

[ByAsura]

I flat-out never even implied anything of the sort and wasn't even addressing that line of argumentation, as I said before. But I digress.

Anyway, @Firestorm808 @Phoenks @Qawsedf234 @Elizhaa what do you think of a likely/possibly rating? I personally disagree, and this thread has been going on for 10 days. So let's try to wrap this up.

 

[Firestorm808]

I lean toward disagreeing without further context.

 

[Phoenks]

I literally never even implied anything of the sort and wasn't even addressing that claim, as I said before, but I digress.

Anyway, @Firestorm808 @Phoenks @Qawsedf234 @Elizhaa what do you think of a likely/possibly rating? I personally disagree, and this thread has been going on for 10 days. So let's try to wrap this up.

I disagree. Other verses have had way more evidence and still been denied even possibly ratings. I don't think it's up to standard.

 

[AxilityIsReal]

I flat-out never even implied anything of the sort and wasn't even addressing that line of argumentation, as I said before. But I digress.

Anyway, @Firestorm808 @Phoenks @Qawsedf234 @Elizhaa what do you think of a likely/possibly rating? I personally disagree, and this thread has been going on for 10 days. So let's try to wrap this up.

Bruh

You straight up said "we have proof it's 10D but we're discussing whether it's high 1C"

 

[karo_senpaii]

Bruh

You straight up said "we have proof it's 10D but we're discussing whether it's high 1C"

What's wrong with what he said? You can be 5d for example and not be low 1c

 

[AxilityIsReal]

What's wrong with what he said? You can be 5d for example and not be low 1c

What is wrong with you guys

 

[karo_senpaii]

Nothing. You are simply blatantly ignorant of this wiki rules. I am telling you the rules. There is insignificant 5d. Stop dropping cringe emojis

 

[AxilityIsReal]

I'll wait for you to explain how can you be 5th dimensional and thus being infinitely stronger than any other 4D character and still not be low 1c