Instant Death CM1 removal

[SweetDao]

I don't know if world here is referring to a celestial foundation or na, but if it does then you can also add that it can also just refer to some physical object that serves as the core of the surroundings. Take the common concept of dungeon cores for example

It's a celestial Foundation yeah. But the thing itself is a combination of energy, information and whatever.

A similar concept that comes to mind is "collective unconscious" that I come across in various manhwas, where the people just drift inside some combined mental realm without any physical objects, so a void from their perspective, not actual non-existence

It's explained in-verse to be some sort of "transition" thing. Although it's likened to a dream a couple of times.

 

[sukuna171]

It's a celestial Foundation yeah. But the thing itself is a combination of energy, information and whatever.

It's explained in-verse to be some sort of "transition" thing. Although it's likened to a dream a couple of times.

It should be noted that not even the gods are sure what that place is, but I agree it’s not Yogiri’s true form. However, it does seem to hint at some connection between the two

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

It's a celestial Foundation yeah. But the thing itself is a combination of energy, information and whatever.

Seems pretty much like a dungeon core tbh, fits the analogy almost perfectly with some other verses, where it's some ball of condensed energy containing all information on the world it's linked to

It's explained in-verse to be some sort of "transition" thing. Although it's likened to a dream a couple of times.

It seems the author left it really vague without a solid answer sadly
Welp, I guess for now we can just treat it as nothing, really, since it's not particularly an ability from Yogiri itself but an in-verse mechanic.

Like how in some verses dying makes you go to some other realm, regardless of who kills you, as long as you actually "die" (and not just be left in a regeneration-applicable state)

 

[SweetDao]

bump

 

[Cipher72]

Bump

 

[LegendariumOfLies]

Based. Complete Isekai Death

 

[Cipher72]

Bumper

 

[Hecky2222]

Bumper

Yogurt Tier 0 before that trust

 

[Hecky2222]

Dao forgot he did this thread

 

[BoastJr]

Dao forgot he did this thread

because azerty distracted

 

[Mr._East_Statement]

Bump

It would be mad funny if this thread doesn't get evaluated until the next year

 

[TWILIGHT-OP]

I am fine with removing it.

 

[God_of_perversion]

The scans don't even prove that the concepts are unbound from reality,obviously i agree with tread

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

Huh, this thread is still up...

How many ID threads do we eeven have ongoing rn?

 

[Vietthai96]

There might have been some confusion with the splendid "on a conceptual level" description of the Celestial Foundation, but as the author stated, "only the Celestial Foundation, Celestial Axis and Canopy are conceptual and even then, they might not always be like this". So yeah, can't be CM1 either. They are just "conceptual object".

1. Conceptual object still conceptual, be able to affect and control it still mean CM

2. Author didn't stated that Celestial Foundation, Celestial Axis and Canopy are not always conceptual, but rather they are not always invisible, some exists in visible form. Having visible form isn't anti-feat against concept or imply something isn't concept

So i disagree with CM removal, the issue is this is type 2 or 1, this can't be type 3 due to the foundation being the base of an entire world

There was some concept manipulation hax in ID, like UEG being able to imbue her attack with the concept of "ignoring defenses" or likewise Luu being able to imbue the concept of "absolute protection". Similarly, there was also the idea in the Demon King Novel that Gods can imbue concept on their attack (like what UEG/Luu did) which is explained here:

This is CM3 indeed

 

[SweetDao]

Author didn't stated that Celestial Foundation, Celestial Axis and Canopy are not always conceptual, but rather they are not always invisible, some exists in visible form. Having visible form isn't anti-feat against concept or imply something isn't concept

He states this verbatim tho:

Elements like the Celestial Foundation, the Canopy, and the Celestial Axis are
conceptual, so it does not mean that they exist physically. There are some
cases where they do exist that way, however.

As far as I'm aware no one directly control the Canopy/Celestial Axis/Celestial Foundation (at most they control what is inside it/the laws etc). It doesn't help that photon torpedoes can also destroy those canopies tbf. As I said it's conceptual objects shenanigans, so if you can to skill give CM, that's a slippery slope imo.

 

[Hecky2222]

Dao makes sense there

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

Yeah, Voting with @SweetDao

 

[Vietthai96]

He states this verbatim tho:


As far as I'm aware no one directly control the Canopy/Celestial Axis/Celestial Foundation (at most they control what is inside it/the laws etc). It doesn't help that photon torpedoes can also destroy those canopies tbf. As I said it's conceptual objects shenanigans, so if you can to skill give CM, that's a slippery slope imo.

That still make it an object that having conceptual properties, it doesn't debunk anything. Even if we ignore those thing, as stated by author, most isn't that way so the physically exist foundation is minority

About who can get CM, idk the verse so i will not comment, but Celestial Foundation and thing still pretty much conceptual to me, so if the removal is based on no one be able to manipulate Foundation then i'm fine with, but if it is based on debunking Foundation not being conceptual then i disagree

 

[Hecky2222]

That still make it an object that having conceptual properties, it doesn't debunk anything. Even if we ignore those thing, as stated by author, most isn't that way so the physically exist foundation is minority

About who can get CM, idk the verse so i will not comment, but Celestial Foundation and thing still pretty much conceptual to me, so if the removal is based on no one be able to manipulate Foundation then i'm fine with, but if it is based on debunking Foundation not being conceptual then i disagree

Thats about removal from users. UEG and Mitsuki have them under this justification.

 

[SweetDao]

That still make it an object that having conceptual properties, it doesn't debunk anything. Even if we ignore those thing, as stated by author, most isn't that way so the physically exist foundation is minority

I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, CM1 or CM2, if they get destroyed, everything they govern disappear with them, right?

 

[Vietthai96]

I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, CM1 or CM2, if they get destroyed, everything they govern disappear with them, right?

Yeah

 

[Grabbing_dragon]

I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, CM1 or CM2, if they get destroyed, everything they govern disappear with them, right?

True: either they disappear, or they lose what they are. For example, when the concept of “world-ness” is destroyed, the world would no longer exist as what it is; it would change into something different. If none of that happens, they wouldn’t qualify as CM, as far as I see, since they wouldn’t have power over anything in the CM sense.

 

[SweetDao]

Yeah

Alright, so what exactly is disappearing with the canopy, the celestial axis, or the celestial foundation?

Because, for a concept to qualify as CM 3/2/1, the prerequisite is to govern something.

let's not talk about CM3 since it's not important rn.

CM2 is about "governing x aspect, but still being dependent on reality", the issue is that the canopy/celestial axis doesn't govern anything. The canopy is a "spheric veil" bubble that protects the world and the Celestial Axis is just a tube to travel between worlds. You do agree that they don't qualify for CM2 (since they don't govern anything) and the same with CM1, right?

Now, we have the issue with the celestial foundation, if, like you said, those are "valid CM concepts," why does some world have the Celestial Foundation (and the rest) physically present? What is supporting the worlds/aspects of the world?

I think we're having a misunderstanding. I'm not saying that "CF/CA/Canopy aren't conceptual objects", I'm saying "they are conceptual by their nature, but they don't qualify for our CM standards, because they don't govern anything".

 

[Vietthai96]

CM2 is about "governing x aspect, but still being dependent on reality", the issue is that the canopy/celestial axis doesn't govern anything. The canopy is a "spheric veil" bubble that protects the world and the Celestial Axis is just a tube to travel between worlds. You do agree that they don't qualify for CM2 (since they don't govern anything) and the same with CM1, right?

Yeah

I think we're having a misunderstanding. I'm not saying that "CF/CA/Canopy aren't conceptual objects", I'm saying "they are conceptual by their nature, but they don't qualify for our CM standards, because they don't govern anything".

Oke i guess

 

[SweetDao]

Oke i guess

thank you sirrrrr

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

thank you sirrrrr

It has been a few seconds now, how have you not implemented the changes yet?

 

[SweetDao]

It has been a few seconds now, how have you not implemented the changes yet?

I'll take care of them in a bit... Unless YOU want to do it

 

[Mido02]

I'll take care of them in a bit... Unless YOU want to do it

I think we need the goat premission first