Important: A new rule about References

[XXKINGXX69]

Well, probably not if the statistics are justified with accepted calculations in it, but we definitely prefer if you use references.

But it says its no longer optional

 

[Bobsican]

TBH one would think that if references are so obligatory from now on, new pages that are posted with none at all would be subject to deletion.

 

[Antvasima]

It is not exactly obligatory, but it is highly preferable.

 

[FluffyCreatureZ]

But OP literally makes them obligatory though.

 

[Antvasima]

Hmm. Here is what our current Editing Rules say:

"Always include the References section in character pages, explanation pages, information blogs, and verse-specific powers and abilities pages to source all the important information covered within them. To learn more regarding how to use them, read the References page."

Still, I don't think that it seems realistic to start deleting all pages without references sections.

Also, the "Songs" section of our References page needs to be adjusted to follow the same format as the other instructions for different media types.

 

[XXKINGXX69]

Hmm. Here is what our current Editing Rules say:

"Always include the References section in character pages, explanation pages, information blogs, and verse-specific powers and abilities pages to source all the important information covered within them. To learn more regarding how to use them, read the References page."

Still, I don't think that it seems realistic to start deleting all pages without references sections.

Then we need to fix that and say they are highly recommended, especially for controversial feats or something like that

 

[Antvasima]

Also, the "Songs" section of our References page needs to be adjusted to follow the same format as the other instructions for different media types.

Never mind. I handled it. Also, @Elizhaa , you inaccurately placed the Songs instructions in our Editing Rules page, so I moved them to our References instruction page instead.

 

[Nullflowerblush]

Are page numbers and episode timeframes allowed in references?

 

[Antvasima]

Then we need to fix that and say they are highly recommended, especially for controversial feats or something like that

Then our members would not take the rules seriously enough. However, unofficially, I don't think that it seems realistic to delete all other pages, if they have linked calculations for all of their statistics.

 

[Antvasima]

Are page numbers and episode timeframes allowed in references?

Yes, that is a good idea.

 

[Bobsican]

Well, if we don't enforce it nothing is going to change by "having" this rule, just applying it to pages made from now on is in itself a generous approach, as we wouldn't be deleting every single page on the site without references, but rather new ones done since the date the rule is properly enforced, which would make the site in itself have references on most of its pages long-term.
We could also just accept calculation blogs as references in themselves, if that's your concern.

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, calculation blogs are a type of references, but you are likely correct in that I may be too lenient.

 

[Confluctor]

Are page numbers and episode timeframes allowed in references?

While they are allowed, I would usually say they shouldn't be. Depending on where someone reads it, the page numbers could very well be different. On top of that, there is also another problem with single chapters and trade paper backs.

Like in comics, for example, a single issue has around 22 - 24 pages worth of relevant content - the rest are ads - but when they put that in trade paperback, the page number decreases because cover and credit page is removed, so that will cause some issues. On top of that, digital ones don't have ads, so sometimes that can also cause some issues with page numbers.

With manga, depending on which site someone reads it, the page number can be slightly lower or higher - sometimes pages are merged together, or other times they add multiple pages beforehand - like credit page or cover page or somesuch.

While it is good to add those things, I am not sure if they should be added. Just chapter number will suffice. But if we wanna add page numbers, I think we need to come up with some rules about its design. We could probably include what format - single or trade paperback or any special editions - and likely what site it is being pulled from.


As for time frames... I mean ig that can work. Although a similar issue to chapters can rise since different sites add or remove different stuff from it.

 

[Antvasima]

Confluctor makes good points above.

 

[Nullflowerblush]

depending on which site someone reads it, the page number can be slightly lower or higher

Well, most of the time with big manga, such as Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Super or Naruto or My Hero Academia, the pages are ripped straight from the volume release or from, like, the Viz online release. Because of that, regardless of whether or not you read the manga at M*ngasee123 or M*ngapill or one of these "Read [blank] Manga Online" sites, the page count is typically identical.

In the case of something like AKIRA, though, where there are three, different, versions with different chapter and page counts — the official Japanese is uncut and hundreds of chapters long, whereas the Marvel full color is only few dozen chapters long, and the most recent Dark Image Comics publish is compiled in volumes rather than chapters — and we use the most recent version, we could make a note of that in the "References" section.

Y'know, something like...

==References==
''"NOTE: This profile references the Dark Horse Images publication of the manga; therefore, the page numbers cited are based off the complete volumes rather than the individual chapters.'''
<references />

And, with fanlations, we could point out that, "'''NOTE: Due to the unofficial nature of the translations referenced, the page numbers cited may be slightly offset due to the presence of translation group advertisements and other miscellaneous, filler pages'''".

M*ngadex typically includes those filler pages, but reuploads to M*ngasee123 or M*ngapill usually remove 'em.

 

[Confluctor]

While I still disagree with adding page numbers in general, but I am not opposed to a note like that.

 

[Antvasima]

Maybe we could simply mention the page numbers and which published edition that is referred to in conjunction?

 

[Elizhaa]

Then our members would not take the rules seriously enough. However, unofficially, I don't think that it seems realistic to delete all other pages, if they have linked calculations for all of their statistics.

Alright, my mistake.

---

Honestly, on the chapter points, I think a note explaining the page number might be inaccurate seems fine like said above. There is also another issue of page number inaccuracy; it is from a certain type of language system.
For example, In the Japanese Light Novel, sometimes, the language is written vertically which can easily increase the page counts and makes the page number inaccurate to the English Translation of the Novel.

 

[Antvasima]

No problem.

So what do you all think about the suggestion in my last post?

Maybe we could simply mention the page numbers and which published edition that is referred to in conjunction?

 

[Elizhaa]

No problem.

So what do you all think about the suggestion in my last post?

Alright. The suggestion seems fine.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. I am uncertain myself though. Maybe it will simply cause lots of confusion.

 

[KLOL506]

Are page numbers and episode timeframes allowed in references?

Usually I wouldn't see the problem but often at times different pulication volumes might use a different number of pages or episode timeframes can vary wildly depending on what format you watch them in. It's often just better to use the Episode Number (For shows), Mission Number (For games, if any exist at all) or the Chapter number (For book-based mediums). Those values are usually much more concrete to rely upon.

 

[KLOL506]

Honestly, on the chapter points, I think a note explaining the page number might be inaccurate seems fine like said above. There is also another issue of page number inaccuracy; it is from a certain type of language system.
For example, In the Japanese Light Novel, sometimes, the language is written vertically which can easily increase the page counts and makes the page number inaccurate to the English Translation of the Novel.

Yes, this is a issue I have with most novel-related media not written in English. But even then I think just using Chapter number is fine, since the likelihood of those changing across English versions or the OG Japanese scans (Or any other language really) is extremely unlikely, if not straight up impossible.

 

[Antvasima]

KLOL makes good points above.