Vietthai96
He/Him- 10,145
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Will be back later, because working hours
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Immeasurable speed sailor moon ?
- Thread starter Grand_Saver_Ritsuka
- Start date
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- 4,058
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- Thread starter
- #602
BTW why are we still debating? Wasn't the scans already rejected by staff?
Vietthai96
He/Him- 10,145
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Well, because he still do that though, if not he is going to say double standard again and bring other verde to this
1. Why are you so nitpicking about they flying.
2. Visual nitpicking again honestly, however the flew to galaxy feat is completely different from Black Lady feat
Now that point is completely made up from you, fly extremely quick???. From his perspective???, if they already cross the universe, why he is still make that comment, again he is not stupid. And time and time again i already said why should we assume they actually cross infinite distance, the process of "travelling" to Wiseman Domain is completely unknown, and don't compare it to the flw to the galaxy feat either because galaxy is inside the universe, Wiseman domain is on the outside of it, in fact it is on a completely unknown place in a rift which require the use of space-time door and it's corridor to reach, Black Moon clan use the Time Machine to travel and Black Lady have direct access to it due to having Wiseman power. In this thread we actually giving you the benefit of doubt that it is outside of the universe. If Black Lady can just fly to Wisemain Domain, why Sailor Moon can just fly to it or why Black Moon Clan don't just use space-ship to travel, why Time Machine, a device for time travel, and space-time door and it's corridor is also use for time travel. I say time and time again that the feat is completely unknown which can be assume in many way, so why should we must assume she cross the entire universe but not the other mean???. Completely unusable
I'm still fine with a possibly infinite rating though. But the decision is up to the staffs
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Visual nitpicking?? By pointing out what's shown on paper?
Not to mention, you literally mistook Wiseman's castle for another planet. Visuals are important. You keep glossing over that.
It happened between panels? He made that comment because he didn't know where she was taking them.
Because the scan shows them flying to it. That's the only method shown. No other method is shown. And we know there is no time-skip because it happened between panels and because the speech bubble is pointed towards them flying right in the next panel. So the conversation was continuous.
Benefit of the doubt????? Buddy. The source material says that it is. I don't need your benefit.
?? What are you trying to argue? That because Sailor Moon and other characters couldn't directly fly there, that Black Lady shouldn't be able to do it? Black Lady was created by Death Phantom. She is a special case.
Also, one character being able to do something others can't is very common in fiction. Ex. Why can Sailor Pluto stop time and other characters who manipulate time can't? That's not an argument.
It is not unknown. You're purposefully ignoring that page shows she flew there.
You are claiming that Black Lady did something between panels, mid conversation that was not shown to the reader. You need extra ordinary amount of evidence to say that.
Since when do we get to ignore what's being shown?
Your arguments have been to either ignore the words on the page or ignore the art on the page.
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- #605
Are we still waiting for more staff input? In dragon ball upgrade threads ONE staff saying "disagree " or "agree" is enough to reject upgrades/ apply downgrade. Why is it for sailor moon so many staff must comment and agree to make a downgrade/upgrade happen?
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I am only opening up arguments again because Vietthai had a major error in his arguments. He believed that Black Lady was flying to a different planet when the scan is actually her flying to Wiseman's castle in his domain. That kind of error completely changes the entire nature of the argument.
Also, I am one person. The dragonball threads have multiple knowledgeable people arguing for the verse. I am the only knowledgeable member. I should be given some kind of grace to address all the arguments being thrown at me and correcting misinformation.
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- #607
ah, noted. The causality and ikanil left right?
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BTW what exactly was downgraded of sailor moon before this? I vaguely remember the star seeds were considered concept manipulation.
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Bump
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@DarkDragonMedeus @Jasonsith @Qawsedf234 @Confluctor @LordGriffin1000 @Elizhaa @QuasiYuri @SomebodyData
So do you think that we should apply "Massively FTL+" or "Massively FTL+, possibly Infinite" speed to the characters?
Also, would somebody here who knows what they are doing be willing to apply these changes to all of the relevant Sailor Moon characters?
Vietthai96
He/Him- 10,145
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Visual is a type of evidences, but visual should be supported by statements, proofs, not visual only
if he don't know, why he still made the Nemesis comment. And he again is not stupid character, if they leave Nemesis to the edge of the universe, then to Wiseman Domain, he will use different statements, not using the word: falling and Nemesis together
Again i never said she is not flying, but you need to prove she actually cross the entire universe. One panel show they are on Nemesis, next they immediately in Wiseman Domain, how did we know she travel the entire universe while the process was off-screen, and don't tell me she cross the entire universe in the fact
What, i didn't mean that, literally i said she can travel to Wiseman domain because she has his power, please read the entire comment
Again, i'm not ignore it, it is because all two, three pages show nothing about she cross the entire universe, to it's edge and then reach wiseman domain, the entire process is, by all mean, off-screen or didn't actually happen, no statement or narration about she cross the universe. You need to prove she actually cross the entire universe, not because art this art that, that is irrelevant when no statement prove
Anyway at this point we probably going in circle, and i'm pretty busy with other verse i support though. And again the decision is up to the staffs
Well i'm busy with DBH so leave me out ^^
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kuramamyfav68
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This user here tried to make them conceptual (and give star seeds way more hax while at it).
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it was conceptual before i joined the sight, downgraded, and has since been reinstated. No need for salt.
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- #616
Are we going with the possibly infinite thing?
Are they conceptual here? Moon's profile has only shown info manipulation/essense manipulation.
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It hasn’t been added yet. The profiles are being cleaned up. It takes time.
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- #618
But then my bro what was exactly downgraded before this? You literally derailed the thread ranting about how unfairly sailor moon gets treated here and downgraded, called out and ranted at the staff over it, and now can't even find a single thread where sailor moon got debunked by flimsy arguments or treated unfairly?
It seems like this is genuinely the first major downgrade sailor moon got.
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Vietthai96
He/Him- 10,145
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don't even know, tbh, i'm not that much invest on SM, watch and read both manga, 90s anime then crystal, except two eternal movies which i don't know how to watch them. And the state of profile is actually terrible, there is some "hax" like Cosmic Manipulation lol
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WTF, we be borrowing from superpower wiki now?
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I don't mind the Massivly FTL+, possibly Infinite.
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"Likely Massively MFTL+, possibly Infinite"
or
"Likely Massively MFTL+, possibly Immeasurable"
will be the terms I will pick to meet the middle.
Just... How would you distinguish between infinite and immeasurable and which case do the feats we have fall into?
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I'd prefer just Massively FTL+, but I wouldn't mind possibly Infinite if I'm outvoted.
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Same ^
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- #625
Just remember, the infinite is attack speed. So it would be "Likely Massively FTL+, possibly infinite attack speed"
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This is probably fine, but if we go with this solution, we probably need an explanation section in the verse page regarding the speed levels that we use. Would you be willing to expand on your reasoning please?
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Just Massively MFTL+ is like a massive downplay.
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Well, I am personally undecided. I would just prefer to see if somebody can provide a good justification text that we can use for either "Massively FTL+" or "At least Massively FTL+, possibly Infinite" speed.
kuramamyfav68
He/Him- 432
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Did I make it sound like I'm salty? My bad.
kuramamyfav68
He/Him- 432
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same
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- #632
So the three of you prefer just massively FTL+, right?
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- #634
What reasoning do we give?
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I think the Massively FTL+ parts are self explanatory; it's already proposed above. For "Possibly Infinite speed", it would be for lighting up the universe being debated as a speed feat.
I personally do not agree with lighting up the infinite sized universe being a speed feat but rather just a range feat and "Other verses" is a whataboutism that basically tells me those other verses if any need to be downgraded too. But some other verses still have ratings with some people still supporting those regardless. But that can be contested in a different thread after taking care of this one.
I personally do not agree with lighting up the infinite sized universe being a speed feat but rather just a range feat and "Other verses" is a whataboutism that basically tells me those other verses if any need to be downgraded too. But some other verses still have ratings with some people still supporting those regardless. But that can be contested in a different thread after taking care of this one.
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We have had a lot of galaxy travelling feats for the MFTL+ speed feats.
The issue is (1) do we truly add in the "possibly infinite attack speed" part, and (2) what explanation to add should we deem an attack speed infinite and what feats makes a spreading of something within some time an attack speed.
Lighting up the universe feat part... Well it can arguably be "weak" hax that has a big range but little effect on normal matter.
The attacking into Wiseman castle part... Well I believe I have made my translation.
I should have been sleeping now it is past midnight in Singapore time here.
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This makes sense to me. So is somebody willing to apply this then please?
We also need to add some kind of footnote explanation in the most relevant wiki pages regarding why we do not accept infinite or immeasurable speed.
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Well:
Massively MFTL+, possibly infinite (The light of silver crystal lit up the static universe, a universe where time and space are infinite) linking to the feats of of course
or
Massively MFTL+, possibly immeasurable (The light of silver crystal lit up the static universe, a universe where time and space are infinite, as well as reached the rifts between times, places outside time and space and only accessible through time travel. Scaling from Black Lady, who was shown physically flying from Planet Nemesis to the rifts.)
Massively MFTL+, possibly infinite (The light of silver crystal lit up the static universe, a universe where time and space are infinite) linking to the feats of of course
or
Massively MFTL+, possibly immeasurable (The light of silver crystal lit up the static universe, a universe where time and space are infinite, as well as reached the rifts between times, places outside time and space and only accessible through time travel. Scaling from Black Lady, who was shown physically flying from Planet Nemesis to the rifts.)
Rabbit2002
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immeasurable again?
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- Thread starter
- #640
So we are taking just MFTL+, is that right Ant?
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