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Goku vs Superman
- Thread starter Sonicflare9
- Start date
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Hyperversal Writer? Geese, Demonbane will have some competition when it comes to big downgrades
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I don't want to go off topic so I'll just say I can see why that's the case, especially since with how Tier 0 has been reworked I don't see how the Writer qualifies for that tier but that's for a different thread altogether
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I thought it was because the Source Wall transcended all dimensions and that's the starter of the DC 1-A scaling chain or something like that.
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I think most of the 1-A stuff comes from scaling Grant Morrison's cosmology to Scott Snyder's cosmology which I think Ant and some other DC experts have had an issue with it for awhile now
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What even are the dimensions anyway? How many are there?
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I think there were immeasurable dimensions due to the 5th dimensional bleed containing immeasurable higher dimension or something like that, I don't read DC comics that much
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You can get to at least 1-A under literally every cosmology writer of DC. Especially since some of the arguments are based on the way of existence of the sphere of the gods and it’s inhabitants. Or stuff such as dream and nightmare being conceptual. Which you can’t just retcon like that.
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Eh?
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Ant talked about possibly downgrading DC to 1-B. I referenced that.
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Above space and time. Stated to be above the concepts of space and time, about every time these realms are mentioned.
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Even Low 1-Cs can be above the concepts of space and time. 1-A is being above every possible extension of space-time.
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It's a stomp.
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Low 1-C’s are not above the concept of space and time (since this would include extensions of them). They are just above 4D space-time.
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The concepts of space and time only goes as far as a verse has them, this was one of the main changes to the tiering system. You have to prove these concepts are 1-A or at least encompass all possible levels of space-time not the other way around. So a Low 1-C can actually be above the concept of space-time, since it has no set tier.
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@Greenshifter
Anyway, maybe you're right and DC is 1-A. Maybe I'm right and DC is 1-B. Won't know until the revisions drop so it's best to wait.
Anyway, maybe you're right and DC is 1-A. Maybe I'm right and DC is 1-B. Won't know until the revisions drop so it's best to wait.
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How high is Goku into 2-A?
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Actually, Superman's 2-A comes not just from Anti Monitor but also Nabu https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Doctor_Fate_(Classic)
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According to Ottavio, this is the scaling chain for Xeno Goku:
"
Limit Breaker SSJ4 Xeno Goku >
SSJG Trunks >= Dark King Mechikabura >>>>>> SSJ4 Gogeta >>>>>>> Old Mechikabura >>>>>>> Dark Broly = Final Form Mira = SSJ4 Xeno Goku > SSJ3 Xeno Goku >>>>>>> Gravy >>>>>>> Base Xeno Goku > Chamel > Demigra (Transcended Demon God) > Demon God Demigra > Base Demigra (DBH) >>>>>> Xenoverse Demigra (TokiToki absorbed) = Baseline 2-A"
"
Limit Breaker SSJ4 Xeno Goku >
SSJG Trunks >= Dark King Mechikabura >>>>>> SSJ4 Gogeta >>>>>>> Old Mechikabura >>>>>>> Dark Broly = Final Form Mira = SSJ4 Xeno Goku > SSJ3 Xeno Goku >>>>>>> Gravy >>>>>>> Base Xeno Goku > Chamel > Demigra (Transcended Demon God) > Demon God Demigra > Base Demigra (DBH) >>>>>> Xenoverse Demigra (TokiToki absorbed) = Baseline 2-A"
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That really doesn't matter. He doesn't scale as far above baseline as Goku now.
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U should read the side Note in Tiering System
"Above the concept of space & time" Isnt enough to reach 1-A
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“It should, on the other hand, be kept in mind that merely existing "beyond the concepts of space and time" and similar feats do not necessarily qualify one to bypass into this tier unless the work of fiction in question leaves it very clear that a character also exists beyond all extensions of the concepts which they transcend”
It’s DC, this should be EZ. I will say however that my 1-A knowledge tends to come from other wiki’s which are more lax on 1-A. But this basically means that the statement can’t be a hyperbole, but if someone is truly beyond the concepts of space and time then they are in fact 1-A.
It’s DC, this should be EZ. I will say however that my 1-A knowledge tends to come from other wiki’s which are more lax on 1-A. But this basically means that the statement can’t be a hyperbole, but if someone is truly beyond the concepts of space and time then they are in fact 1-A.
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No, it means they have to prove to be beyond all extensions of the concepts of space and time, as the bolded part literally makes clear. The concepts themselves can be 1-B, Low 1-C or Low 1-A.
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Exactly
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Exactly
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Platonic concepts should be 1-A by default. We’re saying the same thing here, being beyond all extensions of a concept = being beyond a concept. So like I said it just can’t be hyperbole of a character saying you’re beyond the concept of time but then it turns out that they’re still bound by a form of time in a higher dimension. But I don’t see anywhere that the concepts themselves would just be a certain tier such as 1-C or 1-B, that’d be stupid.
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1. It would have to be really explicit, that Platonic Form stuff. I only know of one verse that scales stuff to it.
2. Being beyond a concept is not being beyond all extensions of a concept at all. No where on this wiki is that accepted.
3. It's not hyperbole, it's that the concepts of space and time don't have a set tier at all. If the space-time of a verse was only Low 1-C, you could be unbound by it's concept and still just be one layer above. Space-time no longer determines 1-A.
2. Being beyond a concept is not being beyond all extensions of a concept at all. No where on this wiki is that accepted.
3. It's not hyperbole, it's that the concepts of space and time don't have a set tier at all. If the space-time of a verse was only Low 1-C, you could be unbound by it's concept and still just be one layer above. Space-time no longer determines 1-A.
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