Giygas Vs Solaris(Earthbound Vs Sonic the hedgehog)

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

I know that, if you see my comment, in the part I cut, you put the Super sonic that used the necessary power to defeat the time Eater, not Solaris.

so super sonic (Generation)>=Time Eater in Speed

Yes, but Solaris is still well above the power and the speed Super Sonic use to demolish the Time Eater

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

Yes, but Solaris is still well above the power and the speed Super Sonic use to demolish the Time Eater

yes I know, I'm just saying that your comparison was very slightly wrong

 

[Ego]

Sigh what's the point in having passives if you can't even use them here

 

[StrymULTRA]

Sigh what's the point in having passives if you can't even use them here

Don't blame Giygas. Blame this site's bs rules on Immeasurable speed.

 

[Jinsye]

Exist across time everywhere in the universe = Omnipresent on a Low 2-C scale. That's not the same as Immeasurable, otherwise anyone who obliterate a universe would have immeasurable attack speed

What is your definition of immeasurable what. An attack that moves throughout all of time would be immeasurable.

 

[StrymULTRA]

What is your definition of immeasurable what. An attack that moves throughout all of time would be immeasurable.

Regardless, either Giygas stomps from passives or Solaris stomps from blitzing.

So this should be closed anyways.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

What is your definition of immeasurable what. An attack that moves throughout all of time would be immeasurable.

You should read the speed page for that. That's not something I defined, this is just how vsbw treat it

 

[Jinsye]

You should read the speed page for that. That's not something I defined, this is just how vsbw treat it

According to the speed page, if Giygas can move throughout all of time and exists in it even on a Low 2-C scale then he'd have immeasurable speed. He can move beyond linear time.

Beyond doesn't mean transcending or whatever here, if you travel backwards in time through speed that would be immeasurable.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

According to the speed page, if Giygas can move throughout all of time and exists in it even on a Low 2-C scale then he'd have immeasurable speed. He can move beyond linear time.

Giygas is considered Omnipresent on a Low 2-C scale. He doesn't actually moves anywhere since he literally encompasses the entire universe space time contiuum. That is not immeasurable speed according to the wiki. His hax also doesn't travel anywhere since it literally comes from him. It's just omnipresent on a Low 2-C scale

Again, this is how the wiki treats it

 

[Jinsye]

I don't see how Solaris is faster to the point of outspeeding passives then. Solaris can move anywhere in linear time but Giygas' passives will be at any point he moves in time. So moving "before" the passives happen won't actually work due to the fact that Giygas' passives will be in that "before" if it emanates from him and he's temporally omnipresent.

We don't treat tier 2 omnipresence as lesser than tier 2 immeasurable, that's simply wrong.

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

I don't see how Solaris is faster to the point of outspeeding passives then. Solaris can move anywhere in linear time but Giygas' passives will be at any point he moves in time. So moving "before" the passives happen won't actually work due to the fact that Giygas' passives will be in that "before" if it emanates from him and he's temporally omnipresent.
We don't treat tier 2 omnipresence as lesser than tier 2 immeasurable, that's simply wrong.

Yes we do. Unless you want to say every single Tier 2 and higher character has immeasurable attack speed for destroying universes

Also, you keep ignoring the fact that the passives take effect immediately, which is equivalent to infinite attack speed. Immeasurable blitzes these instant passives as even infinite speed characters are essentially frozen in their place due to how fundementally different they treat time.

Again, just read the thread about passives vs immeasurable speed. Essentially, the immeasurable speed character simply blitz the effects of the passives, meaning that while the passives are there, Soalris is so fast that it can attack, move and such before the effects take place

This is again, equivalent to an infinite speed attack with the same effects going to Solaris. From his point of view, Solaris views said attacks as frozen

Also two more things: 1) Soalris' speed and reaction scale vastly above that of the Time Eater, who erased multiple timelines and did the same temporally omnipresent attack to erase the timeline, and also have immeasurable attack speed itself, and 2) Solaris' own destruction feat erased everything, past, present and future upon his birth, so Solaris would certainly be able to attack before Giygas' passive will take effects

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

Also, again, Giygas' passive have not shown to affect anyone with Immeasurable speed, and the passive is just omnipresent within a Low 2-C scale

Because of that, Immeasurable speed characters will always blitz the effect of the passives

 

[Ego]

Also, again, Giygas' passive have not shown to affect anyone with Immeasurable speed, and the passive is just omnipresent within a Low 2-C scale

Because of that, Immeasurable speed characters will always blitz the effect of the passives

That logically never makes any sense to me

 

[Jinsye]

Yes we do. Unless you want to say every single Tier 2 and higher character has immeasurable attack speed for destroying universes

By our standards that we use, yes, if your tier 2 character shoots an energy blast and the shockwave travels throughout all of time destroying the spacetime continuum as a result then that would be immeasurable attack speed. Our standards define immeasurable speed as movement beyond linear time, so an attack that moves backwards and forwards through time to destroy all of it would be immeasurable.

It's mostly not applied because most of the times it is just range (aka it happens all at once) and not something with travel time.

Also, you keep ignoring the fact that the passives take effect immediately, which is equivalent to infinite attack speed. Immeasurable blitzes these instant passives as even infinite speed characters are essentially frozen in their place due to how fundementally different they treat time.

You're thinking on a 3D level here. If a 3-D character is immeasurable compared to another 3-D character, then yes this would be true. But breaking down how immeasurable speed works, it would not take effect on someone who permeates throughout all of time.

Immeasurable means you can move through time. It means you can attack things before they happen due to the fact you can move backwards in time and hit people before time even dictates so.

If we think of the timeline as a film reel. The 3-D character's passives would only affect certain "frames" so to speak (most notably the present and future). An immeasurable character dodges this by going to the past where the 3-D character's passives cannot reach.

But, what happens if the passives permeate throughout all of time (thus logically also being immeasurable in speed even if you'd call it Omnipresent on a Low 2-C scale)?

There is literally no location for the immeasurable character to dodge when the entirety of time is filled with passives. How are you supposed to escape passives when they're already on your same level of existence?

 

[Gilad_Hyperstar]

This still doesn't change the fact that at rvery point in time, the passives take effect immediately. The effects happens all at once on a Low 2-C scale. However, this is equivalent only to an infinite attack speed that goes across all of time as well.

So even though the passive is already there, its effect only is as fast as infinite speed without anything to prove that it affects immeasurable speed characters as well, meaning that from Solaris' point of view, the effects of said passive hax will not get felt as it'd literally appear frozen in comparison to it. Again, the effects speed is equivalent to infinite speed even if the passive is already there, so while the time between the passive appearing and taking effect is zero, for Immeasurable speed characters it will appear is if it is literally taking forever for the effects to apply

 

[Snek]

I just read Giygas's profile and have a stupid question to ask since he lacks death manip resistance.

In Sonic 06 the eye's of Solaris can inflict instant death to anyone who touches them despite voids death hax which is 4d in potency being ineffective against those Solaris can affect.

With that in mind since Giygas's body is quite literally everything and impossible to miss would he just die?

 

[StrymULTRA]

I just read Giygas's profile and have a stupid question to ask since he lacks death manip resistance.

In Sonic 06 the eye's of Solaris can inflict instant death to anyone who touches them despite voids death hax which is 4d in potency being ineffective against those Solaris can affect.

With that in mind since Giygas's body is quite literally everything and impossible to miss would he just die?

You have to prove that works on AE1.

 

[sanicspood]

from what im seeing, giygas fra

 

[StrymULTRA]

Ig that if Solaris' AP doesn't make it a stomp, then Giygas FRA too.